Annual General Meeting

[Dr. Gonzo 24,216]

Dr. G i think anyone with even a remote interest in AFL knows how shite this club has been...For PJ to mention september in 2016 is a revelation of epic proprtions in my eyes..

with the previous administration we were staring down the barrel of extinction.

In Feb 1998 did you think we could play off in a Prelim? What about Feb 1987? It's a very long shot and extremely unlikely but it's not impossible. It's sport, sometimes illogical and unexpected things happen. Edited February 5, 2015 by Dr. Gonzo

[Wiseblood 24,637]

Re my comment on the Casey agreement, when it was announced and published on the Club Website in 2008, it said it was a 10 year agreement, we have supporters bemoaning the lack of information from the club, and when it is provided don't read it, I thought it was a well know fact, why I don't join in with the topics about the alignment, perhaps I should have and stopped them dead till 2018, my bad........also believe the bus was a write off

No-one is perfect here. So shoot us if we missed one article 7 years ago and that our lives don't revolve completely and totally around the club.

[Carlos Danger 380]

Well there's a lot of big names in the league that have direct or indirect links to tanking. I'm not going to list them but it's easy to work out. We're talking about a veritable cavalcade of names. Tanking has been practiced by numerous clubs and has happened on numerous occasions from the mid 90's (it perhaps started even earlier)

Tanking was at it's height in that 3 year stretch ('03 - '05) when no fewer than 9 priority picks were handed out. Strangely enough the league changed the rules on the PP eligibility after '05. I wonder why?

Carlton alone have tanked on at least 5 occasions - when are they going to be investigated? (rhetorical question)

Didn't happen because Libba Snr recanted his comments when questioned by the AFL.

McLean had the same option but decided to make a stand and to snitch as much as he possibly could at the detriment of this footy club and to become the sole reason why tanking actually became something to officially investigate.

I really liked him as a player at this club and didn't entirely dislike him for leaving but I lost all respect after he did that.

Dog act. Totally unnecessary. And the biggest impact Brock ever made at AFL level.

[Sir Why You Little 37,036]

In Feb 1998 did you think we could play off in a Prelim? What about Feb 1987? It's a very long shot and extremely unlikely but it's not impossible. It's sport, sometimes illogical and unexpected things happen.

hey Dr G i would love to see the Demons play finals in 2015.

I just don't think the list is quite ready yet.

In 1998 we had a truckload of senior players return from injury. It helped a lot!

[dazzledavey36 54,938]

No-one is perfect here. So shoot us if we missed one article 7 years ago and that our lives don't revolve completely and totally around the club.

This ^^^

[Macca 16,969]

Didn't happen because Libba Snr recanted his comments when questioned by the AFL.

McLean had the same option but decided to make a stand and to snitch as much as he possibly could at the detriment of this footy club and to become the sole reason why tanking actually became something to officially investigate.

I really liked him as a player at this club and didn't entirely dislike him for leaving but I lost all respect after he did that.

Dog act. Totally unnecessary. And the biggest impact Brock ever made at AFL level.

I doubt it would have happened anyway because of the chairman - maybe Libba was worded up. Not saying you're wrong, it's just my opinion. We had no one on the commission in our corner (the Bombers are represented by 2 or 3 people on the commission)

Not sure it was ever mentioned but we started that year (2009) losing 12 of our first 13 games - we were crud. The way some carry on here and elsewhere you'd think we should have been pushing for the 8.

This thinking that somehow we got to the position that we did (rock bottom) because of tanking is just a ridiculous notion. Tanking has an absolute attachment to the draft and we just had rotten luck with our picks ... because we didn't improve, key people were moved on and the rest is history.

In hindsight, the mistake the club made was not making sure that anyone was ever going to blab. All the other clubs who tanked covered their tracks beautifully. Essendon has shown us how a club can stick pat even when under a ridiculous amount of pressure - closing ranks in such an arrogant way but still very effective (up until now)

[dazzledavey36 54,938]

Didn't happen because Libba Snr recanted his comments when questioned by the AFL.

McLean had the same option but decided to make a stand and to snitch as much as he possibly could at the detriment of this footy club and to become the sole reason why tanking actually became something to officially investigate.

