THE SAGA CONTINUES - WADA APPEALS

[Ash35 425]

As I have said all along, I'm looking for closure with a final decision.

If WADA can prove the EFC took performance enhancing drugs at CAS, the appropriate penalties should be given.

If they can't, and the appeal fails, I will be able to going forward in life knowing my club did not cheat.

That's my attitude, but I'm sure if WADA does lose, there will be a hundred conspiracy theories on here as to why.

Annoyed that another season is a write off for my club, can't imagine what the players are feeling right now, let alone how they are going to get themselves up for a game of football Friday night. But in the end, if this is what it takes to get the truth, and closure, bring it on.

Everyone on here is very confident that it's an open and shut case for WADA.

I get the impression they don't appeal on a whim.

Not that it counts for a lot around here, but early media buzz is that no one can understand why WADA would appeal.

I'm happy to sit back and wait to see what happens.

[Demon trucker 1,800]

Essendon are stuffed this time its out of the AFL hands, the only way they are going to glet way with this,is if the AF stop drug testing.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 17,022]

From the Guardian.

Can't wait for WADA to start digging.

I'm not sure what you mean by "digging". Isn't this another hearing of already accumulated evidence? I would be surprised if WADA is doing any evidence-gathering (if that's what you meant by "digging") of its own.

[Young Dee 1,303]

I haven't even bothered trying to follow this saga on Demonland - it is just to overwhelming

Probably wont be successful but at least it will make Essendon squirm (must be some hope if they are appealing tho).

We play them round 15 - enough time for the pressure to kick back in!

I imagine getting Dank in their pocket would be important - he probably has the key to their underground lab.

Edited May 12, 2015 by Young Dee

[Bluey's Dad 3,419]

Not that it counts for a lot around here, but early media buzz is that no one can understand why WADA would appeal.

This frustrates me to no end (not you Ash, the media thing).

We have pages and pages of discussion on why WADA would want to appeal on a fan forum for a club that isn't even involved. How can so many issues and points simply not make it into the media coverage?

It seems to me after reading these threads for 2 years that WADA has EVERY reason to appeal.

[Seraph 1,824]

If they can't, and the appeal fails, I will be able to going forward in life knowing my club did not cheat.

What about when they develop the test for TB4 and test the blood samples that they have on file?

What if they come back positive a few years down the track?

[Seraph 1,824]

I'm not sure what you mean by "digging". Isn't this another hearing of already accumulated evidence? I would be surprised if WADA is doing any evidence-gathering (if that's what you meant by "digging") of its own.

I am not sure whether a fresh case means that they simply don't have to support any previous claims in other cases, or whether they're allowed to gather new evidence.

Either way if we end up hearing from Dank, Charters etc then new information should come to light.

[ManDee 7,320]

As I have said all along, I'm looking for closure with a final decision.

If WADA can prove the EFC took performance enhancing drugs at CAS, the appropriate penalties should be given.

If they can't, and the appeal fails, I will be able to going forward in life knowing my club did not cheat.

That's my attitude, but I'm sure if WADA does lose, there will be a hundred conspiracy theories on here as to why.

Annoyed that another season is a write off for my club, can't imagine what the players are feeling right now, let alone how they are going to get themselves up for a game of football Friday night. But in the end, if this is what it takes to get the truth, and closure, bring it on.

Everyone on here is very confident that it's an open and shut case for WADA.

I get the impression they don't appeal on a whim.

Not that it counts for a lot around here, but early media buzz is that no one can understand why WADA would appeal.

I'm happy to sit back and wait to see what happens.

As you said yesterday,

"And I think that's where a decision by WADA not to appeal might lie.

WADA don't appeal losing cases.

But maybe hold off a few months, get the positive tests through a new type of test that is being developed, and then they have the evidence they need to get the job done.

The next 12-24 hours will be very interesting.

Not just whether WADA appeal, but if they don't, what their reasons are."

Ash I respect your bravery and loyalty but if they cannot be found guilty that does not mean that they did not cheat. I think they most definitely set out to cheat, and that they destroyed records to cover their tracks. They are guilty I just hope that it can be proven.

[beelzebub 23,390]

If they can't, and the appeal fails, I will be able to going forward in life knowing my club did not cheat.

Ash...respectfully this appalls me. To me youre still in denial of any wrong doing at Essendon ? The whole episode has been about advantageous programming ( aka ....cheating ) and the smoke and mirrors disguise to camouflage it. Surely you must understand that.

[Demon trucker 1,800]

Wada all most never lose a appeal, they win 8 out of 10.

[Ethan Tremblay 31,243]

The World Anti Doping Agency believes that the Essendon Football Club has a case to answer at the Court of Arbitration of Sport.

