Post Match Discussion: JLT #2 vs St. Kilda

[Dr. Gonzo 24,235]

11 hours ago, Farmer said:

How was Lever in the third term? Bloody awful. And dropped an uncontested mark early in the last quarter which lead to a goal. Open your eyes guys!!! Might be ok in the long run but is struggling IMO

Let me guess, Watts would've dominated right?

[Diamond_Jim 12,596]

I posted this during the game thread and our wonderful Demonland host replied that our forward entry had been woeful for the quarter:

It is from the AFL game day website and is speaking about the third quarter:

"Despite the Demons winning the inside 50 count 16-12 in that third quarter, it was the Saints who found their efficiency, having ten shots on goal from their entries for a result of 6.3 (39)."

That stat is so worrying on so many fronts but most damning of our coaching staff. We had plenty of the ball but failed to adopt our game plan to take advantage of our possessions. The four St Kilda goals in the first quarter ... a quarter in which we had total domination was also a concern.

It was a practice game but those two faults are the ones we should have been practising as we often failed in these areas in seasons past.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,235]

58 minutes ago, shorty said:

Have to agree, far too many people talking us up, I don't like it.

Better than laughing at/pitying us like they were 5 years ago

[Dr. Gonzo 24,235]

30 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I don't understand why people are so hard on Dom Tyson.

Coming off an injury, he played under 70% game time and still accumulated a raft of possies, kicked a goal and laid 8 tackles.  I know his kicking can be a little suspect, but he was crucial for us last night, especially in the first half.

If you don't think he's in our best 22 then you've got rocks in your head.

He looked very good last night, excited to see how he progresses this year. I think people forget how young he still is. 

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

35 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

He has great touch, wasn't convinced after JLT1 but he seems a monty to debut in R1.

I was convinced after one kick in the AFLX, he's pure class and an upgrade on Watts.

[D4Life 2,476]

Fortunately I didn’t see the third quarter, only 1st, 4th and start of 2nd, but what stood out to me:

Melksham - looks strong, tough, sharpshooter 

Petracca - very strong, skilled, ready to break out like the HULK

Max - fit, smart in the ruck, marking improved across game

Oliver - gun, love to see him kick it

Hogan - fit, has vision, will be great at CHF

Lever - give him 5-6 games for Demons and will be a gun

Brayshaw - on the up, give him another 10 games to build his confidence and will be really strong

Replace - Wagner, Stretch, Pedersen, Maynard, Frost, Fritsch (who are all solid sitting just outside the 22 as depth) with

Ins - Viney (if 100% fit), TMac, ANB, Harmes & Lewis and we look really solid across all lines.

We look a lot stronger than last year!

From what I read went with Salem & Maynard in guts in Q3, and also from seeing Saint goals perhaps stopped running. Probably missed Viney & Lewis Leadership.

Will be good to see where we are after round 6, as season doesn’t depend on round one! Not withstanding, will be very happy if we beat the Cats!

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

42 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I don't understand why people are so hard on Dom Tyson.

Coming off an injury, he played under 70% game time and still accumulated a raft of possies, kicked a goal and laid 8 tackles.  I know his kicking can be a little suspect, but he was crucial for us last night, especially in the first half.

If you don't think he's in our best 22 then you've got rocks in your head.

 

I genuinely don't right at this point and it stands to reason.

Given how healthy our list is going into round one, the reality of the situation is that Dom is vying for a spot against team-mates who simply add more versatility to our side. And I'm not sure that can be argued with?

Dom is one-paced, he isn't overly strong overhead, nimble or agile and he can't play half-back due to his kicking.

So where does that leave him? We already have Jones, Viney and Oliver as definite starting mids. With a rotation of guys who offer more in other areas of the ground because of their attribute diversity. Salem, ANB, Harmes, Brayshaw, Petracca, Hannan and Melksham. 

If Dom is a definite starter for you, who have you left out and more importantly, how does that impact the versatility of our side which is now such a strength of ours?

