3 hours ago, Dame Gaga said:

I just don't like the vague description "mental health issue". I grew up with someone who suffered from  major mental illness all of their life, and saying you suffer from "depression" as an excuse to get out of certain situations, to me devalues the very real suffering of people struggling with this issue. We all get depressed sometimes, but most of us do not get to know the "black dog" of utter despair. To cite mental health issues too many times risks the public becoming immune to the real problems of people with mental illness living their lives out of the spotlight. The public will become cynical and less sympathetic to ALL sufferers is they suspect players are using the system to cover up something else. Sorry to be so heavy, but this is a sore point with me.

I have no respect for people who falsely claim they have a "mental health" problem as an excuse for poor behaviour. But I'm also conscious that as a society we need to make sure that we don't assume that a person who claims a mental health problem does not, in fact, have one. Every case needs to be judged on its merits and none of us will ever know which ones are genuine and which ones are not. Only a person trained in that area and actually dealing with (ie, treating) the person involved will know.  

 

2 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Sorry mate. Can’t agree

drug taking by young people is very high, including AFL Players

What are you disagreeing with?

I’m not denying plenty of players take drugs, particularly on long breaks and the offseason. My guess is it could almost be as much as 50% of a list who on end of season trips, New Years, at the spring races etc. 

5-10 if not more of the 45 on a list probably have never touched drugs, a lot of people and athletes are like that. Some AFL players weigh their food and count every calorie. They aren’t touching drugs

5-10 are probably taking drugs more regularly than once every while and are at risk of harming themselves and almost certainly not performing to their best. A good club either sorts them out or kicks them out. 

18 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

On a slightly different tack, I wonder if there are any players with genuine mental health problems which have been directly caused from drug use. There is plenty of scientific evidence that marijuana can cause depression and other mental health problems in some people.  

You mean like half of the 2006 WC premiership list?

4 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

What are you disagreeing with?

I’m not denying plenty of players take drugs, particularly on long breaks and the offseason. My guess is it could almost be as much as 50% of a list who on end of season trips, New Years, at the spring races etc. 

5-10 if not more of the 45 on a list probably have never touched drugs, a lot of people and athletes are like that. Some AFL players weigh their food and count every calorie. They aren’t touching drugs

5-10 are probably taking drugs more regularly than once every while and are at risk of harming themselves and almost certainly not performing to their best. A good club either sorts them out or kicks them out. 

Or you can just deal with it, because it will always be there. 

Performing enhancing drugs are a completely different story

Dane Swan wants everybody tested including everyone at AFL Headquarters, Past Players & Officials who say the problem is rife and journos who write about it. 

2 hours ago, Demonland said:

Dane Swan wants everybody tested including everyone at AFL Headquarters, Past Players & Officials who say the problem is rife and journos who write about it. 

Lol okay Dane. Why not drug test the supporters before gaining entry to thew G while your at it. Love to see how he himself would fare on a urinalysis. Poorly I would assume. 

Dane Swan is a mouth breather, only the common bogan will agree with his comments.

Edited March 1, 20196 yr by Ethan Tremblay

6 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

a lot of people and athletes are like that. Some AFL players weigh their food and count every calorie. They aren’t touching drugs

Sorry to be pedantic Sir (although I was reading yesterday, how the use of this term is not PC), but Lance Armstrong was the most professional of all the professionals on the world cycling tour and weighed his own food before each meal . He was absolutely obsessed and scrupulous with his training and preparation but had no problem doping.  

This is not about AFL, but it's an interesting illegal doping story. I'm just not sure whether it's humorous, troubling or both.

4 hours ago, hemingway said:

Sorry to be pedantic Sir (although I was reading yesterday, how the use of this term is not PC), but Lance Armstrong was the most professional of all the professionals on the world cycling tour and weighed his own food before each meal . He was absolutely obsessed and scrupulous with his training and preparation but had no problem doping.  

Not my comment 

computer glitch somewhere

F$&@ Lance Armstrong 

The NEW REVISED ASADA will get to the bottom of this and put someone with "experience" in charge.......

In the world of illicit drugs this one has to surprise:

"The world No 1 bridge player has been suspended after failing a drugs test.Geir Helgemo, who is Norwegian but represents Monaco in bridge events, tested positive for synthetic testosterone and the female fertility drug clomifene at a World Bridge Series event in Orlando in September.

Kari-Anne Opsal, president of the Norwegian Bridge Federation, said the drugs were “not performance enhancing”

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/mar/01/world-no1-bridge-player-suspended-after-failing-a-drugs-test-geir-helgemo

PS Geir is a male by the way

 

Edited March 2, 20196 yr by Diamond_Jim

17 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

In the world of illicit drugs this one has to surprise:

"The world No 1 bridge player has been suspended after failing a drugs test.Geir Helgemo, who is Norwegian but represents Monaco in bridge events, tested positive for synthetic testosterone and the female fertility drug clomifene at a World Bridge Series event in Orlando in September.

Kari-Anne Opsal, president of the Norwegian Bridge Federation, said the drugs were “not performance enhancing”

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/mar/01/world-no1-bridge-player-suspended-after-failing-a-drugs-test-geir-helgemo

PS Geir is a male by the way

 

Clomifene is used as a post cycle therapy product by men after a steroid or testosterone cycle. 

6 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

In the world of illicit drugs this one has to surprise:

"The world No 1 bridge player has been suspended after failing a drugs test.Geir Helgemo, who is Norwegian but represents Monaco in bridge events, tested positive for synthetic testosterone and the female fertility drug clomifene at a World Bridge Series event in Orlando in September.

