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No you are clearly clueless and didn't watch the game at all. Riley was one of our best. He had 8 clearences and 7 tackles and tried to take the game on and went in hard all game. While Mark Jamar was useless today all over the ground as McIntosh ran rings around him all day.

and josh says "sure pj, good idea, i hadn't thought of that"

What has any of that got to do with Watts continually losing his feet in 1:1 contests and being outmuscled by smaller opponents?

Both of these resulted in goals to Hawkins. This is what annoys me about umpiring, the inconsistency when the same thing would happen later in the game and a free kick would be paid.

Ross knows more about footy than all of us put together... Agreed. But he's also a good operator with the press, and won't bag his players in public. But does anyone seriously believe that the outside player doesn't have to sometimes win his own ball? I can't remember Watts winning too often in a one on one contest..Takes the odd mark... No comparison with, say, Goddard

As miserable about Melbourne as I am it's no coincidence that we are struggling to kick goals when two of our three top forwards going into the year haven't played a game. I realise it's all hypothetical however if Clark and Hogan were playing this year things would look a lot different and Dawes would be far more effectual.

Funny thing with Watts is I keep hearing from the 'experts' that he is having a good year and is thriving under Roos. If this is his best then god help us. He had 1 excellent game in round 1, maybe 2 or 3 acceptable games, and the rest have been rubbish.

ok, but in the last quarter Nathan Jones with plenty of time assessed his options and chose to kick across the ground to a Jack Watts one-on-one, which Watts is not likely to win, and the ball duly went out-of-bounds; it highlighted Watts' inability to do what his captain was in that instance asking of him; later Jones again had a kick and time to choose what to do, and while Jack Watts charged into space at centre-half-forward, Jones stood thinking about things and the lead died. By the time Jones kicked, we lost the ball. I know these are just two incidents, but to me they are consistent with the pattern of a lot of what the team keeps on doing. And they illustrate a lot about Watts, too. Melbourne do not act quickly enough to seize opportunities, do not encourage spreading by honouring leads, are far, far, far too slow to move the ball. The quick kick forward has to be the option; it may cause a score; what they do now doesn't and won't. All very frustrating (and dreadful to watch) - but here's the thing about Jack Watts as I see it: Jack Watts would look an entirely different proposition in a team that moved the ball quickly. He is a great ball user, he is quick - but he's not Neeld's man, at his natural best in body-on-body work. How come we can't use him? The worst player-use thing I've seen at Melbourne since they thought Flower might make a half back instead of a wingman was the idea that Jurrah needed to become a defender; today, our failure to use Watts at what he's capable of, and persistence in rubbing his nose in what he's not naturally good at, is - for me - as frustrating as it is seeing him not throwing himself at it more. If we trade Watts, to a team who put his abilities to use and does not go on trying to turn him into a one-size-fits-all what-he's-not, it will hurt seeing him become what we know he could be. But, if we did trade him, and he did become what we know he could be, that will be why. Dumb, Melbourne. Dumb. Poke back through the annals and look again at how we used Jakovitch. He was a match-winner, at times criticised for looking uninterested. But surely he knew what he could do. We used him on his terms, and it worked. Unimaginative is dumb. Loved Viney yesterday. (I don't know why I post - bound to be ignored or dumped on. But nobody else is saying it, and I think it's there in front of you.)

Our list this year is a vast improvement on what it was last season. Now that is sad, but it is progress nonetheless.

I can see now why Adelaide fans were keen to keep him! Plenty of grunt, gets where the ball is and is creative. Lets see him develop into a very good ball winner next year! Well done today!

Was just reported on channel 7. Personally awsome news. Its showed that him missing has been a big blow for this club. His direction and leadership on field is something we are lacking at the moment. Well done Crossy! Good hard country tough nut!

