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PODCAST: SF vs Carlton


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The Demonland Podcast will air LIVE on Tuesday, 19th September @ 8:30pm. Join George, Binman & I as we analyse the Demons devastating loss to the Blues in the Semi Final.

You questions and comments are a huge part of our podcast so please post anything you want to ask or say below and we'll give you a shout out on the show.

If you would like to leave us a voicemail please call 03 9016 3666 and don't worry no body answers so you don't have to talk to a human.

Listen & Chat LIVE: https://demonland.com/podcast

Call: 03 9016 3666

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We have a forward line built around maximising our defence.

What is the point of having a Jaguar of a backline and Rolls Royce of a midfield if you have to almost sacrifice a third of the game (when you have the ball) to protect the Jag?

We leave ourselves open to good teams getting us on the break as our entries are shallow, to non-forwards, and/or delayed so in traffic.

If one of you brings up expected score without using a lamenting tone - I am going to unfollow - don’t tell me me ‘should have won’ and ‘not too much is wrong’.

Just isn’t true.

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Just now, Clint Bizkit said:

Was good to see Tomlinson play well and have the ability to free up Lever and May.

Yea, the actual defence made the defence better… Maybe we can get the sherrins out and be positive with the footy next year. We have been so effing boring to watch this year. Really since half way through 2022 when we starting protecting our mids and backs by sacrificing our forward play. 

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given the expectation is that petty will have to play forward in 2024 to give us a semblance of a forward target, what will the defensive structure look like?

do you expect rivers to move into the midfield to provide some drives with legs away from the contest?

how do we combat our lack of speed on the spread?

why do we continue to do this to ourselves?

thankyou @Demonland @binman and @george_on_the_outer for everything you've done for the aflm season - onto bigger things with the aflw

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41 minutes ago, rpfc said:

We have a forward line built around maximising our defence.

What is the point of having a Jaguar of a backline and Rolls Royce of a midfield if you have to almost sacrifice a third of the game (when you have the ball) to protect the Jag?

We leave ourselves open to good teams getting us on the break as our entries are shallow, to non-forwards, and/or delayed so in traffic.

If one of you brings up expected score without using a lamenting tone - I am going to unfollow - don’t tell me me ‘should have won’ and ‘not too much is wrong’.

Just isn’t true.

We could/should have won for the last 2 weeks. Hindsight says injuries to Brayshaw, Petty and Melksham cost us. 

You can pretend alot is wrong but the reality is fine margins decide finals and we were % off with personnel and % off with polish

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Andy, binman, George - I for one really appreciate your hard work and positivity even in a gut wrenching loss like tonight.

I have followed the Dees since the early 1950s, so enjoyed the glory years, and missed through work and travel the late 60s, 70s and early 80s.    This was the most frustrating loss that I can remember.  Poor delivery into F50 resulting in low percentage shots, missed gettable shots, and don't start me on the score review that has won The Cheaters 3 recent games - us, Swans and us again.

Gill's wet dream departure scenario is a Pies v Blues GF and he has certainly given every assistance to this dream. I can only hope that Gil's dream is shattered (as our was tonight) by Brisbane beating the Cheaters, and Port or GW$ beating Collingwood.    

But back to us.   

Where do we go to change out greatest weaknesses?

Scoring goals is surely the KPI of this game?   There seem to be several elements to this.  

Structure - how many tallls, mediums, smalls and who rotates with whom, when?   Do we have the structure if Petty returns in his pre injury form, if JVR does another full preseason (has done particularly well for a second year player IMO), but who else?  Melksham won't be ready until the last few games of 2024, if at all.  TMcD, great servant that he has been, looks on his last leg.  BBB surely has no functioning knees and should be retired.   Smith has surprised me  and was very  good tonight.    Schacke clearly did not have the confidence of the coach when he was not subbed in for poor TMcD who just couldn't run or jump.

So the forward debacle isn't just personnel, or just structural - it is also delivery and also positioning and creating space and leading.  Do we need  new specific forward coaches and forward mid connection teams?  16. gaols, 27 behinds in our two narrow finals losses just about says it all.   2g 6b in the final quarter says a lot.

Is it "soft under pressure" (which I think os wrong) - binman will no doubt has the quarterly pressure ratings, which I have no doubt will be amazingly high) - or just trying set shots at goal from poor positions?  Do we need (and Petty will no doubt help) a new structure, or is a new mindset more important?  Mindset from both forwards but also midfielders and half backs.  Should be adopt more of a SAS mantra - who dares, wins !!!

And, binman, should we expunge the stat "expected score", or does to really Menach um

Backline has done a sterling job  most of the time and Tomlinson has added much in structure releasing Lever to intercept. 

