An external review of the Melbourne Football Club is required!

[Dr. Gonzo 24,266]

10 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

In the Carlton game we absolutely did not have all the momentum in the next 3 quarters. We outscored them by 8 points between quarter time and three quarter time. Then yes, we came home with a wet sail but left our run far too late. What are the odds of a team winning a game from behind from a centre bounce with 40 seconds on the clock (after Gawn's goal). I bet it hardly ever happens.

The GWS game we conceded 12 of the next 15 goals after quarter time. That's not paying the bills and highlights everything wrong with us this year in terms of putting together 4 quarters. Did I think we would win when were 5 goals up? Sure? Did I think we would win when were 2 points down with 70 seconds left? No, and therefore I don't see this GWS game and the Carlton game as ones that got away.

 

The close losses aren't the games I'm worried about. The losses to Lions (MCG), WCE, Freo x2, Bulldogs and Collingwood (!!!) are the ones that are the cause for concern.

I would include the Carlton loss too, we were smashed out of the blocks and although we almost pinched it late it was basically down to Petracca heroics and Carlton almost [censored] the bed.

[Fat Tony 5,262]

16 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

We have the 5th worst percentage in the league. That is indicative of our performance in 2024.

Yes we have performed well across 22-23 post flag, but that is all it was. We didn't excel, we didn't dominate, we didnt win a final and didn't finish top 4 (preliminary finalists). If we had a better culture and standards amongst the playing group we may have won another flag.

I disagree. Our percentage is 97.9% and our win loss is 10-11 (despite losing all the close ones). We have been about average this year.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,266]

Just now, Fat Tony said:

I disagree. Our percentage is 97.9% and our win loss is 10-11 (despite losing all the close ones). We have been about average this year.

We sit 13th and have the 14th best percentage. For every close loss there's a close win (Port, North, Cats) you could say could've gone the other way too. Had we lost those three we'd be 4th last.

[Fat Tony 5,262]

4 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

We sit 13th and have the 14th best percentage. For every close loss there's a close win (Port, North, Cats) you could say could've gone the other way too. Had we lost those three we'd be 4th last.

I contend that the winning record and actual percentage is a better guide. We recently lost to Port (2nd), GWS (3rd) and Brisbane (5th) by a kick. 

I think the analysis you are using is misleading. A decent win on the weekend could easily see our percentage be higher than Adelaide, Collingwood, St Kilda and Gold Coast in three days. Would that really change where we sit?

[John Crow Batty 8,878]

28 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

The close losses aren't the games I'm worried about. The losses to Lions (MCG), WCE, Freo x2, Bulldogs and Collingwood (!!!) are the ones that are the cause for concern.

I would include the Carlton loss too, we were smashed out of the blocks and although we almost pinched it late it was basically down to Petracca heroics and Carlton almost [censored] the bed.

2023 average losing margin was 9 points. This season it’s been 29 points. 

Edited August 16 by John Crow Batty

[frankie_d 1,471]

6 minutes ago, John Crow Batty said:

2023 average losing margin was 9 points. This season it’s been 29 points. 

Interesting - do you have the median loss for those years?

[Sir Why You Little 37,119]

16 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

I contend that the winning record and actual percentage is a better guide. We recently lost to Port (2nd), GWS (3rd) and Brisbane (5th) by a kick. 

I think the analysis you are using is misleading. A decent win on the weekend could easily see our percentage be higher than Adelaide, Collingwood, St Kilda and Gold Coast in three days. Would that really change where we sit?

No. Because we are out of Finals contention 

Far too many games this year we switched off for 20 minutes….

[dimmy 1,308]

5 minutes ago, frankie_d said:

Interesting - do you have the median loss for those years?

Yeh ,but this has been an extraordinary year, we played Fremantle twice !!