I really liked him as a player at this club and didn't entirely dislike him for leaving but I lost all respect after he did that.

Dog act. Totally unnecessary. And the biggest impact Brock ever made at AFL level.

Good on him to standing up and exposing the likes of Schwab and Connelly. Our culture was toxic and these two were the main integrators.

Yeah he is a dog act for standing up and not taking the easy option out like Libba..

What an unbelievable post...

Edited February 5, 2015 by dazzledavey36

[ILLDieADemon 804]

Whether or not you think we will make finals in 2015, it should at least be the AIM to make finals at the beginning of each season. To say our goal is to just make ONE final by the end of NEXT year is pretty poor PR if nothing else.

I don't think we'll make finals in 2015 but it's not a foregone conclusion. Lots of things can happen in a season, look at 1987, 1994, 1998 - why put a ceiling on things?

Let's be realistic here, we are coming from second last on 4 wins.

I don't think any of us honestly think we will make for finals this year.

Would you prefer PJ fill in you up with BS and say we will in a flag this year?

[daisycutter 29,616]

Good on him to standing up and exposing the likes of Schwab and Connelly. Our culture was toxic and these two were the main integrators.

Yeah he is a dog act for standing up and not taking the easy option out like Libba..

What an unbelievable post...

what's unbelievable dazzle?

wouldn't want you or mclean in the trenches, that's believable

[Macca 16,969]

Good on him to standing up and exposing the likes of Schwab and Connelly. Our culture was toxic and these two were the main integrators.

Yeah he is a dog act for standing up and not taking the easy option out like Libba..

What an unbelievable post...

So why didn't McLean say the same sort of thing about the club he joined? Carlton. They were the kings of tanking - they tanked for Walker, Gibbs, Murphy, Kennedy, Kreuzer & Judd. And, they got away with it.

It was common knowledge about what they were doing - even the bookmakers wouldn't take bets on the Kreuzer cup match. I was at that game and they threw the match. It had less intensity than a soccer friendly. Way less. Ratten was their coach and Kernahan was their vice-president at the time.

Edited February 5, 2015 by Macca

[Biffen 12,943]

I will be petitioning the club that we change the mascot from the demon to herbie the hobo.

in these modern times,the demon is less significant due to the dying influence of religion.

As football is now a corporate enterprise expropriated from the community,i think it fitting we identify with herbie as we are in fact,homeless hobos of the afl in its current context.

and should be despised as much as the symbol of ungodliness,the trident bearing,smiley demon.

Edited February 5, 2015 by Biffen

[grazman 7,436]

Interesting comments about Casey. Even far removed up here in Canberra I had serious concerns at the start of last year in regards to certain comments as to the relationship with the Casey coaching staff and the development of MFC listed players. Seems like they may have found a better way forward with the MFC picking up the tab for Casey's coaching and (I'm guessing as a result) Melbourne gaining greater autonomy over the direction and development of MFC listed players. In the end for the relationship to work for the MFC we have to be the senior partner, (sorry but the notion that its an equal relationship is simply a furphy) but we must also understand our responsibilities and give due respect to the benefits that Casey brings to the partnership.

[chook fowler 19,459]

Make this tanking stuff go away. Move on.

[dazzledavey36 54,938]

what's unbelievable dazzle?

wouldn't want you or mclean in the trenches, that's believable

Pfft who are you again?

So why didn't McLean say the same thing about the club he joined? Carlton. You're not seriously putting us in the same category as that bunch of cheats are you?

They were the kings of tanking - they tanked for Walker, Gibbs, Murphy, Kennedy, Kreuzer & Judd. And, they got away with it.

McLean would have known all about it the minute he walked in their door. It was common knowledge about what they were doing - even the bookmakers wouldn't take bets on the Kreuzer cup match. I was at that game and they threw the match. It had less intensity than a soccer friendly. Way less. Ratten was their coach and Kernahan was their vice-president at the time.

By the way, you left out Bailey - if there was any tanking going on he would have had to rubber stamp it. He was the coach after all.

And that's where the irony is. As much as I laud him for standing up he is also a twit for discussing tanking when their club was well known for it also.

