Dawes, why can't he ruck?

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

Just now, rjay said:

Wish I had to play in such horrible conditions...

Not an ounce of mud to be found, slippery ball yes, cold for the spectators yes...hardly horrible conditions. 

A player like Dawes should thrive on days like Saturday, he's not a marking player anyway. Just needed to use his strength to open the game for teammates.

Horrible conditions for talls*? But I get your point. Had to chuckle a little at the conditions up on the gold coast saturday night... I know he isnt a contested marking player but he still should be taking the ones when he gets up with arms free of the defender. He does the hard work to beat his man then just doesnt take advantage.

[ArtificialWisdom 4,045]

26 minutes ago, GoodAsGawn said:

I believe thats why we want Hulett to come on.... exactly what we need..... a forward who can play ruck...
I don't know if he has been doing this in the VFL but in TAC and as a junior he was a Forward/Ruck

I'm really interested in Hulett, havent seen much of Casey but I keep hearing good things. Do we think he will get a chance, maybe later in the year?

[old dee 23,792]

I find this thread amusing.

He performed exactly as I expect.

The guy is past it. The same problems that have been there for three years.

How he gets a game in preference to Pedersen is beyond me.

[beelzebub 23,380]

OD. Many live under the spell that poses that with so many able people in the FD these days that everything is on track and it just perseverance and time. 

Whilst there may well be an element about that they are still just people practicing an imperfect science.

Ie get things wrong 

Edited June 6, 2016 by beelzebub

[Undeeterred 3,124]

Geez Stef Martin would be handy right about now.

Just saying.

[old dee 23,792]

13 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

OD. Many live under the spell that poses that with so many able people in the FD these days that everything is on track and it just perseverance and time. 

Whilst there may well be an element about that they are still just people practicing an imperfect science.

Ie get things wrong 

Reminds me of the doing the same things over and over and expecting a different result

[rhaz 342]

1 minute ago, Undeeterred said:

Geez Stef Martin would be handy right about now.

Just saying.

No he wouldn't. Stef is a good when he is the #1 ruck - we already have that, we just need someone who can give Gawn a rest but play elsewhere most of the time. Stef never played well in that role.

 

[beelzebub 23,380]

Stef had some days out as a link up fwd if I remember correctly. 

[monoccular 17,432]

3 hours ago, AngryAtCasey said:

Wont lie, it is an issue, however I see it an issue either way going forward given Dawes eventual replacement (Weideman) doesn't ruck either.

This is a major reason why Hurley would be such a huge signing for us.  If we could land Hurley, it would free Tom McDonald up to play on the 2nd dangerous forward and chop out in the ruck when need be.  When Tom goes into the ruck his defensive spot could be covered by a utility type.  This would be the only role I can see for Garland going forward, utility who spends time back and forward.

Failing us landing Hurley we could look to secure a ruck/forward like Nathan Vardy, this would then require us to move players around like Watts to defense as our 3rd tall back, which given he's just found form as a permanent forward, I'd rather not do.

I would like to ask KC or others who have seen Hulett regularly - is he a likely back up ruck option, in the medium term if not sooner?   Is M King (the one currently uninjured) looking as if he will get a game in the next year or so?  Does Weideman really look as if he will never become a back up ruck?

Looking forward to your thoughts.

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

1 hour ago, old dee said:

I find this thread amusing.

He performed exactly as I expect.

The guy is past it. The same problems that have been there for three years.

How he gets a game in preference to Pedersen is beyond me.

Suspect the club are looking for an answer to their 2nd string genuine tall forward requirement to ensure the opposition's 2nd string Key defender isn't going to Watts OD. They can then utilise him more in a utility role when required (ruck relief with Dawes/Pedo as well as occasional defencive roles). Will also be handy to have the opp's 3rd stringer on Watts. He should shine up forward with that (lessor) match up both physically and on the scoreboard.

Roos seems to confirm this here....

....."Dawesy will probably pinch-hit a little bit in the ruck, but we haven’t been unhappy with what Wattsy’s (Jack Watts) doing, but it gives us a bit more flexibility with Dawesy down there,” he said on Melbourne TV’s Roos’ Views.

“We had [Justin] Westhoff against us on the wing last weekend, so it would’ve been nice to play Jack [Watts] on the wing against Westhoff. So there are some things that we can do with Dawesy, but predominantly he’s a forward and then we can ruck either Wattsy or Dawesy.

Pedo seems to have gone the way of the dodo bird like Dunn this year. Must have P'd someone off.

Personally i think Pedo is the better option if Dawes isn't being utilised in the ruck. Can't afford the old single role player anymore unless he's a super star. Pedo can play forward, back and ruck relief.

Having said that, we should be looking to recruit a better 2nd string genuine tall forward to replace both. Dixon would have been very handy me thinks.

