Bombers scandal: charged, <redacted> and <infracted>

[Ouch! 2,041]

This is the major issue for me now (aside from Trengove's potential use of a banned substance obviously) as well as why hasn't McLardy or anyone from the MFC come out to strongly clarify this?

Its a good point, however I suspect that there are lingering issues from the tanking affair, and with the AFL recommending Peter Jackson as the CEO and doing a review of the footy operations etc... I suspect McLardy is reluctant to take on AD publicly at the moment.

Mind you, we haven't heard anything significant from the AFL since the 7:30 report went to air and the subsequent meeting MFC and the AFL where Bates was stood down. Perhaps someone reminded the AFL of everything that *was* disclosed as well as what wasn't....

Edited April 27, 2013 by Oucher

[Demon Dynasty 15,721]

"The AFL is furious that it only recently learnt that this drug was used"

Last time i looked a drug was something you ingested or is otherwise introduced into the body (ie., by injection). A cream is not a drug. It may contain substances and supplements within it to acheive certain chemical reactions within the skin/muscle tissue but it isn't a drug.

Trengove has nothing to worry about here and nor does the MFC. Open and shut case. This is the AFL looking to difuse and diflect the Bummers bombshell away from Golden Boy and his men any which way they can.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,533]

"The AFL is furious that it only recently learnt that this drug was used"

Last time i looked a drug was something you ingested or is otherwise introduced into the body (ie., by injection). A cream is not a drug. It may contain substances and supplements within it to acheive certain chemical reactions within the skin/muscle tissue but it isn't a drug.

Trengove has nothing to worry about here and nor does the MFC. Open and shut case. This is the AFL looking to difuse and diflect the Bummers bombshell away from Golden Boy and his men any which way they can.

A cream can definitely be classed as a drug - rubbing it on your skin so that it is introduced through your skin pores is the same as swallowing or injecting it.

[dees189227 10,903]

Well im blaming Scwab who I have noticed is holidaying in NY. But I dont get this cream. Why does Jack need to use anti obesity cream

Edited April 27, 2013 by dees189227

[jazza 1,323]

Well im blaming Scwab who I have noticed is holidaying in NY. But I dont get this cream. Why does Jack need to use anti obesity cream

it gets rid of wrinkly skin on the point of elbows and anywhere else you get soft wrinkly skin

scwabb was the one whu rubbed it in for jack and now has gone to ny to see a dermitologist for a hand growth problem

hope that answers your question

[Bossdog 2,002]

Where do I get some.......I could use it for my tummy......

[Sir Why You Little 34,685]

Very interesting Jigsaw article.

The AFL knew more about the MFC in february than it let on.

Vlad must be worried particularly after 4 corners got involved.

They don't make up stories.

[titan_uranus 22,618]

There is now only really one problematic issue at play, and that's the administering to Trengove of the anti-obesity drug in December. The key question is why we didn't tell the AFL about this.

To me, the facts as they stand lead to a more likely than not conclusion that Bates covered its use up. He didn't tell us because he was scared or stupid or whatever, and there was no reason for us to suspect otherwise. As a result, we didn't tell the AFL about it, because we didn't know and had no reason to suspect it might have been used. We'd done an investigation (Thurin-led) and told the AFL what we knew. We did what we could reasonably be expected to have done, and that's what's important. As the MFC insider who supposedly is leaking this stuff to The Age said, the AFL is the body with the investigative powers, not us. We did what we can/should have done; it cannot be our fault that Bates decided to be non-compliant and deceitful.

[Redleg 37,891]

I don't think your right about that - AOD-9604 was not OK for Trengove to use regardless of whether it was a cream or injected. It was a drug not approved for human use and therefore automatically prohibited for use.

If the article is true and we met with the AFL and divulged the clubs relationship to Dank then the AFL has severely misrepresented this over the last week and our club needs to be vocal about taking issue with this publicly. The AFL has intimated we told them we had no dealing with Dank whatsoever whereas this is simply not true - we told them basically everthing except for the fact he recommended a cream for Trengove's foot which had the prohibited substance, something the club alleges Bates failed to reveal to them when queried. I find it far more plausible Bates either hid this knowledge or flat out failed to realise it may be an issue than he simply misled the club altogether about his relationship with Danks yet the AFL (and their lap dogs in the media) have made out we covered up and lied about any relationship. It is a disgrace and I would expect nothing less than McLardy coming out to publicly state so and demand the AFL publicly clarify this.

Don't hold your breath. When the AFL official Mifsud admitted he lied when he called our Coach a racist, he apologised when he was caught and that was it. There was nothing from the AFL top brass.

Who knows what the damge was to our club and coach. Clearly the AFL couldn't give a rat's tossbag. The we get done $500k in a farce as the whole footy world agrees.

Corporate Governance my arse.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

When the AFL official Mifsud admitted he lied when he called our Coach a racist, he apologised when he was caught and that was it.