A team can support about 2-3 players who have disposal as bad as Jack Grimes. We have about 15. Even if Jack's disposal never improves, it's likely that we can compensate for his weaknesses as our team improves. We can then play him in roles that accentuate his strengths (being able to run through the midfield and also play as a third-man up spoiling defender). Currently however, he's pretty much a shorter Jared Rivers--and that's not what we need in a captain.

there it is again! My favourite! The old interrupted pre-season get out of jail free card. Where missing some training is an excuse to be rubbish 7 months later. Why don't we just put every player that gets injured in the PS on ice, long-term injury list so they can be cherry ripe for the following preseason, where, hopefully they will not get interrupted again. As we know these are delicate little flowers and just because they are declared fit and selected to play doesn't mean we should expect them to be any good on the field. FMD.

Is harshly treated on Demonland. Reads the play better than the majority of our players. Yet another player who can't kick to a target to save himself.

Such a disappointing performance, but really we've been playing poorly for many weeks. The essendon win, wonderful as it was, was a cruel tease. Any rational observer would know we were lucky to not be 10 goals down early. The earlier performance vs collingwood was abysmal. Yet we only lost by 30 odd points that day. More telling was the 3 goals we managed that day. Paul Roos has some decent coaching credentials, but fans are entitled to question his approach to management of his entire squad. He has allowed a 2 tiered approach to player management to develop. His total abandonment of the guys at casey is revealing. He hasn't attended a casey game all year. He allows the guys down there to be critiqued in a public and savage way, and having watched a single recording of an abc broadcast offers an opinion those guys are atrocious. At the same time he leaps to public defend the failings of guys like jack watts. Apparently it wasn't Jack's fault he was shite yesterday, it was the fault of the other guys. There are many guys in the senior team who are being gifted games and presumably aren't any better at "defensive transition" than the casey guys like blease and the others and if they are, how come we have been belted most of the last 10 weeks. I reckon we've got too many guys who feel they are way too safe in the senior team. Of course there'll be some weeks when it's not practical for coaches etc to watch the twos, but having watched at least 4 casey games during the year I find it interesting the number of senior coaches and senior players there to support their club mates at Carlton, box hill, Richmond collingwood even bloody nth Ballarat. Spoke to a box hill family and they said Clarkson sometimes even stays and watches box hill and travels on a later flight to coach hawthorn. At casey games I've seen Byrnes and max gawn a couple of times and that's it. I note rookie rookie harmes was listed as casey's best yesterday and even Strauss got a mention. Shame the Melbourne head of development wasn't there to see it! Still, since I guess he was at the MCG I'm looking forward to Brett Allison's internet musings on the 22 guys who ran out in melbourne jumpers. What day will it be on the Melbourne web page?

Could be worse, could have Buckey at the helm...... Can't help but feel once we can hit the scoreboard when we get a run on things will improve dramatically. We had chances in the first but just could not convert. Cats really took advantage of the let off, some of their field kicking in the second was outrageous. Just toyed with us safe in the knowledge we could not hurt them on the scoreboard.

I doubt there will be too many players involved in trades. More likely, I suspect Roos and co will adopt the same approach as last year and use one or two of our higher picks for some more established players - especially if Frawley leaves. Players on the chopping block will be those who have been around a while and can't break into the side. There are plenty of them around including Tapscott, Blease and Strauss for starters. Dan Nicholson is another. And as guys like Salem and Barry come on and Trengove comes back, pressure will come on guys like Bail, Terlich, McKenzie and Matt Jones. Even Grimes. I suspect Watts, as one of only 3 or 4 genuinely good kicks in the team, will be safe for now. We aren't suffering for endeavour, we lack skills once we get the ball and fail to hurt the opposition. The greatest improvement will come as we cycle out blokes who can't kick or make decisions for those who can. As I said, we have plenty of them to choose from.

I think they took him as some sort of tax write off.

You're a clown - the minute you lumped me in with Picket Fence I didn't even bother with the rest of your post. Harden up, of course when discussing players part of it is whether they have the courage or will power to make it in the AFL - this isn't the ammo's where you can get by on skill alone.