[Richard Tionary 145]

Fritsch is beautiful kick.

[Gator 17,383]

2 minutes ago, stevethemanjordan said:

I genuinely don't right at this point and it stands to reason.

Dom is one-paced, he isn't overly strong overhead, nimble or agile and he can't play half-back due to his kicking.

Tyson's pace is virtually never an issue, he has a great sidestep, is creative, tough, is hard to bring down, is good overhead, knows how to find the footy, is valuable in rotations through the centre square, and usually a good distributor.  

You may not have him in your best 22, but I'm certain Goodwin does.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

10 minutes ago, stevethemanjordan said:

 

I genuinely don't right at this point and it stands to reason.

Given how healthy our list is going into round one, the reality of the situation is that Dom is vying for a spot against team-mates who simply add more versatility to our side. And I'm not sure that can be argued with?

Dom is one-paced, he isn't overly strong overhead, nimble or agile and he can't play half-back due to his kicking.

So where does that leave him? We already have Jones, Viney and Oliver as definite starting mids. With a rotation of guys who offer more in other areas of the ground because of their attribute diversity. Salem, ANB, Harmes, Brayshaw, Petracca, Hannan and Melksham. 

If Dom is a definite starter for you, who have you left out and more importantly, how does that impact the versatility of our side which is now such a strength of ours?

 

4 minutes ago, ProDee said:

Tyson's pace is virtually never an issue, he has a great sidestep, is creative, tough, is hard to bring down, is good overhead, knows how to find the footy, is valuable in rotations through the centre square, and usually a good distributor.  

You may not have him in your best 22, but I'm certain Goodwin does.

PD answered it better than I could, Steve.

[Demonland 72,230]

5 minutes ago, Richard Tionary said:

Fritsch is beautiful kick.

Picks the ball off the ground on the run very nicely too.

[Demonland 72,230]

GLASS THREE QUARTERS FULL by The Oracle

Melbourne fans were left with a feeling of holding a three quarters full glass in their hands after their team’s 26 point win over St Kilda in their second JLT Community Series match up last night. 

Their team produced some stylish and scintillating football in the first, second and final terms in front of 4,567 fans at Casey Fields but it was the complete fade out in what is often described as the “premiership quarter” that left some of them with worries about the season ahead. 

Yes, it was only a practice match but this was a team that missed the finals last year by a slim percentage margin and surely, its occasional propensity to switch off from time to time was one of the contributing factors to that sorry outcome?

The Demons were quick out the blocks with their eight goal opening term in which ruckman Max Gawn was a dominant factor who gave his midfield led by an effervescent, slim line Clayton Oliver an armchair ride that opened up multiple avenues to goal with some strong contested football. The Saints somehow managed four goals on the rebound but Melbourne maintained control and looked comfortable as it led by 39 points well into the shadows of the half-time break.

The team seemed to ease up the pressure just a little late in the second term but not only did they completely lose momentum in the third, they also coughed up the lead after a run of seven unanswered goals left them five points in arrears until a Jeff Garlett kick found a way from the outside of his boot through the big sticks to settle the team down 30 minutes into the quarter.

Big Max had been a little quiet after half-time but he was back to his best in the pressure cooker atmosphere in the final term as the Dees regained their composure in the final quarter through Angus Brayshaw who booted their first two of six goals that saw them safely home. 

Despite the lapse in that third quarter when the team was often beaten on the rebound after pushing hard forward, there was still plenty to be pleased about with a little over two weeks to go before the main campaign starts. Recruits Jake Lever and Bayley Fritsch were impressive with the former putting in a superb display in defence. The team was generally neat and precise in its ball movement, and there was great depth and evenness through the team with 13 goal kickers. 

Also pleasing is the fact that there would be close to half a dozen important players out of the side (including Jack Viney, Jordan Lewis and Tom McDonald) who will also come into selection consideration for the opening game in a fortnight’s time. With a full strength side, Simon Goodwin might yet have a team that can fill his glass with success.

