Bombers scandal: charged, <redacted> and <infracted>

[Sir Why You Little 34,695]

I agree- and everyone here, myself included, would have called our club weak for doing that. Guess you have to know which battles to chose. I wonder how many clubs would have fought the tanking case if they were in our position?

No...Drug Cheating is a lot different to the Tanking issue...Re Tanking, we and others did it but there was no specific rule that was broken.

The WADA Code is specific.

[ManDee 7,091]

I agree- and everyone here, myself included, would have called our club weak for doing that. Guess you have to know which battles to chose. I wonder how many clubs would have fought the tanking case if they were in our position?

We were not found guilty of tanking. Did we tank? Of course we did. Was the penalty fair? Yes. Should other clubs also have copped it? Yes What should we do about it? Nothing, move on.

We were not weak we were pragmatic.

You are absolutely right when you say, you have to know which battles to choose. We did, EFC didn't. Remember what came out of our penalties. We received a fine, we received a hand out from the AFL, coaches and administrators were penalised, we received Paul Roos and Peter Jackson.

We took it for the greater good. EFC !!!!! what a bunch of narcissistic fools. Don't poke the bear!

[jnrmac 19,202]

I know i'm preaching to the converted but honestly it staggers me that some still don't get it. Tim Watson has been saying how all the other clubs are just pushing EFC and the players to resolve this but says 'what would you do, take a deal even if you know you are not guilty'? (or words to that effect).

That's the point. They don't have a clue what they took. The defence of 'we don't know what we took but we know it wasn't illegal' doesn't wash with ASADA. That they still spout this line is quite simply breathtaking.

Every sport in the world would try to get away with that. Imagine the Olympics if every athlete said I was duped by my coach. It would simply not function.

They signed waivers for a banned substance and the paper trail says dank ordered it and it was supplied. He told The AGE journalist that he had administered it. The club admitted they ran a bad regime,. Ziggy confirmed the major details. They even sacked the Weapon for administering a dodgy program.

They haven't got a leg to stand on. Everything todate is just fluff and stalling till they can turn their list over.

The world is watching and the world is sick of waiting for action. They are cooked.

[John Dee 438]

I need this view explained to me.

You are faced with a show cause notice and you have a court case where you are trying to have it declared illegal. That is about as consequential as anything.

[monoccular 16,281]

Can you prove that the players knew that they were taking banned substances? Again I'll be shocked

We cant. However they have to prove they didn't. It is kinda like guilty before proven innocent

^^ such are the agreements between players, AFL, ASAD and ultimately WADA

Im not sure they know exactly, well not convinced actually that ALL know exactly. I suspect many do or indeed have reasonably worked out what it was ( and shouldnt have been )

Theyre playing a game of bluff with 7-2 off suited !!

You surely have to think even as a half witted neanderthal that the game has changed again since Middleton's ruling. Anything and Everything told ( sold ) to them must be bunkum as it just got shot to hell and cast to the winds ( kinda poetic that bit...lol ) from high on hill

These guys are cannon fodder to the nth. Still gets me why they would take this stance as now theyre on a hiding to nothing. ASADA dont even need a strong hand to win here, just a hand that says. You , you and you took this and that. You can t prove you didnt so that alone is smacky smacky time but just to lay all doubts to rest read this. Youve been worse than just a naughty boy youve been stubbornly stupid.

All thats left really is .......is it the Lions or Crucifixion for them ??

For Paddy Ryder it could be both :-)

Seriously I am suprised the EFC Board haven't run away to Mexico...

I will not be suprised if at some stage players or families do not lay criminal charges...

.....to be near the Messiah as he continues his eternal quest for greater perfection in California?

[ManDee 7,091]

.....to be near the Messiah as he continues his eternal quest for greater perfection in California?

Redundant? Like his job next year.

[old dee 22,946]

I heard the following on SEN this morning (Patrick Smith and KB)

When the infraction notices are issued the players concerned have two alternatives.

- Accept the punishment

- do not accept, then it goes to an AFL committee that has to prove that the drug use has happened.

I was not aware of the way this is supposedly handled.

Under those circumstances if I was one of the players involved I would be hanging tough at this stage.

In other words the onus of proof shifts from them having to prove their innocence to the AFL having to prove them guilty.

The interesting comment came when discussing the situation at Cronula.

A player (name eludes me ) said he would never admit guilt, he said it numerous times in the media over journey took just 24 hours to change his tune once he saw the Show cause notice.

Accepted the punishment with little comment as to why he had changed his mind.

Now correct me if I am wrong

Same Mr Dank is involved

Same no records exist

Same ASADA investigating.

EFC players are in the clear!

When they see the evidence there may be a big change of heart I think.

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

I really do not get why so many people are happy about this case, the potential demise of EssendonFC is not something to be happy about. What about the fans? How would everyone on here be if we did this? I bet everyone would be ranting and raving about the way ASADA has handle this. I am not condoning what they did but this is very very bad for every club and fan.

Sorry but for nearly two years I've put up with idiotic essendon supporters and their stand by hird, AD is a liar and ASADA are incompetent arguments. Then their glorious club drags this on for so damn long and continues to beat the drums of ignorance. Essendon has hijacked our great game for far to long. I have no doubt their last card to play will be them asking for sympathy from every supporter from every club. My sympathy expired a long time ago.

[ManDee 7,091]

From Crikey - Essendon's wings melt as ASADA brings it crashing back to earth

The Federal Court is the most business-like of courts, and the lawyers who practise there are apt to take good and bad results with the same deceptive equanimity. On judgment days it can sometimes be difficult to tell the victor from the vanquished. But not this time.

