PREGAME: Rd 23 vs Hawthorn

[Binmans PA 26,292]

7 hours ago, Fat Tony said:

In 2023 we are 6 wins & 5 losses when we have 3 midget forwards (Kossie, Spargo and Chandler) and 8 wins & 2 losses (both by less than a goal) when we play just 2 midget forwards.

The balance of our side is out with too many small players, particularly forward of the ball where players need to compete in the air in outnumbered situations.. We are already playing 2 small wingers and Bowey in defence.

This data is skewed by when we played smaller players.

We played the three smalls against Collingwood on KB.

I don't think we get exposed for height very often. Particularly, when you've got Max at almost every kick down the line.

The post 2022 game style requires more smalls.

I guess I'm saying I disagree.

[Maldonboy38 5,971]

Huge relief that Tomlinson is in, probably means Smith forward. I know Tomlinson has a big turning circle but he does his job and is a really good kick. Smith is a natural forward and his athleticism can worry defences.

Very surprised about Laurie, not sure what he adds. I would have given Taj another go.

I feel very, very sad for Grundy but it is the right selection. 

[dazzledavey36 48,987]

48 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

That may well be the end of Gawndy.

If we win the flag this year no one will care. If we don't win it, there will be so much said and written about how much time we put into Gawndy when it didn't work.

That's all for another time.

For now, I think the Tomlinson-Smith-Grundy shuffle is the right call. I think dropping Jordon was the right call (although is he really the best option for sub?). But I'm not at all sure Laurie is the right call for that spot. Hope he proves me flatly wrong.

Would have preferred Woewodin myself,  but what other options did we have in mind?

[Demon Disciple 11,069]

I think the Laurie inclusion is a pre-emptive warning shot at our smalls that they have to be on their game, or they too face the axe .

[Binmans PA 26,292]

3 hours ago, Watson11 said:

To be fair, it tells us we are doing fine without him against bottom teams.  Against top 8 teams we are 0-1 without him and 6-2 with him.

I personally think 4 small forwards would work if we switched our forward 50 gameplan to high pressure and not bombing long ie Richmond 2017 style.  My view is we need to accept that Grundy/TMac/BB are not the answer and adjust our inside 50 gameplan appropriately.  And that would mean our forwards all leading for a change and Spargo would be helpful delivering inside 50.

I personally think Spargo got dropped by Goody because he went away from team rules and instead of just bombing it in, took on risky kicks against Brisbane and turned it over.  But who knows.

I agree. This is the way forward IMO.

[Binmans PA 26,292]

2 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

Wow Laurie is left field two weeks out from finals. I was sure Spargo was a shoe in.

Interesting to see what role he plays. 
 

A bit of Bowey 21 about it.

Hope he does well. Caulfield Grammarian.

[ANG13 1,523]

1 hour ago, Roost it far said:

I’m still full of fear and loathing this week. It wasn’t long ago that you could bet on us losing this week and then getting pipped by a point next week. 

Has your account been hacked? 

[Floody100 193]

Folks who are worried about Smith as our second tall need to remember Fritsch is going to make his job a hell of a lot easier.

[dworship 3,342]

1 hour ago, picket fence said:

 

Dazzle can u get a gig on an AFL List as an ASTUTE behind the scenes tactician, your analysis and insights are ALWAYS on the money! Thanks 😎

You two need to get a room.

Apology to WCW, I hadn't seen her comment when I posted the above.

Edited August 18, 2023 by dworship

[daisycutter 28,635]

1 hour ago, old55 said:

 

Blanck (22 games), DGB (27 games) are their tall backs.  Koschitzke (46 games) and Ramsden (1 game) are their tall forwards.  Reeves (36 games) is their ruckman, presumably with help from Ramsden - it's hardly land of the giants ...

it was just an observation

i didn't say too small, just that it was smaller than we normally go for

we will have to play a little bit different 

i've also noticed that lately we are generally being outmarked

[Jaded No More 58,593]

1 hour ago, old55 said:

JJ being subbed last week indicated the FD weren't convinced by his performance. There aren't many compelling mid/forward alternatives though - Spargo, Woewodin, Laurie, Dunstan ...

 

38 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Would have preferred Woewodin myself,  but what other options did we have in mind?

I was hoping AMW would get a run purely because I love his pace. But I guess the FD don’t think he’s ready. 
Fascinating times ahead. A few players who need a big game on Sunday if they want any chance of playing finals. 

