The GW$ Debacle...

[dazzledavey36 49,002]

GWS are the laughing stock of the town why?

•They have a 6 million dollar tagger.. who isn't even that good at that either.. oh dear..

•They are known to give alot of verbal to opposition opponents who then only to turn back and laugh back at them. Who does these kids think they are? Spoilt arrogent brats.. what have they got to give lip service for??

•I played in a Ovens and Murray country game with fev in it that pulled 8000 people through the gates.. go figure.

•Why the hell would you start your All Australian FF in the backline!?

•Josh Kelly is the next Brownlow medalist who will make Melbourne pay aaand we were stupid for giving up pick 2 for Dom Tyson... Josh did NOT even touch the ball yesterday. . Wasn't injured. Another Melbourne draft mistake.

[Ethan Tremblay 28,470]

See what you've done Ethan. Moderator?

My apologies, I'm new to this and didn't know what I was doing...

Maybe GWS are just tanking...?

Edited May 25, 2014 by Ethan Tremblay

[PJ_12345 1,098]

GWS are the laughing stock of the town why?

•They have a 6 million dollar tagger.. who isn't even that good at that either.. oh dear..

•They are known to give alot of verbal to opposition opponents who then only to turn back and laugh back at them. Who does these kids think they are? Spoilt arrogent brats.. what have they got to give lip service for??

•I played in a Ovens and Murray country game with fev in it that pulled 8000 people through the gates.. go figure.

•Why the hell would you start your All Australian FF in the backline!?

•Josh Kelly is the next Brownlow medalist who will make Melbourne pay aaand we were stupid for giving up pick 2 for Dom Tyson... Josh did NOT even touch the ball yesterday. . Wasn't injured. Another Melbourne draft mistake.

Dont forget about that spud Salem.

I mean Kelly > Salem + Tyson

(People forget that he was blunt knives in that deal)

On a serious note though I would love to see a journalist actually publish what you have highlighted.

[bush demon 1,901]

How good would it be to be a fly on the wall when they talk renewed contract with Valdermort. I'm imagining them sliding a piece of paper over the table with two less zeros and Phat Phil suggesting there's been a typo. "And Phatty, we also thought that, rather than $100, 000 to simply google big footy, how about two felafels and a slab per game?"

who on here wouldn't take that kind of cash and guarantee their financial security for life? i say good on him. the one to blame is sheedy, who - spurned by the dees, and with the afl's monopoly money - used scully to try and do a job on us. (a la 2000!).y

[InVINCEable 358]

who on here wouldn't take that kind of cash and guarantee their financial security for life? i say good on him. the one to blame is sheedy, who - spurned by the dees, and with the afl's monopoly money - used scully to try and do a job on us. (a la 2000!).y

Don't make us to be the bad guys, we have every right to hate him, don't be "that guy", he chose the money over his fans, and we are the ones laughing.

[Deestroy All 14,262]

I hate GWS more than all of you, so it pains me to be the wet blanket... but when Kelly came on he copped a knock, right eye was almost swelled shut and perhaps he got rattled/concussed.

Toumpas once went a whole half without getting a single stat and had no injury at all, so I wouldn't be too quick to pot the kid.

I said to my mate when we were watching it, they really could use a classy clearance machine to compliment all their stick insect outsiders. But no, trade away Dom Tyson to recruit another skinny outsider. Idiots.

They're collecting KPPs and light outside runners up there, ones that only run one way going by the Richmond game.

I forgot what such an open forward line looked like. I don't buy the out of petrol excuse. They weren't pushing back from the first five minutes. Lazy, poorly coached or both.

Now that we have what we needed most in Tyson, let's take one of their skilled mids too.

As for Patton, not for me. Too much of a dinosaur when it comes to defensive pressure, he's huge and will never do what Dawes does. Can run off him all day.

Jeremy Cameron is not happy up there I'm told (very reliably), I'd throw a mil at him and see what happens.

It won't just be us knocking on their door, the big clubs won't need to shake very hard to get some kids to fall out of the nest.

Train wreck.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

The only smart thing GWS have done is recruit players mostly from Victoria so they have 10 clubs to negotiate with once they eventually become homesick.

