Farewell Jack Watts

[DV8 2,271]

5 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

Listened to the interview and all this talk about habits, making the right decisions outside the club, McCartney talking about falling into old habits, comments in Roos' book; all points to a severe mismanagement of our young players in the Bailey and Neeld years and setting the right professional habits. 

Watts clearly had no idea how to be a professional athlete until Roos entered the club and this set back his development years and years. Old habits die hard and if he doesn't get traded this year then, after what has now been communicated to him, then he'll be playing a lot of VFL football next year if he doesn't demonstrate some change in these professional habits.

I would not wait any longer, he is 27Yrs at the start of 2018 season.

Its not worth the gamble of getting less when he's older.

 

It's time for an example be set by the club.  Done your dash jack. seeya.

4 hours ago, GCDee said:

If we have a senior player which can't be trusted from his time away from the club then it's time to cut ties. 

How can you be paid like a professional but not prepare like one!!

Get rid of him, clearly does not have what it takes, he is soft, & looks to be having a negative effect on "a few younger players"

There is time for these other players, but if Jack hadn't figured this out yet he never will. 

 

Yep I'd settle for Aaron Hall, or work to make a deal for one of the Suns talls, who might like out.

 

1 hour ago, Petraccattack said:

He hasnt done that in 9 seasons, why will he now?

This is a new era for the MFC, and Watts doesn't fit in. Hes probably the last remnant of the dark years and is hopefully shipped out.

It's time for a fresh slate. 

And its time the club showed off, that it has Testi's.  And means footy business.  Not some holiday camp for spoilt kids.

[The Corridor 119]

Some short memories and recency bias.

Great start to the season - one of our most important for the first half of it.  Then injured, struggled to recapture form, not given the leeway that some were (eg Gawn - perhaps Watts appeared more lost/out of form due to playing forward rather than starting where the ball is). 

Despite criticisms of work ethic/preparation, still a great runner and covers the ground well. Also one of our only elite disposers (both in field and goal kicking) as others have highlighted.

Certainly seems to be a different standard applied to Watts than others.  

[Trac-man 13]

It's funny we all jump on jack for being lazy and disinterested which he is sometimes. But we have a high profile full forward who I know had a rough year thru personal and health issues that really needs to apply himself just as much as jack..

[GCDee 3,199]

49 minutes ago, Trac-man said:

It's funny we all jump on jack for being lazy and disinterested which he is sometimes. But we have a high profile full forward who I know had a rough year thru personal and health issues that really needs to apply himself just as much as jack..

Not sure if serious or not???

Jesse has done more in 2 years than jack has in 7!

Jesse also lost his father this year

Jesse also battled cancer himself this year

Jesse broke his collarbone and came back within 2 weeks and kicked 6!!! 

 

Jack on the other hand partied too hard in summer and didn't come back in shape.

Jack cannot be trusted when he is not "kept in line" whilst at the club. 

This comparison is utterly [censored]. 

Sorry I know your quite a new poster but in my opinion your view is right off the mark.

[Akum 2,660]

5 hours ago, Ouch! said:

Was about to say the same thing.... I can't see why the club, in this case the captain, would be going public about Watts if it was about to put him on the trade table. Fire him up now, prior to the pre-season to make sure 2018 is as good as it can be!

Seems to me that the club wants to avoid putting a large part of its younger fan-base off-side, so they don't want to be seen to be responsible for taking the initiative to show him the door, while making it difficult for him to stay. This is the only way I can explain the bizarre juxtaposition of Watts being "disciplined" with the indiscretions by the younger players before & during the season. The narrative seems to be that we have to be harsh on Watts to guard against our standards slipping, otherwise these other sorts of things can happen.

For the first time, I'm now beginning to believe that a significant chunk of the club (or the coaches or footy dept or whatever) want him gone, but want him to take the initiative. For many reasons I certainly think this is unwise from our (MFC) point of view, though for Watts to go elsewhere, it might actually remove the shackles of expectation from him, especially if he goes for a low price.

I mean, it's not like we have a history of shooting ourselves in the foot just as things look like they might be getting better.  

