TEAMS: Rd 05 vs Richmond

[BigFez 1,388]

Just now, Rednblueriseing said:

A defender should know when to force his opponent out of bounds (Ablett) that goal should never have happened 

Yep that's the kind of mistake I was talking about.  That was dumb footy, he was lucky he wasn't pinged for the throw too.  Take that out of his game and you might end up with a reliable defender.  Will he ever be Matthew Scarlett?  No, but I think there's a chance for him to be a decent lock-down defender and i wouldn't mind if he was kept i the side for a few more weeks to see how he goes.  i don't think there is anyone demanding his spot just yet.

[Mel Bourne 3,672]

19 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

I don't think he's a dud per se, he's on the list of an AFL club, so it's a bloody lot higher than I have ever played.

My problem with him is that I think his shortcomings far outweigh his strengths.

I look at someone like Rivers.  You can just tell that Riv has "it", that's one of his strengths.  He's a footballer, first and foremost, and that's the perfect starting point.  He already understands the game, and will only continue to improve as he gets bigger/stronger/fitter.  What level will he get too?  Who knows.

I don't feel that Smith understands the game, and because of this, the role he is given is at a reduced capacity.  You only need to see how he panicked in the 3rd quarter last Sunday to know that his football awareness is just not there.  While the more he plays, the more he will learn, but he's so far off where Rivers' knowledge of the game is, that he (Smith) needs to learn a lot, just to get him to what I'd consider a minimum standard.

The problem with AFL sides these days is that their defence is so structured and smart.  Smith is fine from a structure point of view, but he would have no idea how to adjust if the structure breaks down, or if he needs to take the game on, he'd be lost.

I'll be interested to see if he plays this week, and if he does, what match-up they give him.  If I was Hardwick, I'd be licking my lips if Smith goes back again.

The above is only my opinion, so not really worth much in the scheme of things, but that's how I see it.

I appreciate the considered response. Cheers. 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,443]

25 minutes ago, Engorged Onion said:

@La Dee-vina Comedia, perhaps you could attend the next Zoom meeting, or presser and ask these questions

I expect to get a more truthful response on Demonland than anything the club might publicly provide (and I'm fine with that). The only problem is that the truthful Demonland response might still be less accurate than the possibly untruthful, official response!  

[chook fowler 18,277]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

It would help if the club had a consistent narrative around Harley:

• When selected to play rnd 2 Goodwin was effusive with praise and believed he was ready to play.
• When not selected to play rnd 4 Goodwin said its about his form and building his game but Mahoney said he had to get his body right.
• When not selected to play rnd 5 Goodwin says he needs to work on his defensive game and only got the rnd 2 game because Hannan, AvB and Pickett weren't available. ie gifted

No wonder people are sceptical. 

Agree. Hunt and AVB had about 10 possessions between them. Bennell 14 in half a game. Who would you prefer?

[WA Demon Boy 966]

I actually think Smith played ok too down back and just played his role well. However, can I see him playing down back the rest of the year and into the future. No

Do I think he's being wasted down there? Yes

The thing is, is that we have Omac who isn't an AA defender by any stretch of the imagination but also doesn't need to be. Rarely do players get off the chain and kick bags anymore and he is an honest defender. I would 100% rather have Omac in our backline than Smith. He can take the #1 key fwd which frees up May and Lever. 

I like Smith for all this assets too - but you don't need those assets down back, if Smith was like a Sicily then yeah sure play him down there but his assets are being wasted when all he has to do is lock down a defender, why not get Omac to do that? 

Play Smith off the bench as that high half fwd? 

I really want to see Omac back in the side and I never thought I'd say that. 

Backline is far more stable with Omac, May and Lever than Smith, Lever and May. 

If i was Smith i'd be super frustrated. The team is crying out for goals and something to happen forward of centre and Smith is stuck in a back pocket....



 

[ManDee 7,089]

It is possible that there is another issue with Bennell that the club are not talking about.

I know nothing about any problem but I do know that clubs lie. Logically to me Bennell would be playing.

[nosoupforme 3,085]

2 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

We have too many romantics who were fans of Smith Snr and just like to see his young fella playing in the red and blue. No doubt Joel is an athletic guy but he’s not an AFL Footballer. Bring in OMac. 
 

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=12&pid1=4160&fid1=C&playerStatus2=A&tid2=12&pid2=4024&fid2=C&type=A

Yes that is right.  I agree wholly with what you have written. However it is better coming from you.When l have voiced the same opinion I have been attacked and accused of denigrating  Joel in unsavory terms. 

i do like reading your posts as l do with many others. I also know when one is not going to make the grade as a footballer. Joel is one of them.  PERIOD.        

 

[WA Demon Boy 966]

4 minutes ago, ManDee said:

It is possible that there is another issue with Bennell that the club are not talking about.