Our culture was just as bad. I was at the Richmond game and our own supporters were cheering and laughing when McMahon kicked that sealer. Lets not try and sugar coat things here. You could almost say we tanked for Sylvia, Mclean, Watts, Morton etc..

Wrong. Bailey has his hands tied behind his back. Just like when Bailey offered Jmac a one year contract only to be overturned by Schwab and Connelly last minute to focus on youth. Bailey was livid as he believed he still had a year left of footy in him. That's straight from the mouth of a McDonald relative who delivered cattle up our way last year at a family friends station.

[Macca 16,969]

Pfft who are you again?

And that's where the irony is. As much as I laud him for standing up he is also a twit for discussing tanking when their club was well known for it also.

Our culture was just as bad. I was at the Richmond game and our own supporters were cheering and laughing when McMahon kicked that sealer. Lets not try and sugar coat things here. You could almost say we tanked for Sylvia, Mclean, Watts, Morton etc..

Wrong. Bailey has his hands tied behind his back. Just like when Bailey offered Jmac a one year contract only to be overturned by Schwab and Connelly last minute to focus on youth. Bailey was livid as he believed he still had a year left of footy in him. That's straight from the mouth of a McDonald relative who delivered cattle up our way last year at a family friends station.

I edited my post with the Dean Bailey reference - it was unnecessary ... however, the fact remains that he was the senior coach and he could have said no in an adamant fashion (that's if we can believe the story that the directive to tank came from above)

My position on tanking is that it requires a buy-in from the key people (the players are just used as pawns) In other words, you can't "not know" about your own club tanking if you hold down a major position at an AFL club. Most supporters will know what's going down as well.

Usually it's a matter of following the money but with tanking there is (or was) 2 prizes ... the PP and the 'other' top end draft pick. Quite an inducement really. And one that many clubs were happy to chase after.

[Matt Demon 1,429]

Why doesn't anyone ever mention Stynes when talking about tanking?

[daisycutter 29,616]

Why doesn't anyone ever mention Stynes when talking about tanking?

you just did

[Dr. Gonzo 24,216]

Let's be realistic here, we are coming from second last on 4 wins.

I don't think any of us honestly think we will make for finals this year.

Would you prefer PJ fill in you up with BS and say we will in a flag this year?

I'd prefer he said nothing or alternatively say that as a professional sports club it is our aim at the start of every year to play finals just as every other team would be aiming to play finals. That's not spouting BS that's just being obvious.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,216]

Tanking is so overstated it is unbelievable. Who gives a stuff if a team tanks or not, every comp in the world that has a reverse order draft has tanking. It would be absolutely ridiculous if a team didn't tank, in fact in 2009 only would have been livid if we were stupid enough to win 5 games AGAIN.

After 2007 and the Kreuzer Cup I was furious not because Carlton tanked but because we didn't. That's why in 2009 I was relieved we finally had the balls to do the professional thing and plan for the future like Carlton, Collingwood, Hawthorn, Essendon, West Coast etc in the years before us instead of doing the meek thing and being bullied by the media (who interestingly enough mostly support those other teams and didn't come down on them nearly as hard) into stuffing ourselves.

The only difference between us and those other clubs tanking is that they had no guilt over what they'd done as they knew it was the right thing to do. We still had this ridiculous notion that we hadn't played fair and it ate our club from the inside out. We could've handled the senior players better but winning one extra game and losing out on a top 2 pick would've been ludicrous. Not to mention the fact that no player has ever taken the field to lose.

Look at the Patriots supporters, they don't give a stuff about Spygate, Deflate-gate or any other accusations of "cheating" - the only thing that matters is the 4 Lombardi's and their decade long domination of the division and I applaud them for that - and I'm a Jets supporter!

[old dee 23,791]

Tanking is so overstated it is unbelievable. Who gives a stuff if a team tanks or not, every comp in the world that has a reverse order draft has tanking. It would be absolutely ridiculous if a team didn't tank, in fact in 2009 only would have been livid if we were stupid enough to win 5 games AGAIN.