Surely that is enough to warrant the sacking of James Hird. This is no tin pot AFL tribunal. This is a World body.

Sack Hird today!

Maybe there's a reason Hird hasn't been fired. Maybe he has dirt on four officials and if fired, he'll take them down as well. Just saying...

[Ethan Tremblay 31,243]

Wada all most never lose a appeal, they win 8 out of 10.

80% of the time...all the time...

They've lost the two they've prosecuted here (not that it matters).

Edited May 12, 2015 by Ethan Tremblay

[Sir Why You Little 37,310]

Interesting re jailing - in which juristriction would that happen?

perverting the course of justice would be my first thought... Edited May 12, 2015 by Sir Why You Little

[ManDee 7,320]

Maybe there's a reason Hird hasn't been fired. Maybe he has dirt on four officials and if fired, he'll take them down as well. Just saying...

Ethan that goat story has being going around for a while. I will believe it when I see the photos.

[ManDee 7,320]

[Young Dee 1,303]

Wada all most never lose a appeal, they win 8 out of 10.

I expect this to be wraped up by the end of the week then

[Ethan Tremblay 31,243]

Ethan that goat story has being going around for a while. I will believe it when I see the photos.

No photos, perhaps TI product?

[Dees2014 2,377]

I like your confidence bb. Unfortunately, I have seen far too much pulling of strings and calling in of favours to believe what SHOUD happen DOES happen.

The AFL Tribunal only confirmed my belief. Yes, I know that CAS is a different and an outside jurisdiction. But take another look at my post and the names and roles of each. The scope for subtle influence/favourable interpretation of subjective rules is still there.

If 2 of the 3 on the CAS panel are not from Australia and are not from Athletics, my concern will continue.

Very very unlikely. First of all for the last 20 or so CAS cases heard relating to Australia, they have been all Australian Arbitrators. Read my list of them in my previous post reposted by WJ this morning on here. If they have anything to do with the AFL, or have in anyway been involved in the Essendon case, they are automatically excluded. Most of the remainder are either related to the Olympic movement or are unaligned.

I am confident the hearing will be scrupulously fair. That after all is all we can ask.

[mauriesy 7,417]

Wada all most never lose a appeal, they win 8 out of 10.

WADA has only appealed to the Court of Arbitration for Sport twice on Australian sports doping matters. It lost both cases.

So I don't think anyone can feel vindicated, happy, sad, jubilant, disappointed or whatever until the case is completed later in the year.

All it does at present is put Essendon in the frying pan for another seven months.

[jnrmac 20,276]

What we might find is that there isn't enough evidence to get the players but the coaches, administrators and board are banned for life. And the club is sanctioned very heavily - ie banned from games etc. This will effectively be whacking the players as well

The facts are:

There is evidence of a doping regime.

They can't find the records. (I still laugh at the "we don't know what they took but we know it wasn't illegal")

They were searching for a competitive edge.

They employed dodgy charlatans

They by-passed their club doctor

They have obfuscated and attempted to hinder the investigation

The EFCs behaviour has been deplorable. Judgement time coming.

And another season or two wasted.

And don't forget Worksafe is still going....

[FireOath 290]

I'm going to enjoy AFL360 tonight.

[Dees2014 2,377]

The process:

The process is that the Court of Arbitration for Sport, of which Australian Olympic Committee head John Coates is the president, will appoint a chair for the Essendon case.

WADA and the defendants then have the right to select their preferred arbitration to form a three-person panel that will sit in judgment of the case.

I hope the CAS members for the case are carefully selected. I have in other posts mentioned the friendships between David Grace (lawyer for Ess players and Head of Athletics Australia, CAS panelist), John Wylie (Australian Sports Commission chair) and Mike Fitzpatrick (AFL Commission chair).

I truly hope that John Coates and WADA respectively choose someone outside Australia who will be seen to be truly independant because the players won't.

Look at CAS rules. No judge is able to be chosen who has anything to do with the case (which excludes Grace, Collisi), nor anyone affiliated with the AFL. Their rules are very clear on this.

[Sir Why You Little 37,310]

All it does at present is put Essendon in the frying pan for another seven months.

and isn't it just beautiful. Turn up those gas jets...

[nutbean 8,838]

If they can't, and the appeal fails, I will be able to going forward in life knowing my club did not cheat.

When has this ever been about guilt or innocence - cheating or not cheating ?Like all justice now - it is only about what can and can't be proven - nothing more nothing less.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 17,022]

When has this ever been about guilt or innocence - cheating or not cheating ?Like all justice now - it is only about what can and can't be proven - nothing more nothing less.

Technically, proven (or disproved) "to a level of comfortable satisfaction"