Veil of Negativity

[CYB]

23 minutes ago, Axis of Bob said:

The counter to that is that if you don't want feedback on your comments then start a blog. 

This is an online community. If you choose to engage with the community then you will have to accept that you will receive feedback from the community. This is one such item of feedback. 

Because blogs are boring. 

I get your point, it is a fine line. Most thread titles give an indication of what they are getting themselves in for. If it doesn't interest you, I don't get why some feel the need to jump into the thread and criticize the OP on their sentiment alone. 

[binman]

12 hours ago, Winners at last said:

A pessimist is an optimist in possession of all the facts.

I thought that was the definition of a realist

[Bombay Airconditioning]

On 8/14/2022 at 12:32 AM, Dee Zephyr said:

I’ve said it before, I’m enjoying this season. Like many on here I’ve never seen our team defend a premiership. 15 wins, not too bad hey?  It feels like every team has played their ‘GF’ against us. 
I know it sux to lose games, but you can’t be too despondent with the fact the boys in Red & Blue have been in almost every single game (21). 
If we go back to back it will be something remarkable for all of us. Back them in!

The Dogs, Pies and Carlton being prime examples.

Gawn was interviewed after the game Saturday night and said something along the lines off “playing the Bulldogs and every game since has felt like a final”.

[Axis of Bob]

12 hours ago, Winners at last said:

A pessimist is an optimist in possession of all the facts.

I see pessimists as not seeing the forest for the trees. Can you look past the individual faults to see the strength of the whole?

It's incredibly easy to see things that are wrong. As humans we are hardwired to be pessimists because we respond to threats far more strongly than we do to opportunities. That's because misjudging a threat often led to being eaten by a lion whereas misjudging an opportunity might have resulted in a meal of nuts rather than meat. The consequences of our failures were very different, so humans erred strongly on the side of caution .... on pessimism. It's easy to point out the individual flaws in a bigger plan because it makes you sound smart and other people are more likely to react positively to the pessimism because they are hardwired to do so.

The challenge for us all is to acknowledge that those possible threats exist but also to understand that we are inherently biased towards being influenced by those threats. Overall we are an excellent team who has a proven finals record and several of the best players in the league.

And if that is too difficult, because it is genuinely very hard to do, then think about it from the opposition's perspective: If there was one team that you didn't want to play in finals this year, who would it be?

The answer is, obviously, Melbourne.

[Winners at last]

55 minutes ago, binman said:

I thought that was the definition of a realist

Only an optimist would think that.

Nice meeting you on Friday. Look forward to your podcast tonight.

[titan_uranus]

1 hour ago, Axis of Bob said:

I see pessimists as not seeing the forest for the trees. Can you look past the individual faults to see the strength of the whole?

It's incredibly easy to see things that are wrong. As humans we are hardwired to be pessimists because we respond to threats far more strongly than we do to opportunities. That's because misjudging a threat often led to being eaten by a lion whereas misjudging an opportunity might have resulted in a meal of nuts rather than meat. The consequences of our failures were very different, so humans erred strongly on the side of caution .... on pessimism. It's easy to point out the individual flaws in a bigger plan because it makes you sound smart and other people are more likely to react positively to the pessimism because they are hardwired to do so.

The challenge for us all is to acknowledge that those possible threats exist but also to understand that we are inherently biased towards being influenced by those threats. Overall we are an excellent team who has a proven finals record and several of the best players in the league.

And if that is too difficult, because it is genuinely very hard to do, then think about it from the opposition's perspective: If there was one team that you didn't want to play in finals this year, who would it be?

The answer is, obviously, Melbourne.

I've said this on Demonland before, but it's also easier to be pessimistic.

For one, you are more likely to be "right" than "wrong" - you can set the bar at winning a flag and have a 17/18 chance of being right about us not being good enough.

For another, you don't expose yourself to disappointment. Being optimistic opens you up to being disappointed if we don't get it done. Being pessimistic all the time lets you tell yourself it isn't going to happen. 

[Grapeviney]

20 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

For another, you don't expose yourself to disappointment. 

I don't think that's true. Pessimists might tell themselves they're not disappointed because they knew it was going to happen, but they experience the same hurt we all do.

And that's why - from a rational outside perspective - it's better to be an optimist. We all end up in the same place emotionally at the end of the ride, it's just that one group (the optimists) have enjoyed the journey while the other have grumbled all the way.  

[layzie]

There is something to that and I occasionally find myself subscribing to the 'Expect the worst and you'll never be disappointed' theory.

It is an ugly feeling to be expecting something that doesn't turn out and life is a bit short to be disapointed about something that has little to do with you, espcially when you've raised the bar so high that your general happiness is riding on that successful result.

