Post Match Discussion - Round 15

[Dr. Gonzo 24,379]

I have just watched the Bail deliberate rushed behind clip - it is something that one sees several times every game of every round: why pick that one??

How many have been paid this year? Last year? Ever?

It seems so unjust, but typifies the pathetic inconsistent state of umpiring at AFL.

Not saying it cost us the game, but it certainly put more indecision into our deep defenders especially in the dying minutes, who may otherwise have rushed it through.

It was a blatantly incorrect decision. Don't try and understand it, it was just paid incorrectly.

The umpiring was terrible all day, we seemed to cop the worst of it but then again I'm obviously biased. The worst offender was the number 32 ump who looked all of 14 years old. Chamberlain was't too bad all things considered however did pay a couple of HTB howlers but I blame that on the direction from above of the HTB interpretations rather than the actual umpiring.

[chook fowler 19,693]

Listening to Roos presser I think he was pretty pizzed off with Watts lazy, careless disposal. Expect his ears to burn in the match review.

[Beetle 4,692]

It was a blatantly incorrect decision. Don't try and understand it, it was just paid incorrectly.

The umpiring was terrible all day, we seemed to cop the worst of it but then again I'm obviously biased. The worst offender was the number 32 ump who looked all of 14 years old. Chamberlain was't too bad all things considered however did pay a couple of HTB howlers but I blame that on the direction from above of the HTB interpretations rather than the actual umpiring.

Dropping the ball seems to be now a thing of the past...there were plenty today, especially in the second half that were overlooked.

If Barry's tackle on Murphy (happy to be corrected) on our half forward line in the last was paid...we may have a different result.

[Ethan Tremblay 31,187]

There was absolutely no physicality to the game, boring, bruise free football.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,268]

Our skill execution in the first 40 minutes was horrid. Surprisingly we cleaned up the clangers and got back into the game. Too many players who are not clean with ball handling, quick of decision or crisp of disposal. Two more quality mids required and they will make the world of difference.

Edited June 29, 2014 by big_red_fire_engine

[Ethan Tremblay 31,187]

It was a blatantly incorrect decision. Don't try and understand it, it was just paid incorrectly.

The umpiring was terrible all day, we seemed to cop the worst of it but then again I'm obviously biased. The worst offender was the number 32 ump who looked all of 14 years old. Chamberlain was't too bad all things considered however did pay a couple of HTB howlers but I blame that on the direction from above of the HTB interpretations rather than the actual umpiring.

Umpire 32 has to be held accountable. If I was that bad at my job I wouldn't have one, simple. Like most umpires, he wasn't there to simply umpire it, they now want to be a part of and influence it.

[P-man 13,366]

The umpiring was woeful but both teams were on the end of it.

[Ethan Tremblay 31,187]

The umpiring was woeful but both teams were on the end of it.

I agree

[DemonOX 8,823]

At training this week I would like to c Roos split the boys into two teams and play one on one accountable football.

Put pressure on the opposition and teach them how to react and dispose of the ball. By teach them I mean that Roos stops the play and says "no u should have gone this way or kicked it there"

Then follow it up by practicing skill, skills, skills and more skills.

I know he probably has been doing this but clearly we need more practice.

Edited June 29, 2014 by DemonOX

[rjay 25,233]

The umpiring was woeful but both teams were on the end of it.

I agree

Just a question on the rule book...is there a rule called unrealistic expectation or is it another interpretation just made up and accepted by the commentators. Just saw one in the Coll/Carl game.

I don't remember there being such a rule, maybe I'm wrong. Or is it what that modern day genius Der Wayne says is not a rule but an interpretation. Anyone out there able to help me understand the rules or have a Lamborghini that needs fixing.

Edited June 29, 2014 by rjay

[Allen Jakovich 516]

The last time we lost by a goal or less was Round 2, 2010.

Feels crap.

[Ethan Tremblay 31,187]

Just a question on the rule book...is there a rule called unrealistic expectation or is it another interpretation just made up and accepted by the commentators. Just saw one in the Coll/Carl game.

I don't remember there being such a rule, maybe I'm wrong. Or is it what that modern day genius Der Wayne says is not a rule but an interpretation. Anyone out there able to help me understand the rules or have a Lamborghini that needs fixing.

