Talking Point: What does the Melbourne Football Club stand for?

[Whispering_Jack 28,089]

I'm interested in people's views on whether and what does the club stand for under the Bartlett/Jackson/Roos regime?

Lets's flash back several years to the time when our latest set of troubles as a club were becoming evident. The Daniher years were over, the team was already closing in on rock bottom, we were financially in the red and many in the football world including the AFL hierarchy were claiming that the Melbourne Football Club stood for nothing.

We've experienced eight torrid years during which time we have not come anywhere near a 50% win-loss ratio, let alone make finals. There's a whiff of optimism in the air under the Peter Jackson/Paul Roos combination with Glenn Bartlett at the top as club chairman despite some media speculation of tensions about the future of the CEO.

This is neither the place for discussing that issue (for which there is a separate thread) or the upheaval within the club in recent years (which has been the subject of heated debate elsewhere).

What I'm looking for is what we are doing to set Melbourne apart from the others as a football club.

In sporting terms, Melbourne is known for the Melbourne Cricket Ground, the Melbourne Cup, Melbourne Park, the venue for the Australian Open and great golf courses like Royal Melbourne. In recent times we are falling behind sporting clubs like Melbourne Storm and Victory in other football codes in terms of national recognition.

The obvious is to start winning games and become a power in the game as we were in the 1950s/60s and establishing interstate rivalries with clubs like Sydney but do we have the vision to achieve this?

[Bitter but optimistic 21,556]

Your final line sums it up for me Jack - "start winning games". For the last several years we have been easybeats, a joke. FFS, I was once at a game where a Hawthorn supporter "felt sorry" for Melbourne. We must win games and regain credibility as a football club. We must be seen as a serious football club. For all that I hate Collingwood they have a swagger and street cred that at the moment we can only dream about. Win games, become arrogant bas tards!

[The Oracle 118]

Your final line sums it up for me Jack - "start winning games". For the last several years we have been easybeats, a joke. FFS, I was once at a game where a Hawthorn supporter "felt sorry" for Melbourne. We must win games and regain credibility as a football club. We must be seen as a serious football club. For all that I hate Collingwood they have a swagger and street cred that at the moment we can only dream about. Win games, become arrogant bas tards!

Good to see you've become more moderate now that you've changed your alter ego to abstemious BBO.

[Wormburner 674]

Your final line sums it up for me Jack - "start winning games". For the last several years we have been easybeats, a joke. FFS, I was once at a game where a Hawthorn supporter "felt sorry" for Melbourne. We must win games and regain credibility as a football club. We must be seen as a serious football club. For all that I hate Collingwood they have a swagger and street cred that at the moment we can only dream about. Win games, become arrogant bas tards!

I'm sick of being 'felt sorry for'. The can shove their sorrow where the sun doesn't shine, as we're a comin (I hope)!!

[Sir Why You Little 34,858]

It is now all about winning games. If we don't do that the clubstands for nothing

Wins will get the place rolling

[ILLDieADemon 804]

I'm so over hearing this question, what does it even mean?

[Goodvibes 3,596]

Jack, as you might remember, I'm one of the many teachers on Demonland. A much respected colleague of mine once suggested that a school's reputation is usually based on the things that happened 6 - 10 years ago. I think footy clubs are similar. The hard yards that are being made will be recognised in a decade and when, as others have suggested, we start winning, all the things that we want to stand for now will in fact be openly respected by other clubs and their supporters. Well, here's hoping anyway.

What we stand for seems like another expression for 'culture'. This appears to be one of the key reasons for Goodwin's appointment. He is big on culture in Roosy's view. Hope he can walk the walk. Then we'll stand for something.

[Lucifers Hero 37,323]

As PJ said at the AGM: start with win back respect!

It is happening in our off-field. To win back respect on field we need to get over what Roos called 'when we fall behind in games, players expect to lose mentality, an outcome of 3-4 years of heavy losses. We need to get over this mental fragility to regain on-field respect.

I wonder whether we can change that mentality in 2015. On our list we still have 13 players that were there for the 186 game against Geelong and another 9 who played under Neeld. So 22 were 'mentally scarred' to some degree and now form a large part of our starting 22 in 2015. Of those I count about 8-10 who in 2014 showed they were 'over it'.

