POST MATCH DISCUSSION - Round 17

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, AdamFphlebeb said:

I agree. It's time they just said it's unacceptable. When Port came out and said that, their players, specifically their leaders, responded. Of course, we have to balance that with the understanding that with so many young players, we will be inconsistent. But I thought our 'leaders' let us down today, so is it worth putting them to the sword publicly or just internally?

This week, they did.  In his presser Roos didn't say we weren't tired or whatever - just that we didn't turn up and that we can't afford to do that.

We need to remember that what Roos tells the press is very likely to be different to what he says to the players after the game.

[Generation dee 1,336]

1 minute ago, Soidee said:

I will throw a party when this club stops making nonsense excuses after a loss like that.  Roosy, Goodwin, Jackson and every other paid coach or footy dept person needs to spell it out that it's not acceptable.  Don't give us supporters bulldust platitudes. This one today is bad, very bad.

Without being dramatic, we are at risk of looking as bad as North or geelong when we lose and I don't want to continue supporting a club like that. I can handle being beaten by a more experienced side but when you make the same mistakes, especially to the same sides, and fail to either plan accordingly or have a plan b, well that's what really hurts. Good teams adjust or at least learn. I've been a very patient and positive supporter for too long and always had belief at times blindly, but I'm really getting tired of the slow ascent, especially tripping over the same hurdles.

[Adam The God 30,249]

11 minutes ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

They were ahead of us in aggression at the ball and man by a few levels. As soon as their pressure lifted in the second we did not have enough confidence in our game plan and went back to hand balling to the next stationary person under pressure. Viney aside, we lacked leadership again. It all felt very deja vu to me.

Agreed. As soon as Hunt was shut out of the game in the second, we completely went to water and lost our confidence. An absolute avalanche ensued. We must be pretty easy to coach against at the moment. We simply keep backing our one and only system in at almost every centre bounce and sometimes we have to learn to jump to something else.

[Adam The God 30,249]

11 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

This week, they did.  In his presser Roos didn't say we weren't tired or whatever - just that we didn't turn up and that we can't afford to do that.

We need to remember that what Roos tells the press is very likely to be different to what he says to the players after the game.

Of course the internal message would be different, but I was proffering that perhaps the external message should be similar at a point. 

[stuie 7,374]

WTF.

 

[olisik 4,060]

Just now, stuie said:

WTF.

 

Didn't he say the complete opposite before the game? That we were at the same age, experience level ect 

[layzie 33,796]

2 minutes ago, AdamFphlebeb said:

I agree. It's time they just said it's unacceptable. When Port came out and said that, their players, specifically their leaders, responded. Of course, we have to balance that with the understanding that with so many young players, we will be inconsistent. But I thought our 'leaders' let us down today, so is it worth putting them to the sword publicly or just internally?

It's a good question. I would say internally. At this point in the season I just don't know if we'd gain much shaming them publically. Port have a list that really shouldn't be missing finals and therefore demand that standard. 

[Bobby McKenzie 2,385]

1 hour ago, Diamond said:

Our list is second rate. Our game plan is poor. Our skills are very poor. We handball too much and stuff it up.

Strange isn't it? We win and our list is great and the future bright. Lose and our list suddenly becomes poor and we are doomed. Surely we have depth with many players all just missing out on selection. Also Casey is one of the top teams in the VFL. A good indicator. Im very disappointed with todays loss but I am circumspect and know that a young developing team will have its ups and downs for a while.St Kilda are like us except they seem to have an up when they play us.

[Lucifers Hero 39,779]

Just now, stuie said:

WTF.

That is the most worrying comment I have heard Roos make.  Lyon hasn't been there for 5 years and only a handful of StK players were coached by him.

It sounds disrespectful to Richardson and Co and I'm really surprised our club chose to put that on twitter. 

Poor form all round.

[Adam The God 30,249]

1 hour ago, _becks_ said:

Mitch White can go back to VFL and never play AFL again as far as i am concerned. He was seriously hopeless today. Beaten in one on ones, too slow, poor disposal, sh!thouse.

Harmes doing the kick outs? ummmm.....i don't get it

White, Harmes, Grimes, Kennedy, VandenBerg (in current form) cannot all play in the same team again, far far too many passengers.

Neal-Bullen had 37 disposals at Casey, seriously give him a game!

We need Salem back. 

 

 

White may yet offer something at AFL level, but at the moment he doesn't offer us enough drive and as we know from the demise of Dunn and Garland, if you don't do that in our defensive set up, you won't have a consistent spot.

Frost back for White next week. Thought Tommy Mac was pretty good actually. His kicking set up numerous forays forward. Funny how a few weeks can change a perception of a player. 

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Just now, Lucifer's Hero said:

That is the most worrying comment I have heard Roos make.  Lyon hasn't been there for 5 years and only a handful of StK players were coached by him.

It sounds disrespectful to Richardson and Co and I'm really surprised our club chose to put that on twitter. 

Poor form all round.

Disagree, although I would need to listen to it in the context in which it was being given.  

I have no doubt he is referring to the standards, culture etc that he established in his time there, something we didn't have at all when Roos arrived.  Having that already in place allows them to be in a different category for the time being, as they have been able to focus all of their energy in different areas while we've had to make a long and sustained effort to turn around a shambles of a club.