[mattjm 151]

reading between the lines of Jones' comments, do you think Watts was perhaps leading some of the younger brigade astray off field?

why else were the two topics singled out by jones?

or is that drawing a long bow?

jones isnt afraid of publicly whacking his team mates as captain. second times watts has copped it (both deservingly), vince and bugg were on receiving ends too...

[Lucifers Hero 39,597]

8 hours ago, Akum said:

Seems to me that the club wants to avoid putting a large part of its younger fan-base off-side, so they don't want to be seen to be responsible for taking the initiative to show him the door, while making it difficult for him to stay. This is the only way I can explain the bizarre juxtaposition of Watts being "disciplined" with the indiscretions by the younger players before & during the season. The narrative seems to be that we have to be harsh on Watts to guard against our standards slipping, otherwise these other sorts of things can happen.

For the first time, I'm now beginning to believe that a significant chunk of the club (or the coaches or footy dept or whatever) want him gone, but want him to take the initiative. For many reasons I certainly think this is unwise from our (MFC) point of view, though for Watts to go elsewhere, it might actually remove the shackles of expectation from him, especially if he goes for a low price.

I mean, it's not like we have a history of shooting ourselves in the foot just as things look like they might be getting better.  

Jack is hugely popular and I also feel that the club is softening up supporters and preparing them for Jack to leave.

The narrative has been suitably vague all year.  Now Jones throws in some vague reference to Jack needing to be held accountable for 'out of hours' activities that might affect performance. 

I doubt all our 'senior' players are managing their 'out of hours' activities and doing everything they can to perform and it showed when their performance lapsed.  Yet Jack is the only one that gets a public dressing down.  Not happy.  Our players should be treated the same, at least in public.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Lucifer's Hero

[Wiseblood 24,637]

16 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Jack is hugely popular and I also feel that the club is softening up supporters and preparing them for Jack to leave.

The narrative has been suitably vague all year.  Now Jones throws in some vague reference to Jack needing to be held accountable for 'out of hours' activities that might affect performance. 

I doubt all our 'senior' players are managing their 'out of hours' activities and doing everything they can to perform and it showed when their performance lapsed.  Yet Jack is the only one that gets a public dressing down.  Not happy.  Our players should be treated the same, at least in public.

I bolded the bit above but it also relates to your earlier post (didn't want to quote too many and fill up the page), but what other senior players should have been held accountable like Jack?  The only other player I can think of is Bernie Vince for his on field discretions, and from memory it was discussed in public how he needed to lift his game as a senior player.

Do Jones, Viney, Lewis etc all fall off in their application at training and on game day?  No.  I'd like to know which other senior players needed to be dressed down in public for their 'out of hours' activities or their application and dedication to the club as a whole.  Jack was dropped and from what we can gather the leadership group were not happy with him - maybe he didn't put in the hard yards to get over his injury properly?  Jones didn't divulge that info, but it's clear they have set a standard and Jack didn't meet them.

[beelzebub 23,313]

15 hours ago, Petraccattack said:

He hasnt done that in 9 seasons, why will he now?

This is a new era for the MFC, and Watts doesn't fit in. Hes probably the last remnant of the dark years and is hopefully shipped out.

So Jones would be carrying the bags ? 

Think through before commenting.

To tell the truth i laugh every time Chunk opens his mouth and repeats the mantra. 

Im tired of it personally. Id rather he just shut the [censored] up and be a better captian/ leader on the field than line up team members to throw under buses.

We still have problems at Melbourne ...meh

[Wiseblood 24,637]

11 hours ago, The Corridor said:

Some short memories and recency bias.

Great start to the season - one of our most important for the first half of it.  Then injured, struggled to recapture form, not given the leeway that some were (eg Gawn - perhaps Watts appeared more lost/out of form due to playing forward rather than starting where the ball is). 

Despite criticisms of work ethic/preparation, still a great runner and covers the ground well. Also one of our only elite disposers (both in field and goal kicking) as others have highlighted.

Certainly seems to be a different standard applied to Watts than others.  

If this is all it was, then why did the leadership team feel the need to pull him up on his second half of the season?  Why was he dropped?  If he was playing injured then you could assume that they would have let it go, much like Viney at the end of the season, but you are just making excuses.

