Starting 22 - Round 1

[P-man 13,367]

The more I see the players train, the more I realise how hard it's going to be to pick that starting 22.

I'll leave my judgement until after the NAB cup

I get a feeling it's going to become even more difficult after the NAB. There are several players being omitted from most teams who could turn it on - Stretch, Michie, Vanders, NB...

[jabberwocky 2,301]

I get a feeling it's going to become even more difficult after the NAB. There are several players being omitted from most teams who could turn it on - Stretch, Michie, Vanders, NB...

It's also a reason why I think we are a very difficult side to quantify at the moment.

It's a very different list with vastly improved midfield options in particular.

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,525]

I'll have a go at my preNAB team for round one.

B: GARLAND DUNN JETTA

HB: GRIMES MCDONALD HOWE

C: WATTS JONES LAMUMBA

HF: VINCE PEDERSEN KENT

F: GARLETT HOGAN GAWN

Foll: JAMAR TYSON VINEY

Int: TOUMPAS NEWTON CROSS

Sub: SALEM

(it is very frustrating that Dawes had that brain-fart at the end of last year. He plays an important role in the team and he's going to be missed in round one, where we'll be looking to make a strong start to the year)

[Breggsy 123]

Interesting that nobody has picked dean terlich in their side yet champion data has him ranked as the best general defender in the afl last year

I'd like to see toump off half back.

The general thought is that all the players brought in by trade will be ready to play, so frost, hl gartlett plus newton should be pretty close to the round 1 side

[Coup Cooper 610]

Like the look of it. ^^^

B: GARLAND DUNN JETTA

HB: GRIMES MCDONALD Lamumba

C: WATTS JONES Vince

HF: Howe PEDERSEN KENT

F: GARLETT HOGAN GAWN/Bail

Foll: JAMAR TYSON VINEY

Int: M Jones Petracca/Brayshaw CROSS

Sub: Bail/Gawn

I too am frustrated by Dawes being suspended, I cant see Toumpus in there round 1 unless he dominates the NAB cup.

I Think if one of our top 3 picks shows for early they'll get a crack.

I see Howe playing up foward and Lamumba down back, Keep in mind Malceski is now at the suns, I wouldnt be surprised to see Jetta or Cross go straight to him.

Also think Matt Jones starts rd 1 along side Bail.

Hope Gaz isnt playing but if he is.. Wouldnt it be nice to see one of the big boys test out that shoulder early!

[La Dee-vina Comedia 17,072]

Interesting that nobody has picked dean terlich in their side yet champion data has him ranked as the best general defender in the afl last year

I'd like to see toump off half back.

The general thought is that all the players brought in by trade will be ready to play, so frost, hl gartlett plus newton should be pretty close to the round 1 side

If Champion Data had Dean Terlich as "best general defender" (whatever that means), it says more about the weaknesses in Champion Data's methodology than the strengths in Dean Terlich's game.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

This is really hard to do...

There are many players who I can't seem to fit in and they're players that would have been staple 22 two years ago.

A great sign.

For round 1 against The suns I think we need to be playing guys like Toumpas, (as long as he performs during the NAB cup) as we'll need guys who can use the ball well against this mob.

We'll need a good mix of inside grunt and outside skills. I remember how easily they moved the ball against us at the 'G' last year once they got their hands on it but I thought we competed really well in the scrap/contested ball.

The exciting realisation for me is that we now have many more options for that midfield/half-forward role. Guys like Michie, Newton, Petracca, Kent, Salem, Toumpas, Jones, Bail, JKH etc will all be fighting for that spot. Then we've got the same problem if we're wanting a half-back/midfielder with some of the same guys plus Grimes, Lamumba, Howe and Hunt competing.

The competition for spots has gone through the roof over the last couple of years and I'd argue that we've got more talent and individual drive than in previous years when we had players like Blease, Strauss, Gysberts, Tapscott etc.

Roos has clearly loaded up on midfielder types with the ability to play HF or HB as well. It's very exciting knowing Matt Jones, Bail or McKenzie are not lock ins. In fact, skill and talent wise, they're on the lower end of the pecking order. It's only running ability that keep Jones and Bail in front and as soon as we see some of our more talented and skilful players build their tanks, we'll see a squeezing out of some of those less talented players.

