POSTGAME: Community Series vs Carlton

[dworship 3,342]

7 hours ago, John Crow Batty said:

Perhaps go the Rugby Union way. No players allowed to talk to the ref unless spoken to by the ref. Only Captain can question or speak to ref. Players can only respond with, “Yes sir” when spoken to by the ref.

This, but I think a Captains challenge also needs to be introduced.

[whatwhat say what 22,941]

1 hour ago, leave it to deever said:

Your right. I used to have a front wheel Magna that had a smaller Tc than Tmac circa two seasons ago, but he seemed to have fixed this last year and here's hoping he keeps going well this season.

chris lamb had the biggest turning circle of any player i've seen play for the mfc

i remember seeing him get turned inside out by a 36 (or so) year old sav rocca in canberra one pre-season and knew he was never gonna make it right there and then

that young fella aaron davey looked pretty orright in the same game tho...

[Jjrogan 1,439]

11 hours ago, Sydney_Demon said:

Firstly, I apologise for starting this whole exchange. I accept disappointingly I'm probably in a minority of one on this given no-one else has come out in support and a number of you have actually pushed back (I must have touched a sore point). I already acknowledged that the fans who still use the term maggots to describe umpires are highly unlikely to take a good hard look at themselves but thanks for confirming it in your case.

I totally get the emotion involved in watching a game of footy. I got involved in a meaningless and fairly childish exchange with a Carlton supporter last year. I cooled down a little and actually apologised to him for overreacting and he apologised back (a high point for both of us that day). Playing Brisbane in Sydney last year I got involved again in a meaningless exchange with a group of Brisbane supporters who'd obviously had a few beers pre-game. I decided that I was about to lose it so changed seats at half time. before it got out of control (I was vastly outnumbered). I'm also fairly notorious for loudly expressing my view on umpiring decisions I don't agree with.

I also agree it's better to call an umpire a maggot rather than jump the fence or affect your mental health by not being able to say it. A bit sad that that's what it comes down to but if that's the way it is... I also appreciate you making just that little bit of extra effort under duress to make sure you're not too close to the action or shouting too loudly to make sure the umpires don't hear it. I'm also sure all those around you are sitting there silently thinking how witty you are and how they love the use of your colourful if dated vocabulary. Even if they find it offensive (highly unlikely I know as everyone loves a bit of verbal abuse), that's not important. It's much more important that you can feel free to fully express 

I agree with your sentiments fwiw.  I used to get all worked up about umpires once upon a time, but then I got myself a life and realised abusing someone to make me feel better is actually pathetic.  But Rome is the mob so er, play on. 

[Lucifers Hero 40,361]

12 hours ago, Watson11 said:

If the umps look up at the coaches box during cats games they’ll give up about 25 of them. 

So true! 

Not to mention Selwood and Hawkins!!

[Lord Nev 13,512]

14 hours ago, Lucifers Hero said:

We also gave up a few 50m for 'delaying' when players asked who had the free.  It took about 15 seconds.  Is that delaying?  I would say not?

And, Oliver was pinned 50m for giving ball to teammate thinking he had the free.

The umps need to not be so whistle happy when it isn't clear who has the free, or the infringement wasn't in line of sight of the player collecting the ball.  Or stand next to and point to the player who has the free. 

Perhaps, it is best to let opps players collect the ball themselves.  That is what some other teams do.

 

As an aside, I wonder how many 50m the whingeing cats give up.  Good chance by the time they play their game the umps put the whistle away for 50m...

Actually thought the delay ones were fair tbh. Lingers has been taking the [censored] with that for a fair while and I hate it when players do that fake pointing thing to delay the game. The Oliver one has been an automatic 50 for as long as I can remember, honest mistake or not. I'm keen on cracking down on the delay of game ones.

The 'abuse' ones in our game tho.... sheeesh... Hopefully the backlash and attention from our game will mean it will settle in before round 1. Always happens with new rules, I remember tons of 50s the start of last year when players standing the mark lost their balance, moved a foot slightly or sneezed, but that settled in after a while.

[Ollie fan 3,468]

1 hour ago, Lucifers Hero said:

So true! 

Not to mention Selwood and Hawkins!!

And Dangerfield!! According to him, he has never given away a genuine free, but has missed being awarded about 20 per game.

[sue 9,142]

54 minutes ago, Ollie fan said:

And Dangerfield!! According to him, he has never given away a genuine free, but has missed being awarded about 20 per game.

Will be interesting to wathc the Suns vs Geelong match.

 

[MT64 1,144]

Missed a lot of game/comments but can someone please tell me how many goals the "brown paper baggers" kicked from 50mt frees given by the ump's by their MIS-INTERPRETATION" of an interpretation. I shudder to think what new interpretations the AFL may try to sneak in with one coaching brother talking to AFL brother.