Justice John Middleton’s comprehensive rejection of Essendon’s challenge to the legality of the investigation into its 2012 supplements program left the club and its reinstated coach as shaken as any elimination final thumping.

Edited September 23, 2014 by Whispering_Jack
Sorry but we can't quote the full article without Crikey's permission

[ManDee 7,091]

Tim Watson accuses Essendon rivals of hypocrisy over supplements saga

Tim Watson joins the deluded self righteous denial mongers.

Firstly, he blames the AFL and ASADA for it dragging out....pleeese! (We want our day in court so the truth can come out - then lets do everything we can so it can't)

Secondly, ASADA have dragged their feet and still haven't produced the evidence to the players (They don't have to - if they do, they will do it after Essendon & Hird confirm that they will not appeal the Middleton judgement)

The facts are, the EFC set out to cheat, they instituted a program with no checks or balances kept no records, ordered and paid for prohibited substances that they kept on the premises, injected players with unknown substances (thousands of injections) sacked key staff for allowing it to happen, insist that nothing untoward did happen, refuse to face the facts, and live in cloud cuckoo land. Who the F do these pricks think they are kidding.

Bring on the Tassie Bombers.

[biggestred 4,357]

That's unbelievable

[SaberFang 7,141]

The most hilarious assertion this biased imbecile makes:

"Watson was adamant every other club would fight tooth and nail to clear their names as Essendon has done."

Um, what? Your precious club just failed in a doomed legal case predicated entirely on getting themselves off the hook ON A TECHNICALITY. At no stage whatsoever have Essendon tried to clear their name. At every single junction they have destroyed records, put up roadblocks, hidden the truth, denied assertions without any evidence to back themselves up, and sought countless injunctions and lawsuits to delay ASADA from getting on with the process of discovering the truth.

As far as I'm concerned, Watson is utterly compromised and should not be providing a voice in the media on this subject. He's nothing more than a mouthpiece.

[John Crow Batty 8,279]

The most hilarious assertion this biased imbecile makes:

"Watson was adamant every other club would fight tooth and nail to clear their names as Essendon has done."

Um, what? Your precious club just failed in a doomed legal case predicated entirely on getting themselves off the hook ON A TECHNICALITY. At no stage whatsoever have Essendon tried to clear their name. At every single junction they have destroyed records, put up roadblocks, hidden the truth, denied assertions without any evidence to back themselves up, and sought countless injunctions and lawsuits to delay ASADA from getting on with the process of discovering the truth.

As far as I'm concerned, Watson is utterly compromised and should not be providing a voice in the media on this subject. He's nothing more than a mouthpiece.

And they did self report to kick things off. He is just preaching to the faithful to keep them in the dark and stalling the inevitable revolt.

[Outside fifty 967]

Watson is simply being a Father trying to look after his Sons interest. Sure it is breathtakingly hypocritical but understandable. What I find unacceptably galling is the complete lack of contrition from this corrupt organisation. Once I had some sympathy for the players, but my good will toward them has evaporated the longer this saga has dragged on. Now I find myself questioning the players integrity. How could they in all consciousness still standby such an unethical and grubby organisation, unless of course they too are devoid of a moral compass.

[Dr John Dee 1,057]

From Crikey - Essendon's wings melt as ASADA brings it crashing back to earth

Thanks for the link ManDee. Terrific last line.

It was always pretty obvious that while Essendon’s conga line of QCs had probably made plenty of money and big reputations from corporate and other civil law stuff, they didn’t know much about statutory and administrative law. It seems they didn’t bother trying to find out either (as I’ve mentioned earlier their ‘case’ against Andruska betrayed a comprehensive ignorance of some basic administrative processes and how they’re legitimated).

But that they didn’t even seem to try and acquaint themselves with Federal Court practice and protocols speaks volumes for their arrogance. It’s good to see that being called for what it is, even if Crikey doesn’t have much of a readership compared to those marvels of modern news invention like the Hun.

I wonder if they’ll be offering Little and Hird a discount on their fees.

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

Think he's angry now, wait till they take Jobe's Charlie away lol

[Whispering_Jack 28,023]

Thanks for the link ManDee. Terrific last line.

"Money well spent, if it cures them of their hubris."

[Redleg 37,906]

Spoke to Justice Middleton in a lift today. He is a nice man.

[Whispering_Jack 28,023]

Spoke to Justice Middleton in a lift today. He is a nice man.

Paul Little and James Hird disagree about the nice man part.

[beelzebub 22,264]

Paul Little and James Hird disagree about the nice man part.

they'll probably soon start disagreeing about much !!! lol

[beelzebub 22,264]

Watson is simply being a Father trying to look after his Sons interest. Sure it is breathtakingly hypocritical but understandable. What I find unacceptably galling is the complete lack of contrition from this corrupt organisation. Once I had some sympathy for the players, but my good will toward them has evaporated the longer this saga has dragged on. Now I find myself questioning the players integrity. How could they in all consciousness still standby such an unethical and grubby organisation, unless of course they too are devoid of a moral compass.

Watson is seriously compromised and a total hypocrite. He's failed as a father also in my book and he probably knows it.

He chose the club over Jobe.

[beelzebub 22,264]

Spoke to Justice Middleton in a lift today. He is a nice man.

What'd you say..."Hows that Hird ....bit of a lad eh ? "

[Whispering_Jack 28,023]

What'd you say..."Hows that Hird ....bit of a lad eh ? "

No, he said, "could you press the button for the 17th floor please, mate?"

[sue 8,463]

No, he said, "could you press the button for the 17th floor please, mate?"

17 hmmmm, must mean half of them will get off.

[beelzebub 22,264]

Leading lawyer Justin Quill tells us what the Bombers judgment means

quite a good run down of it all