I'm a Watts fan and always have been, but if we want to be a finals side then certain standards need to be met.  As a senior player he has no excuse and I'm happy the leadership group stepped in and ensured that he knew about it.

[beelzebub 23,313]

And who is this marvelous Leadership Group.

Hardly ever see a leader on the field.

All full of mouth off of it though.

Hypocritic shlts !!

Closest ive seen in years has been some determined directives in play by Lewis and some laudable moments by Viney. One half a game by Jones screamed im capt..follow me do this.

Many are kidding themselves we have leadership. Lot of name callers !!

 

Edited September 19, 2017 by beelzebub

[robbiefrom13 887]

8 hours ago, Akum said:

Seems to me that the club wants to avoid putting a large part of its younger fan-base off-side, so they don't want to be seen to be responsible for taking the initiative to show him the door, while making it difficult for him to stay. This is the only way I can explain the bizarre juxtaposition of Watts being "disciplined" with the indiscretions by the younger players before & during the season. The narrative seems to be that we have to be harsh on Watts to guard against our standards slipping, otherwise these other sorts of things can happen.

For the first time, I'm now beginning to believe that a significant chunk of the club (or the coaches or footy dept or whatever) want him gone, but want him to take the initiative. For many reasons I certainly think this is unwise from our (MFC) point of view, though for Watts to go elsewhere, it might actually remove the shackles of expectation from him, especially if he goes for a low price.

I mean, it's not like we have a history of shooting ourselves in the foot just as things look like they might be getting better.  

Would be a bullet in the foot that might take down a lot more than Jack Watts.  

 

[Lucifers Hero 39,597]

54 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I bolded the bit above but it also relates to your earlier post (didn't want to quote too many and fill up the page), but 1) what other senior players should have been held accountable like Jack?  The only other player I can think of is Bernie Vince for his on field discretions, and from memory it was discussed in public how he needed to lift his game as a senior player.

Do Jones, Viney, Lewis etc all fall off in their application at training and on game day?  2) No.  I'd like to know which other senior players needed to be dressed down in public for their 'out of hours' activities or their application and dedication to the club as a whole.  Jack was dropped and from what we can gather the leadership group were not happy with him - maybe he didn't put in the hard yards to get over his injury properly?  Jones didn't divulge that info, but it's clear they have set a standard and Jack didn't meet them.

1) Agreed, all players should be held accountable, Jack included.  Players are often named and called out after a poor game or doing something stupid and rightly so.  Then they let it go publicly.  But with Jack it has been a constant, negative and vague narrative.   

2) Tbh I don't know what Jones means by 'out of hours' activities.  Rehab maybe?  None of the players that had soft tissue injuries (Watts, Tyson, Garlett, Gawn, Salem) played very well on return.  But let's assume Jack was the only one that didn't do his rehab properly.  Why on God's earth would Jones say anything at all especially now that the season is over.  It simply feeds the 'he is up for trade narrative' which may be what he and the club want.

Whatever Jack's lapses have been I simply don't like how the club has negatively publicly portrayed him all year.  

Over and out on this.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Lucifer's Hero

[binman 42,669]

15 hours ago, DV8 said:

I would not wait any longer, he is 27Yrs at the start of 2018 season.

Its not worth the gamble of getting less when he's older.

 

It's time for an example be set by the club.  Done your dash jack. seeya.

Yep I'd settle for Aaron Hall, or work to make a deal for one of the Suns talls, who might like out.

 

It's time for a fresh slate. 

And its time the club showed off, that it has Testi's.  And means footy business.  Not some holiday camp for spoilt kids.

Right. And if jack say's no to being traded what does the club do with its testis?

[old55 23,396]

17 hours ago, drdrake said:

This is what I find interesting, both the Coach and now the Captain have had a crack at Watts pretty openly through the media.  I don't think you do that to a bloke you are trying to trade, the only result is decreasing his trade value.  I think the club just wants him to have a red hot crack in 2018 and we are going to poke him and poke him so he comes back with the I am going to stick it up everyone attitude.

Or the club is painting the picture for members when a favourite of many is traded.

I'm a Watts fan but there's absolutely no doubt he's tradeable for the right currency.