I know nothing about any problem but I do know that clubs lie. Logically to me Bennell would be playing.

I don't think so

I think it was really, really dumb for Goodwin to say he wants Bennell to work on his defensive element of his game. Yes that might be the case when you play more games and your body is 100% but to say that was super dumb 

If he said that we are managing (which we are, but why not say that) then there wouldn't be any questions asked because he hasn't played in some time. 

Still a 70% fit Bennell is an asset and the only way to build out his strength in his body, fitness and defensive elements if it's a worry is to play him? 

Not play him in the 2's. He's a 1's player every day of the week. 

Problem = We bomb it in and have limited players who ooze class with ball in hand

Solution = Play Bennell and have a focus on his defensive element as the game goes on

 

[Grimes Times 1,278]

People complaining about an extended bench and possible inclusion over others when no one has seen any scratch matches or training sessions to base any form or not????

[WA Demon Boy 966]

Just now, Grimes Times said:

People complaining about an extended bench and possible inclusion over others when no one has seen any scratch matches or training sessions to base any form or not????

but you have to look at problem vs solution right? 

Life is problem vs solution

And our problems are scoring, so our solution has to be a) delivery inside 50 and then b) ability to convert 

Both of which are just ongoing problems and when you don't see hard solution or at leas "potential" solutions to fix these then it causes mayhem.

I can't wait to see our team this afternoon because our strategies right now seem non-existent and we're playing in hope 

 

[Grimes Times 1,278]

17 hours ago, Wiseblood said:

Spargo won't play.

It will be Brown or Jackson in for possibly AVB.

Goodwin spoke of continuity, so I can see us making just the one change and adding a little extra height to the side.  That's fine with me.

We can whinge about Spargo coming in all we like (even though he won't play), but Jones and Jetta were both way out of form and Bennell could barely get through 50% of a game while avoiding as much contact as possible.  I know that's to be expected after so long out of the game, but they clearly want him to get some of that confidence back before they give him another dip at AFL level.

Changes are fine by me as we're potentially adding in a tall player, which is what we need.

WOW somebody that is talking sense.

[Grimes Times 1,278]

16 hours ago, buck_nekkid said:

Wow.  All the whiners queue up.  There has been HEAPS of commentary from inside the club that, if the complainers were to listen, might give a few hints about selection.  Goodwin - looking for consistency and small changes on a role by role basis.  Bennell now third in the line and has to work. Plapp - Weids working on his game and Will be ready when needed.  Brayshaw - the team know what goodie wants and are all aligned around delivering it.  Omac best on last weekend.  Spargo great in his role.  Jones body nearly back to full fitness.  Jetta - playing more like old Nev, but still a bit to do. Brown - kicked goals on the WE.  Anyone remember Spargo at his best?

Without track watchers to help us, we are further away from seeing who is in our out based upon training.  If your cognitive frame is the MFCSS, then you are not gonna like it.  

But honestly?  There are really few surprises here if you tune in to what the club have said across the week.  

SNAP

[BScotti 112]

15 minutes ago, MF-C said:

I don't think so

I think it was really, really dumb for Goodwin to say he wants Bennell to work on his defensive element of his game. Yes that might be the case when you play more games and your body is 100% but to say that was super dumb 

If he said that we are managing (which we are, but why not say that) then there wouldn't be any questions asked because he hasn't played in some time. 

Still a 70% fit Bennell is an asset and the only way to build out his strength in his body, fitness and defensive elements if it's a worry is to play him? 

Not play him in the 2's. He's a 1's player every day of the week. 

Problem = We bomb it in and have limited players who ooze class with ball in hand

Solution = Play Bennell and have a focus on his defensive element as the game goes on

 

Surely just focus on quality and simplicity.  Quality delivery (includes Bennell), a FWD target who can mark it or bring it to ground (has to include Weideman) and some crumbers.  Oh and a fwd set up that means not everyone goes to the same spot and fly's together.

 

[Axis of Bob 10,229]

I am so looking forward to watching this place burn to the ground when the final team is Spargo in for Rivers.

The team is too slow up forward with McDonald plus Vandenberg and another tall. If we're going for the second tall it'll probably be at the expense of Vandenberg. Spargo is a much more likely in, since he's someone who makes good decisions going inside 50, which is a skill we've really lacked. 

With Hibberd coming back in and playing well, plus Lockhart, it's likely the choice will be between Lockhart and Rivers. Rivers has been promising so far but he's been beaten in some big contests over the past few weeks which have been costly in a team that has been otherwise very good defensively. 

Goodwin has flagged the style he wants to play through the media and press conferences. We want to attack quickly with a tall to bring it to ground and then a fleet of smalls and mediums to take advantage of the space created behind the contest at half forward. Kossie was very important to those contests last week and Spargo is a similar, if much less dynamic, player.

