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Yeah doesn't look too serious, swelling has gone done a lot and the physios don't think it's anything serious. He thinks he might be able to play for Casey Sunday.

I've lost some respect for the Demonland faithful based on some comments about Pederson. If you can't see his contribution, you have rocks in your head. Zero chance Pederson gets directly replaced by Weeds. Pederson is respected by opposition defenders, as such he demands a key defender. This has allowed Hogan to thrive. Pederson is an incredibly smart and instinctive player, and is an asset to the current team structure. Dropping him would be a huge mistake. Teams know he has the capacity to kick 3-4 goals, can take a contested mark, has pace, can tackle, and has very good vision. Dare I say teams are more focused on defending Pederson than Hogan, because they know that Hogan naturally floats through the middle at random points. As it stands, he adds complexity to our forward line structure. Replacing him with an inexperienced, one dimensional (as it stands) player in Weiderman would be bordering on tanking. By all means, bring in Weeds. But not at the expense of Pederson.

Thread deserves a bump after his sensational game on the weekend. And to think some on here wanted him dropped after one quiet game. He's still criminally under-rated, on this board and in the broader footy community. Jeff Garlett: 169 games / 299 goals Cyril Rioli: 187 games / 274 goals

Was that the week he missed with split sides?

I think many people on this site have amnesia about what Pedersen actually did in the first two rounds. His passing, body work seemingly goes unnoticed by many here..

Tim Watson said if Cyril had a game like Jeff did on Saturday night, the media would talk about it for weeks, but Jeff hardly get a mention.

Is that the same Mick Jagger who played Lizzie Birdsworth in Prisoner?

That's great news.He doesn't need the sort of early career injury issue hampering his chances of getting his chance to play seniors. For what its worth i have real faith he'll make it. Apart from his competitiveness and strength in the air he is a reliable kick and whilst for all players that's important it is critical for defenders. I reckon he i competing with Frosty, and whilst Frost is ahead at this stage his kicking is his biggest issue.

Admittedly I've had a few and am writing this in a cab on the way home. I've watched the game quarter by quarter throughout this week on the way to work. Salem was not anywhere near as bad as people are suggesting. Often very clean and effective, there was not way he was getting dropped. Wagner did a lot right as well. If you were looking at it objectively, out of the back 6, hunt was definitely the one to make way.

Went to training with my 2 year old son, so may have missed a few things, but hally to try and answer questions where I can. Hogan trained for the first 2/3 of the session, sometimes in the main group, sometimes doing things off to the side. Left the track earlier though. was told he WILL play though. The training itself was pretty basic, but they were working pretty hard and trying to work on some specifics. Could see they were working on their kicking skills, practicing all types ignored kicks in a drill. Also spent a fair bit of time in their groups, doing specific work on their areas. Such as backs doing 1 on 1 stuff and practicing punching/ marks etc. was really impressed with Oscar in those drills. Surprisingly. Jetta was the best small defender in the 1 on 1's. the final drill was more game based with 10 on 10 or so. Practicing pressing up as defenders and trying to cause turnovers, while the forwards were working on quick ball movement, short/ hard passes through the middle and getting out the back or a quick goal. They had to work really hard in this drill as there wasn't much rest. Overall was a simple session, but I was impressed with a few. Notably Oscar on defence, weideman also showed me a bit. Looked much bigger and more athletic to me. Of the current players in the side, I like harmes and petracca with their speed and power and skill and fritsch trained well too. Finally, spoke to my club source. He said that they won't change much this week. Most likely ins are frost and Kent if anything, but they need to find someone to drop (i know many of us have opinions on who that should be) and some of the borderline guys did well last week. Guys such as bugg/ Wagner etc. will always be the ones on the block. Also heard that they are very excited with weideman and his progress, so when he is fitter (considering he missed some of the pre season) he will come in as a forward / ruck. Apologies for any mistakes as this was done on my phone while the son sleeps!!

