On 21/10/2020 at 00:47, Pollyanna said:

I'm torn.  Continued organic improvement from Weid, hopefully a full season from Jackson and Petty vs. the instant target hit of Brown but who may make us too tall overall.  Which way are you coming down Spongy?

Christmas,? If we are putting our hopes in an unproven Petty we are on track for a Heartbreaking experience!

  On 21/10/2020 at 04:28, picket fence said:

Christmas,? If we are putting our hopes in an unproven Petty we are on track for a Heartbreaking experience!

there's also Smith ?

Surely a bit depends on injury / fitness assessment of both Ben Brown and of Tom McDonald.

IF (emphasize if) Tom has been carrying an injury that has caused him to fall from a match winner / leader in 2018 to his 2019 and 2020 situation, and IF that injury / fitness issue is regarded by experts (not just Demonland posters) as having fully recovered, then maybe Brown could be regarded as surplus.

And vice versa, should Brown’s 2020 be related to an injury that he is carrying that does not look like resolving, then would we want him.

I am certain that there is a lot more going on than meets the eye.

  On 21/10/2020 at 04:19, The Jackson 6 said:

If we are so good at marking inside 50 why are we prioritising a KPF then? 
 

It felt (I don’t have the stats to validate) sides were happy for us to ask for the ball wide and we therefore took lots of uncontested marks on the boundary between 25-50 out from goal. Hitting up a key forward in the slot is of huge value but is a much different game to hitting up an uncontested Fritta on the boundary. 

I actually believe it is for other reasons than good/bad delivery, but we are very likely to be no better or worse than other teams at hitting leading forwards. I just find comments 'Not sure our midfield could hit a leading forward' etc to be unnecessarily defeatist and it tends to irk me. The fact that we were able to have good mark inside 50/retention numbers without a dominant forward tends to say that we certainly aren't much worse at it than the league average and certainly better than Brown's current club, North.

I think it's because we scored a lot on the rebound where we were able to avoid contested situations inside 50 more often than many teams. The fact that a small key forward in Fritsch was able to lead our goal kicking probably indicates this, but it also points towards our delivery not being terrible.

Why are we prioritising a KPF? I'd say it's to allow us to kick the ball longer into the forward line and not having to rely on our ability to spot up smaller targets. Some of the best teams with multiple big key forwards (Richmond and Port) actually ranked lower for forward 50 retention (10th - 20.7% and 14th - 18.4% respectively) because their big forwards create contests that their smalls can capitalise on. Our forward setup involves tall/medium forwards marking the ball or the ball being rebounded. Getting a big forward allows us to set up more defensively ie, lock the ball inside 50, inside 50 stoppages and repeat entries. 

Ironically getting a big forward probably will result in us marking the ball less inside 50! ?

Pending fitness, I now think Brown is a must. With our list I genuinely think our window for a premiership is now, however our forward line with Weideman and Jackson in my opinion is too immature and would rely on some drastic improvement from both players. This is both unrealistic and unfair on both in my opinion. We may have seen the best of McDonald and Petty is promising but unproven.

 We can't afford to wait 5 years for Jackson to be an established KPF, particularly as he may play more midfield anyway, while Weideman needs help from a mature Key forward. Brown instantly makes our forward line more potent and gives Weideman the second defender with Jackson having the ability to play as a mobile third tall and have flexibility around the ground. Brown, outside of Cameron, is the best key forward available on the market; I hope like hell we're doing our best to get him.

zzzzzzz (snore)

zzzzzzoooommeeting

are we there yet?

Ben Brown meets with Melbourne

a post script:

on a side note, I often talk about whether the organisation fits YOUR culture vs whether you fit the culture of an organisation.

I find it rather saddening/hilarious that the 'story' that is put in the media (if it is true re: the treatment of Ben Brown and his family after the death of a child) is that the club are choosing to offload him.

It clearly should be he is walking away from a culture that was unsupportive of his context, and from that the relationship was unrepairable.

@Lord Nev did mention this a week ago that he met with the club via zoom with Gawn, Mahoney and Goody!

 

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:30, Engorged Onion said:

zzzzzzz (snore)

zzzzzzoooommeeting

are we there yet?

Ben Brown meets with Melbourne

a post script:

on a side note, I often talk about whether the organisation fits YOUR culture vs whether you fit the culture of an organisation.

I find it rather saddening/hilarious that the 'story' that is put in the media (if it is true re: the treatment of Ben Brown and his family after the death of a child) is that the club are choosing to offload him.

It clearly should be he is walking away from a culture that was unsupportive of his context, and from that the relationship was unrepairable.

I was thinking "Groundhog Day" at the beginning of the week... I've since learned three classical languages as well as Japanese and Mandarin, can play most of Beethoven's catalogue and have obtained my commercial pilot's license.

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:30, Engorged Onion said:

on a side note, I often talk about whether the organisation fits YOUR culture vs whether you fit the culture of an organisation.

I find it rather saddening/hilarious that the 'story' that is put in the media (if it is true re: the treatment of Ben Brown and his family after the death of a child) is that the club are choosing to offload him.

It clearly should be he is walking away from a culture that was unsupportive of his context, and from that the relationship was unrepairable.

Agree - Especially at that stage of his life, he needs to make sure that Melbourne fit him and his family. Think back to May talking about Melksham's kid running around in the hub. If he feels supported and that his child (they were meant to have twins) can spend the first few years of their life in this environment as well, will be important factors. 