Apparently "unrealistic attempt to spoil" is a rule.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Ethan Tremblay

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Things you'll find on Demonland after a loss:

• No matter how he plays Watts is potted. One possession out of his 15-20 will be a turnover or he doesn't win a one on one contest and we spend pages dumping on the bloke and focusing on that.
• Toumpas will be blamed, directly or indirectly, for the loss and for our horrid drafting, even when he isn't even in the side.
• Everyone will ask for 'Player A' to replace 'Player B', even though 'Player A' has been not been doing much in the reserves side and offers little in the seniors. But they will be 'the answer' to our pace or disposal problems.
• Our horrible drafting
• Still horrible drafting
• We could have had Wines etc etc
• If Frawley has even an average game everyone will tear him down, claim he is gone and that we can't wait to get MORE top end picks, even though 90% of the posters have whinged about how bad our drafting has been.

Some of these aren't necessarily wrong, just terribly predictable. We lost because we still aren't that good of a side. Yes, the Roos factor has allowed us to double our win tally and be WAY more competitive than we would have hoped for this year. But games like today still highlight how far we have to go and that we still need to be awfully patient, even when we have a right to demanding some success from our team.

Our time will come, even if it's still a few years from now.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Wiseblood

[beelzebub 23,389]

Our skill execution in the first 40 minutes was horrid. Surprisingly we cleaned up the clangers and got back into the game. Too many players who are not clean with ball handling, quick of decision or crisp of disposal. Two more quality mids required and they will make the world of difference.

Skill execution..... yep we murdered any skill we had for a lot of this game

[rjay 25,233]

Apparently "unrealistic attempt to spoil" is a rule.

Interesting, so those players trying to mark are really trying to spoil.

[Ethan Tremblay 31,187]

Interesting, so those players trying to mark are really trying to spoil.

That's the only way I can see why a free kick is getting paid given "unrealistic attempt at a mark" isn't a rule.

Unless it's being paid as "in the back"?

Edited June 29, 2014 by Ethan Tremblay

[The heart beats true 18,182]

Seriously still lacking in gun midfielders and midfield depth

After Jones, Viney, Vince and Jones there is a massive drop off

Gonna be a big draft-trade period

You don't rate Dom Tyson?

I reckon if we don't want him we'll be able to trade him to any club in the land for the number 1 pick, such is his value.

He is going to be a gun.

[Cards13 9,117]

At training this week I would like to c Roos split the boys into two teams and play one on one accountable football.

Put pressure on the opposition and teach them how to react and dispose of the ball. By teach them I mean that Roos stops the play and says "no u should have gone this way or kicked it there"

Then follow it up by practicing skill, skills, skills and more skills.

I know he probably has been doing this but clearly we need more practice.

Unfortunately one weeks training means f all. They are professional, full time sports people and have been training like this for how long and still can't execute it. Will take a little longer ie into next year and beyond.

[P-man 13,366]

Things you'll find on Demonland after a loss:

• No matter how he plays Watts is potted. One possession out of his 15-20 will be a turnover or he doesn't win a one on one contest and we spend pages dumping on the bloke and focusing on that.
• Toumpas will be blamed, directly or indirectly, for the loss and for our horrid drafting, even when he isn't even in the side.
• Everyone will ask for 'Player A' to replace 'Player B', even though 'Player A' has been not been doing much in the reserves side and offers little in the seniors. But they will be 'the answer' to our pace or disposal problems.
• Our horrible drafting
• Still horrible drafting
• We could have had Wines etc etc
• If Frawley has even an average game everyone will tear him down, claim he is gone and that we can't wait to get MORE top end picks, even though 90% of the posters have whinged about how bad our drafting has been.

Some of these aren't necessarily wrong, just terribly predictable. We lost because we still aren't that good of a side. Yes, the Roos factor has allowed us to double our win tally and be WAY more competitive than we would have hoped for this year. But games like today still highlight how far we have to go and that we still need to be awfully patient, even when we have a right to demanding some success from our team.

Our time will come, even if it's still a few years from now.

Another guarantee on Demonland is someone jumping on their high horse to cast judgement on others, as if everyone bar them is an overly emotional, reactive wreck.

I don't begrudge others the right to be shitty over our drafting. Let's face it. The stagnation of Toumpas is rubbing salt into an already open wound. We desperately needed to nail that pick after our horrid history, and right now it's being kind to say that the jury is out.

Watts had an alright game, but just as some are too willing to bash him, there are some who are overly defensive of him. He was okay, and at times he was very good. He had some disappointing moments where you'd expect better from a player with his skills and he still struggles one on one.

