Buckenara: Dees List Overrated

[Dr. Gonzo 24,463]

6 hours ago, Demonland said:

I saw the potential in this Melbourne list back in 2016 when I wrote at the end of the season those long-suffering supporters could finally start saving for finals tickets ahead of the 2017 season.

When I look at this Melbourne list it is full of talented players and has that star quality you need for sustained success. Players like Angus Brayshaw, Christian Petracca, Viney, Clayton Oliver, Tom McDonald, Jesse Hogan (if he stays), Jake Lever and Christian Salem are the present and the future of this club. This is one of the most talented groups of young players in the AFL and they’re starting to hit their peak.

They will form the nucleus of a side I expect to build a successful era for this football club.

Add them to the experience of Jones, Max Gawn, Michael Hibberd, Jake Melksham, Neville Jetta and Jordan Lewis and it’s a very nice group of 14 players for which the sky is the limit in what they can achieve together

 

C-graders

[Sir Why You Little 37,400]

7 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

His rating should be for 2020

Why? 2019 is done and complete

2020 is yet to be

(Wow I cannot believe it is 20 years since 2000)!!!

[Mel Bourne 4,537]

Jay Lockhart doesn’t seem to make it on anyone’s lists ??‍♂️.

At least deserves the title of “developing”. 

[Supermercado 2,806]

I can accept Jetta being ranked poorly. At his best he's great but even when he played this year he was average. However, by that logic having Kolodjashnij above Petracca should ensure he's never allowed to submit an article again without taking a [censored] test first.

[Ugottobekidding 1,244]

Was interesting till i read Harmes was a C then realised bucks has no idea really and doubt he he a verybastute observer of the game.

[Sorry kids 635]

8 hours ago, TGR said:

Hey SK,

 

Most of us here thin we are going to rebound into finals in 2020.  Most, apart from Lyon, think this fall is an aberration.  Most, think that the club know where we are at.

 

 

 The individual ratings of Buckys are pretty poor. Who do you think should be ranked higher. That is the point of the article and subsequent post based on where we are now.

[D4Life 2,581]

21 hours ago, Tough Kent said:

Josh Wagner = C PLUS

James Harmes = C

Yep, he knows our players intimately.

Petracca C+ Same as Josh Wagner, killed his credibility instantly in my eyes!

Buckenarra like everyone has an opinion, there’s a saying about opinions and a-holes!

[Demon Dynasty 17,150]

22 hours ago, Deemania since 56 said:

Got a feeling that Harmes is going to be in for a thriller year - a game-changer, and loose cannon, friggin' good footballer and his class will rise.

I'm a huge fan 56 ....if, like many on our list, he can lower his vision more often & clean up his kicking...he might take it to the next level.  If that wasn't a factor he would nudging towards A grade by now.  Sitting at B- ish now imv.

Edited October 10, 2019 by Rusty Nails

[BW511 2,728]

So aside from everyone being upset about 1 or 2 names, we can all acknowledge the list isn’t filled with consistent high end talent

[Dr. Gonzo 24,463]

1 hour ago, BW511 said:

So aside from everyone being upset about 1 or 2 names, we can all acknowledge the list isn’t filled with consistent high end talent

It's that dirty word BW - potential

We'd be hoping Petracca, Brayshaw, Lever, Salem and probably Viney fulfill their potential as elite players in their respective positions

They'd also be hoping Weideman comes on and be the key forward we need him to be.

IF those players meet expectations we will have a great core with Gawn and Oliver. Time is on their side but 2020 is the year they need to collectively take that step.

[Deemania since 56 6,803]

5 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

I'm a huge fan 56 ....if, like many on our list, he can lower his vision more often & clean up his kicking...he might take it to the next level.  If that wasn't a factor he would nudging towards A grade by now.  Sitting at B- ish now imv.