Looking at last year's draft, we selected the following players: - Salem - JKH - Hunt Looking at those we drafted, the ability to get on the outside and do damage was very important. Rookies - Harmes - King - Jetta - Georgiou plus we added Tyson, Cross and Riley. Through the rookie draft and trades we picked up players opportunistically, like experienced hard bodies and role players. Interestingly, our first rookie pick was also a midfielder with pace. I think that there was a clear long term plan with our drafting which addresses a key need that will only get more important - speed. I would be surprised if this wasn't a theme in this year's drafting as well.

In order: - Can't run - Can't run - Can't run - Football sense - Can't run I'll give you a hint about how the game is played.

I was at the game yesterday and witnessed Hell freezing over. A lot of players weren't interested in picking up a man. Could someone enlighten me on who was responsible for getting within 10m of James Kelly. In case it was Tappy, that should be the last we see of him.

Geelong might have played a free-flowing game, but Ling was certainly no free-wheeling player. He understands two-way running and defensive mindsets.

I agree with the overwhelming majority that totally disagree with the OP. It was Geelong's outside run that killed us far more than their inside work. Geelong got outside us, ran hard and used the ball well. We lack speed and class. I'd take one more inside mid (if they were a tall inside mid) but I'd rather focus our efforts on midfielders that can get outside and use the footy.

So one minute we've got someone calling for the return of Troy Davis, now someone else wants Brock McLean brought back... what's next? Issac Weetra to fill our small forward role from 2015 onwards?

cos he talks nicely Thats honestly the only reason i can think of

can we rename this thread "The Picket Fence Fantasy Thread"? or Pfft for short?

Go Dees.

Who says the long apprenticeship is needed or is even greatly beneficial? I'd say that if you can coach, you can coach. Roos himself didn't need a long apprenticeship. I'm not convinced. It seems like you're looking for excuses as to why it shouldn't be Ling. I don't think 2 years as an assistant, and then Roos staying on as a guiding force, is insufficient for any candidate.

As a senior coach, none. I could be wrong but those who don't want Ling to be the incumbent coach might need to get used to the idea.

Riley was great. The one positive about watching that lackluster effort yesterday

Jack I think this is more about is there clear top end talent that will be elite this year? I expect McCartin will go number 1 and even he did not look a sure thing. If in an even top 20 we think we can balance getting players we rate highly later and bring in players from other clubs and trade down then we should look at this. I hope that Petracca, McCartin and others have cracking ends to the year and others drive up their standing similar to McRae and Bontempelli in previous years because if nothing else it will drive up what clubs are willing to give to attain them.

So DL you now want the MFC to recruit Broke Mclean so he can play 6 games on the off chance his spawn will become an AFL Player??Please go back to sleep.

Overall I have been a Watts supporter but yesterday he took lack of effort, disengagement and poor attitude to a new level. That doesn't mean I think he should be traded but it wasn't good enough and for that there are no excuses.

You blokes really enjoy flogging yourselves.

It's interesting to see that McCartin kicked 7 goals and Petracca 5 for their respective TAC Cup sides yesterday. Both made their teams' best player list in their first games back after the Under 18 championships. Goddard was among the best for the Geelong Falcons too. Yes, we did well with the Tyson/Pick 9 deal but I'm wondering why so many people are quick to shun the potential top five picks when we're crying out for star quality players? Despite the examples of the odd failure here and there, the stats show that you're more likely to pick up an elite player with a top 10 pick than with picks 11 to 20. If we trade out of a top 3 or 4 pick this time it's going to have to be a super deal as far as I'm concerned.

Agree.. But needs at least two more games to show something..

I can see where he gets his nickname "Pigdog".....he's a real terrier!