Melbourne 8.4.52 11.5.71 12.8.80 18.11.119

St Kilda 4.1.25 6.4.40 12.7.79 14.9.93

Goals

Melbourne Brayshaw Garlett Hogan Melksham Oliver 2 Bugg Fritsch Hannan Hunt Petracca Salem Tyson Vince 

St Kilda Bruce 3 Sinclair 2 Acres Armitage Billings Clark Gresham McCartin Membrey Savage Steven

Best

Melbourne Oliver Gawn Hibberd Petracca Lever Hogan

St Kilda Billings Acres Ross Geary Savage Steele 

Injuries

Melbourne O McDonald (back tightness)

St Kilda Steven (rolled left ankle)

Reports Nil

Umpires Rosebury, Fleer, Mollison

Official crowd 4,567 at Casey Fields 

 

[Bates Mate 4,500]

Harmes not playing yesterday and missing from family day 

Anything happening there???

[Demon Jack 6,921]

47 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Was Bugg off the pace or did his two misses at goal standout?

Bugg had some decent moments, particularly when I saw him up the ground. I wouldn't say he looked off the pace, but I don't think we'll ever be convinced on his finishing. He missed two easy shots at goal (one from 25m out to ice the game in the final quarter) and his one major came as a result of a 'joe the goose.'

I'm a bit torn on whether he fits into the 22 or not because we arguably played our best football last season (that four game winning streak) when Bugg's role was to be a niggling forward. He was never statistically impressive during this period but he always seemed to bob up for a goal or two every week and play a handy team role. 

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

31 minutes ago, ProDee said:

Tyson's pace is virtually never an issue, he has a great sidestep, is creative, tough, is hard to bring down, is good overhead, knows how to find the footy, is valuable in rotations through the centre square, and usually a good distributor.  

You may not have him in your best 22, but I'm certain Goodwin does.

 

27 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

 

PD answered it better than I could, Steve.

 

Fine to have that view but whose spot does he take for round 1?

Edited March 9, 2018 by stevethemanjordan

[Gator 17,383]

Bugg is the sort of player that would have played 100 games for us in years gone past.

He's good depth, but not best 22 in a quality finals team.  That's not to say he wouldn't play a final, but imo it would be off the back of injuries.

[old dee 23,800]

Just now, ProDee said:

Bugg is the sort of player that would have played 100 games for us in years gone past.

He's good depth, but not best 22 in a quality finals team.  That's not to say he wouldn't play a final, but imo it would be off the back of injuries.

You have my vote.

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

10 minutes ago, Bates Mate said:

Harmes not playing yesterday and missing from family day 

Anything happening there???

Apparently you have MFCSS if you ask the question....

[DemonWorshipper 304]

20 minutes ago, Leoncelli_36 said:

Apparently you have MFCSS if you ask the question....

Watch Goodwin's press conference http://www.melbournefc.com.au/video/2018-03-08/media-conference-simon-goodwin-postmatch.  Apparently Harmes had a knock to the head at training last week, so they are taking the cautious approach before round 1.

Edited March 9, 2018 by DemonWorshipper
Grammar

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Given 24 (?) played last night, my team for round 1 is...

 

OUT: Bugg, Wagner, Maynard, Stretch, Pedersen, OMac (more likely Frost), Fritsch (or Hannan)

IN: Viney, TMac, Harmes, ANB, Lewis

 

Backs: Lever, Frost, Hibberd, Hunt, Jetta, Vince, Lewis

Midfielders: Gawn, Jones, Viney, Oliver, Salem, Tyson, Petracca, Brayshaw

Forwards: Hogan, McDonald, Hannan, Garlett, ANB, Harmes, Melksham

[DeeSpencer 25,723]

23 minutes ago, stevethemanjordan said:

 

I genuinely don't right at this point and it stands to reason.

Given how healthy our list is going into round one, the reality of the situation is that Dom is vying for a spot against team-mates who simply add more versatility to our side. And I'm not sure that can be argued with?