Of course I think it is always better, always smarter, always wiser to be optimistic. That goes for anything in life, but tempering expectations is not a stupid thing either. 

[Bring-Back-Powell]

If you stack up round 20, round 21, and round 22 2021 with the same three rounds in 2022, I reckon our form stacks up. And both round 19s we lost to the Dogs.

Round 20 2021 - A walk in the park 96 point win against a Gold Coast Suns who had clocked off for the year and had a last second venue switch from Metricon to Marvel put on them (as for us too but we had plenty to play for)

Round 20 2022 - Arguably our best win of the year against Fremantle in hostile territory. A road win over a top 4/5 side is a brilliant effort.

Round 21 2021 - A fall over the line win against a West Coast that fell off the cliff after round 16. Played 1 really good quarter that night.

Round 21 2022 - Led for at least 90% of the night against a red hot Collingwood that had an unsustainable level of accuracy. The major disappointment that night was that we had no answers to their pressure in the last 5 minutes.

Round 22 2021 - A win over a bottom 4 Adelaide, but one must remember that they got within a goal mid way through the third quarter before Fritta went off and we won by 40 odd points.

Round 22 2022 - A thrilling win over a desperate Carlton side showing excellent composure.

The point is we've played 3 finals like intensity games for a 2-1 record compared to a 3-0 record last year but with games with extremely low intensity with little to no crowds. You could argue that each round this year has been better than last year corresponding rounds.

Lastly, one also needs to recall that we were pathetic for a portion of the round 23 Geelong game last year.

 

 

 

 

[Engorged Onion]

Perhaps the mods could introduce a way to highlight the background - traffic light style.

Green for a happy/positive post

Orange for raising concerns

Red for vitriol to players/club/other...

[loges]

5 hours ago, deegirl said:

I recently saw a meme that said

'People really pick a sports team when they're a kid and let them annoy them the rest of their lives'

We're all in that boat, some of us are just more measured than others 

I'm definitely in the crazy half of the supporter boat.  I was so flithy with our performance on Saturday at one stage had to tell myself "you can't control what these clowns do on field".  And I'm outing myself as one of those who cracked it and walked out with 2 minutes left. 

I'd love to be one of those 'support the boys 100%' types but like all of us MFCSS sufferers, I've been hurt too many times to be optimistic.  But I fully own my craziness 

So when did you get the result?

[layzie]

Well at least we know where to come if we ever need a veil of negativity. 

[deegirl]

1 hour ago, loges said:

So when did you get the result?

Halfway along Brunton Ave it was confirmed we’d won & that I’m one of the worst supporters ever. 

[He de mon]

5 minutes ago, deegirl said:

Halfway along Brunton Ave it was confirmed we’d won & that I’m one of the worst supporters ever. 

And a fast walker.

[jacey]

2 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

If you stack up round 20, round 21, and round 22 2021 with the same three rounds in 2022, I reckon our form stacks up. And both round 19s we lost to the Dogs.

Round 20 2021 - A walk in the park 96 point win against a Gold Coast Suns who had clocked off for the year and had a last second venue switch from Metricon to Marvel put on them (as for us too but we had plenty to play for)

Round 20 2022 - Arguably our best win of the year against Fremantle in hostile territory. A road win over a top 4/5 side is a brilliant effort.

Round 21 2021 - A fall over the line win against a West Coast that fell off the cliff after round 16. Played 1 really good quarter that night.

Round 21 2022 - Led for at least 90% of the night against a red hot Collingwood that had an unsustainable level of accuracy. The major disappointment that night was that we had no answers to their pressure in the last 5 minutes.

Round 22 2021 - A win over a bottom 4 Adelaide, but one must remember that they got within a goal mid way through the third quarter before Fritta went off and we won by 40 odd points.

Round 22 2022 - A thrilling win over a desperate Carlton side showing excellent composure.

The point is we've played 3 finals like intensity games for a 2-1 record compared to a 3-0 record last year but with games with extremely low intensity with little to no crowds. You could argue that each round this year has been better than last year corresponding rounds.

Lastly, one also needs to recall that we were pathetic for a portion of the round 23 Geelong game last year.

 

 

 

 

Agree. Form for both years aren't that far off. Difference is last year was bottom 6 teams whilst this year, top 6 finalist playing out of their skins. 

The intensity late this year could burn out the players, sure but look at it this way lads. 

We need 16 more good quarters this year.

Go flat out as you will have a week off before finals. A week off before prelim.

It's go time.

