Sanctions

[DemonWA 3,936]

The club will survive whatever comes its way.

[Striker475 696]

Hmmm seriously?

You think that a draw that is defined as the most complex draw in professional sport in Australia has a provision or parameter to punish the MFC for potentially tanking as part of how it is calculated?

Even if you separate out the actual teams playing each other from the venues and timeslots (I don't even know if that's possible) You do realise that with such a big TV deal, that the broadcasters want to maximise their exposure and return on the investment that they paid for?

We don't get Friday nights because we are at the bottom of the ladder. 4 other clubs aren't getting these games either.... I don't see anything in the draw that looks like we have been harshly done by.

I think you are jumping at Shadows Striker! Don't see any correlation between the draw and the tanking issue.

Let's look at it then.

The club makes money from its 11 home games based on gate receipts.

Now, one of these is sold, sure. That's the Darwin game.

10 games left.

Of those:

- 1 is at Etihad Stadium. Well-recognised that we get significantly lower attendances at Etihad.

- 6 of the MCG games are against interstate sides. Of these, two of the sides are the brand new clubs. These will naturally bring in less revenue as there is a lower 'away' support base.

- Our one 'quality' time slot for a home game, Saturday night v Western Bulldogs, is just that. The Western Bulldogs are not a high-drawing club.

- We have two home games against high-drawing teams. One is the Collingwood game, which always is, thankfully. The other is the Hawthorn game - but even this has had the edge taken off it, being put on Sunday at 3.15, well known as an unfriendly timeslot.

Meanwhile, we have away games at the G against Essendon, Carlton and Richmond.

Yeah, we've been screwed.

[H_T 3,049]

Sanctions? Well you have got be found guilty first, agree with those whom say the AFL will tighten a few rules, and remove the prizes for being the biggest loser.

That's right. They've already moved the Priority pick.

It doesn't sit well with me removal of premiership points, draft picks, etc.

But if the AFL deem fit to strip us of our wooden spoons like the NRL did with the Storm's premierships, I'm happy to oblige.

[P-man 13,366]

Let's just all take a deep breath and calm down. The majority of you worry far too much. No sanctions have been handed out as yet and there may not be any handed out by the end of the investigation.

Start stressing IF we are hit with sanctions, until then just chill out..

Agreed. People need to chill the f*** out. This state of hysteria is being assisted by naysayers and routine club bashers. The fire may have been lit but Rome hasn't burned to the ground yet,

[Akum 2,660]

You can if its feeding you with one hand and punching you in the nuts with its other!!

That would make anything it feeds you impossible to swallow!!

[pm24 451]

I get that we are coping criticism for all this, but in the back of my mind I can't help but come back to the fact the we did not do anything illegal. The club used a tactic that a number of teams have in the past. As we keep saying, it is no different to what Collingwood, Hawthorn, Carlton and even St Kilda have done in the past. The AFL created this system, they should have to live with the consequences.

The only thing I believe they could sanction us for is "bringing the game into disrepute", but then again on on-field perfomance could be said to have done that regardless of the tanking stuff. However, if we do get sanctioned by the league, it would be overkill if we were to be hit with a penalty greater than that of Adelaide. We worked within the system that the AFL had set up. Adelaide deliberately used outside mechanisms to remunerate a player outside of the cap.

I can't help but think that throughout this, there are some personal agendas that are leading the attack rather than trying to achieve any sense of justice.

[rpfc 28,768]

You can't bite the hand that feeds you.

We will.

The AFL have lost control of their own investigators and if the Commission want to make an example of us then this is headed for the courts.

[the real deelirium 8]

In the court challenge for sanctions over tanking:-

Unnamed player on the witness stand.

MFC Attorney :- What evidence do you have of this tanking ?

Unnamed player :- It was disgusting what was going on and you felt for Bails because everyone knew he was under the pump to lose

You'd work your butt off in the pre-season and hang up all these words in the gym and the change rooms or whatever and what did it all mean? Nothing

MFC Attorney :- So , you worked extremely hard in training and you did all you could to ready yourself for a season of Afl football ?

Unnamed player :- Yes.

MFC Attorney :- Have you ever lied before ?

Unnamed player :- No.

MFC Attorney :- I enter into evidence your honor the fitness and strength statistics of the witness from his years at the MFC.I would also like to enter statistics from all the other Afl listed players not at the MFC. Also I wish to add the notes about the witness from the current strength and conditioning officials and current coach. I will also call on Mr David Misson , who is considered an expert in this field.