While training reports have been exciting from a physical and game development view I haven't detected much that the mental side has improved. That is our biggest hurdle to winning more games this year. It may take a few years yet for the scars to fade entirely.

As far as a strategy goes: fix mental fragility--> gain respect--> win games--> gain confidence--> win more games-->get more members-->more money-->attractive to sponsors-->. Repeat!

Will we be a powerhouse again? Even with multiple premierships I don't think we can be a powerhouse like the clubs that have their building blocks already in place: stand alone VFL team; + an inner suburban oval they can host matches on; + >50,000 members and growing; + strong financial backers; + solid heartland etc etc. I can count about 6-8 teams that have these and they make up the 8 nearly every year!! We are coming from a long way back (and there is soccer to contend with).

[Moonshadow 16,408]

Winning games will do wonders for our street cred, but we must also ensure that our off field stability continues. Clubs with a strong and experienced board, CEO and senior staff tend to ooze strength and more often than not are financially stable (maybe not Power, after posting their latest loss). When confidence, stability and good management start at the top, it usually filters through all aspects of the club and creates the nucleus of healthy culture. We are seeing that emerge now. Obviously we need to win games and continue to recruit the right players and develop those we have, but as we've seen in the dark years, the wrong people in senior club positions can destroy morale. What's that saying about the fish rotting from the head first.......

[bluey 895]

We are durable and enduring if anything, being able to stare down one crisis after another and survive, a little like the Monty Python knight..

[Ted Lasso 17,110]

Right now I think we are a rebuilding force, I'm sure other clubs are aware how much talent we have and how quickly it could click and see us improve dramatically.

In terms of what we stand for as a club it's harsh but probably not a whole lot I think it will take some time to earn an identity

[jabberwocky 2,301]

I'm so over hearing this question, what does it even mean?

Yes.

We are football team that loses a lot.

I would like to be a football team that wins a lot.

[Guest]

What we stand for in the eyes of the non Melbourne supporting public is not pretty. The best way the club could be described is as a bunch of milquetoasts (on the football side) and a gentlemen's club who don't really care about winning but how going to the footy will help them maintain their MCC memberships and business networks (on the supporting side). As rusted on supporters, we know that is not true and we know about all of the hard work that is taking place on the admin side and that many of our supporters are 9-5 types who pay their bills like anyone else.
If PJ and Roos fix this up, all of the armchair quarterbacks will be quick to say they saw it all coming when the club does have a 'Bloods' style culture. I agree with Goodvibes. Sadly, the stench of the 'red and blueprint' era still lingers and we still get pegged as the club who tanked (and got nothing out of it to boot), who had a bloke play a trumpet on the ground before each game and who forced their players to wear silly private school boy blazers. Whatever work is being done now will be recognized at least 6-10 years down the road.

P.S. Glen Bartlett, for crying out loud, do not burn your bridges with PJ. Cook is an attractive proposition but if he were to come, it should be with PJ's blessing as part of a succession plan. From what I can tell, PJ is pretty reasonable. Shoot straight with him and he will shoot straight with you. Ask if his heart is in the club for a 3 year contract and if the answer is no then look to the future. If so, why replace what is working? Onfield still needs to be fixed but I can't think of too many out and out stuff ups PJ has made since arriving.

[The Reverend 1,718]

Yes.

We are football team that loses a lot.

I would like to be a football team that wins a lot.

Success in an organisation is about clarity of expectation. If people are unsure of what is required/expected of them they will not perform at their best. Success comes when every "difficult conversation" about performance is framed by a shared understanding of the organisation's expectations.

You can call it culture or whatever you like, but without a shared understanding, success will not come. It's not enough to hope for success, or for individuals to do their best; it's about everybody working as one to achieve a shared goal.

The MFC has to stand for something. An uncompromising belief in our ability to be successful would be a good start.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

Success in an organisation is about clarity of expectation. If people are unsure of what is required/expected of them they will not perform at their best. Success comes when every "difficult conversation" about performance is framed by a shared understanding of the organisation's expectations.

You can call it culture or whatever you like, but without a shared understanding, success will not come. It's not enough to hope for success, or for individuals to do their best; it's about everybody working as one to achieve a shared goal.

The MFC has to stand for something. An uncompromising belief in our ability to be successful would be a good start.

I suppose it depends on who you ask the question to. If you are asking internally, then the answer would be different.