Frawley might have kept Liam jones quiet, but Liam Jones is no star. His constant indecisiveness said to me that his head wasn't in it. I could be wrong.

Some of those player Bs do seem to have done enough, if the match reviews are anything to go by. Blease and Tapscott have it within them to be good AFL players. They have shown enough consistency to be given a chance before we sign their papers and ship them off, and I'd be very surprised if at least one of them isn't granted theirs next week.

I think everyone is aware that we are still a long way off being a decent side.

[Go the Biff 3,454]

Watts struggles to keep his feet and he made a couple of mistakes today - the biggest I believe being when he ran directly to the bench without looking at the ball, after Dunn played on from a kick in, hoping to bomb it to Watts on the flank. That was a total loss of concentration on his behalf and cost us a goal.

However he was far from our worst today and was valuable in some link up play. He has come a fair way from the last couple of years, no matter how many people still love to bash him.

That was entirely on Dunn. Watts was already headed for the bench with his back to play when Dunn played on from the kick in & booted it at Watts anyway. Dunn has been outstanding this year but he was deplorable today. That hot potato handball to an under pressure Grimes, failing to clear the zone by kicking long up the line, failing to either shepherd or run to space to provide an outlet. Plus he was extremely lucky not to be pinged for holding Crameri a few times. Horrid game.

I am a huge Col Garland fan but he had a stinker. Footscray players must have been lining up to play on him as it was just about a garanteed goal. Not sure what to do with him but he is in terrible form. And he knows it. See his reaction post game. He looked as sad & lonely as a bastid on Father's Day

Our midfield killed us. Too many blokes that don't really want the responsibility of presenting for the ball. Part of the reason Dunn & Frawley made errors was that no-one was working to give them something. Players just clump together & shuffle meaninglessly towards the nearest boundary. Nate Jones, Bernie Vince, Dom Tyson - all guilty today. And we missed Frawley up forward. At least he presents, even if he does get most of his possessions on the wing. We need a minimum three quality mids just to get close to having a decent midfield. That's not to deny we've improved significantly but we are still miles off the pace. We have one player in the team who gives us any outside run. Sadly that player is Matty Jones whose report card will always read A for Effort & E for Execution. While Watts made some characteristic one on one fails and some uncharacteristic kicking errors, he was the one player who when he got up into the midfield, looked like creating a passage of play that might see us score.

I'm as disappointed in the team today as I have been all season. The Dogs were rip for the picking & our midfield sat back & decided someone else could do the work

And Jihad Stadium is still a shitehole, albeit thankfully today, a shitehole with a roof

Edited June 29, 2014 by Go the Biff

[Pirlo 813]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/melbourne-coach-paul-roos-disappointed-with-players-and-himself-confused-with-rules/story-fndv8pdq-1226971310260

Absolutely teed off has Roosy, not sure if it's the right idea or not. Seems to me like he only just understands how bad some of these players are.

Facts are that our players didn't want it. At 6 minutes left in the fourth when Jamar put us in front, we were so golden. All we had to do was pen it in for a few minutes, pop one forward. What do you know, the Dogs get one back 25 seconds later.

[Pirlo 813]

Also, FFS.

When Toumpas is barely racking up double touches in the VFL and the two players taken immediately after him are starring - one is allowed to be frustrated.

It's no longer HERHERHER Wines > Toumpas.

It may not be Jimmy's fault, but we have overlooked half a dozen very good kids after him to draft one who isn't showing a whole lot.

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Another guarantee on Demonland is someone jumping on their high horse to cast judgement on others, as if everyone bar them is an overly emotional, reactive wreck.

Merely making an observation P-man. This is what we get after a loss. I was shattered after the game, but unlike others I don't stream on to here the moment the game is over to smash every player that I can remember from the game doing something bad. Nobody is wrong about our drafting, for example, yet it's brought up ad bleeding nauseum each time we lose. Like our efforts for the better part of a decade it gets old, fast. It's getting to the point where you don't need to read these threads anymore as the same posters waffle on about the same stuff each week.

[rjay 25,233]

That's the only way I can see why a free kick is getting paid given "unrealistic attempt at a mark" isn't a rule.

Unless it's being paid as "in the back"?

Might be paid for interference, the problem for me is that all these interpretations are coming into the game and they're not actual rules.

[beelzebub 23,389]

Watts may well have already been on his way to the bench but surely he still needed to be aware as anyone on the ground is still in play. Its this kind of game slip ups which kill us We have to be switched on for 100% of the game....every game.