I think that football wise he fits at the club for all the reasons discussed, he is the right age for our list as well, and we have the picks/players to get him. The question is culture, and if he and we believe this is the place for him to finish his career. 

Lewis thought so, Landgon thought so, Tomlinson thought so. I hope that Brown does as well. 

Still a hard no for me.

Will provide a momentary short term boost that will stall the development of the other tall targets and cost us an asset that we need to improve the skilled runners and strong defenders that influence the game far more than one trick forwards.

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:30, Engorged Onion said:

Ben Brown meets with Melbourne

 

 

Finally some real news.   

Come on down Benny Brown!

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:30, Engorged Onion said:

zzzzzzz (snore)

zzzzzzoooommeeting

are we there yet?

Ben Brown meets with Melbourne

a post script:

on a side note, I often talk about whether the organisation fits YOUR culture vs whether you fit the culture of an organisation.

I find it rather saddening/hilarious that the 'story' that is put in the media (if it is true re: the treatment of Ben Brown and his family after the death of a child) is that the club are choosing to offload him.

It clearly should be he is walking away from a culture that was unsupportive of his context, and from that the relationship was unrepairable.

Defeated by the firewall.

A précis please, someone. 

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:57, monoccular said:

Defeated by the firewall.

A précis please, someone. 

One eyed bloke... essentially we spoke with him via zoom (a week ago).. will do a medical. 

and then drifted off onto other afl scuttlebut.

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:57, monoccular said:

Defeated by the firewall.

A précis please, someone. 

With The Age you can go in an incognito window and copy and paste the link and it usually comes up. 

But the gist is what Lord Nev told us last week - he met virtually with the dees and we are asking for a medical. 

WTF is going on with this thread? Come on 'Land this afternoon and read pages 42 and 43 to catch up with the BB news and what do I get? Sane, rational, respectful conversation. Back to Fox News After Dark for me. 

  On 21/10/2020 at 06:42, dazzledavey36 said:

@Lord Nev did mention this a week ago that he met with the club via zoom with Gawn, Mahoney and Goody!

 

Which, when you consider that we have been linked to him for weeks, isn't all that surprising.  

The club will do it's due diligence re: his medicals, what North want via trade and the type of contract he wants, and hopefully all three fit in to place so he is worth pursuing.

The wheels are in motion.

  On 21/10/2020 at 03:48, Pickett2Jackson said:

We have to get Brown.

No guarantee Weid kicks on.   LJ will be needed in the ruck when Gawn is injured/rested.  And LJ himself is coming off  a bad hammy.

We havent had a player kick 60+ goals in as many seasons as Brown since Neitz was running around.  Before that who knows, might need to go back to Fred Fanning.

 Come on down, Benny brown!

We've had a few Bro. Wizzzzzzzzzzzz, Lyon, Bennnnnnnnnnnnnett, Robbooooooo, both Jakkkkkkkkkka and Jackooooooooo, Healy, Brewer, Parke, Smith (Norm) Freddieeeeeee, Margitich and Johnoooooooo (Bob).

  On 21/10/2020 at 07:27, Queanbeyan Demon said:

We've had a few Bro. Wizzzzzzzzzzzz, Lyon, Bennnnnnnnnnnnnett, Robbooooooo, both Jakkkkkkkkkka and Jackooooooooo, Healy, Brewer, Parke, Smith (Norm) Freddieeeeeee, Margitich and Johnoooooooo (Bob).

 I meant to say we havent had a player kick 60+ goals in more than 3 seasons since Neitz who did it in 4 of 5 seasons, Brown did it  in 3 straight.

Before Neitz who knows... 

I'm ambivalent, but can see the merit, especially as I think the next two years are crucial for the club.

Weideman starts next year as a 23 year old (is already) and it's his 6th season, which is the year many key forwards, such as Hawkins, really made their move.

Big year for Weideman, big year for the club.

  On 21/10/2020 at 04:28, picket fence said:

Christmas,? If we are putting our hopes in an unproven Petty we are on track for a Heartbreaking experience!

I fear we'd be free-falling down the ladder without him!

  On 21/10/2020 at 07:45, Moonshadow said:

I fear we'd be free-falling down the ladder without him!

[censored] wedged that one in...didnt ya ?

Excited to read The Age article. If it’s between us and Essendon, or moving to Freo, I think we look the goods. More want out than in at The Bombers, and nobody with a young family wants to move away from their support in Melbourne.

Also, please don’t discount the absolute shambles that North have revealed themselves to be. Ben had a tough year personally, and the club was in a right state. He’s a great player, and we don’t have anyone even close to him as a logical full forward for the next 3 years. 

Get him in, get him fit, and watch how much better (and more consistent) our forward line structure is.

At 28 (next month) and being a mature age recruit, I think he’ll go to wherever offers the biggest contract. 

  On 21/10/2020 at 07:35, Hannibal Inc. said:

I'm ambivalent, but can see the merit, especially as I think the next two years are crucial for the club.

Weideman starts next year as a 23 year old (is already) and it's his 6th season, which is the year many key forwards, such as Hawkins, really made their move.

Big year for Weideman, big year for the club.

At same stage of careers.

Hawkins 79 games and 107 goals. Weed 44 games and 46 goals. Hawkins also offered influential power forward presence during his early years which Weed does not. I remember well the brutal mauling  he gave Nathan Carroll and us in his third game where he kicked 4 goals and helped set us on our current never ending mediocrity streak. That was a watershed game for us. Weed needs the competition for his spot. Sink or swim I say.

Edited October 21, 20204 yr by america de cali