Can't wait to see how some of these guys perform during the NAB cup.

[P-man 13,367]

steve - skills wise I agree, but running ability alone isn't what will keep Bail in the side. Ranked 3rd last season for tackles per game, behind those two layabouts Jones and Cross.

Most don't have him in their best 22 (myself included), but whilst he is setting that type of standard, he will take some moving.

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,525]

What pleases me about our recruiting over the last two years is the hypothetical teams are not entirely composed of 18-19 year olds.

Over previous years the team predictions and training reports have been dominated by kids who were drafted three months before. I would suspect that if this were 2010, the teams in this thread would feature Oscar McDonald (CHB), Neal-Bullen ( C ) and Stretch (W), so we can get 'as many games into the kids as possible'.

This pressure and expectation is no longer lumped onto the kids at the MFC and the fans and media attention is placed upon older, more developed shoulders. It's a positive position for the club that the training reports are not solely focused on Brayshaw, Petracca and co. and how they will burst onto the scene and 'make an immediate impact'.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

steve - skills wise I agree, but running ability alone isn't what will keep Bail in the side. Ranked 3rd last season for tackles per game, behind those two layabouts Jones and Cross.

Most don't have him in their best 22 (myself included), but whilst he is setting that type of standard, he will take some moving.

Noted.

I'd say his ability to run all day contributes to the tackle count. He is going to be able to get to more contests with the amount of running he does. An advantage of being an elite runner. In the past he has been someone who has given away silly free kicks due to high tackles but as I've said, last year he really did play some consistent, disciplined football and contributed to the team playing that HF role. He definitely played to his strengths and again that's Roos' ability to get through to him. (He's a seriously special coach).

I guess I'm excited by the thought of getting someone who has more attributes to offer up to the required running standard so that they can offer more to the team and I feel like we have a few waiting in the wings.

If Roos can get a limited player in Bail playing a consistent brand of 'role playing footy', imagine what he could do with some of the more skilled and talented recruits we have.

[Mad_Melbourne 877]

If Champion Data had Dean Terlich as "best general defender" (whatever that means), it says more about the weaknesses in Champion Data's methodology than the strengths in Dean Terlich's game.

Actually a really good system and highlights how Terlich improved his accountability down back in the games that he played. Obviously it is based more around defence than offence and takes into consideration goals against and minutes on opponents. Or something of that Ilk

Edit: obviously all statistical data is not going to indicate who would be picked but for a defender it's pretty important to stop your opponent kicking goals.

[Dees2014 2,377]

Sure, Brayshaw and Petracca have more developed bodies than most draftees, but they have only ever played against younger bodies in the Championships and TAC Cup.

Give them a few games at VFL level first, so they can better adapt to the rigours and speed of AFL footy, still a big jump from VFL to AFL but not as great as coming straight in. Ollie Wines is the exception not the rule, even for bigger bodied mids.

I think we should trust Roosy and the coaches on this. The MFC have had an appalling record in the development of young talent in the last 5 or 6 years, but we now have almost the best expertise in the AFL in this area. We have turned a huge weakness into a strength. I have ultimate faith that it will be, for a change, handled well, and be a long term determinant of our success in years to come.

[Maggot 1977 263]

Just from reading the training reports I would not be surprised to see Newton in the Round 1 team and also Mitchie who I think is underrated on here and had a great finish to the year. If I was a player right now I would be wanting to stay injury free over the next 5 weeks and making the most of my game time during the pre season.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

(it is very frustrating that Dawes had that brain-fart at the end of last year. He plays an important role in the team and he's going to be missed in round one, where we'll be looking to make a strong start to the year)

The frustrating part is that he was just playing tough footy and booked for nothing, under the new softc-ck style of football the AFL has imposed on us - and of course he was crucified at the MRP, because he plays for Melbourne

[deeko 952]

I'm more interested in the roles that players will have this year and will they have a positive impact. Such as:

- Will Dunn stay at full back on the key forwards again like last year. Or does the recruitment of Frost free Dunn up as an attacking defender?

- Does HL really play in the guts, the wing or back to the old faithful HBF?

- Does Grimes get a game if all are fit?

- Will Petracca or Brayshaw have any impact?

