Welcome to Demonland: Jake Lever

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,108]

Lever went as a mid first round picked and if you re-ordered that draft now you would have him at worst 3rd behind Trac and Heeney. He is a player type that will only get better as his body matures.

Our first pick is likely to be around about where he got picked that year (but not better) yet some think that and some steak knives will get the job done. It will take our first pick and some serious quality unless we put a deal forward that means we could walk him through the draft (unlikely).

Whilst I am sure we wont entertain it unless he wanted out,the Hogan article aside from the emotion attached is not that far off logic. We have proven we can kick good scores without him and this was before we unearthed T-Mac as a forward option. We have proven we leak multiple goals against tall forwards and need to improve the quality of our transition from defence.  A lot on here are unsure whether O-Mac and Frost are the answer. I assume some on here are worried whether we have already seen the best of Hogan.  It could be argued Lever is more important to us having a tilt than Hogan. Granted you would want to keep both but if push came to shove........ 

[Tricky 341]

10 hours ago, brendan said:

This thread has gone mad 1st off it was Tyson getting put up for trade which is madness and now hogan, my god that's just rediculous, might as well offer up clarry next 

 

[binman 42,608]

4 minutes ago, Dante said:

Not sure why there are so many in this thread suggesting we trade ANB, I'd say he would be one of the first picked every week.  The coach seems to have a really high regard for him and seems to think he does his job effectively most weeks, but here on Land, he's the first one to go.  

I'd be happy to get Lever but we have to balance it up with what we are prepared to pay and let's not rob Peter to pay Paul. 

Agree he is best 22 atm (though he'ed be in the 15-22 range) and that the coaches love him. Has really come on this year. But that is precisely why there is a good chance he is chance to be part of any deal to get Lever.

Crows don't want a player like Kent or ben ken who can't get a regular game of senior football. They want someone who can be a best 22 in their side. They need mids and we are reasonably well covered for players of ANB's size and skill set, particularly with Smith coming on, Maynard getting a senior gig and Gus not having played this year.

And of course he is an SA boy, which is a big factor i reckon given how many players they lose who are going back to their home state. 

As i have said before i hate to lose players that are not peanuts and who want to stay at the club. But no doubt he will be in discussions. Trading Frost would be robbing Peter to pay Paul but not ANB.

The alternative to trading a player of his ilk is to give up this years and next years first round draft picks (perhaps with a late pick coming back this year, for example if Taylor had another smokey in mind). But that is risky as it starts to muck around with your age spread in the next two or three years as you need quality young players filtering in as our older players drop off and/or filter out . 

[rjay 24,852]

34 minutes ago, small but forward said:

What did Geelong give up to the crows to get Dangerfield?

According to the logic of some on here it should have been Selwood or Hawkins...

[binman 42,608]

I cannot believe there is any discussion at all of swapping hogan for Lever. Really apart from the emotional aspect of hogan being a much loved demon, objectively no club would do that deal.

Hogan is miles ahead of lever as a player. I get that Lever is good now and in all likelihood will become a top shelf player, and perhaps even a star (though i do think some on here are getting ahead of themselves a bit with their assessments - i really worry about his history of hamstring issues - as i think Webber has pointed out before once a player starts to get them it can become a problem) but Hogan is a star now and will become one of the greats. Look at his numbers.

For Pete's sake he won the NAB rising star - an award forwards never win, pipping Cripps who was unbelievable that year. And has kicked 99 goals in only 49 games - amazing for a young KPF. This season has been a write off yet he is still kicking goals when he plays. I can't believe how short some people's memories are.

The Crows would take that trade in a heartbeat and be laughing as they signed the paper work. Crows fans would be saying "Lever who?" 

[Dante 2,739]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Agree he is best 22 atm (though he'ed be in the 15-22 range) and that the coaches love him. Has really come on this year. But that is precisely why there is a good chance he is chance to be part of any deal to get Lever.

Crows don't want a player like Kent or ben ken who can't get a regular game of senior football. They want someone who can be a best 22 in their side. They need mids and we are reasonably well covered for players of ANB's size and skill set, particularly with Smith coming on, Maynard getting a senior gig and Gus not having played this year.

And of course he is an SA boy, which is a big factor i reckon given how many players they lose who are going back to their home state. 

As i have said before i hate to lose players that are not peanuts and who want to stay at the club. But no doubt he will be in discussions. Trading Frost would be robbing Peter to pay Paul but not ANB.

The alternative to trading a player of his ilk is to give up this years and next years first round draft picks (perhaps with a late pick coming back this year, for example if Taylor had another smokey in mind). But that is risky as it starts to muck around with your age spread in the next two or three years as you need quality young players filtering in as our older players drop off and/or filter out . 

I understand what you say about early draft picks and the possibility of having a gap of quality young players coming through, but realistically you can get some good players later in the draft. We learnt a lesson when we tanked that you may get the number one pick, but not necessarily the best player, $cully/Trengove, Martin.

Hawthorn haven't had an early pick for a long while now but are rebuilding their side with older players and some later picks. Carlton have got some talented young players as have Brisbane but they are last and second last. 

We've got the basis of a good side and plenty of talented kids, now we have to top up with some specific players to fill specific gaps we have, if Lever is it then the club will know how much to pay for him. I'm not suggesting paying old rope for silk, but we may have a player or two who suits their needs and a first round draft pick and/or a second for next year, instead of a player. 

 

[McQueen 17,864]

2 hours ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

Lever went as a mid first round picked and if you re-ordered that draft now you would have him at worst 3rd behind Trac and Heeney. He is a player type that will only get better as his body matures.