Have you got a link to these facts?

[Ted Lasso 16,928]

I am praying and keeping all fingers crossed that Trengove doesn't cop any serious punishment for this, a two year ban would be a disaster for everyone

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Last time i looked a drug was something you ingested or is otherwise introduced into the body (ie., by injection). A cream is not a drug. It may contain substances and supplements within it to acheive certain chemical reactions within the skin/muscle tissue but it isn't a drug.

Trengove has nothing to worry about here and nor does the MFC. Open and shut case.

I can take it that you have nothing to do with the medical profession.

Or you were feeding Danks his lines with Bates

[Sir Why You Little 34,685]

I am praying and keeping all fingers crossed that Trengove doesn't cop any serious punishment for this, a two year ban would be a disaster for everyone

i doubt it will go that far, but to lose our 1-2 picks from 2009 and cop a $500,000 fine for being not guilty would just top it all off i agree!!

[Redleg 37,891]

Its a good point, however I suspect that there are lingering issues from the tanking affair, and with the AFL recommending Peter Jackson as the CEO and doing a review of the footy operations etc... I suspect McLardy is reluctant to take on AD publicly at the moment.

Mind you, we haven't heard anything significant from the AFL since the 7:30 report went to air and the subsequent meeting MFC and the AFL where Bates was stood down. Perhaps someone reminded the AFL of everything that *was* disclosed as well as what wasn't....

McLardy may also be a better poker player than he is given credit for.

We accept the tanking result. Why, when we had them cold according to the AFL's and our legal advice.

We sack our CEO the day after we say there will be no sackings. Why?

We instal the AFL preferred man as interim CEO, when we had our own interim CEO. Why?

We don't bash the AFL over this latest scandal, even though we have again been pilloried in the press and our brand damaged. Why?

The answer to the why's, could well be that Don is happy with the cards he is being given, at each step by the AFL. There is such a thing as future grants, good draws, priority picks, assistance with sponsorships etc, etc, etc.

[daisycutter 28,635]

I don't think thats the case though - as far as has been reported if a substance or drug is not specifically "approved" then athletes should not be using it whether it has been approved for human use or not.

disagree dg, but neither of us are the experts

[Redleg 37,891]

Have you got a link to these facts?

RR I am on holidays using a computer on restricted use.

I recall the press conference where Mifsud appeared and apologised to Neeld and the MFC, for calling Neeld a racist and nothing was offered by the AFL. Do you recall it in any different way than I do?

I am sure you could find a link if you search back through Mifsud apology to MFC/Neeld. It was about mid year or slightly earlier last year.

Found one - Davey, Mifsud reconcile

AFL community engagement manager Jason Mifsud and Melbourne midfielder Aaron Davey have brokered peace at a mediation hearing on Tuesday morning in wake of discredited claims Demons coach Mark Neeld had offended his indigenous players.

Davey had wanted to meet with Mifsud last week but the hearing was delayed until today after Mifsud was given time off. Mifsud had been revealed as the source of a blog by former St Kilda coach Grant Thomas claiming Neeld had interviewed his Aboriginal players as a group, and the rest of his playing list individually, during the pre-season.

Davey, the Demons most senior indigenous footballer, had denied he was Mifsuds source. The AFL last week maintained he was.

In a statement released by both parties yesterday, Mifsud said: "I have apologised to Aaron personally for the distress this has caused him and his family and I am pleased we were able to fully discuss the matter."

Mifsud had offered his resignation last week but now says he will remain in the role.

[Demon Dynasty 15,721]

I can take it that you have nothing to do with the medical profession.

Or you were feeding Danks his lines with Bates

I'm sure you're a fully qualified Medico RR. I'll defer to your more learned judgement as always.

If Trengove goes for applying a topical cream, part of which has a questionable weight loss chemical that isn't on the Wada banned list (only caught via a "catch all" sub clause introduced Jan 2011) then the whole AFL list would be at risk of being banned.

As for your last line i see you haven't changed your spots RR. Always playing the man not the ball.

[heartbeatstrue 57]

Well im blaming Scwab who I have noticed is holidaying in NY. But I dont get this cream. Why does Jack need to use anti obesity cream

Here's what a quick google turned up on the therapeutic efficacy of the drug AOD9604. Easy to see the attraction for the doc treating Trengove:

AOD is a peptide 15 amino acids long which mimics a small portion of the growth hormone that has the fat reducing effects (increases fat metabolism). It works by mimicking the way natural growth hormone regulates fat metabolism but without the adverse effects on blood sugar and growth that is seen if unmodified growth hormone is given. It stimulates lipolysis (break down of fat) and inhibits lipogenesis (non fat food being stored in the body as fat).

AOD has been shown to target abnormal fat stores, and to prevent fat from being stored in the cells. Studies have shown that it reduces the most stubborn fat regions (like abdominal fat). It also has other benefits including increasing muscle mass, increasing IGF-1 (insulin growth factor) in a positive way to metabolise fat, and increase the amount of energy burned for the same amount of activity.