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

On 3/4/2022 at 2:00 PM, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

My namesake needs to pull his finger out and quickly. People will point to the fact that he laid 8 tackles. Big deal. Did any of them stick and cause turnover in our favour? Whether it's the position he is playing at the moment or something else, he is all out of sorts. He does not get to any of the right spots as a small forward. We literally had no representation at ground last night. He doesn't know where to be when we don't have the ball. I think he needs some serious guidance, as he is ineffectual at the moment, as he was on GF Day. I hope he can find his mojo, otherwise a spell at Casey may reignite the spark. Seemed to have plenty of 'leisure time' over the summer. Time to get serious. 

100% on the money. He was ordinary against the Roos as well as most of the games late last year. It may be a role but he needs to lift and impact the scoreboard.  In all fairness though, Spargo and ANB were very average too. 

[dazzledavey36 55,319]

5 minutes ago, CYB said:

100% on the money. He was ordinary against the Roos as well as most of the games late last year. It may be a role but he needs to lift and impact the scoreboard.  In all fairness though, Spargo and ANB were very average too. 

What a crap post.

Late last year? He kicked 3 goals in the preliminary final against Geelong and and had a dozen score assists.

He kicked 2 goals in the first final against Brisbane and provided huge amount of forward line pressure.

The final game of the season he had 14 disposals, 4 tackles and kicked 3 goals. He kicked a really important goal in the last term to get our resurgence going for that win.

Not only was he he doing some incredible defensive work off the ball but he was still hitting the scoreboard.

I also found the whole impacting the scoreboard comment boring.. he kicked 40 goals last year playing as a 19 year old small forward in just his 2nd year of AFL. Some of you are seriously outdated with writing kozzie off so early.

His upside is scary.

[binman 43,761]

4 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

What a crap post.

Late last year? He kicked 3 goals in the preliminary final against Geelong and and had a dozen score assists.

He kicked 2 goals in the first final against Brisbane and provided huge amount of forward line pressure.

The final game of the season he had 14 disposals, 4 tackles and kicked 3 goals. He kicked a really important goal in the last term to get our resurgence going for that win.

Not only was he he doing some incredible defensive work off the ball but he was still hitting the scoreboard.

I also found the whole impacting the scoreboard comment boring.. he kicked 40 goals last year playing as a 19 year old small forward in just his 2nd year of AFL. Some of you are seriously outdated with writing kozzie off so early.

His upside is scary.

Yep.

And I'd add tbat goals are not his KPI - pressure is.

Goals are a bonus. 

He had 8 tackles against Carlton, a stand out in a low intensity performance from us.

And his pressure was outstanding in the practice match against the roos.

[leave it to deever 17,517]

15 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

His upside is scary

Cant wait to follow Kozzie this season.

Has such star potential at such a young age.

A couple of quiet pre season games is nothing.

[dazzledavey36 55,319]

6 minutes ago, binman said:

Yep.

And I'd add tbat goals are not his KPI - pressure is.

Goals are a bonus. 

He had 8 tackles against Carlton, a stand out in a low intensity performance from us.

And his pressure was outstanding in the practice match against the roos.

He was really good against North. Was used more in the midfield and showed he has capabilities there if needed.

He was cruising on Friday as were some of our star players.

Saving his best work for the real stuff.

[Willmoy1947 4,140]

14 hours ago, dworship said:

This, but I think a Captains challenge also needs to be introduced.

A ref hasn't been in mortal danger since Fabulousl Phil retired in AFL

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,294]

5 hours ago, Lucifers Hero said:

So true! 

Not to mention Selwood and Hawkins!!

 

3 hours ago, Ollie fan said:

And Dangerfield!! According to him, he has never given away a genuine free, but has missed being awarded about 20 per game.

I wish this new interpretation was around when Ablett was playing. 
 

Would make our 8 x50s against Blues look pedestrian all these blokes !

[durango 2,023]

I wonder what will be considered decent of an umpire just shaking your head or a quick 4 letter work when you are upset with your self for giving away a free kick.

This rule could go into the annals as the Putin Rule invented by Gillon to appease the umpires.

[loges 6,767]

Can anyone explain how the umpire is going to differentiate between a player expressing frustration at himself and abuse.

[Clintosaurus 7,861]

12 minutes ago, loges said:

Can anyone explain how the umpire is going to differentiate between a player expressing frustration at himself and abuse.

The colour of their jumper comes to mind.

[DeeSpencer 26,081]

17 minutes ago, loges said:

Can anyone explain how the umpire is going to differentiate between a player expressing frustration at himself and abuse.

Really shouldn’t be too hard. Petracca not looking at the umpire, not motioning towards the umpire, all ok. McDonald - gesticulating and walking towards the ump - abuse.