I love Hunt but his form over JLT and the first 2 rounds has been very average

I can't believe the changes. Pedersen has been ok and Hunt puts in 1 shocker and is dropped while Goody's pets Wagner and Bugg continue to get a game. UNBELIEVABLE Salem is very lucky too didn't see him anywhere near Beams on the TV. B: LEVER, O.MCDONALD, JETTA HB: HIBBERD, FROST, LEWIS C: VINCE, OLIVER, HARMES HF: MELKSHAM, PETRACCA, NEAL-BULLEN F: GARLETT, HOGAN, FRITSCH FOLL: GAWN, TYSON, JONES IC: SALEM, WAGNER, BUGG, KENT

I was going to say Pedo is stiff. I think I’ll go with Pedo is unfortunate.

Kent is classy, quick and is a runner who kicks goals. Frost plays tall and is also a runner who can be very quick, insurance for Brown, but also makes us more attacking. Pederson has been just ok and Hunt seems to be low in confidence. Good changes.

Pleased for Kent. To be honest I'm not a great fan, but he's done it hard through what must have been a difficult period, so good luck to him.

He was on top of the list in the “ 9 things we learned from Round 2 “ article on Monday. Stated Jeffy should be in the discussion as the league’s best small forward.

He's a bloody star. His performance didn't go totally unnoticed in the media. Robbo gave him some love on 360 last night, including a laugh at Carlton's expense.

No reason...other than we don't seem to be able to pummel any team into the ground. Even when we get 7 goals up with half a match to go.

We should treat every game as if it is an AFLX Round Robin match.

I got down there today. Yokozuna did a wonderful summary. Here are some little observations from me: I watched the re-hab group very closely. They worked with Crossy, Garlo (who did a lot of the work the boys) and a few others. This group consisted of Viney, Tommy Mac, Patty McKenna and Jesse. Jesse looked a bit ginger and seemed to be conscious of a groin/upper leg issue. He moved pretty slowly but later joined the main group and looked okay. Viney and McDonald worked for about 45 minutes. They did some dynamic stretching, run throughs, ladder work, kicking, shots at goal and some interval running. It was far from intense and both seemed to be in good spirits. Viney had on these Nike shoes with the most cushioning in a runner I had ever seen. Weid is doing all the work with the ruck group now. He spent a lot of time with Flip and Kingy working with Greg Stafford doing agility stuff. Benny Matthews took the session. It was in beautiful conditions and the mood was very upbeat.

I spell his name differently to you, but i agree....carry on.

I don’t mind the in’s. Kent can be dangerous and looks fitter this year. Also knows he’s playing for his career so deserves a look for a few weeks to see if he will get an extension. Frost and Omac to man the talls, Jetta the small and we get rebound from Hibberd, Lever and Lewis - along with run from Frost. So his inclusion is fine. The outs however I can’t have. Hunt had a mare last week but has runs on the board from last year. Can play forward (dangerous when tried last year), mid and back. Has X factor and we all love his pace. Pedo just plays a role. Not great but he competes. We have the worst plan going forward where we bomb it long all the time. We need another tall down there unless we finally lower our eyes. If we bomb it long to Hogan one on three all weekend and watch them easily rebound it out from uncontested intercept marks I’ll spew. Keep it simple Goody, you cost us finals last year playing Weid early on whilst Pedo killed it in the twos and you have already cost us 4pts round 1 not playing Tyson over Maynard. With these two ins it has to be Wags and Bugg out

What I find a bit confusing about the selections is Goody's comments. Coach Simon Goodwin said Frost and Kent’s recent efforts for Casey couldn’t be ignored. “They’ve been in unbelievable form at VFL level and they’ve been knocking down the door for a few weeks now,” I didn't think the VFL had even started, and that all we've done is play some practise matches haven't we? I thought our first actual match is this weekend against Coburg?? Didn't think we'd have any changes, and honestly am not fussed with who is in and out, but the comments to justify the inclusions .... just sounds like a guy spouting 'footy cliches'

