Which is worse: our skills or decision making?

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

Decision making is over rated. If your teammates work hard to make good options, the decision becomes obvious and easy. The skills also become easier to execute because the option is obvious and easy...

Lol, sorry I got a good laugh from that comment

[P-man 13,366]

You know how "success breeds success"? We're the complete opposite of that.

A guy like Tom McDonald gives me some hope for a brighter future. Not the most skilled, far from the best kick, but is getting the most out of himself every week and is emerging as a potential A grade defender.

Whether we can hang on to him is another question, but while we can still produce players like T Mac, there is hope for the MFC yet.

[Pates 9,660]

For me I think it's the skills that are letting us down the most, there are times where we're getting into good runs and positions but stuff t up with a dead basic kick or handball.

[Jesse Christ 2,884]

I know we could list reasons why we have been so poor for so many years.

Skills, decision making, recruiting, contracts, training facilities (Junction Oval), coaches, finances, culture, etc.

What I want to understand is why has this happened for so long and how has this become the norm?

I really don't get why just about every other club has made basic, simple, responsible decisions that have moved their club forward and created some on field success. Or at least some form of positive hope. Why do we seem to go from bad to worse year after year? Why have club structures not created a unity of purpose and drive that has resulted in on field success. False dawns are hard to take.

I know we are much better off financially and Jimmy did a great job of pointing us in the right direction. But we keep falling further back in what is an ever-more cut throat, supporter-led competition. Yes, it's not that simple a matter that can be explained here.

People can point to Port Adel or Brisbane (or even back to Fitzroy) and say they struggle/d as well. But I know several Bris and Port fans who wouldn't want to be in our shoes for a million bucks.

It's getting very hard to keep supporting this club. But I will, of course, persist. The alternatives are too unthinkable. I love this Club, as did my father and grandfather.

Exactly what I was feeling!

What I take solace in, and suggest you do to- is we have a beauty of a full forward in Mitch Clark (even though he was taken from us for the rest of the season, such is life I guess), we have a solid backline with an awesome full back and a very promising backman in Mcdonald coming through, we have some Xfactor in Howe, we have some promising players in a few positions around the ground- it's just the midfield we sorely lack in.

This upcoming draft (and I am getting a little sick of looking to drafts to fix our issues) is CRUCIAL for us. We need jets- we need them to be successful picks and we need them to stay and become ensconsed in all things MFC and we need them to be apart of and help us cultivate a new hard edge culture.

These early picks- the $ully compos- MUST be fruitful. They have to be hits otherwise there will be more pain to come. No pressure

[Macca 16,972]

I know we could list reasons why we have been so poor for so many years.

Skills, decision making, recruiting, contracts, training facilities (Junction Oval), coaches, finances, culture, etc.

What I want to understand is why has this happened for so long and how has this become the norm?

I really don't get why just about every other club has made basic, simple, responsible decisions that have moved their club forward and created some on field success. Or at least some form of positive hope. Why do we seem to go from bad to worse year after year? Why have club structures not created a unity of purpose and drive that has resulted in on field success. False dawns are hard to take.

I know we are much better off financially and Jimmy did a great job of pointing us in the right direction. But we keep falling further back in what is an ever-more cut throat, supporter-led competition. Yes, it's not that simple a matter that can be explained here.

People can point to Port Adel or Brisbane (or even back to Fitzroy) and say they struggle/d as well. But I know several Bris and Port fans who wouldn't want to be in our shoes for a million bucks.

It's getting very hard to keep supporting this club. But I will, of course, persist. The alternatives are too unthinkable. I love this Club, as did my father and grandfather.

There's always a tangible answer if you look hard enough 'Moonshadow'

Mine is 'Free Agency' . For others it might be the National Draft . Free Agency is a brand new thing for our sport . And the good thing is that it's going to happen every year . It gives clubs without much talent (and lots of Salary cap room) a chance to bring in 'Instant' quality experienced players and not have to give anything up to get these players (except a fair wad of cash as an inducement)

The key is getting the right type of player or players . And ....we can front load contracts in order to re-visit the free agency table every year . The 'Restricted' free agents are the ones we should target IMO , because you can get (in theory) at least 4/5 years of service from these players . Quite a few of the free agents that are available this year are 'A' grader's . That's what we need . In theory , we could bring in 4 to 6 very good experienced players by the end of 2013 .

I expect our club to be fairly big players come free agency time . In a lot of ways we have to be . Just watch the enthusiasm amongst our supporters increase if we snag a couple of experienced midfielders . Plus maybe Boak in a trade .

And back on thread topic - both are major issues - can't split 'em .

Edited July 8, 2012 by Macca

[biggestred 5,093]

Lol, sorry I got a good laugh from that comment

laugh all you want, but if your team mates are presenting instead of standing still it makes it much easier to make a decision!

[pitmaster 3,559]

You know how "success breeds success"? We're the complete opposite of that.

A guy like Tom McDonald gives me some hope for a brighter future. Not the most skilled, far from the best kick, but is getting the most out of himself every week and is emerging as a potential A grade defender.

Whether we can hang on to him is another question, but while we can still produce players like T Mac, there is hope for the MFC yet.