Other benefits which have been shown include an improvement in osteoarthritis. It does this by increasing cartilage and collagen production in the joints to increase the thickness and repair some of the damage. It has been shown to improve muscle, tendon and ligament repair, improve bone density which may have positive effects on osteoporosis.

AOD is given daily either as an injection or transdermal cream. The effects are accumulative and continue to improve while taking it.

As far as ASADA's concerned, it won't matter whether it's administered by injection or cream. Just injecting sounds worse when emblazoned across a Caro headline. The cream is the sort of stuff the Top Gear boys rub on their tummys each night.

It was discovered by Monash Uni scientists and is subject to a US patent.

[71 Molloy 266]

At least we now know where Caro got her information about the Dank link.

AFL giving her a nice drip feed.

Edited April 27, 2013 by 71 Molloy

[titan_uranus 22,618]

I am praying and keeping all fingers crossed that Trengove doesn't cop any serious punishment for this, a two year ban would be a disaster for everyone

He won't.

As the article notes, any attempted charge from ASADA would be met with a significant legal challenge (this goes for Trengove as well as the Essendon players). IMO, I cannot see how Trengove can be penalised if he was instructed of the drug's safety by Dank/Bates/anyone else with relevant seniority.

The previous CEO (Mr Ings) of ASADA claimed that players have a duty of care to suss out a drug's status for themselves. That's an ignorant view, one which I'm sure would easily be rejected by a court. Seriously, do we expect 17/18/19 year old kids to be calling ASADA and asking for information when their club doctor has told them the substance is OK?

IMO, in the washup of this all, no Essendon player or Trengove (or any other Melbourne player) will be prosecuted or guilty of anything. The people upon whom the charges will fall will be the administrators of either/both club.

[Ted Lasso 16,928]

He won't.

As the article notes, any attempted charge from ASADA would be met with a significant legal challenge (this goes for Trengove as well as the Essendon players). IMO, I cannot see how Trengove can be penalised if he was instructed of the drug's safety by Dank/Bates/anyone else with relevant seniority.

The previous CEO (Mr Ings) of ASADA claimed that players have a duty of care to suss out a drug's status for themselves. That's an ignorant view, one which I'm sure would easily be rejected by a court. Seriously, do we expect 17/18/19 year old kids to be calling ASADA and asking for information when their club doctor has told them the substance is OK?

IMO, in the washup of this all, no Essendon player or Trengove (or any other Melbourne player) will be prosecuted or guilty of anything. The people upon whom the charges will fall will be the administrators of either/both club.

Thanks mate, i am feeling much better about things, it's abit hard not to be concerned with the AFL looking like it will take any excuse it can get to destroy the club.

[Cards13 9,117]

The athletes/players have an ownership to know what they use/ingest. The I didn't know what it was excuse doesn't work.

[sue 8,463]

I haven't followed all this carefully, so sorry if this has been answered before:

but is there evidence that JT actually purchased and applied the cream? Or is the only evidence the text message saying he should go and get some?

[Mono 454]

"The AFL is furious that it only recently learnt that this drug was used"

Last time i looked a drug was something you ingested or is otherwise introduced into the body (ie., by injection). A cream is not a drug. It may contain substances and supplements within it to acheive certain chemical reactions within the skin/muscle tissue but it isn't a drug.

Trengove has nothing to worry about here and nor does the MFC. Open and shut case. This is the AFL looking to difuse and diflect the Bummers bombshell away from Golden Boy and his men any which way they can.

A cream can definitely be classed as a drug - rubbing it on your skin so that it is introduced through your skin pores is the same as swallowing or injecting it.

...........

As far as ASADA's concerned, it won't matter whether it's administered by injection or cream. Just injecting sounds worse when emblazoned across a Caro headline. The cream is the sort of stuff the Top Gear boys rub on their tummys each night.

..............

Quote from SMH:

"Metabolic Pharmaceuticals, which owns the drug, says US authorities are close to approving it for general use in food.

Chief executive David Kenley told CBD AOD-9604 was already available over the counter in Australia as the active ingredient in a cosmetic cream called Bodyshaper."

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/guests-scarce-at-virgin-wedding-20130423-2icv9.html#ixzz2Rd4POC5M

If its available as an over the counter cream in Australia, it can hardly be classified as "not approved for human use". (or is that just for injecting?)

Seems to be a grey area here, at least as far as using the compound in a cream.

Presumably this is the stuff here: http://elixia.com.au/range:bodyshaper

[Sir Why You Little 34,685]

The athletes/players have an ownership to know what they use/ingest. The I didn't know what it was excuse doesn't work.

Yes you are right, But let's presume Trengove rang the club Doc Bates and asked "Is this AOD cream ok to use?"

"Not a problem Captain" replies Bates.

Does that clear Jack and put the clamps on the Doc??

If it doesn't it should.