After 2007 and the Kreuzer Cup I was furious not because Carlton tanked but because we didn't. That's why in 2009 I was relieved we finally had the balls to do the professional thing and plan for the future like Carlton, Collingwood, Hawthorn, Essendon, West Coast etc in the years before us instead of doing the meek thing and being bullied by the media (who interestingly enough mostly support those other teams and didn't come down on them nearly as hard) into stuffing ourselves.

The only difference between us and those other clubs tanking is that they had no guilt over what they'd done as they knew it was the right thing to do. We still had this ridiculous notion that we hadn't played fair and it ate our club from the inside out. We could've handled the senior players better but winning one extra game and losing out on a top 2 pick would've been ludicrous. Not to mention the fact that no player has ever taken the field to lose.

Look at the Patriots supporters, they don't give a stuff about Spygate, Deflate-gate or any other accusations of "cheating" - the only thing that matters is the 4 Lombardi's and their decade long domination of the division and I applaud them for that - and I'm a Jets supporter!

Wow Dr you are a sad case.

The MFC and the Jets.

Next you tell us you support Chicago Cubs

[binman 42,962]

Interesting comments about Casey. Even far removed up here in Canberra I had serious concerns at the start of last year in regards to certain comments as to the relationship with the Casey coaching staff and the development of MFC listed players. Seems like they may have found a better way forward with the MFC picking up the tab for Casey's coaching and (I'm guessing as a result) Melbourne gaining greater autonomy over the direction and development of MFC listed players. In the end for the relationship to work for the MFC we have to be the senior partner, (sorry but the notion that its an equal relationship is simply a furphy) but we must also understand our responsibilities and give due respect to the benefits that Casey brings to the partnership.

Good post.

PJ was pointed in his comments about the relationship with Casey and specifically commentated on the coaches not implementing the dees game plan.

Which just highlights how off the mark those DL posters who argued all was well with the casey coaching set up, even after the couple examples of public criticism of MFC players via the media, rumors of discontent and the overheard criticism of the dees game plan in a quarter time huddle (that some dismissed as cocky poop). Sometimes where there is smoke there is actually fire.

Edited February 5, 2015 by binman

[Sir Why You Little 37,036]

Tanking is so overstated it is unbelievable. Who gives a stuff if a team tanks or not, every comp in the world that has a reverse order draft has tanking. It would be absolutely ridiculous if a team didn't tank, in fact in 2009 only would have been livid if we were stupid enough to win 5 games AGAIN.

After 2007 and the Kreuzer Cup I was furious not because Carlton tanked but because we didn't. That's why in 2009 I was relieved we finally had the balls to do the professional thing and plan for the future like Carlton, Collingwood, Hawthorn, Essendon, West Coast etc in the years before us instead of doing the meek thing and being bullied by the media (who interestingly enough mostly support those other teams and didn't come down on them nearly as hard) into stuffing ourselves.

The only difference between us and those other clubs tanking is that they had no guilt over what they'd done as they knew it was the right thing to do. We still had this ridiculous notion that we hadn't played fair and it ate our club from the inside out. We could've handled the senior players better but winning one extra game and losing out on a top 2 pick would've been ludicrous. Not to mention the fact that no player has ever taken the field to lose.

Look at the Patriots supporters, they don't give a stuff about Spygate, Deflate-gate or any other accusations of "cheating" - the only thing that matters is the 4 Lombardi's and their decade long domination of the division and I applaud them for that - and I'm a Jets supporter!

Tanking only works if you recruit the correct players

Schwab didn't so it all fell apart.

[Macca 16,969]

And then there's the hypocrisy that surrounds tanking 'Gonzo'

Secretly wanting their team to tank and then the do-gooder attitude later on.

That's for all the teams that tanked - not just our club.

[Dr. Gonzo 24,216]

Wow Dr you are a sad case.

The MFC and the Jets.

Next you tell us you support Chicago Cubs

I'm a walking sporting curse!

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

Good on him to standing up and exposing the likes of Schwab and Connelly. Our culture was toxic and these two were the main integrators.

Yeah he is a dog act for standing up and not taking the easy option out like Libba..

What an unbelievable post...

are you effing kidding me? He cost us a lot of money and instability in the club, and compromised the reputation of the club, and you're backing him for some reason. What is with some people here? The McLean, Scully and Clark defenders who the F do you barrack for? just shut up