The question is I believe directed to those outside the club, to which the answer would undoubtedly be "losing".

There are much better and more important questions to ask as you have alluded to.

[The Reverend 1,718]

I suppose it depends on who you ask the question to. If you are asking internally, then the answer would be different.

The question is I believe directed to those outside the club, to which the answer would undoubtedly be "losing".

There are much better and more important questions to ask as you have alluded to.

If the question is aimed at supporters, it's clear that we need to be exactly that, supporters. No more of the MFCSS garbage. We need to radiate a sense of belief that the club is great and that we make no apologies for being supporters. In the end, we are an integral part of the organisation as well.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

If the question is aimed at supporters, it's clear that we need to be exactly that, supporters. No more of the MFCSS garbage. We need to radiate a sense of belief that the club is great and that we make no apologies for being supporters. In the end, we are an integral part of the organisation as well.

I think you are reading too much into the question.

You have the right answer to the wrong question.

The club currently stands for losing, we need to change the answer. To do that we need to ask a whole new set of questions, which I am sure we have done/are doing.

That is the real, non political, non jargonististic answer.

I am with Illdieademon, the question is pointless. The question is, "How do we change the answer?"

[ILLDieADemon 804]

Yes.

We are football team that loses a lot.

I would like to be a football team that wins a lot.

Lets ask this question at the end of round one once we can see if the boys have woken up.

At the moment we stand for FA!!

[Macca 16,173]

The most important part is how we view ourselves ... the people at the club must know what the benchmark is from an on field and off field point of view ... the people involved at the club right now need to have a clear vision on how to build a team that is top 4 material - it's no good ever comparing ourselves to other strugglers or using one team's meteoric rise as that vision.

In the recent past, we've had a lot of people involved at the club that talked big but couldn't deliver. I prefer to see a situation where we get to our goals without any fanfare ... also, I don't wish to see any great fanfare once we get there (we supporters can carry on as much as we like - I'm talking from the club's point of view)

Just get the job done with a minimum of fuss. A club is only ever as good as the people it has in it. Right from the top, a club needs talent and a dogged determination. In the space of 18 months, our list has a much more solid look about it - there are some positive signs but we've a long way to go.

But it's all about the winning - Roos is re-building the list properly and so far, he's doing a fine job. Instilling self belief should be a lot easier now that we've turned over the list as we have. Those players left over from 5 or so years ago has dwindled to a point where there relevance isn't as profound. Our reliance on them isn't great - the new breed will be taking us forward.

That's my view on what we need to stand for ... how we're perceived from the football world right now is almost the opposite and a lot of that perception is correct (but not all of it)

.

Edited February 15, 2015 by Macca

[P-man 13,277]

Comparisons with the Storm and Victory are a bit wayward. Victory are one of two Melbourne teams in their league and Storm are the sole representative in theirs, with both being relatively successful in recent years. The AFL environment is very different for a club called "Melbourne".

As for what the club "stands for", it's basically a question that gets dragged out when trying to berate a club that has been down as long as ours has.

As soon as we start winning games, it will stop getting asked.

[daisycutter 28,684]

Comparisons with the Storm and Victory are a bit wayward. Victory are one of two Melbourne teams in their league and Storm are the sole representative in theirs, with both being relatively successful in recent years. The AFL environment is very different for a club called "Melbourne".

As for what the club "stands for", it's basically a question that gets dragged out when trying to berate a club that has been down as long as ours has.

As soon as we start winning games, it will stop getting asked.

that's right. winning clubs have culture, losing clubs have no culture and stand for nothing

the sole objective of a professional football club is to win (unlike in times yore)

[T-34 409]

Just interested to hear what we believe other clubs "stand for"?

Overused question which has no definite answer.

[Courtney_Fish 183]

What we stand for will sort itself out as we rise up the ladder. What's more important is what we won't stand for.

[dee-luded 2,958]

Don't know yet; but in recent past decade+, it seems its become Us inside, & the rest outside.....

we've IMO, become IN-bred culturally. this is why we do not get anywhere on the win loss ratio, & finals successes, & Premierships.

we must let our shyte stink like normal once again, & let those so called unwashed back into this clubs past open arms.

let the club grow, 'normal', once again, for foux sake

[Chook 14,613]

​What does any club stand for?