But let’s be honest they’ll just pay a few in the first month of the season then relax it. They just want to send a message to community umpires and also make sure it’s not just Toby Greene carrying the can for poor behaviour. He was clearly the worst but there’s others who have pushed the line. 
 

Its crazy that they’ve publicised it and built it up to more than what should be just the occasional 50. 

[daisycutter 29,737]

13 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Really shouldn’t be too hard. Petracca not looking at the umpire, not motioning towards the umpire, all ok. McDonald - gesticulating and walking towards the ump - abuse. 

why is that "abuse"? gesticulating with arms is not abuse, facing the umpire is not abuse.  we don't know what he said but i'd guess it was probably something about the carlton player ducking to draw a free.  now if he swore at the umpire or said something offensive then that would be abuse, but you don't  know what/if he said.

let's not reinvent the word abuse or it just becomes ridiculous

[DeeSpencer 26,081]

2 minutes ago, daisycutter said:

why is that "abuse"? gesticulating with arms is not abuse, facing the umpire is not abuse.  we don't know what he said but i'd guess it was probably something about the carlton player ducking to draw a free.  now if he swore at the umpire or said something offensive then that would be abuse, but you don't  know what/if he said.

let's not reinvent the word abuse or it just becomes ridiculous

Dissent then? You know it when you see it. The Tomlinson one is the trickier one because unless he’s called the umpire a nasty word he hasn’t done anything wrong.

[daisycutter 29,737]

Just now, DeeSpencer said:

Dissent then? You know it when you see it. The Tomlinson one is the trickier one because unless he’s called the umpire a nasty word he hasn’t done anything wrong.

dissent maybe better but it could have just been simply querying, asking

certainly not "abuse" (on what we can see)

 

[D4Life 2,523]

On 3/4/2022 at 5:26 PM, Kick_It_To_Pickett said:

He ain’t exactly a midfielder either. Hunt gets criticism for the fact he runs quick but butchers it, not sure Kozzy does much better. Easily moved off the ball at centre bounces and hardly likes to get down and dirty. In say that, he does tackle. Think he needs to be more desperate and make better decisions with ball in hand

Can someone please remind me how many goals Pickett kicked last year and was it the final against Brisbane that he kicked 3 goals?

This post is up there with the drop Fritsch calls made last year on Demonland!

on other matters:

I don’t think we dropped 4 points against Carlton? We also didn’t lose by 10 goals, only 5 points after giving away 6 goals through 50 M penalties and a few centre square infringements. Yet Carlton we’re great.

Why don’t we wait until the season actually starts before deciding the sky is falling!

Goodwin has some good ammunition pre the season starting, if you don’t put in, you won’t get the rewards!

Re depth, listen to Choco  Williams views - while the mantra is one soldier put another in, when you lose a Gawn, Clarry or Trac, players 23,24,25 can’t replace them. Seems like Demons have reasonable coverage across the ground and that is all you can expect.

Every club seems to carry 3-5 players on the list that fans wonder why, there just aren’t many stars waiting to be plucked out of lower leagues!

It seems with few injuries that we are well placed going into 2022!

Go Demons in 2022, 2021 premiers no matter what happens!😃

[Josh 1,420]

6 hours ago, Lord Nev said:

Actually thought the delay ones were fair tbh. Lingers has been taking the [censored] with that for a fair while and I hate it when players do that fake pointing thing to delay the game. The Oliver one has been an automatic 50 for as long as I can remember, honest mistake or not. I'm keen on cracking down on the delay of game ones.

The 'abuse' ones in our game tho.... sheeesh... Hopefully the backlash and attention from our game will mean it will settle in before round 1. Always happens with new rules, I remember tons of 50s the start of last year when players standing the mark lost their balance, moved a foot slightly or sneezed, but that settled in after a while.

I agree. The James Jordon one happens all the time. "Who him" yes him, aka the only other opposition player within 20m. I think the umpires can tell the difference between genuine confusion and time wasting.

 

The abuse one is a no brainer as well IMHO. Yes it's a high pressure, high paced environment and again there's a difference between a once off sly comment and flat out abuse.

 

No excuse, just don't so it

[daisycutter 29,737]

9 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Dissent then? You know it when you see it. The Tomlinson one is the trickier one because unless he’s called the umpire a nasty word he hasn’t done anything wrong.

lets take another tack...

suppose a player throws the ball, tackles someone high or some other infringement

umpire doesn't pay a free

player looks at umpire, raises arm in appeal, says "he threw the ball!",  no malice or anger in delivery

happens all the time

directed at ump - tick

dissenting an umpire decision (i.e. no free) - tick

so, for consistency re dissent this would be a free kick against the dissenter?