Our first pick is likely to be around about where he got picked that year (but not better) yet some think that and some steak knives will get the job done. It will take our first pick and some serious quality unless we put a deal forward that means we could walk him through the draft (unlikely).

Whilst I am sure we wont entertain it unless he wanted out,the Hogan article aside from the emotion attached is not that far off logic. We have proven we can kick good scores without him and this was before we unearthed T-Mac as a forward option. We have proven we leak multiple goals against tall forwards and need to improve the quality of our transition from defence.  A lot on here are unsure whether O-Mac and Frost are the answer. I assume some on here are worried whether we have already seen the best of Hogan.  It could be argued Lever is more important to us having a tilt than Hogan. Granted you would want to keep both but if push came to shove........ 

We've also proven we can defend scores without Lever.

Letting go of Hogan is completely illogical. I can't believe it's even being considered.

[Redleg 40,815]

If we get Lever, then we can concentrate on other areas we are deficient in, such as another quick outside mid and a talented small forward. 

[old55 23,356]

If we land Lever then Frost becomes a very valuable trade option.  I can't see Lever, OMac, Frost and Hibberd all in the same backline and we have TMac forward who could go back in case of injury.  With Weid and Keilty coming through we developing tall options.

2017 1st + ANB would be a great result.

Edited August 5, 2017 by Fifty-5

[Demon Disciple 12,063]

2 hours ago, McQueen said:

We've also proven we can defend scores without Lever.

Letting go of Hogan is completely illogical. I can't believe it's even being considered.

Um, no. After today's effort, i'm going to have to disagree with you on that McQueen. We can't defend [censored].

[Dr. Gonzo 24,131]

1 hour ago, Fifty-5 said:

If we land Lever then Frost becomes a very valuable trade option.  I can't see Lever, OMac, Frost and Hibberd all in the same backline and we have TMac forward who could go back in case of injury.  With Weid and Keilty coming through we developing tall options.

2017 1st + ANB would be a great result.

Frost wouldn't net us much, he's a good athlete but he's no footballer. Deer in the headlights when faced with real competition.

[Lord Travis 10,696]

I'm all for getting Lever just so I don't have to see Frost playing anymore. He's been shitful the past few weeks and loses so many aerial contests, even when the ball is to his advantage. He just can't read the ball or play it seems. While O Mac lacks intensity, he at least can read the ball and spoil it most of the time.

Get Lever in to sure up our backline!

[deelete my account 1,194]

Would trading Tyson or Watts if his next month is awful, allow us to not have to use a 1st round pick on Lever? ie Player + 2nd round pick this year and next ?

[Mac7 309]

Hogan for Lever is the most  ridiculas thing I have ever read on demonland. 

 

More realistic is Watts and our first round pick. Plus some other swaps.That's if we're even nominated as the choice from lever. 

Edited August 5, 2017 by Mac7

[grazman 7,405]

20 hours ago, Fifty-5 said:

2017 1st + ANB would be a great result.

It would be indeed, but if I'm the Crows recruiting manager I'd ask us to go back and have another go.  I think another first round pick is more valuable than ANB, and trading the likes of a Frost/Tyson/Watts would potentially get you that. 

[mattjm 151]

9 hours ago, Mac7 said:

Hogan for Lever is the most  ridiculas thing I have ever read on demonland. 

 

More realistic is Watts and our first round pick. Plus some other swaps.That's if we're even nominated as the choice from lever. 

agree. we should not be proactively trading hogan under any circumstances 

[spirit of norm smith 16,250]

Sorry ANB.

1st draft pick 10-13 range + ANB

=

Lever + Crows 3rd round pick. 

[whatwhat say what 22,658]

2 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Sorry ANB.

1st draft pick 10-13 range + ANB

=

Lever + Crows 3rd round pick. 

It really doesn't

ANB would have minimal value 

[Demonstone 22,296]

19 hours ago, Lord Travis said:

Get Lever in to sure up our backline!

Are you shore?

[Jibroni 4,987]

49 minutes ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Sorry ANB.

1st draft pick 10-13 range + ANB

=

Lever + Crows 3rd round pick. 

 

Depends if we finish up with a top ten pick which on current form is unfortunately achievable.

I would'nt be giving up Pick 7-12 and a player for Lever. He is a very good footballer but he is also part of very good backline for which he would not get the same support at Melbourne.

 

 

[McQueen 17,864]

22 hours ago, Demon Disciple said:

Um, no. After today's effort, i'm going to have to disagree with you on that McQueen. We can't defend [censored].

Everything is going badly for us at the moment. Our defence appeared to be in tatters yesterday. 

I don't think Jake Lever could've changed the course of yesterday's game too much.

[junk 342]

There is talk about using Tyson as part of the trade bait to get Lever, Tyson is the equivalent in my mind to Caddy(tigers) a serviceable player but not spectacular,he is no Trealoar or Paddy. Do we need to keep both N.Jones and Vince in the same team. We might not necessarily need to make changes but perhaps the way we play.

[Demons11 6,906]

On 04/08/2017 at 9:47 PM, DemonAndrew said:

What's the general consensus on the notion of Hogan of being used as an asset to get Lever?

I don't like it, personally, when the option is there to trade something else - I do not want to lose Hogan

There is no way it happens 

[chook fowler 19,444]

On 06/08/2017 at 10:56 AM, demonstone said:

Are you shore?

I don't know where good grammar has went 

[pineapple dee 2,892]

13 minutes ago, chook fowler said:

I don't know where good grammar has went 

Demon stone is clearly having trouble with his worms.......... and for a lot of demonlanders, it's much crutch nurse.