[Binmans PA 26,292]

2 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Think it's fair to say we won't see Grundy again this year unless injury to Gawn.

Forward experiment hasn't and won't work but I think for he's sake he'd be silly not to seek further opportunities elsewhere. 

What's bizarre is why did we never try (not once), Gawn behind the ball with Grundy rucking?

It's really one of the great mysteries to 2023 and it's annoying me. :P

[Deebauched 1,219]

Odds have blown out on Hawthorn last 24 hours.

Do Sportsbet know something we dont?

[Binmans PA 26,292]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

That may well be the end of Gawndy.

If we win the flag this year no one will care. If we don't win it, there will be so much said and written about how much time we put into Gawndy when it didn't work.

That's all for another time.

For now, I think the Tomlinson-Smith-Grundy shuffle is the right call. I think dropping Jordon was the right call (although is he really the best option for sub?). But I'm not at all sure Laurie is the right call for that spot. Hope he proves me flatly wrong.

Which IMV, would still be folly given we've got a fresher Max than we would have without Gawndy and given Max's injury earlier in the year, we may well have struggled far more without Grundy. 

[Fromgotowoewodin 792]

1 hour ago, dino rover said:

Quite right

he’s a ruckman and they can’t magically become forwards

I know I’m a forward 

for starters forwards are attractive charismatic….

I digress 

He doesn’t have the speed to get separation he doesn’t have a leap and the timing needed to play forward 

neither does Gawn 

we need ruck back up and a key forward- a fwd who rucks

 

I think that’s what we wanted, but couldn’t get one in the trade period.

What we could get was Grundy so the plan was hatched to play both and hopefully take a lot of i50 marks and kick a lot of goals.

Sadly it hasn’t worked that way - in Fritta’s foot we trust 

[Demonstone 19,394]

8 minutes ago, Deebauched said:

Odds have blown out on Hawthorn last 24 hours.

Do Sportsbet know something we dont?

They know who all the money has been for and the punters are obviously backing Melbourne.

[Roost it far 6,239]

48 minutes ago, ANG13 said:

Has your account been hacked? 

Hahahaha, no but the Hawks give me nightmares 

[Jaded No More 58,593]

41 minutes ago, Binmans PA said:

What's bizarre is why did we never try (not once), Gawn behind the ball with Grundy rucking?

It's really one of the great mysteries to 2023 and it's annoying me. :P

I don’t think we want to play Gawn behind the ball until finals. We don’t want teams planning for it, or Max copping the endless physical hits until then either. 

[beelzebub 22,257]

45 minutes ago, Binmans PA said:

What's bizarre is why did we never try (not once), Gawn behind the ball with Grundy rucking?

It's really one of the great mysteries to 2023 and it's annoying me. :P

Was just talking to a guy....  exact discussion...

Why not Grundy main ruck... Max behind... Max Rucks when Grundy resting...

Is it egos ??.  Or to some a nonsense idea ?

Personally  i like it..   We go ok with Grundy tapping.....  some might just call it herest...dunno

[Binmans PA 26,292]

16 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

I don’t think we want to play Gawn behind the ball until finals. We don’t want teams planning for it, or Max copping the endless physical hits until then either. 

 

10 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Was just talking to a guy....  exact discussion...

Why not Grundy main ruck... Max behind... Max Rucks when Grundy resting...

Is it egos ??.  Or to some a nonsense idea ?

Personally  i like it..   We go ok with Grundy tapping.....  some might just call it herest...dunno

If this was the case, that'd mean we're gonna play Grundy in finals, but not in R23 or R24. Surely not?

[Young Angus 336]

I know it hasn’t worked that well, but I love seeing Grundy in the team and I’d love to keep him. Great ruck and a good footballer. I reckon it’d eventually click, or maybe it’s a surprise for finals who knows. 

[Superunknown 3,364]

Hawks paying 4.55

This like the GWS game seems very generous of the bookies

[Roost it far 6,239]

Having seen the odds I’m feeling more confident 

[praha 10,306]

13 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

Hawks paying 4.55

This like the GWS game seems very generous of the bookies

Nah it's about right. GWS game was outrageous given neutral venue and how both teams were playing at the time.

[rpfc 27,590]

13 minutes ago, Roost it far said:

Having seen the odds I’m feeling more confident