[MadAsHell 4,088]

So who is going to merge with GWS for them to come good and how are the Bears going now?

Brisbane Bears were actually starting to come good before the merge.

Robert Walls got them to the finals for the first time in 1995 and then Swooper Northey took them to a Prelim in 96 and then the merge begun. It certainly helped them get their premierships though.

[MadAsHell 4,088]

The Great Contribution from Andrew Demetrio.

Rennovating linton St Princess Park and Vic Park would have been a far better strategy in my view.

Yeah I was always one to renovate Victoria Park, made perfect sense to me.

Right on a train line, only just outside the city and several clubs would be able to play a few home games there.

But alas we're stuck with these stupid stadium deals that we currently have instead.

[MadAsHell 4,088]

But anyway, back on topic GWS are a complete rabble and it's hard to see where the light at the end of the tunnel is for them.

It's going to be tough for them to attract good mature age players, and with few great role models and leaders for the kids they have up there, they're certainly coming from a long way back.

I reckon it will only take a light shake of the tree at seasons end and a lot may shake out. Think Lachie Plowman fits our needs basis pretty strongly, we may also make enquiries about Shiel & Treloar, but I expect they'll be tougher ones to get.

[bush demon 1,901]

, whi

Don't make us to be the bad guys, we have every right to hate him, don't be "that guy", he chose the money over his fans, and we are the ones laughing.

Scully's career hasn't really been helped by his 'recruitment' anyway. The AFL are trying to head-off soccer, so they set up some stupid thing called GWS. For teams like GWS and gold coast to succeed then the bottom clubs in victoria have to drop off. fortunately, in our case the player we lost was not what he was being built up to be so we emerged out of it ok. in the long run, 18 teams is a crowd-killing concept, and when the Aus. economy takes its next dip and the tv rights drop off, that's when the proverbial will hit the fan.

[pitmaster 3,064]

They beat us.

That's what really hurts.

But Mumford was at the top of his game and we had a second string ruck - no Jamar - and no forwards - it was Frawley's first outing up there.

That kid Devon had a day out and I seem to remember Hunt was pretty good too.

But Mumford monstered us and he was the key to the win whereas against Richmond he was back from injury and underdone.

Replay that game now and we'd win comfortably.

Scully was interesting. He really is only a cameo performer, and while he fired off a couple of laser-accurate passes most of his time was spent chasing tail. That's where his famous endurance comes in - defensive pressure running but I did not see any of it result in a tackle.

What a waste of money he has proved. We dodged a big bullet.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,499]

A few weeks ago after they beat us, and more impressively, Sydney - we were all lamenting the free ride they got with their concessions and how they would be a power team.

They get flogged and they are a debacle on the precipice of failing as a club?

Pls.

The got too many kids and wasted money on the $6m man. GC did not just get kids and spent their money on the best player I have ever seen.

And 'the experiment' will continue.

You can howl at the moon all you like - they are not going anywhere.

Beautifully summarises the situation and this thread. In particular, the ambiguity of last 5 words.

Those who think the GWS experiment is a disaster can read it one way and those who think GWS are a necessary part of the national development of the game can read it the other.

With both GCS and GWS the AFL was on a hiding to nothing. If the teams were too successful the AFL would be criticised and if they lost too many games they get criticised. If GWS can maintain the bulk of their squad I expect in about three year's time they'll be playing finals, along with GCS, Port Adelaide and Melbourne.

By then Sydney may have dropped out of the eight, but the AFL will have what it wants - and needs - a successful NSW-based team which will be worth a fortune in broadcast rights. Relying solely on Sydney to keep the nation's biggest TV viewing market interested in watching football is a formula designed to fail.

[pitmaster 3,064]

who on here wouldn't take that kind of cash and guarantee their financial security for life? i say good on him. the one to blame is sheedy, who - spurned by the dees, and with the afl's monopoly money - used scully to try and do a job on us. (a la 2000!).y

This argument that he had to go because who wouldn't take six million if it was offered is horsesh*t.

It's not like his choice was the six mill or nothing...it was more like $6 mill or $4.2 mill.

He was 'set for life' whatever he did.

[jnrmac 19,202]

Really? Got a link or something, cos I've never heard that before. Ever.