I’d be willing to put my house on the fact that Frost will not be playing forward

Whether we like it or not, the AFL operates a form of socialism (via the draft, salary cap and distributions from HQ). To do otherwise would see the competition fail with the strongest clubs eventually preventing the weakest clubs from ever improving their position. If that were to occur, the competition would inevitably die. Nevertheless, within this framework clubs need to be accountable for their actions, including financial strength and good governance. We should not, however, confuse real-world economic practice with the needs of a sport like AFL.

you are a brave, brave man

The more I think about this decision, the more I hate it. My 7 year old son has probably never seen a poker machine in his life, and certainly wouldn't know what to do with one. For most people they are out of sight and out of mind. I certainly can't see anybody forcing people to use them. On the other hand, sports betting is absolutely everywhere - at the football, on the TV, in the newspapers. My son certainly knows all about the odds, even though nobody in the family gambles. It is a far, far bigger problem, not least of all because it can be done any time, any where without anybody knowing. For the AFL community to decide that pokies are the work of the devil on one hand, but support the betting agencies on the other, is incredibly hypocritical. However this is fairly typical of an industry that chooses to go all in on certain causes and turn a blind eye to others, depending on the views of its financial backers.

Hannan had 1 tackle, 0 tackles Inside 50, 2 score involvements, 0 1%ers & 9 possessions Bugg had 4 tackles, 2 tackles Inside 50, 6 score involvements, 2 1%ers and 13 possessions Not groundbreaking stuff but had a better game statistically and provides that forward pressure that is essential. Also did the job shutting down Hodge apparently and did a good job if that's the case. This also doesn't take into some of the other advanced stats like pressure acts etc

You have to give a bloke at least 2-3 weeks

Salem killed Beams...

Bugg survives, think our defence is now too tall unless Frost plays forward??? No Brayshaw, Kent... wtf? Goodwins selections this year have been baffling.

Bugg must have nudes of goody on his phone. Only way I can make sense of him staying in the side.... Love the Frost inclusion, but do hope he is down back and not forward.

Pedersen dropped. As I expected, Pedersen is not nearly as entrenched as some Demonlanders think. Apparently Goody has "disrespected" him.

Can’t believe Bugg is getting another run. No Brayshaw again, just can’t understand why he would not be in the team!

I'm over my man flu but I've been running on little to no sleep for a week. There might be a 3rd quarter fade out tonight but y'all should be used to that.

Wasn't saying it to show you what a wonderful person I am (alas, I'm not) - I said it to illustrate the fact that, if you behave ethically, there are people in this world who will support you for it. Speaking out is a way of encouraging businesses (and football clubs) to behave with decency (that's why we are members of a super fund noted for its ethical investment) It was the phrase "virtue-signalling" that puzzled me. Like I said, I never heard it until recently, and it doesn't seem to make much sense. From what I can gather, it's an expression that right-wingers have started using to belittle anybody who expresses progressive views. The trouble is,it doesn't mean anything. For example, when I heard Bolt using it, I think he was using it to mock somebody who was in favour of alternative power. So if you speak out in favour of solar power, you are "virtue signalling". Whereas If you speak in favour of coal-power, you are not. What's the diff? They're all just political opinions.

Relax...we got this Dees by 37 All good

oh ffs.......there is a whole separate forum called the general forum for political proselytising......use it

I reckon I'm batting at one for twenty-four at trying to pick Goodwin's teams on a Thursday night. I keep telling myself that he knows the players far better than I, but I've seen enough to know that Josh Wagner is not taking us forward.