[Die Hard Demon 1,224]

15 minutes ago, binman said:

Right. And if jack say's no to being traded what does the club do with its testis?

If he says no .. Then it will have 1 of 2 possible outcomes .. the almighty kick up the bum he gets will either make him pull his head in and change his bad habits and have a cracking 2018 .. OR, he will go into his shell, nothing will change and will spend most of 2018 playing VFL .. Then will be delisted in 2018.

[old55 23,396]

21 minutes ago, binman said:

Right. And if jack say's no to being traded what does the club do with its testis?

You've been pressing this line for ages - and it has happened - look at Ryan Ferguson for Brad Sewell.

But if the club makes it clear to Watts that they don't value retaining him then he's going to be better off moving on.  Think about the conversation.

[drdrake 3,162]

Just now, Fifty-5 said:

Or the club is painting the picture for members when a favourite of many is traded.

I'm a Watts fan but there's absolutely no doubt he's tradeable for the right currency.

Members couldnt care less if he was traded.  Player movement is now a big part of our game.  My point is the right currency wont be there if coach and captain get stuck into him via the media

[old55 23,396]

Just now, drdrake said:

Members couldnt care less if he was traded.  Player movement is now a big part of our game.  My point is the right currency wont be there if coach and captain get stuck into him via the media

You may need to consult with @jumbo returns and @binman

[Dee tention 616]

Yes trade if the right deal comes along. 

If not, being put up for trade is a big kick in the bum for Jack. He isnt a walk up start best 22 so he will have to work hard to get back in or languish in the VFL.

Either way Win-Win for MFC.

I can see Jack being traded to Carlton in Lever, Gibbs deal.

[Die Hard Demon 1,224]

1 hour ago, beelzebub said:

And who is this marvelous Leadership Group.

Hardly ever see a leader on the field.

All full of mouth off of it though.

Hypocritic shlts !!

Closest ive seen in years has been some determined directives in play by Lewis and some laudable moments by Viney. One half a game by Jones screamed im capt..follow me do this.

Many are kidding themselves we have leadership. Lot of name callers !!

 

We have our leadership group on-field .. And Watts is not apart of that group – for good reason. However off-field leadership which we aren't really privy to is where Watts should be excelling. He should be mature enough now to know how to set a good example for the younger guys .. Which is what Jones seems to be alluding to.

I respect people's desire to defend Watts. I used to be one of those blokes. But enough is enough. The playing group and coaches are clearly frustrated and considering they have been the most patient over the years, if they think its time to part ways, we should too.

[beelzebub 23,313]

9 minutes ago, Die Hard Demon said:

We have our leadership group on-field .. And Watts is not apart of that group – for good reason. However off-field leadership which we aren't really privy to is where Watts should be excelling. He should be mature enough now to know how to set a good example for the younger guys .. Which is what Jones seems to be alluding to.

I respect people's desire to defend Watts. I used to be one of those blokes. But enough is enough. The playing group and coaches are clearly frustrated and considering they have been the most patient over the years, if they think its time to part ways, we should too.

they the ones wearing invisible cloaks ??

We play like a rudderless ship all too often.

Watts is far from perfect..I reckon hes got about 39 other mates in that category !!

That so MUCH is placed at his feet as being HIS fault..is laughable.

He's become EVERYONE'S whipping boy.

If I was Goody and Jones etc Id be shutting up big time. The buck doesnt stop with Jack.

Talk about not learning lessons and being hypocrites..fmd

[Cards13 9,117]

18 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Jones:  "...That's probably why we tend to come down harder on him, because he's a more senior player." 

I'm glad someone finally admitted the club is harder on Jack than it is others.  That has long be a suspicion of mine.  Among the harsh public talk about Jack by Coach, Captains and even young players there has rarely been a positive word/encouragement to go with it.  Makes me wonder if Jack has become the whipping boy inside the club as well?  Very said if so. 

Players and coaches wanting to seeing him stop coasting through his AFL career... good on them!

[beelzebub 23,313]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Right. And if jack say's no to being traded what does the club do with its testis?

shh....no place for reality Bin...it's Dland !!

[64" 97]

For Jones to come out and publicly comment on Watts is clear to me.They want him gonski!!