Judge :- So entered.

Defence :- Before Mr Misson comes to the stand , I just have one last question for this witness . Unnamed player, were you asked to lose a game by any official from the MFC ?

Unnamed Player :- No.

Judge :- I see no reason to waste the courts time any further.

[P-man 13,366]

We're an entrenched bottom four side that pulls Port-like crowds. Claiming the draw as a form of punishment for perceived actions still being investigated? It's a stretch, to say the least.

[The heart beats true 18,145]

I get that we are coping criticism for all this, but in the back of my mind I can't help but come back to the fact the we did not do anything illegal.

This has been my ongoing question throughout this whole thing. Does the AFL have a contract with each team that states that every team will do everything in it's power to win each and every match it plays in?

Does that mean they'll fine clubs for sending injured players off to surgery if they look like they won't make finals?

It's not as simple as saying 'we tried to lose', it's about the intent as opposed to the action. The action in this circumstance actually helps us in the Richmond game. We could never have orchestrated a kick after the siren. If we'd been beaten by 12 goals thats a whole other issue.

Can you be guilty of thinking something benefits you that the league put in place? Did we think we wanted to lose? How can you prove a thought from a legal perspective?

And for those of you who say the club shouldn't seek legal action against the AFL I genuinely think if the fine is large they should consider it. Imagine if the Government created a system and then private enterprise took advantage of the system for long term gain instead of short term thinking? We'd call that great foresight.

I think the AFL knows it made a mistake, but I think they don't know how to fix it. This is far more their issue in my opinion than it is any one clubs. If the MFC bears the brunt of it I'm going to go ballistic.

[old55 23,687]

Let's try to keep the panic in one thread folks ...

[beelzebub 23,382]

Let's try to keep the panic in one thread folks ...

but the chooks need heads in order to see that thread !!

[Philthy 284]

If we lose pick 4 im glad we traded away Pick 3 for a 10 yr CHF

[The Demon 2565 28]

The problem is that there is no defence, as we have to cop whatever penalty the AFL dishes out.

There is no way we would take the AFL to court.

there is no need for defence if the AFL has no evidence. the fact that a meeting was held to discuss tanking, bearing in mind that this 'fact' is currently no more than media speculation, isn't all that water tight unless there is some kind of record of the meeting, or everyone present signs statements to that effect (or at least a couple do, and no one signs a statement to the contrary). it's a loophole yes, but the onus is on the prosecution to prove guilt nonetheless

we absolutely must take it to court if the AFL imposes sanctions with no hard evidence. This is clearly the last thing the AFL wants, because it will open the flood gates with regard to being forced to take action other teams doing the same thing

having said all that, and pending loopholes as to hard evidence, i tend to think that we deserve to be punished if indeed we were stupid enough to have a meeting to plan this, and then subsequently shafted people who were involved in that meeting

[Ouch! 2,266]

Let's look at it then.

The club makes money from its 11 home games based on gate receipts.

Now, one of these is sold, sure. That's the Darwin game.

10 games left.

Of those:

- 1 is at Etihad Stadium. Well-recognised that we get significantly lower attendances at Etihad.

- 6 of the MCG games are against interstate sides. Of these, two of the sides are the brand new clubs. These will naturally bring in less revenue as there is a lower 'away' support base.

- Our one 'quality' time slot for a home game, Saturday night v Western Bulldogs, is just that. The Western Bulldogs are not a high-drawing club.

- We have two home games against high-drawing teams. One is the Collingwood game, which always is, thankfully. The other is the Hawthorn game - but even this has had the edge taken off it, being put on Sunday at 3.15, well known as an unfriendly timeslot.

Meanwhile, we have away games at the G against Essendon, Carlton and Richmond.

Yeah, we've been screwed.

Ok, you are misunderstanding my argument, I am not saying that the draw is great, but I am saying that the notion that is is the way it is because the AFL want to punish us for tanking which is what you alluded to.... thats the bit that I find is fanciful. Look below for an alternative perspective on the draw to what you put above...

Every year we don't ask for home games at Etihad, we always seem to get one, what has changed

We were always going to end up playing twice against the other bottom teams, So GWS, GC, Port and the dogs. 3 of those teams are interstate teams, so that means we either play them at the G, at Etihad or up in Darwin.