A interesting quote from this fascinating article: “The capitalist system we know is dominated by huge, unaccountable, global banks and corporations” For centuries now, capitalism’s appeal has rested in its promise of control. Unlike with societies of the past, in capitalism no one is supposed to be stuck in a rank given at birth. Instead, we all make our own choices – how hard to work, what to work at, how to balance our working lives and our private lives – and shape our own futures. The problem for capitalism is that it doesn’t feel like that any more. The capitalist system we know is dominated by huge, unaccountable, global banks and corporations. Add to that eye-watering and ever-increasing inequalities of wealth, and the suggestion that capitalism empowers us, rather than enslaves us, becomes an ugly joke. So, yes, capitalism is at a crossroads. Its advocates must either find an entirely new argument to defend it, or work out what it is in the system that needs to change for the promise of real control to be delivered. When anyone properly reflects on that choice, I believe they will realise that an economy that provides people with the sense that they really matter in the world remains the right ambition. But they will also note that building that economy demands radical and far-reaching action. Such action should start by limiting the power of unaccountable vested interests, from banks to tech companies, strengthening the hand of those whose work creates the wealth, and protecting our ever more fragile environment. It can be done – capitalism has adapted in the past – but time is running out. Marc Stears Chief executive, New Economics Foundation

We won't need him back. Petty will be a gun. And we may not need him forward. Many have written off Weideman, but I haven't. If he comes along we may not need Tom in the forward-line either. What's he worth on the market ?

errr......wrong forum

Best on Ground in his first game. His attuitude was right We F$&@ed up so badly

I'm a punter. Ponies are my fist love but also enjoy footy betting. However agree 100% about your concerns about sports betting, particularly those related to the impact on young people who are growing up to connect sport and betting in a way that no other generation has. And of course that's exactly what the bookies want, with the aim of a generation of people consuming their product. It is pathetic that the AFL takes sponsorship dollars from online bookmakers and allows betting to so insidiously infiltrate football. I can't stand the constant ads on radio and TV either and have no doubt that betting advertising will go the way of cigarette advertising within the next decade or so. As it should.

Interesting that Goodwin has always said something like: “the past isn’t relevant to us, this team will make its own history” when asked about other hoodoos eg Etihad. And he is right about that. Some player quotes from yesterday’s SEN interviews: Salem: “To be honest we haven’t really spoken about it at all”. Melksham: “The North Melbourne boys were giving us a fair bit of stick about it…I certainly know about it now. I think there is a fair bit of bitterness towards North in that sense that they have got the wood over the boys for most of their career…It’s a pretty big stat and we’re pretty keen to get rid of it.” Lewis: “We’re planning on it not being 18 in a row.” While Goodwin doesn't talk about hoodoos it seems some players have and breaking this hoodoo means a lot to the them! Hope the ‘bitterness’ Melksham talks about spurs then to go the extra mile and make sure it is not 18 in a row. Maybe this is one of those times Goodwin can drop the talk of 'humble' players and harness that 'bitterness' to get that elusive win.

Let's just say I disagree with your pseudo science. I fully accept these insidious machines are programmed to pay out less than is put in and I think they're vile. However, they are far from victims and I'm in the camp that believes addiction is not a disease. Take some personal responsibility, or don't. I'm all for assistance for people wanting to break their addiction, but they need to be ready to help themselves.

Only on the scoreboard !

Pedersen may have kicked two early goals against Geelong, but he was terrible for the remainder. As for last week, you'd be forgiven for saying he didn't play. Weideman clearly has a number of things he needs to work on, but I wouldn't be adversed to trying him. Weideman and Pedersen both get run off regularly, but Weideman's game against Adelaide last year should be his model for the next 2-3 years. Ensure he brings the ball to ground (or marks it) and tackle everyone in sight.

i hope not jim. i need to see the weid put in at least 2 or 3 solid games in real vfl matches first

If the AFL ran international cricket ... Demetriou would have called Lehmann and Smith telling them they were about to be nailed Bancroft would have been made to swallow the sandpaper There would be no charge of ball tampering. The whole thing would be put down to governance failures Smith would be sent to France for a year on a management study course Lehmann would score a gig with a management consultancy firm Warner would spend a year in New York learning to be a barista Smith would eventually present the Alan Border medal Everything would be the fault of the media. The players would all be brave, hard done by, Some numpty would sue the ICC