I believe ENYAW is at the cutting edge RTG, or even beyond. He challenges us with his esoteria.( I may have just coined that word). Fl og, on the other hand is just a [censored]

A lot of people seem to wish to avoid assistant coaches, and go for tried and tested. Tried and tested coaches are hard enough to come by as it is, let alone good ones. The recruits Roos has brought in have, in the space of just over half of a season of football justified their pay, and my membership fee. The same can be said for few (any?) of the recruits brought in three years ago under previous regimes. The man is no fool; and if he reckons someone like Ling is the man for the job, we can only trust him, even if Ling's credential list for coaching is nonexistent. On somewhat of a tangent, it's interesting to sit back and watch Malthouse's decline (not without some pleasure...), given how highly-rated assistants of his went. These men (thinking of Neeld and the former Saints' coach, whose name escapes me) were leaders in their field, coming from what was considered the best coaching school in the sport. Of course, it wasn't entirely their fault---they had to work with teams unused to a winning culture---but they failed, completely and utterly. They were well-trained---but in a style of football which is almost antiquated. And we see the same with Malthouse now. I suppose what I'm getting at is that, no matter how good your schooling, if you've learned everything you know in Latin, your knowledge is only going to tak you so far. Better to have someone schooled in modern football who is untested, than someone who has been an assistant for years and years in a team whose game style is prewar. (I'll not even mention Sheedy).

We had periods where we controlled the play in the first and second quarters but similar to last week we couldn't convert that into goals. I thought we actually controlled the play for a big part of the first quarter but only kicked 2 points and a couple out on the full.

Ling was a limited footballer. Started as a Full forward with no tank, ended up a goal kicking, run with player and captained the most successful club in recent history. He is also a very astute and intelligent businessman and manager. Lingy has had to work very hard and has persisted in all facets of his life to make things work. That includes starting at a poor, battling club. He has done a fair bit I would say. From what i know about him her has the right character for a coach. Strong, assured and a galvaniser of people. I am a fan of the bloke. Can he coach, who knows?

I don't think PJ was brought in for his list management expertise.

It is what it is. Change will come, but incrementally.

Let us put today in perspective. Geelong are coming off ( and still contain) elements of possibly the best team seen in the AFL. Our bllokes are coming off the floor. I notice that in the 3 word assessment failed to take in : * The quality of ball coming into the forward line * The pressure on our backline ( I cannot accept that Frawley was disinterested as alleged ) nor can i accept that Grimes is a liability. At this moment some people are too intent on consistenly scapegoating Grimes, Garland ,Frawley ( because of ....) and Mc Donald. Consider we contained Geelong to near enough 100 points today, which is a huge improvement on recent times. Need to keep things in perspective when playing top 5 sides.

now that is a court house Gallery i would attend. Completely ruined an AFL Club...We members are stuck with it.

The first thing he has to do is bite the bullet and make another application for draft assistance. If the rule allowing for this is on the books then forget the politics, we need to apply because its plain to see that after eight years, we qualify and we need to take advantage of every legally available means to help our recruiting people improve our list. Watching Casey struggle today against a team that has decided to fold at the end of the year merely reinforces my viewpoint that we are being held back by a poor list that lacks depth and strong measures need to be taken.

please tell me Rohan Bail is not contracted past this season

What really fascinates me about Picket Fence's maniacal obsession with meat-bag midfielders is that if there is one area on the ground that the Demons are most deficient, it's the classy, good decision makers with good kicks who either have the vision to bring us cleanly out of half-back tangles, or the awareness to offer relieving leads and to run for hand-ball-receives. That and he fact that he keeps banging on despite having the evidence placed in front of him earlier, showing that there are five clubs whose top contested ballwinners are what he would call 'skinny, outside types who don't deserve to go before the third round'. Picket Fence's concept of recruiting and team balance might be seen as appropriate for suburban C-grade teams, and certainly it was the strategy used by Terry Wallace at Richmond, but it is a liability in multiple ways when you get to the top level.

Of course, don't worry about his 'enormous workrate, professionalism, super athletic ability, smart ball use, clean hands and bringing teammates into the game'. Let's worry more about the size of his thighs.