Is failure to get enough % of centre (and other) clearances demons having atratwa dominant ruck a result of that dominant ruck, rucking dumbly?  

 

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6 hours ago, DemonWA said:

We could/should have won for the last 2 weeks. Hindsight says injuries to Brayshaw, Petty and Melksham cost us. 

You can pretend alot is wrong but the reality is fine margins decide finals and we were % off with personnel and % off with polish

I think that’s a trap. We are never going to be ‘out’ of a final with our personnel and their strength in the contest. But what is the point of that if you can’t maximise dominance in territory? Can’t maximise dominance in forward entries. The game is becoming more about doing well with the time that is given to you. And we are not built for that in how we move the ball from defence, and also who is there to maximise in the forward line. 

 

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52 minutes ago, rpfc said:

And we are not built for that in how we move the ball from defence, and also who is there to maximise in the forward line. 

Our movement from defence is elite league standard. Our forward line was as disrupted by injury as 2019, and that’s saying something. Petty, JVR, Fritsch, Melk available and together all season (along with our best smalls - Koz, Chandler), and Clarry in the middle all season to free Tracc forward, and we win this year’s flag. That was never even close to happening, sadly. It’s that simple. 

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2 minutes ago, Webber said:

Our movement from defence is elite league standard. Our forward line was as disrupted by injury as 2019, and that’s saying something. Petty, JVR, Fritsch, Melk available and together all season (along with our best smalls - Koz, Chandler), and Clarry in the middle all season to free Tracc forward, and we win this year’s flag. That was never even close to happening, sadly. It’s that simple. 

Is that what the stats say? How can you have that opinion? We move it sideways before corridor. We move it slow by foot as opposed to quick by hands.

You’re right about our disrupted forward personnel but I think changes are on the horizon.

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Our game that is built for finals, can't win finals. Are we very close or very far, I'm not sure.

Injuries to our forward line a big factor for sure but I'm with @rpfc. We need to freshen things up. some new faces around goody with fresh ideas. And gameplan wise take more risk.

Keen to hear what the boys think.

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Maybe this is Goodwin's style.

Remember 2018, we looked primed to become regular contenders. Then we had 2019 and 2020 of learnings and got it together in 2021.

Maybe 2022 and 2023 are the "learnings" years and it'll come together again next year. 🤷🏻‍♂️

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8 minutes ago, BDA said:

Our game that is built for finals, can't win finals. Are we very close or very far, I'm not sure.

Injuries to our forward line a big factor for sure but I'm with @rpfc. We need to freshen things up. some new faces around goody with fresh ideas. And gameplan wise take more risk.

Keen to hear what the boys think.

There will always be changes of course, that’s the nature of footy. But we were/are obviously so close it’s crazy. Kick straighter, we win, it’s that simple and that close. I don’t understand how people can’t see this. That’s what makes it so frustrating. And yes, @rpfc, our back half turnover and transition to score has been elite all season. Statistically. It’s not really an opinion. 

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1 minute ago, Webber said:

There will always be changes of course, that’s the nature of footy. But we were/are obviously so close it’s crazy. Kick straighter, we win, it’s that simple and that close. I don’t understand how people can’t see this. That’s what makes it so frustrating. And yes, @rpfc, our back half turnover and transition to score has been elite all season. Statistically. It’s not really an opinion. 

It may be statistically perfect but the eye test sais it is predictable and boring. Need more corridor carry and run, be more damaging at turnovers.

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10 minutes ago, ElDiablo14 said:

It may be statistically perfect but the eye test sais it is predictable and boring. Need more corridor carry and run, be more damaging at turnovers.

It obviously isn’t statistically perfect, but you know what’s wildly imperfect? The eye test. It’s the first reason we have statistical analysis. 

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When do we stop using injuries as an excuse? We did really well with the cards we were dealt this year but just like the inaccuracy there is little control over it and I feel like people are just hoping that will somehow be perfect next year. We need to control the controlables, gameplan, personel and coaching staff need to be looked at.

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20 minutes ago, Gunna’s said:

Goody in his press conference mentioned that the club will look at ways to be better. What is your take on this?

At least that should stop the usual suspects claiming he won't review it!

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36 minutes ago, layzie said:

When do we stop using injuries as an excuse?

Never, because they’re not an excuse, they’re a reason. The ENTIRE history of footy determines it so. You can blame poor management and systems for those injuries when appropriate (not for us this year), and you can be frustrated with HOW we play, inconsistency and the average ups and downs of a season, as we all are, and none of us are immune to it, but NOTHING, and that means NOTHING determines success, W/L percentages and ladder position more than ‘games unavailable through injury’. Clubs do their absolute best to work around them - depth, ‘mirror’ players in the VFL - but it’s still the truth. It’s the most reliable indicator of relative success, bar none. 

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