Kinda agree, Rusty. Now that the two wing-type recruits have been nabbed, it will free up Harmes quite a bit for this to occur at 100mph. Harmes is often potent; Harmes is very likely to become more potent with constraining positional roles (and ever-changing at that) being removed. He can at times be very ordinary - but I do suspect that he will be a 'freer' player with the wings better covered up and down the ground. He is, after all, a very good leader to the ball, and can find space to exploit.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

Buckenara:

D+ overrated thug apart from the odd speccy and a few good games.

Edited October 11, 2019 by Wadda We Sing

[Fork 'em 7,052]

Can't say I remember much thuggery from BUCKENARA !
Matthews and Brereton yes.

[Red But Mostly Blue 4,631]

Can't argue with much of this. I know Trac has not hit his potential but having him alongside Wagner makes no sense. It's ruthless, but let's be honest, the fact that this list was overrated, and probably self-overrated by the players themselves contributed to our result this year.

[whatwhat say what 23,747]

there's a few i disagree with him on; have added langdon and tomlinson too

Here’s my breakdown:

A: Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver

B+: Tom McDonald

B: Steven May, Christian Salem, Christian Petracca, Jack Viney, Jake Melksham, Ed Langdon

B-: Nathan Jones, James Harmes, Angus Brayshaw, Michael Hibberd, Bayley Fritsch, Neville Jetta, Adam Tomlinson

C+: Mitch Hannan, Aaron vandenBerg, Jayden Hunt, Alex Neal-Bullen, Marty Hore

C : Oscar McDonald, Joel Smith

C-: Billy Stretch, Kade Kolodjashnij, Braydon Preuss, Jay Kennedy-Harris, Corey Wagner, Josh Wagner

Developing*: Jake Lever (B rising to B+ / A hopefully), Sam Weideman (C+ rising to...?), Harrison Petty (C+ rising to...?)

Developing: Charlie Spargo (C+), Oskar Baker (C)), James Jordan (n/a}, Tom Sparrow (B-), Toby Bedford (n/a), Aaron Nietschke (n/a), Austin Bradtke (n/a), Kade Chandler (C-)

i've added grades for the developing* - i think both weed and petty can be best 22 players for us, and think that their performance could be key for us going forward

if my way of thinking of it is if you add all the a to c+ers and the three developing* then there's 24 players that ideally would be in our best 22, plus the addition of preuss and joel smith would take it to the named squad of 26...at least until we (hopefully) add some high class kids to the squad at the draft

B: Jetta - May - Hibberd
HB: Salem - Lever - Harmes
? Langdon - Brayshaw - Tomlinson
HF: Petracca - T Mac - Melksham
F: Fritsch - Weideman - Hunt
Foll: Gawn - Oliver - Viney
I/c: Jones - Hannan - vandenBerg - Petty
Emerg: Preuss - ANB - Hore - Smith

Edited October 11, 2019 by whatwhatsaywhat

[Pennant St Dee 13,428]

On 10/10/2019 at 7:47 PM, old dee said:

This may sound strange to you DD but I actually agree with you.

where we may differ is the size of that young talent group.

+ 1 old dee, hope you're keeping well

[Adam The God 30,684]

1 hour ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

there's a few i disagree with him on; have added langdon and tomlinson too

Here’s my breakdown:

A: Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver

B+: Tom McDonald

B: Steven May, Christian Salem, Christian Petracca, Jack Viney, Jake Melksham, Ed Langdon

B-: Nathan Jones, James Harmes, Angus Brayshaw, Michael Hibberd, Bayley Fritsch, Neville Jetta, Adam Tomlinson

C+: Mitch Hannan, Aaron vandenBerg, Jayden Hunt, Alex Neal-Bullen, Marty Hore

C : Oscar McDonald, Joel Smith

C-: Billy Stretch, Kade Kolodjashnij, Braydon Preuss, Jay Kennedy-Harris, Corey Wagner, Josh Wagner

Developing*: Jake Lever (B rising to B+ / A hopefully), Sam Weideman (C+ rising to...?), Harrison Petty (C+ rising to...?)