But I'm going to log in later tonight for the melts.

[rjay 23,922]

1 hour ago, hardtack said:

Ok, thanks.  However, I'm not sure that automatically translates to greatness as a head coach.  After all, Goodwin was an assistant at Essendon and then assistant to one of the greats in Paul Roos for two years, yet apart from one good season in 2018, it hasn't really counted for much; at least, not yet.

Yep, as Carlton found out with Bolton.

If Goodwin is moved on then we don't have time to train another who may or may not make it as a coach.

Lyon, Scott....

[drdrake 3,038]

We have played 2-3 quarters of decent football for the entire season to date, we have massive issues our mids are slow and have big issues kicking the football.  The reason why we bomb it long is we don't have the confidence in hitting a target 20-30m away and we would rather bomb it to a 3 on 1, 50m away.  

 

[rjay 23,922]

5 minutes ago, Axis of Bob said:

Kossie was very important to those contests last week and Spargo is a similar,

They're nothing alike 'Bob'...

Spargo doesn't have the leg speed for that role, can't hit front and square...Kossie can also take a grab (Spargo can't get off the ground) and he creates defensive pressure.

If Goodwin is serious about defence, Spargo struggles to hold a tackle and opponents know it.

They run over him like he's not there.

He's a total defensive liability.

[WA Demon Boy 966]

1 minute ago, drdrake said:

We have played 2-3 quarters of decent football for the entire season to date, we have massive issues our mids are slow and have big issues kicking the football.  The reason why we bomb it long is we don't have the confidence in hitting a target 20-30m away and we would rather bomb it to a 3 on 1, 50m away.  

 

which is why we need Weed and Bennell 

it's just so obvious. 

I swear if Spargo and AVB play I'll be drinking 4 bottles of vodka in rage to numb the pain 

[Axis of Bob 10,229]

11 minutes ago, rjay said:

They're nothing alike 'Bob'...

No, they're pretty similar players. Small, clever, fall of the ball forwards. It's just that Pickett is much, much better. 

But that style of player is very important for us, which is why they went so hard for Kozzie last year and have taken a risk on Bennell. We have a lack in that area and, when Spargo plays well, we are a high scoring team. It's the role, more than the player.

[Demons11 6,404]

3 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

It would help if the club had a consistent narrative around Harley:

• When selected to play rnd 2 Goodwin was effusive with praise and believed he was ready to play.
• When not selected to play rnd 4 Goodwin said its about his form and building his game but Mahoney said he had to get his body right.
• When not selected to play rnd 5 Goodwin says he needs to work on his defensive game and only got the rnd 2 game because Hannan, AvB and Pickett weren't available. ie gifted

No wonder people are sceptical. 

Building his game, working on his defensive game and getting his body right seem all fairly logical to me.  Why is this an issue? All players would be working on different things on a weekly basis, why should he be any different? 

[rjay 23,922]

2 minutes ago, Axis of Bob said:

No, they're pretty similar players. Small, clever, fall of the ball forwards. It's just that Pickett is much, much better. 

But that style of player is very important for us, which is why they went so hard for Kozzie last year and have taken a risk on Bennell. We have a lack in that area and, when Spargo plays well, we are a high scoring team. It's the role, more than the player.

One of the greatest myths in AFL...the role.

Blight laughed at this one the other day and I agree.

The player has to be good enough...

Spargo isn't a drop of the ball player, he's a good little player at VFL/local league level...not AFL.

He's a small link up player and doesn't hit the packs.

[binman 38,396]

32 minutes ago, Axis of Bob said:

 

Goodwin has flagged the style he wants to play through the media and press conferences. We want to attack quickly with a tall to bring it to ground and then a fleet of smalls and mediums to take advantage of the space created behind the contest at half forward. 

Agree. Given this don't you find it strange how we allowed the cats game to play out?

[Axis of Bob 10,229]

1 minute ago, binman said:

Agree. Given this don't you find it strange how we allowed the cats game to play out?

How so?

[rjay 23,922]

1 minute ago, Demons11 said:

Building his game, working on his defensive game and getting his body right seem all fairly logical to me.  Why is this an issue? All players would be working on different things on a weekly basis, why should he be any different? 

He shouldn't, but like the others he should be doing this in the senior team where he is needed.

Wallace mentioned we had players not up to AFL level, he didn't name them so let me have a go.

From this weeks squad....Spargo, Smith, AVB, Hannan, Tommy Mac, Melk (on current form), Hunt, Brown

Young players still learning the game...Rivers, Lockhart, Jackson

[Grimes Times 1,278]

14 hours ago, Demonland said:

Bring back Greeny?

 

There is a reason green isnt coaching anymore