[The heart beats true 18,144]

52 minutes ago, Sydee said:

The fact this question keeps surfacing might suggest that the demonland experts aren’t experts or are just too lazy to watch Casey matches

Btw for the record I’d probably give the kid a couple of games now that our season is done - it will make him understand how much work he has ahead this pre season and beyond 

It was actually just a bit of a joke at the expense of @picket fence because, and I’m not sure, but I think he wants Jefferson to get a game.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,266]

33 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

I contend that the winning record and actual percentage is a better guide. We recently lost to Port (2nd), GWS (3rd) and Brisbane (5th) by a kick. 

I think the analysis you are using is misleading. A decent win on the weekend could easily see our percentage be higher than Adelaide, Collingwood, St Kilda and Gold Coast in three days. Would that really change where we sit?

How is it misleading? Our record has us 13th. Whether it's 12th/13th/14th it's really splitting hairs about the level of underwhelming we've been this year.

[Dee*ceiving 1,690]

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

We sit 13th and have the 14th best percentage. For every close loss there's a close win (Port, North, Cats) you could say could've gone the other way too. Had we lost those three we'd be 4th last.

Great point, overall in hindsight I think we've actually done ok considering all the hurdles, those made ourselves and those not our fault, but...

We've been stinky in way too many games, either for sizeable chunks (Blues, Dogs, Roos, Lions) or the whole game (Eagles, Dockers, Pies) 

The silver lining is we blooded some kids this year that have potential (Windsor, Kolt & AMW) and trialled Rivers and Disco in different positions presenting some reason for optimism long term in those roles

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,906]

6 hours ago, KozzyCan said:

I don't understand why some are so resistant to the club getting a review. We keep hearing about how great everything is, how great our culture is, to judge the club on their actions. But the sideshow has popped up again and again. If the club believes they're that good then why should they be afraid of a review?

If there are no issues then the club gets vindicated and it brings peace of mind to the members if there are serious issues they can be exposed and dealt with properly.

Every club should hold an external review after every third season, irrespective of how they are travelling. And in the other two years, they should do an annual, internal review. The reason the external reviews are necessary is because club boards, by their nature, are not dispassionate enough to make tough decisions.

[picket fence 17,462]

1 hour ago, The heart beats true said:

It was actually just a bit of a joke at the expense of @picket fence because, and I’m not sure, but I think he wants Jefferson to get a game.

Um ok I'll bite.... want and deserve are two different things. In Matt Jeffersons case he has been building with some impressive form for 8 weeks or so and in so doing has 

• Clunked PACK Marks
• Hit the scoreboard on multiple occasions
• Crashed packs hard
• Created something out of nothing to either create a goal himself or goal assist
• This ALL with substandard delivery from a undermaned Casey midfield

So would I like him to get a game??? Sure but does he deserve a game? more the question, and if Melksham gets game on poor performances like in the last 3 weeks AND Petty on a flimsy 6 goal season well there's an answer right there. Like and deserve are two different things but for much of this season MANY players have got games under false pretences, because selections have very much been comprimised by like!

Edited August 16 by picket fence

[Demonstone 22,792]

You still here, @picket fence?  You assured us that you would LITERALLY!!!  explode if Jeffo wasn't picked.

I don't know if I can ever take any of your posts seriously after this.

[Watson11 2,241]

6 hours ago, Fat Tony said:

External reviews are fraught with danger. We particularly don't want an external review at this time given the litigation we are facing.

 

The Pies 2017 review was fraught with danger for Gary Pert but not Collingwood. They bounced back immediately and were within a fluky wind gust of winning the flag in 2018.  I think it’s best to find out what is festering by those that could never have created/contributed to the problems. Ie an independent group.

[manny100 1,594]

Damien Barret had a go about the culture in sliding doors today.

We know about Smith. Dealt with. We know about Clayton's past issues - dealt with and sorted.

We know about Tracc's injury  - processes by club and docs ticked off.

ANB requesting trade - personal issues - all ok, club handling well.

What else can the club do. Are there other real or imagined issues?

Schwarter said he saw some players misbehaving last preseason. Where was his duty of care as a past player. Why didn't he report it quietly to the club? Maybe they were not that serious and he is just seeking a story or joining the media thugs and putting the boots in.

4 games lost by under a goal. If we won 2 and were in the 8 would the noise be quieter.