In fact:

"The AFL will announce a $15 million profit this week from record revenue of about $440 million for 2013."

http://www.afr.com/p/business/sunday/afl_doubles_profit_despite_controversies_nrvwCSKgoSmNVq9BwlTwuI

Not sure where you get your "information" WYL.

err, operating profit doesn't mean you aren't a not-profit business...

[pitmaster 3,064]

That's the problem though, BB. It's a rubbish location. I already have to drive 40 to 60 minutes every time I go north side for meetings (bloody creative industries), I don't want to have to navigate it on the weekend for the footy as well. I'd much prefer to just get the train in or drive into Richmond and walk. As soon as you go north side, for me, it's painful.

That's right. Bad location with very limited public transport and bugger all parking.

Princes Park is a remnant of the old suburban competition when the locals walked to the game.

Edited May 25, 2014 by pitmaster

[hardtack 10,127]

Beautifully summarises the situation and this thread. In particular, the ambiguity of last 5 words.

Those who think the GWS experiment is a disaster can read it one way and those who think GWS are a necessary part of the national development of the game can read it the other.

With both GCS and GWS the AFL was on a hiding to nothing. If the teams were too successful the AFL would be criticised and if they lost too many games they get criticised. If GWS can maintain the bulk of their squad I expect in about three year's time they'll be playing finals, along with GCS, Port Adelaide and Melbourne.

By then Sydney may have dropped out of the eight, but the AFL will have what it wants - and needs - a successful NSW-based team which will be worth a fortune in broadcast rights. Relying solely on Sydney to keep the nation's biggest TV viewing market interested in watching football is a formula designed to fail.

Agree with this. Suns are already looking like they may emulate the feats of their "older brother" Brisbane and I would not be in the least bit surprised to see them manage a threepeat; their improvement over the last 12 months has been nothing short of spectacular. GWS will start to do the same in a couple of years.

[Bossdog 2,002]

I have played, coached and been a part of 3 clubs at VFA and grass roots club level

I haven't seen one re cent, in any of those clubs that, was donated by the AFL.

The AFL mutter bulls**t about how much money they pour into "grassroots" footy and development of the game, but I am yet to see it

The AFL couldn't give a rats arse about suburban or country footy and you just have to see many clubs folding through lack of resourses such as footys, players, jumpers etc etc

So don't tell me the AFL are not just about money and profit.......It's all their about.....

[Little Goffy 12,726]

You'd have to laugh at Leon Cameron wouldn't you?

Jeremy Cameron starts off in the backline and Heath Shaw on Jack Riewoldt? Absolute [censored] imo.

Tanking?

Well, one way or another I'm pretty sure that effort was 'bringing the game into disrepute'.

I support, in principle, the expansion of AFL in Sydney, but gee, they've made a mess of it. Total lack of strategy. Massive hubris. All the good 'I've been the CEO forever so everyone will do it the way I just invented" traits.

[Little Goffy 12,726]

Agree with this. Suns are already looking like they may emulate the feats of their "older brother" Brisbane and I would not be in the least bit surprised to see them manage a threepeat; their improvement over the last 12 months has been nothing short of spectacular. GWS will start to do the same in a couple of years.

Sun's improvement has been impressive but ease up. So far this season they have beaten precisely the bottom six teams, plus the up-and-down North Melbourne.

How they go for these coming six rounds will tell us a lot more.

Adelaide (Adelaide)

Sydney (home)

West Coast (Perth)

Geelong (home)

Hawthorn (Tassie)

Collingwood (home)

If they are still in the top four at the end of that, then we're watching a true rising superteam.

On the other hand, they could easily finish that stretch without a win and not even in the top 8.

By the end of that

[jnrmac 19,202]

GWS had a deliberate recruitment strategy of harnessing the best youngtalent. They stocked up on draft picks and shocked most (incl the AFL) when they didn't recruit decent senior players to give themselves a chance of playing competitive footy sooner rather than later. They spent their money on Folau (wasted), Scully (wasted), Ward (good get) and Davis (not bad get). No star or AFL leader among them.

They know that their young guns will come out of contract and be targeted. Like Tyson they are prepared to change their talent around in order to get the right mix. When they lose talent they expect to get decent players in return. They are playing a long game and are quite deliberately following a strategy. Exhibit A their trading for the first 3 draft picks last year.