Developing: Charlie Spargo (C+), Oskar Baker (C)), James Jordan (n/a}, Tom Sparrow (B-), Toby Bedford (n/a), Aaron Nietschke (n/a), Austin Bradtke (n/a), Kade Chandler (C-)

i've added grades for the developing* - i think both weed and petty can be best 22 players for us, and think that their performance could be key for us going forward

if my way of thinking of it is if you add all the a to c+ers and the three developing* then there's 24 players that ideally would be in our best 22, plus the addition of preuss and joel smith would take it to the named squad of 26...at least until we (hopefully) add some high class kids to the squad at the draft

B: Jetta - May - Hibberd
HB: Salem - Lever - Harmes
? Langdon - Brayshaw - Tomlinson
HF: Petracca - T Mac - Melksham
F: Fritsch - Weideman - Hunt
Foll: Gawn - Oliver - Viney
I/c: Jones - Hannan - vandenBerg - Petty
Emerg: Preuss - ANB - Hore - Smith

It shows how important a lack of injuries are to a team.

We've barely got depth, but if we could have a Richmond 2017-2018-like run of injury-less games, we'd be a big shot at the top 4 if we get our systems right (and with the aid of a softer draw).

Still reckon we need to also find a goal kicker with a bit of x factor that could bob up at an important moment and turn the game (like a Jeffy when he was in good form, but with a harder edge).

Edited October 11, 2019 by A F

[praha 11,267]

I'm very concerned tbh. When I saw our midfield and centreline with Langdon and Tomlinson it still doesn't fill me with confidence. We are still excruciatingly top heavy and will struggle to win 8 games imo. If we lose Langdon and one of May or Lever to injury we are back in the same situation we were in this year.

2018 was our window and we missed it imo. We've skipped over multiple drafts and instead gone all in across other years, neglecting player development and young talent. Only one player under 21 is damning. 

If we miss finals again this year, Goodwin won't coach again at AFL level. So much is on the line in 2020.

[Sorry kids 635]

10 hours ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

there's a few i disagree with him on; have added langdon and tomlinson too

Here’s my breakdown:

A: Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver

B+: Tom McDonald

B: Steven May, Christian Salem, Christian Petracca, Jack Viney, Jake Melksham, Ed Langdon

B-: Nathan Jones, James Harmes, Angus Brayshaw, Michael Hibberd, Bayley Fritsch, Neville Jetta, Adam Tomlinson

C+: Mitch Hannan, Aaron vandenBerg, Jayden Hunt, Alex Neal-Bullen, Marty Hore

C : Oscar McDonald, Joel Smith

C-: Billy Stretch, Kade Kolodjashnij, Braydon Preuss, Jay Kennedy-Harris, Corey Wagner, Josh Wagner

Developing*: Jake Lever (B rising to B+ / A hopefully), Sam Weideman (C+ rising to...?), Harrison Petty (C+ rising to...?)

Developing: Charlie Spargo (C+), Oskar Baker (C)), James Jordan (n/a}, Tom Sparrow (B-), Toby Bedford (n/a), Aaron Nietschke (n/a), Austin Bradtke (n/a), Kade Chandler (C-)

i've added grades for the developing* - i think both weed and petty can be best 22 players for us, and think that their performance could be key for us going forward

if my way of thinking of it is if you add all the a to c+ers and the three developing* then there's 24 players that ideally would be in our best 22, plus the addition of preuss and joel smith would take it to the named squad of 26...at least until we (hopefully) add some high class kids to the squad at the draft

B: Jetta - May - Hibberd
HB: Salem - Lever - Harmes
? Langdon - Brayshaw - Tomlinson
HF: Petracca - T Mac - Melksham
F: Fritsch - Weideman - Hunt
Foll: Gawn - Oliver - Viney
I/c: Jones - Hannan - vandenBerg - Petty
Emerg: Preuss - ANB - Hore - Smith

Pretty good, i have jetta and Hibberd slipping down a rank due to age, injury and form but agree we have around 14 players on the list to the B- acceptable AFL standard currently. Blokes you once would have said are good AFL footballers. So still two drafts and first class coaching and development away from the big time.