Media forgets we had more players under 22 in the team for a number of games than anyone else.

Still there is so much [censored] going around maybe we should have an independant review just to clear the air 

 

 

[Dr. Gonzo 24,266]

3 hours ago, manny100 said:

Damien Barret had a go about the culture in sliding doors today.

We know about Smith. Dealt with. We know about Clayton's past issues - dealt with and sorted.

We know about Tracc's injury  - processes by club and docs ticked off.

ANB requesting trade - personal issues - all ok, club handling well.

What else can the club do. Are there other real or imagined issues?

Schwarter said he saw some players misbehaving last preseason. Where was his duty of care as a past player. Why didn't he report it quietly to the club? Maybe they were not that serious and he is just seeking a story or joining the media thugs and putting the boots in.

4 games lost by under a goal. If we won 2 and were in the 8 would the noise be quieter.

Media forgets we had more players under 22 in the team for a number of games than anyone else.

Still there is so much [censored] going around maybe we should have an independant review just to clear the air 

 

 

Yep nothing to see here. Club's kicking goals everywhere, why do those nasty media types keep harassing us!

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,294]

15 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Yep nothing to see here. Club's kicking goals everywhere, why do those nasty media types keep harassing us!

I hear ya Gonz

We've also got the best club culture Pertys ever been involved in, plus Goody promised we'd stop the talk and walk the walk on the footy field.....

Why won't the media leave us alone we are in ripping knick.

 

[Ethan Tremblay 30,961]

Absolute waste of money. 

[leave it to deever 17,517]

On 16/08/2024 at 01:21, Supreme_Demon said:

I haven't been on Demonland for a while due to work commitments and family matters.

However, I thought I should make a post about the serious issues the Melbourne Football Club is facing.

After finally breaking our 57 year Premiership drought in 2021, things are now looking grim and we need to fix the serious problems that the Melbourne Demons are currently facing.

This is why I support former Demons champion in David Schwarz about having an entire review of the Melbourne Football Club.

I don't think CEO Gary Pert should do a mere internal review as I don't think that will be enough.

We need both internal and external people investigating the problems the Melbourne Football Club has and look to identify these problems and find solutions to them.

Kane Cornes actually wrote a good news article discussing our issues the other week: https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/the-demons-stand-at-the-gates-of-footy-hell-these-are-the-five-mistakes-that-got-them-there-20240808-p5k0ms.html

I actually agreed with many of the unpleasant truths that he identified about the Melbourne Demons.

An external review is the only way to get to the bottom of all our problems at the Melbourne Demons.

Some of the problems have been out of our control like Luke Jackson wishing to leave the Demons and return home to WA. Others, have been due to rotten luck, like poor Angus Brayshaw being knocked out by Brayden Maynard and then forced to medically retire due to all his concussion injuries.

Why the Demons players didn't seek vengeance for what happened against Angus Brayshaw still bitterly disappoints me. But I guess I have a more bloodthirsty attitude compared to others and would of liked to see football played the way it was in the good ol' days of the 1980's with brawls and pay back against any of our players that were hurt by an opposition player with "an eye for an eye" mentality. Sadly, our attitude against Collingwood on King's Birthday this year was as soft as butter on a hot summer's day in my opinion and was humiliating to witness.

Nevertheless, other issues have to do with poor list management and recruitment. The foolish trade for Brodie Grundy, with the experiment given up after one mere season of trying to see if it could work and then trading away both James Jordon and James Harmes. Not trading in a tall forward or a forward-ruck to help Max Gawn was a big mistake. I don't think we bothered using Tom Fullarton at all either.

Losing Alex Neal-Bullen is disappointing too, but family comes first and hopefully we can arrange a fair trade for him to either the Crows or Power.

Then there are cultural problems and the poor behaviour of Demons players. Obviously, some of these matters cannot be mentioned. But the most important factor is the need to raise the level of the professionalism of a significant portion of our players. David Schwarz even mentioned this on the radio with Demons players allegedly mucking around during their preseason camp down at Anglesea.