Edited June 6, 2016 by Rusty Nails

[MadAsHell 4,212]

10 minutes ago, monoccular said:

I would like to ask KC or others who have seen Hulett regularly - is he a likely back up ruck option, in the medium term if not sooner?   Is M King (the one currently uninjured) looking as if he will get a game in the next year or so?  Does Weideman really look as if he will never become a back up ruck?

Looking forward to your thoughts.

From my observations of the three young players you've mentioned.

Hulett: Could well become a good ruck/forward option.  He's very strong in the contest and is already a bit of a beast for such a young kid.  From all reports he played as a bit like Pedersen as an U18, in that he could play forward, back & pinch hit in the ruck.  Haven't had the chance to see him ruck at VFL level yet due to Spencer, Max King, Keilty, Pedersen & Mitch King (Round 1 only) all being available at different stages to play ruck.  So there's certainly scope for him to play this role, but it's hard to make an informed call as of yet on his body of work.  Looks a player though.

Max King: 3rd year on the list, and he's capable of some special things, but if I had to make a call either way, I'd say I don't think he'll make it and will likely be delisted at years end.  Still looks very light physically and gets pushed out of marking contests a little to easily for mine.  I'd go as far to say that both Weideman & Hulett look stronger in the contest then King does.  I hope he proves me wrong, but don't see him being an option.

Weideman: Very excited about his prospects going forward.  He looks a natural footballer & a natural forward at that.  I don't see him as being a 2nd ruck option as I think we'd be robbing Peter to pay Paul.  Again, may be proven wrong, but he just doesn't strike me as the type to go into the ruck.

[Cards13 9,117]

36 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

 

Pedo seems to have gone the way of the dodo bird like Dunn this year. Must have P'd someone off.

 

Peds has been ill with pneumonia hasn't he? I think he could be an in once fit again.

[Moonshadow 17,676]

Wasn't that one of the main reasons he wanted out of Collingwood? Because they wanted him to chop out in the ruck and he didn't want that roll? I know he's a team orientated guy and will give any task a go, but if he's made it clear in the past he doesn't want that, well....

[Moonshadow 17,676]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

Stef had some days out as a link up fwd if I remember correctly. 

And Stef played some admirable games in the backline for us too 

Edited June 6, 2016 by Moonshadow

[jackaub 1,402]

Why cant he mark?

[Tony Tea 2,809]

5 hours ago, stuie said:

Maybe it's do with his calf injuries? He didn't look 100% on the weekend, just a bit off, and maybe they've decided it's a factor in his management.

Even when Dawes is on, he looks off.

[What 18,810]

He is just not a good player. He was nothing more than serviceable on the end of a premiership winning midfield at Collingwood, and even back then he was dropping easy marks.

Edited June 6, 2016 by Petraccattack

[rjay 24,943]

With Dunn seemingly out of favour and blooding Omac as a defender then I don't see Dawes offering a lot more so maybe time to blood Weed &/or Hullet...

[Demon Dynasty 17,109]

3 hours ago, Cards13 said:

Peds has been ill with pneumonia hasn't he? I think he could be an in once fit again.

Rings a bell. Can anyone confirm this for certain?

[chookrat 4,250]

9 hours ago, poita said:

It seemed to me that Watts was doing the ruck work that Dawes should have been doing, and Kent was doing the pack crashing that Dawes should have been doing. Hence I have no idea why Dawes is in the side.

Our forward line has functioned well for most of this year, generally with Hogan, Pedersen and Watts as the talls. As soon as that mix changes we fall apart.

Dawes has a presence about him that our team otherwise lacks.

[old dee 23,792]

17 minutes ago, chookrat said:

Dawes has a presence about him that our team otherwise lacks.

The only presence I care about is the one that wins games and he clearly does not achieve that.

the guy is bog ordinary.

[DubDee 25,902]

8 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Stef had some days out as a link up fwd if I remember correctly. 

Stef has proven over the past 5 years he cannot play forward more than 20%.

i honestly dont know if he would get a game at the moment if we had him.  he is average aside from 1st Ruck

[DubDee 25,902]

Why can't Dawes ruck?

Why can't T Mac kick?

Why can't Watts hip n shoulder?

whats the point of this thread? different players have different skills.  Dawes' strengths when fit are leading, kicking for goal, tackling, leadership. Not marking or ruck work. he just rucks when there is noone better to do so

[Adzman 2,154]

Dawes isn't the answer in the ruck. Sadly I don't have the answer for who is going to work as second ruck.

[rjay 24,943]

56 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Why can't Dawes ruck?

Why can't T Mac kick?

Why can't Watts hip n shoulder?

whats the point of this thread? different players have different skills.  Dawes' strengths when fit are leading, kicking for goal, tackling, leadership. Not marking or ruck work. he just rucks when there is noone better to do so

Have to get the ball to kick it, he chases, rarely tackles because he can't catch anyone and if he leads (often to the wrong spots) he needs to mark it.

He is only of value if he can relieve in the ruck....