[Return to Glory 8,441]

I blame myself. 'Let me tell you something my friend. Hope is a dangerous thing. Hope can drive a man insane.'

[Nasher 33,616]

I would like to see Harmes playing forward again, too.  We can all see his is as hard as a cat's head, as they say, but he's too cruddy a user of the ball to be used as an attacking half back flanker.  He did his best damage as a forward who tackled, marked and hit the scoreboard.

Increase the responsibilities of the youngsters in the middle - Brayshaw, vandenBerg, bring Oliver back etc, recall Stretch, and use he and Vince as those midfielders receiving on half back.  Push Harmes back to half forward and Kennedy to Casey.

[Undeeterred 3,123]

4 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

That is the most worrying comment I have heard Roos make.  Lyon hasn't been there for 5 years and only a handful of StK players were coached by him.

It sounds disrespectful to Richardson and Co and I'm really surprised our club chose to put that on twitter. 

Poor form all round.

What they do have is a core team of leaders who are overseeing the transition to the next generation.

I think what he means is that Riewoldt, Montagna, Gilbert etc are true leaders for the young kids, where we just don't have the equivalent leaders to show the young kids coming through how to be successful.

[The heart beats true 18,123]

So disappointed by today.

All we can do is move forward - which means Grimes should make way for ANB and we need to get more games into Oliver. Mitch White looked a step off the pace today, and made 3 really critical errors when he needed to step up and attack the game.

It should be list management time now. 

Also, I bet we get within 3-4 goals of the Eagles next week and put in a huge effort. Honestly, it will count for nothing. The club needs to take the next step and win games it should. Honourable loses aren't going to help - at the end of the day we sit below St Kilda on the ladder and I don't rate them at all.

[chook fowler 19,458]

Thought Brayshaw showed some good signs despite his clangers - wasn't alone there. Needs time to adjust to the pace - would give him a solid block of games.

[Demonetta13 95]

Unsure if it has been mentioned yet so i apologies if it has, but it seems we don't have a clear-cut kicker after a behind. i saw Hunt, Harmes Bernie and Oscar all take kick ins today and none of them offered much. As much as he had the ability to completely drop off from time to time, When Dunny is in the team we at least know he'll give us something from the kick in.

[Demi Dee 578]

3 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

So disappointed by today.

All we can do is move forward - which means Grimes should make way for ANB and we need to get more games into Oliver. Mitch White looked a step off the pace today, and made 3 really critical errors when he needed to step up and attack the game.

It should be list management time now. 

Also, I bet we get within 3-4 goals of the Eagles next week and put in a huge effort. Honestly, it will count for nothing. The club needs to take the next step and win games it should. Honourable loses aren't going to help - at the end of the day we sit below St Kilda on the ladder and I don't rate them at all.

Well said. I'm annoyed and kicking up dust, but, I'll move forward and won't lament those poor turn overs. 

[Pates 9,660]

By the way if anyone is thinking we were tired after the Darwin game, Freo looked pretty good again Geelong. Darwin should not even factor, and I'm putting my hand up and saying I've changed camps on that. 

Not sure what Roos is on about with the Ross Lyon bit, but I think they are a micro step ahead of us. We are a younger team, but that still does not excuse losing to this mob for so long. 

Next year we must beat the Kangas and a Saints to claim any real improvement. 

[Demi Dee 578]

1 minute ago, Demi Dee said:

Well said. I'm annoyed and kicking up dust, but, I'll move forward and won't lament those poor turn overs. 

Too much 

[Biffen 12,943]

5 minutes ago, Max_well58 said:

Unsure if it has been mentioned yet so i apologies if it has, but it seems we don't have a clear-cut kicker after a behind. i saw Hunt, Harmes Bernie and Oscar all take kick ins today and none of them offered much. As much as he had the ability to completely drop off from time to time, When Dunny is in the team we at least know he'll give us something from the kick in.

kick in specialist.

I like it.

he can just hang in the diamond until they have a shot at goal.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

18 minutes ago, stuie said:

WTF.

 

I can't believe I missed this one, I was too busy putting on my veil of negativity.

Edited July 17, 2016 by Clint Bizkit

[Adam The God 30,249]

1 hour ago, Clint Bizkit said:

He actually kicked the ball as a first option, for that he was one of our best.

Oh, I disagree. Thought he was far too cute and ran himself or team mates into trouble during a number of critical stanzas in the game.

1 hour ago, hemingway said:

Post Darwin, Etihad and St Kilda, says it all. Until we win these games and are able to win consistently and consecutively we cannot claim to have turned the corner. And other clubs and the media will not take us seriously.  Incredibly disappointing. The team needs its head read. 

I swear you're my old man posting, Ernest. I share your frustration, but we've definitely improved. I'd argue we've turned a corner, but I think there are more corners to turn.

[DemonOX 8,791]

Great way to start the working week. 

Well done Melboune yet again u have ruined another weekend and made another start to the week so pleasurable!!!

[Adam The God 30,249]

34 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

That is the most worrying comment I have heard Roos make.  Lyon hasn't been there for 5 years and only a handful of StK players were coached by him.

It sounds disrespectful to Richardson and Co and I'm really surprised our club chose to put that on twitter. 

Poor form all round.

I think he means their leaders played under Lyon and that's who's propping them up at the moment. I'd agree. I wish he'd just say that though. Their older guys always kill us. And the fact we lack decent leaders in that older age category makes it even more apparent.