This is quite different to the 'traditional' route that GC have taken and which is now bearing fruit.

The AFL were apparently livid at the early GWS drafting and now GWS are going to be bumping around the bottom for some time AND take a lot of life support to stay liquid. Getting crowd support is going to be nearly impossible with performances like the ones they have shown this year (bar the Swans win - how the hell did that happen??).

Its no surprise GWS are terrible ATM. They will be that way for a long time and the AFL must by very worried about their ablity to field a competetive team, draw crowds and gain a viewing audience.

This is a terrible moneypit but with 60% of advertising revenue coming from NSW and SE Qld this is driving their decision making. They can't pull out now.....

[jazza 1,323]

My brother in law works for GCS,and is of the opinion " failure unless sustained top 8 finishes happen yearly."

He said the gold coast couldnt support the bears and wont support the suns.

He cited rugby union and league, surfing,older populace,bad place to base an AFL club.{hes had a bit of experience}.

He also commented that gws has every chance to survive because of the market place they are in,

Dont worry about them being belted the list they have is not to shabby,it will win games in the future and make a home for itself.

[bush demon 1,901]

This argument that he had to go because who wouldn't take six million if it was offered is horsesh*t.

It's not like his choice was the six mill or nothing...it was more like $6 mill or $4.2 mill.

He was 'set for life' whatever he did.

Yes but aren't we glad we didn't waste that 4.2m? Is my point.

[DEE fence 4,535]

Just merge them with Fitzroy.

Send Carlton to GWS, or maybe whatever's left of Essendon after ASADA finishes with them, serve their bloody supporters right.

[jackaub 1,402]

It just goes to show that you should never follow conventional wisdom for the sake of it.

The AFL, in regards to GWS and GC, were resorting to the same old tired lines they pushed in the 80's/90's to rationalize their decisions i.e. 'We need to grow the code if it is to survive/the only way for the game to survive is a national competition'. To be fair, they were legitimate points in 1986 (weren't 10 out of the 12 clubs nearly bankrupt?) It's just like how they told us that we needed to get rid of all the suburban grounds. They weren't big enough to sustain the 80k supercrowds that were needed to keep the game alive. Now we have two AFL stadiums in Melbourne and clubs are getting pantsed on the deal at Etihad. The one team in Victoria who kept it's local ground now make 500k on a 25k crowd. They haven't done to badly on field either.

Blowhards like John Elliot whinge about 'football socialism' but the truth is the AFL, in terms of selling a product to the consuming public, has been very much on the supply side of the economic debate with regards to GWS and GC. However, flooding the market with a new product only works if there is disposable income to spend on it. We are getting to the end of a mining boom (which the AFL should have seen coming). We are also going to pull a buttload of money out of the economy with the upcoming federal budget (which the AFL didn't see coming). Neither of this bodes well for a football team based in a less economically affluent area with even less interest in the AFL.

GC made more sense but was there a popular uprising in Western Sydney who wanted a team out there? It was almost pulled out of thin air. Don't forget that before the Swans moved to Sydney, they were at least playing exhibition and regular season games at the SCG. Did the Swans play a game out at Blacktown to start sowing the seeds? Nope.

The AFL will suffer because of their hubris. They were warned by a senate subcommittee that neither Gold Coast or GWS would work. To be honest, I think the Suns might work one day due to population movement and the lifestyle the Gold Coast offers. I can never see the Giants working.

I will feel sad for the people at the club who are busting a gut to make it work but I am drunk on my own schadenfraude when it comes to Kevin Sheedy. He has spent the last 50 years with a grudge against us (and to be fair, making us look like amateurs) and he thought he would continue it up there by taking Scully from us. He thought that the AFL would buy him Buddy Franklin and this would enhance the 'Sheedy legend'. The facts are it is because of his outdated coaching and vindictiveness to get back at Essendon that this club will take ten years at least to even look like a professional sporting outfit and not a monumental waste of time

Wouldnt be surprised if KS got a substancial kick back from some of the deals done while he was there. He is a big part of the problem. Comes across as an affable everyman Far from it!

Maybe he shared some of T$ largese along with old man Phil