Re-signed for two years last week P Man, so at least rest easy on that score.

Edited July 8, 2012 by pitmaster

[robbiefrom13 887]

A lot of the mistakes were in the first quater

confidence, perhaps? and as the game goes on they realise they actually aren't that bad, or the opposition isn't that good (except when it is Hawthorn or some team that isn't making mistakes - then we never do get going) or we pull out some good individual efforts and they walk taller for a while till they tire...

elsewhere I've speculated on anger being the ingredient likeliest to change things for us. Stuff all those mental attitude/expectation factors, if they just got seriously [censored] off at being everyone's punching bag, and went mental... If only we could get Smithy to talk to them for a few weeks... But today, go Clark-like; hurl themselves at it and who cares if someone gets in the way, you're just not stopping for that. How much abuse can you take? - you either end up a serial victim, or you bellow and kick the can over...

Edited July 9, 2012 by robbiefrom13

[Sir Why You Little 37,045]

Both are absolutely deplorable.

[Hells Gates 505]

Our skills or decision making in recruiting?? I'd have to say both!

[poita 3,902]

There is a bit of chicken and egg around these, although both are equally woeful.

Our skills look bad because we don't take the first option and end up putting ourselves under unnecessary pressure. Our decision making looks bad because we don't have the confidence to execute basic skills under pressure and end up second guessing ourselves.

Plus the support actions, eg shepherding, blocking, leading, etc that other teams do so well are never displayed by our players.

[Biffen 12,943]

Decision making is a skill.

Making the right one is based on availabitity of guys moving to the right position.

In the "V" of the player attacking the ball. V is for vision

I.e 45 degrees either side of the player getting the ball and moving past at the right moment .

The guys who make it into the V of the contest are the ones who get the easy kicks.

If you are running up the ground and the player running up to meet you is beside the marking target as the ball arrives he is useless .

We are not much good at creating these attacking options by hand or foot because we are worried about our opponent.

As we start to get more winners around the ground then players can peel off with confidence.

[Juicebox 628]

Decision making is over rated. If your teammates work hard to make good options, the decision becomes obvious and easy. The skills also become easier to execute because the option is obvious and easy...

I hear what you're saying. At the moment the players aren't working hard enough to spread and provide a target. This doesn't do the players skills/decision making justice since they have nothing on offer and are forced to kick it to a contest.

But what's the difference? Hitting a stationary target from 30m seems to be too big an ask for most of the players...

[McQueen 17,864]

you are not alone Moonshadow, there are plenty of us with similar feelings.

Hang in there it has to get better

it does doesnt it

Is that a small hint if optimism creeping in there, old dee?

Wonders will never cease...

[old dee 23,792]

Is that a small hint if optimism creeping in there, old dee?

Wonders will never cease...

Yes McQueen I am confident the MFC will get It right just unsure I will live long enough to see it Mate

[Scotty 3]

I think both go hand in hand, I am sure you all have witnessed a player making a good decision but lacking the skill to deliver the footy thus resultin in either a very ugly passage of play, or a turnover. More of the latter has me teaching my kids new words they don't need to know just yet.

Player confidence is down, I am seeing players placing themselves under 'percieved' pressure making terrible decisions with poor execution.

[71 Molloy 266]

Decision making is over rated. If your teammates work hard to make good options, the decision becomes obvious and easy. The skills also become easier to execute because the option is obvious and easy...

Could not disagree more. Goes against the 'train the decision' mantra heavily pushed by most clubs these days.

Take a elite decision maker with average dosposal over average decision maker with elite skills anyday.

[Bitter but optimistic 22,241]

Could not disagree more. Goes against the 'train the decision' mantra heavily pushed by most clubs these days.

Take a elite decision maker with average dosposal over average decision maker with elite skills anyday.

So he can use his "average" disposal skills to give the ball off to the opposition? We are very good at that!

[old dee 23,792]

Could not disagree more. Goes against the 'train the decision' mantra heavily pushed by most clubs these days.

Take a elite decision maker with average dosposal over average decision maker with elite skills anyday.

Trouble is 71 Molloy we have a lot of players who are poor decision makers with below average skills.

[P-man 13,366]

Re-signed for two years last week P Man, so at least rest easy on that score.

Good point. I'm hoping we can hold on to him long-term, when we actually resemble an AFL footy team.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Clint Bizkit, June 11:

Attention all Melbourne players: When you mark the ball, do not turn your back on play. Turn around to face your forward line and run backwards quickly to give yourself room to kick and see all options forward.

Mark Neeld, July 9:

“There were some basic fundamentals, like your Auskick stuff [that couldn’t be achieved],” he said.

“Like, when you mark the ball, it’s a really good idea to get back quickly from the man on the mark, and then be moving forward when you kick it."

This really grinds my gears, you wouldn't see most players in the TAC Cup not getting the fundamentals right of moving back off the mark quickly, yet for too long Melbourne players have refused to do this.

[Clark_Kent 315]

I don't think there is anything as frustrating as watching us play right now.

I am constantly asking myself time and again WTF a player is thinking when they stuff something up.

I just hope that as their confidence grows so will their skill level.......maybe.