Most importantly, we also certainly don't want to see one of our greatest Demons players ever and Norm Smith medallist in Christian Petracca leave the Club. Losing Christian Petracca would be as bad as Ronald Dale Barassi leaving for Carlton at the end of 1964. So reconciling with Christian Petracca is a crucial matter that needs resolving.

The stagnation regarding our Home Base development at Caulfield Racecourse has also been incredibly frustrating and this also needs to see further progress.

In the end, I don't think I am alone with these concerns and the entire Melbourne Football Club (from boot studder to President) has a lot of pertinent questions to answer.

We as Melbourne supporters and members deserve answers and explanations for how things have fallen into disarray so rapidly in season 2024.

Anyway, we still have 2 rounds to go. So let's see what happens....

 

Some games have been absolutely horrible but we started the season very well.

We have had key players go down at the worst of times.

We lost four out of five games where the margin was a goal or under

Teams like Port who are second won four out of five within a goal

Makes a difference.

Our fwd line has been abysmal this year.

Our midfield fell apart.

Now it's players talking about leaving.

The latter is the most worrying.

I think Goidys coaching has been suspect at times with Petty played consistently up fwd.

A few big name players have look uninterested too often.

There are certainly issues that need to be addressed.

A review would not hurt 

[Demonsone 2,043]

12 hours ago, manny100 said:

Damien Barret had a go about the culture in sliding doors today.

We know about Smith. Dealt with. We know about Clayton's past issues - dealt with and sorted.

We know about Tracc's injury  - processes by club and docs ticked off.

ANB requesting trade - personal issues - all ok, club handling well.

What else can the club do. Are there other real or imagined issues?

Schwarter said he saw some players misbehaving last preseason. Where was his duty of care as a past player. Why didn't he report it quietly to the club? Maybe they were not that serious and he is just seeking a story or joining the media thugs and putting the boots in.

4 games lost by under a goal. If we won 2 and were in the 8 would the noise be quieter.

Media forgets we had more players under 22 in the team for a number of games than anyone else.

Still there is so much [censored] going around maybe we should have an independant review just to clear the air 

 

 

Club needs an internal review across the whole footy dept with culture issues and our best player Trac clearly upset! A shake up of our coaches, recruiting, if not addressed we will see a once in generational list torn apart & members will walk away including myself!

[Demonsterative 3,020]

22 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

Club needs an internal review across the whole footy dept with culture issues and our best player Trac clearly upset! A shake up of our coaches, recruiting, if not addressed we will see a once in generational list torn apart & members will walk away including myself!

Shut the door on your way out….

[Watson11 2,241]

Pretty sure clubs do internal reviews every year, so that would just be more of the same if that is the path Roffey follows.  Interesting graphic below of the Pies performance leading up to their external review. Maybe they waited too long to do it.  The cultural issue at the Pies were masked over by the flag in 2010, but appear to have peaked in the years after.  Cultural issues make high performance unsustainable (re Pies 2010, re West Coast 2006 etc).  Our only hope to not slide into irrelevancy is to have a thorough and independent review, and if we have absolutely zero issues it would still be money well spent.

[Demon Disciple 12,257]

1 hour ago, Watson11 said:

Pretty sure clubs do internal reviews every year, so that would just be more of the same if that is the path Roffey follows.  Interesting graphic below of the Pies performance leading up to their external review. Maybe they waited too long to do it.  The cultural issue at the Pies were masked over by the flag in 2010, but appear to have peaked in the years after.  Cultural issues make high performance unsustainable (re Pies 2010, re West Coast 2006 etc).  Our only hope to not slide into irrelevancy is to have a thorough and independent review, and if we have absolutely zero issues it would still be money well spent.

Damn objective data, there’s no room for argument when it enters the fray.

Edited August 17 by Demon Disciple

[rpfc 28,727]

5 minutes ago, Demon Disciple said:

Damn objective data, there’s no room for argument when it enters the fray.

‘Objective data???’ as a person in IT  - the use of the above data was wholly to back up a preconceived argument or notion to pin blame on a singular individual. 

It’s the furtherest thing from ‘objective’ use of data.