We don't get quality slots cos we are a crap team. 5 teams didn't get a friday night game..... guess which ones?

Bottom line is that the TV networks want to maximise their returns on their investment, that means prioritising those teams that draw good ratings.

We don't have a great draw perhaps from the perspective of maximising revenue, but we do have a solid draw in terms of giving us a good chance to improve our ladder position.

If we can prove we are a team on the up, and with young players that are exciting to watch.... then we will get better timeslots.

[TheoX 1,222]

The individuals that carried out any alleged 'tanking' like Bailey should be punished the most harshley. The players were always tyring to win.

[mjt 640]

The individuals that carried out any alleged 'tanking' like Bailey should be punished the most harshley. The players were always tyring to win.

if the AFL want to sanction us they should make us keep CS for another 5yrs, now thats a harsh penalty, the blokes toxic and nothing but trouble.

[rpfc 28,768]

Yeah, we've been screwed.

We are being screwed for being sh!te not for any tanking blowback.

The AFL want Clothier to find anything as much as we do.

[Bossdog 2,002]

This isn't the AFL's fault this happened, it's the MFC's fault plain and simple.

It's the fault of a weak culture, and managerial incompetence.

A 10 person meeting to conspire the deliberate loss of football matches.................it tells you everything you need to know about those involved.

Perhaps when Schwab was dicking around with the new club emblem, he could have included a symbol that represents the clubs interest or intent to win every game we participate in, or does that go without saying????

I take it that you were at that meeting and heard everything that was said??????....Otherwise pure speculation and until it is sworn to via affidavit or a court of law...It is heresay evidence......So many experts these jurnos with not having to PROVE anything

[baysidedave 246]

Luckily there needs to be a certain thing called evidence. A document, a recording, a confession. Etc etc. Brock Mclean is still going on about it. Absolute snake.

you said it, l hope McLean is proud of what he's started here, l only hope Carlton get investigated and he loses his job, he's the biggest scumbag ever to pull on a Demon jumper and l don't know who the other 'ex-player' speaking anonymously in the heralsun is?

[Clintosaurus 7,861]

I can't see how pick 4 can be taken off us, as it is a compensation pick. When Carlton lost picks, they still got to keep a priority pick which was used on Andrew Walker. Can't see the difference.

[Sdemon53 15]

What rule or regulation of the AFL has the Melbournsfc transgressed???

Be blowed if I can find anything.

From a legal standing the AFL has not got anything to hang their sanctions on from what I can see.

[Adam The God 30,407]

All still speculation at this point and if there isn;t anymore evidence then what's been mentioned in the media then there's still no smoking gun in my opinion from a legal perspective.

Worst case scenario and there is a fine & loss of draft picks the club need to convince the AFL that the draft pick loss should be for 2013 given our 2nd round pick is dedicated to father son and Pick 4 is a compensation pick that we're entitled to under the AFL expansion rules, it's not our first round draft pick.

The speculation is also being driven by a journalist who clearly has a vendetta against Schwab. Wilson has always lacked a semblance of credibility. She jumps the gun with heresy and innuendo. I maintain the AFL will do nothing about this. It's a can of worms they don't want to open. They'll release articles like today, with Vlad sprouting things such as the AFL won't tolerate anyone undermining the rules, but ultimately will do nothing.

[Roost It 1,434]

Extreme masochist.

We are a laughing stock for what has happened over the past 4 years.

There has been very little to be proud about.

We continue to be a C grade circus act.

Sad but true.

Although C grade is still to high.

There was a tipping point thread going around and I've started to wonder why I have such an intense interest in a corrupted sport, run by corporate egomaniacs, advertised by banks, fast food joints and crap TV. Not to mention my team lurches from one shambles to another. If I didn't laugh at the absurdity of my support I'd probably cry. When did it become so fine and acceptable to be morally bankrupt? The corporate world that we feed off has not done the world or us any favours.I realise now there is an end point and it may be soon if we are stripped of draft picks and cash we surely cant do without.

Sorry about the off track ramblings but do I really care if my kids give this rabble a miss?

[Roost It 1,434]

The individuals that carried out any alleged 'tanking' like Bailey should be punished the most harshley. The players were always tyring to win.

Yeh lets punish the guy who was simultaneously being lent on to lose and being undermined by Schwab and Connolly. Sounds fair!