- WIth a full pre-season will the Toump justify his high position in his draft?

- Are Newton / Mitchie / Pigdog actually good recruits and another Roos genius move or are they busts.

- Will Maxy pass over Jamar?

- Will Hogan ever play for us? Can he play? Will he suffer the same injury cursed career of so many forwards before him.

- Is Jeffy worth the punt?

One things for sure its going to be exciting for a while anyway.

It's really impossible to pick a best 22 at this stage and thats a great thing imo.

[Wrecker45 3,378]

I'm more interested in the roles that players will have this year and will they have a positive impact. Such as:

- Will Dunn stay at full back on the key forwards again like last year. Or does the recruitment of Frost free Dunn up as an attacking defender?

- Does HL really play in the guts, the wing or back to the old faithful HBF?

- Does Grimes get a game if all are fit?

- Will Petracca or Brayshaw have any impact?

- WIth a full pre-season will the Toump justify his high position in his draft?

- Are Newton / Mitchie / Pigdog actually good recruits and another Roos genius move or are they busts.

- Will Maxy pass over Jamar?

- Will Hogan ever play for us? Can he play? Will he suffer the same injury cursed career of so many forwards before him.

- Is Jeffy worth the punt?

One things for sure its going to be exciting for a while anyway.

It's really impossible to pick a best 22 at this stage and thats a great thing imo.

I've seen him play live twice. Once against the Tigers in the pre-season cup where he demonstrated he was the most exciting prospect on Melbourne's list. The second time was in a VFL game at Vic park where he again demonstrated he was the most exciting prospect on Melbourne's list. He can play. Both times were before Dom Tyson was on our list...

[Samael 560]

Just from reading the training reports I would not be surprised to see Newton in the Round 1 team and also Mitchie who I think is underrated on here and had a great finish to the year. If I was a player right now I would be wanting to stay injury free over the next 5 weeks and making the most of my game time during the pre season.

I agree with you on Michie. He finished last season very well. He is just a quiet no nonsense player that goes about his job with little fuss. As Saty notes he is a man of very few words which is why I think he flies under the radar. Reading through the Maroochy reports I don't think he was mentioned twice by the DL reporters. I am expecting him to have a very good year this year and I reckon it will be of the HBF.

[P-man 13,367]

Post NAB 1:

B: MCDONALD DUNN JETTA

HB: SALEM FROST HOWE

C: LUMUMBA JONES VINCE

HF: WATTS PEDERSEN TOUMPAS

F: GARLETT HOGAN KENT

Foll: JAMAR TYSON VINEY

Int: VANDENBURG NEWTON CROSS

Sub: KENNEDY-HARRIS

Dawes to replace Pedo when he returns.

The only name I look at with a slight sense of dread is McDonald and with his iffy disposal and decisions. Otherwise I am liking the look of that side. Frost, Salem and Lumumba completely change the way in which we move the ball out of the back half.

[bing181 9,436]

Post NAB 1:

B: MCDONALD DUNN JETTA

HB: SALEM FROST HOWE

C: LUMUMBA JONES VINCE

HF: WATTS PEDERSEN TOUMPAS

F: GARLETT HOGAN KENT

Foll: JAMAR TYSON VINEY

Int: VANDENBURG NEWTON CROSS

Sub: KENNEDY-HARRIS

Looks good. Grimes will be in though. If he's to be dropped, it won't be till after at least a few games. He's not in the leadership group without Roos and co.'s endorsement.

So: Vandenberg or Salem to sub, Kennedy-Harris out. Also, to make it more difficult, suspect that one of Gawn or Spencer will be included, and if Vince isn't ready, Mitchie or next mid off the rank. Finally, we may look to our Gazza-stopper, Jordie McKenzie - even if it's the only game he plays all year.

Getting difficult though.

[watchtheeyes 1,429]

Post NAB 1:

B: MCDONALD DUNN JETTA

HB: SALEM FROST HOWE

C: LUMUMBA JONES VINCE

HF: WATTS PEDERSEN TOUMPAS

F: GARLETT HOGAN KENT

Foll: JAMAR TYSON VINEY

Int: VANDENBURG NEWTON CROSS

Sub: KENNEDY-HARRIS

Dawes to replace Pedo when he returns.