Dom is one-paced, he isn't overly strong overhead, nimble or agile and he can't play half-back due to his kicking.

So where does that leave him? We already have Jones, Viney and Oliver as definite starting mids. With a rotation of guys who offer more in other areas of the ground because of their attribute diversity. Salem, ANB, Harmes, Brayshaw, Petracca, Hannan and Melksham. 

If Dom is a definite starter for you, who have you left out and more importantly, how does that impact the versatility of our side which is now such a strength of ours?

I thought Dom was solid last night. Especially given he's a game behind the others. Frost, Jetta, Garlett - the others who missed JLT 1 were also a bit off the pace at times.

If we play 7 backs, 8 mids, 7 forwards then I think he's in the 8 best mids.

If it was up to me: Gawn, Viney*, Oliver, Petracca, Salem, Jones, Harmes, Tyson. With Brayshaw playing as one of the 7 defenders and Salem going back at times as well. With Viney 50/50 for round 1 I'd say Gus takes a midfield spot and Vince takes the 7th defender.

As long as he's not matched up on a speed/endurance running machine type I think he can play wing as well as on ball. He probably finds the most uncontested possessions for any of our centre square players in that he's very good at making himself an option for a short corridor kick. Very reliable hands in that situation as well. Oliver (for short rests), Petracca and Harmes are the mids who will go forward with Hannan, Melksham, ANB maybe moving in to the midfield. We don't need to be spinning all the midfielders forward and vice versa. I'm not that in love with versatility in rotating players. 

He's not an automatic pick all season, but I think he's pretty safe for round 1 and almost a certainty if Viney isn't right.

[hemingway 7,628]

1 minute ago, Forest Demon said:

Given 24 (?) played last night, my team for round 1 is...

 

OUT: Bugg, Wagner, Maynard, Stretch, Pedersen, OMac (more likely Frost), Fritsch (or Hannan)

IN: Viney, TMac, Harmes, ANB, Lewis

 

Backs: Lever, Frost, Hibberd, Hunt, Jetta, Vince, Lewis

Midfielders: Gawn, Jones, Viney, Oliver, Salem, Tyson, Petracca, Brayshaw

Forwards: Hogan, McDonald, Hannan, Garlett, ANB, Harmes, Melksham

Reasonable thinking Forest.

Encouraging thing is that all your "outs" are reasonable players. No duds. 

[Deeoldfart 8,033]

My excitement level for 2018 went up another notch last night.  I'm not too phased by the 3rd quarter when they got on top in the clearances (while our 3rd string clearance players were being given some exposure through the middle).  This gave them some momentum that took us a while to arrest, however I reckon their run-on would have been more easily halted if Viney, Lewis, ANB and Harmes had been on the park. 

What really excited me was:

• our start (which was a problem area for many games last year);
• our spread of goal kickers / avenues to goal;
• our improved skill levels (confirming training reports);
• the return to very good form of Hoges, Gawn and Gus after injuries etc. plagued their 2017 seasons; and
• the continued development of Tracc, Clarrie and Melky. 

All looks fantastic to me!

[D4Life 2,476]

10 minutes ago, Forest Demon said:

Given 24 (?) played last night, my team for round 1 is...

 

OUT: Bugg, Wagner, Maynard, Stretch, Pedersen, OMac (more likely Frost), Fritsch (or Hannan)

IN: Viney, TMac, Harmes, ANB, Lewis

 

Backs: Lever, Frost, Hibberd, Hunt, Jetta, Vince, Lewis

Midfielders: Gawn, Jones, Viney, Oliver, Salem, Tyson, Petracca, Brayshaw

Forwards: Hogan, McDonald, Hannan, Garlett, ANB, Harmes, Melksham

I like it, only change for me is OMac in for Frost!

[DemonWorshipper 304]

15 minutes ago, DemonWorshipper said:

Deleted

Edited March 9, 2018 by DemonWorshipper
Can't delete!