Kari-Anne Opsal, president of the Norwegian Bridge Federation, said the drugs were “not performance enhancing”

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/mar/01/world-no1-bridge-player-suspended-after-failing-a-drugs-test-geir-helgemo

PS Geir is a male by the way

 

The European petanque circuit has also been rocked by recent drug allegations. Interestingly, the suggestion of a recreational drug being performance enhancing.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/15/petanque-drug-allegations-cocaine-belgian-players

On 3/1/2019 at 11:38 AM, Ethan Tremblay said:

Dane Swan is a mouth breather, only the common bogan will agree with his comments.

I agree with him.
For eg. you had the St.Kilda president Rod Butterss making key club decisions while off his face on coke and alcohol.
Wouldn't put it past Gill.
And then you have a bunch [censored] journo muck rakers like purple and slobbo.
Who knows what those clowns get up to in the dunnys on brownlow night.
It's about running a clean and fair workplace.
Cant just test the blue collars while the white collars do what the fork they want.

And yeah, I'm a bogan.
No cheese platter at the footy for me.

Edited March 2, 20196 yr by Fork 'em

On 2/28/2019 at 7:24 AM, Lucifer's Hero said:

The allegation is players are claiming mental health issues to avoid testing even if they have not stepped aside from the game.  They keep playing without being tested.

I see... so as long as they can run, jump, mark and dispose of the ball ok it doesn't  really matter what else they do!   They'll keep getting a game ?

Part of the solution needs to be alchohol and ilicit drug testing not only for players but anyone while working for the AFL or Clubs, including coaching and support staff, back office personnel, media (while working at an AFL event or function) and executive management.  As it stands the players would see this inconsistency and game the system, where as if you make sure whats good for the duck is good for mother goose then there is at least some integrity about the policy. 

12 hours ago, chookrat said:

Part of the solution needs to be alchohol and ilicit drug testing not only for players but anyone while working for the AFL or Clubs, including coaching and support staff, back office personnel, media (while working at an AFL event or function) and executive management.  As it stands the players would see this inconsistency and game the system, where as if you make sure whats good for the duck is good for mother goose then there is at least some integrity about the policy. 

While I agree with you that some players might think that it's inconsistent that they're the only ones being tested from within the AFL community, those players are forgetting another inconsistency - they're the ones getting the big money to perform. I think there is an argument that perhaps coaches (including assistant coaches) could be tested, but how the rest of the AFL community performs and whether they're using illicit drugs is not relevant.  

4 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

While I agree with you that some players might think that it's inconsistent that they're the only ones being tested from within the AFL community, those players are forgetting another inconsistency - they're the ones getting the big money to perform. I think there is an argument that perhaps coaches (including assistant coaches) could be tested, but how the rest of the AFL community performs and whether they're using illicit drugs is not relevant.  

It's not relevant how the AFL executive perform? Great they can relax. Chill. Snort some coke before they organize next year's fixture. Again.

Oh and the exec are on way more than the average player so can afford all the coke they want.

In any case if the issue is performance what about those players who perform better because some mull helps them wind down one in a while or a pill in the off season dancing at a festival.helps their mental health?

28 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

those players are forgetting another inconsistency - they're the ones getting the big money to perform.

You don't think that Dill is on bigger bucks to perform (much more than any player)...or Eddie, Gary, Robbo, Sam???

I would think the decisions made at AFL executive and board level are more important than anything a player will have to do.

Shouldn't they have a clear head.

...and those reporting, wouldn't it be good to know they are not being hypocritical in their views.

Coming out strongly against drug use but privately in it up to their eye balls.

Edited March 4, 20196 yr by rjay

29 minutes ago, rjay said:

You don't think that Dill is on bigger bucks to perform (much more than any player)...or Eddie, Gary, Robbo, Sam???

I would think the decisions made at AFL executive and board level are more important than anything a player will have to do.

Shouldn't they have a clear head.

...and those reporting, wouldn't it be good to know they are not being hypocritical in their views.

Coming out strongly against drug use but privately in it up to their eye balls.

You make a good point and get into the area of whether executives in any business should be drug tested. Personally, unless it's a privately owned business and is not in an area of public risk, then I think executives do not have the right to say it impinges on their privacy because their actions affect others. So, I would have to say that the AFL is not privately owned and as such I have no problem with AFL executives being drug tested. (IQ testing might be a good idea, too.)

53 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

You make a good point and get into the area of whether executives in any business should be drug tested. Personally, unless it's a privately owned business and is not in an area of public risk, then I think executives do not have the right to say it impinges on their privacy because their actions affect others. So, I would have to say that the AFL is not privately owned and as such I have no problem with AFL executives being drug tested. (IQ testing might be a good idea, too.)

Trouble with that is that they would have to find it before they could measure it.

11 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

While I agree with you that some players might think that it's inconsistent that they're the only ones being tested from within the AFL community, those players are forgetting another inconsistency - they're the ones getting the big money to perform. I think there is an argument that perhaps coaches (including assistant coaches) could be tested, but how the rest of the AFL community performs and whether they're using illicit drugs is not relevant.  

I couldn't disagree more. The AFL cannot take an ethical stance on illicit drugs that only applies to the players. Im fine that PED testing should only apply to players but there is no justification to only subject players to illicit drug testing. Everyone under the AFL banner should be subject to the same cultural standards. 

I have forwarded the same idea as Dane Swan on this forum some time ago.

I feel intellectually vindicated .

 

On 2/26/2019 at 8:38 AM, Petraccattack said:

Nick Riewoldt  denies recreational drug use at St Kilda in his time there.   He probably also denies their documented dwarf tossing and their issue with school girls.

The bloke is full of [censored].

Nick Reiwoldt who had Rod Butters as president and captained Ben Cousins best mate Gardner?