Anyone know if Buckenara has given ratings on Tomlinson and Langdon.

[spirit of norm smith 16,676]

On 10/10/2019 at 10:06 AM, Tough Kent said:

Josh Wagner = C PLUS

James Harmes = C

Yep, he knows our players intimately.

Exactly.  Buckenara was drunk when he dribbled this crapola.  Insulting and ignorant person. 

[WERRIDEE 5,636]

1 GAWN

2 OLIVER

3 T.MCDONALD

4 MAY

5 VINEY

6 BRAYSHAW

7 MELKSHAM

8 HARMES

9 FRITSCH

10 HIBBERD

11 LEVER

12 JETTA

13 PETRACCA

14 SALEM

15 LANGDON

16 JONES

17 TOMLINSON

18 PETTY

19 WEIDEMAN

20 HUNT

21 VANDENBERG

22 J.SMITH

23 HANNAN

24 HORE

25 NEAL-BULLEN

26 PREUSS

27 KOLODJASHNIJ

28 C.WAGNER

29 LOCKHART

30 BAKER

31 J.WAGNER

32 O.MCDONALD

33 SPARGO

34 SPARROW

35 DUNKLEY

36 CHANDLER

37 JORDON

38 BEDFORD

39 BRADTKE

40 NEITSCHKE

 

1 to 2 are A graders

3 to 5 are B graders

6 to 17 are C graders

18 to 40 are D graders

[Wiseblood 24,637]

12 hours ago, praha said:

I'm very concerned tbh.

Surprise of the decade right there.

While the discussion around our stinker of a season and the expectations on 2020 are more than valid, Buckenara can't be taken seriously when he rates Petracca on par with blokes who only get a gig when we have injuries.  Poor journalism at best.

[dave 183]

On ‎10‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 10:24 AM, Hatchman said:

Must have been, which is why this is my front runner for the laziest piece of AFL journalism of the trade season. Go home Bucky you're drunk

 

A: Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver

B+: Jack Viney, Tom McDonald

B: Nil

B-: Nathan Jones, Christian Salem, Angus Brayshaw, Michael Hibberd, Kade Kolodjashnij, Jake Melksham, Bayley Fritsch, Steven May

C+: Christian Petracca, Jake Lever, Sam Frost, Aaron Vandenberg, Jayden Hunt, Alex Neale-Bullen, Marty Hore, Josh Wagner, Neville Jetta

C: James Harmes, Billy Stretch, Mitch Hannan, Oscar McDonald, Joel Smith, Corey Wagner

C-: Jay Kennedy-Harris, Braydon Preuss

 

 

Harmes a C? Brayshaw(3rd in Brownlow '18) a B-?, Lever a C+? that's just a few, Buckenarra is f*%kwit

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,489]

So much confusion.

Broken down in its simplest form “if we’re being honest”.....

Lets remove the +’s  and the -‘s and just have ratings of a, b , c and d. 
 

If Dusty and Fyfe are an A, then Oliver must be a B. That would put Petracca as a C. Then based on last years form where does that put Jones and Hibberd. 

95 % of our list were C and D grade this year.
 

 

[Sir Why You Little 37,400]

3 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

So much confusion.

Broken down in its simplest form “if we’re being honest”.....

Lets remove the +’s  and the -‘s and just have ratings of a, b , c and d. 
 

If Dusty and Fyfe are an A, then Oliver must be a B. That would put Petracca as a C. Then based on last years form where does that put Jones and Hibberd. 

95 % of our list were C and D grade this year.
 

 

Correct. Not fit enough or mentally prepared

Preparation never lies