 

 

 

[The heart beats true]

This will make you feel better. It’s from tonight’s On The Couch:

Matches vs Top 8 teams since Round 12:

Melbourne - 7

Freo - 5
Carlton - 5
Richmond - 4
Brisbane - 4
Sydney - 3
Geelong - 3 
Collingwood - 3

We also played the Dogs in that time. We’ve had a hard run and come through it.

Also, Jeremy’s Cameron’s done his hammy, and Essendon are a shambles. Lift the veil and look around. We are going ok.

[Macca]

The strange bit about the pessimists is they often get even more upset about a loss than the optimists.  Even though they were often expecting a loss

I've always viewed footy fans as optimistic pessimists or pessimistic optimists.  We delight in having 2 contrasting opinions

Realists see both sides and end up arguing with both camps.  Optimists often see realists as pessimists and pessimists often see realists as optimists

 

Edited August 15 by Macca

[binman]

12 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

This will make you feel better. It’s from tonight’s On The Couch:

Matches vs Top 8 teams since Round 12:

Melbourne - 7

Freo - 5
Carlton - 5
Richmond - 4
Brisbane - 4
Sydney - 3
Geelong - 3 
Collingwood - 3

We also played the Dogs in that time. We’ve had a hard run and come through it.

Also, Jeremy’s Cameron’s done his hammy, and Essendon are a shambles. Lift the veil and look around. We are going ok.

Jezus  - how did the cats get that draw?

Three games in tbe second half of the seaon against top 3 sides, at least one of which was at home (us).

And they played North twice!

[Demonstone]

34 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

Matches vs Top 8 teams since Round 12:

That only tells half the story.  You'd need to include the first 12 rounds to get a more accurate picture.

We had a fairly easy run in the first half of the season, but people conveniently forget that.

[Boots and all]

9 hours ago, David-Demon said:

Unfortunately we are now third on the ladder not second with the Swans playing St Kilda in the last game of the year and of course we play Brisbane at their home Ground. To get to second place we would need to win by more points that Sydney beat St Kilda by to edge to that position. Frankly both the Demons and The Swans will be fighting not only for wins but percentage points as well as the gap is slight between us and the Swans.

 

...and unfortunately the Lions are a better side than the Saints, so advantage Swans.

[Demon Dynasty]

44 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

Also, Jeremy’s Cameron’s done his hammy, and Essendon are a shambles. Lift the veil and look around. We are going ok.

HBT i would ask that you restrain yourself from posting such positive things on the veil of negativity thread.

P.S.  Rhys Stanley also out with an adductor strain

[The heart beats true]

34 minutes ago, Demonstone said:

That only tells half the story.  You'd need to include the first 12 rounds to get a more accurate picture.

We had a fairly easy run in the first half of the season, but people conveniently forget that.

Yes, it only tells half the story because it’s only half the season - which is why it says clearly FROM ROUND 12.

This place is filled with grumpy pedants at the moment, that want to argue with you about the things you didn’t say. Weird vibes.

[Demonstone]

24 minutes ago, The heart beats true said:

Yes, it only tells half the story because it’s only half the season

I understand that and I wasn't having a shot at you. 

It was more a comment on poor journalism based on incomplete and misleading stats.

[Dr. Gonzo]

12 hours ago, Vipercrunch said:

100%.  Our raw Win/loss record is very comparable but we've had a much harded season to contend with.

I believe our 2022 season has actually been an improvement on 2021 when you take in all the factors above and you look past the incredible final 45 minutes of footy we played in 2021.  We are not playing our best footy and must improve in many areas to win it all again, but that is exactly the situation we were in at this time in 2021.  

Agree although I keep seeing this about having a shorter preseason due to playing in the GF. The 2020 covid impacted season ran into October so our last H&A game against Essendon was on 19th September less than a weeks difference to the GF in 2021. Surely then our preseason was similar for 2021 and 2022 (albeit we had a longer preseason compared to the teams who played finals in 2020).

[titan_uranus]

2 hours ago, Demonstone said:

That only tells half the story.  You'd need to include the first 12 rounds to get a more accurate picture.

We had a fairly easy run in the first half of the season, but people conveniently forget that.

I've posted on this a few times in other places today.

Everyone plays everyone else once, so the focus is the five return matches.

We've had 3 against current top 8 sides, which will become 4 if the Dogs replace Carlton.

Currently Geelong and Sydney have had 0 return games against current top 8 sides, which will become 1 each if the Dogs replace Carlton.

And currently Richmond's had 1 return game against current top 8 sides, which will become 0 if the Dogs replace Carlton.

So the full story is similar to the half story - our fixture has had more difficult games in it than many of our competitors.