The only name I look at with a slight sense of dread is McDonald and with his iffy disposal and decisions. Otherwise I am liking the look of that side. Frost, Salem and Lumumba completely change the way in which we move the ball out of the back half.

I reckon you're pretty well on the money, will be interesting to see if Grimes/Garland do actually get there. On last nights form they shouldn't be.

Loved Frost's run, bloody hell he's a unit and so quick!

Agree with bing as well, if Vince is out I don't really have a problem with Michie coming in. He's definitely next up for me.

Just think what we could have with Vanders. Bloke came in to the team injured, had an interrupted preseason after being on a semi-professional training program at Ainlee. Looking forward to seeing him next year!

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,477]

About time the heat is on Grimes and Garland.

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,477]

Looks good. Grimes will be in though. If he's to be dropped, it won't be till after at least a few games. He's not in the leadership group without Roos and co.'s endorsement.

So: Vandenberg or Salem to sub, Kennedy-Harris out. Also, to make it more difficult, suspect that one of Gawn or Spencer will be included, and if Vince isn't ready, Mitchie or next mid off the rank. Finally, we may look to our Gazza-stopper, Jordie McKenzie - even if it's the only game he plays all year.

Getting difficult though.

Leadership group doesn't always = abilty.

I know he tries, but is it enough to keep his spot. He can't cut it pre season but he'll suddenly find form for round 1.

He needs to dropped and reprove himself.

[Lucifers Hero 40,563]

About time the heat is on Grimes and Garland.

Yep, they are both RFA's this year. They need to play themselves into a contract otherwise there won't be many takers at anything like a good deal. Hopefully, that is enough heat for them to lift their game very quickly.

Because they are RFA's and they have earnt respect, I think Roos will give them every chance to prove themselves and they should get games in the first half of the year on the back of this. However, I wouldn't be too confident in the second half when new recruits will be needing a taste of seniors football.

Unfortunately, both are scarred by the 186 loss, 'tanking', Neeld etc They have both had really good years with the Dees. Just hope they can clear their heads of those mental scars and re-find their best.

[DeeSpencer 26,480]

Yep, they are both RFA's this year. They need to play themselves into a contract otherwise there won't be many takers at anything like a good deal. Hopefully, that is enough heat for them to lift their game very quickly.

Because they are RFA's and they have earnt respect, I think Roos will give them every chance to prove themselves and they should get games in the first half of the year on the back of this. However, I wouldn't be too confident in the second half when new recruits will be needing a taste of seniors football.

Unfortunately, both are scarred by the 186 loss, 'tanking', Neeld etc They have both had really good years with the Dees. Just hope they can clear their heads of those mental scars and re-find their best.

First thing I'd give up is any talk of mental scars. Garland played his best footy in 2013. For whatever reason, despite Saty telling me it's fine he's not looking fit on the training track. Dead last in the running. He's also not suited to tall opponents. He's a mid sized versatile type who can provide run from the backline. Roos needs to get out some tapes of Garland 2013 and they both need to familiarise each other with how he played then. Aggressive, attacking play from the backline.

Either Grimes' body is shot or the game has gone passed him. It's sped up and he doesn't have the skills or power to compete any more.

[Lucifers Hero 40,563]

First thing I'd give up is any talk of mental scars. Garland played his best footy in 2013. For whatever reason, despite Saty telling me it's fine he's not looking fit on the training track. Dead last in the running. He's also not suited to tall opponents. He's a mid sized versatile type who can provide run from the backline. Roos needs to get out some tapes of Garland 2013 and they both need to familiarise each other with how he played then. Aggressive, attacking play from the backline.

Either Grimes' body is shot or the game has gone passed him. It's sped up and he doesn't have the skills or power to compete any more.

Saty looks at all our players thru rose-coloured glasses and more than a few grains of salt are needed when reading his training reports so agree with your comments re the training track.

I'm prepared to cut these guys some slack as Garland had a major injury at end of 2013 (shoulder??) and severely affected his 2014 season. We can't play all our new recruits in the first half of this season so nothing lost by giving G & G the extra chances. Just maybe they play the role coaches request which we can't see. Will be surprised to see them dropped from the team before the bye. Time will tell.