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It's the decision of a follower and not a leader, they will make me a Premiership and Finals Player, where the likes of Boak say right I want to be a leader and want to play finals but I'm staying at this club and I'm going to give everything to make sure we do it, who is coming with me. I understand Frawleys decision but it actually says a lot about him, Brian Lake was in the twilight of his career and made the decision to try and win a flag and whilst I also understand his decision it also says a lot about him. Here was a AA at his previous club who was overweight, struggled to get out on the park and wasn't prepared to play through the pain of niggles. My how that changed when he moved clubs, he lost weight and was determined and played through games hurt for fear of missing out on something. People can talk about that being the culture of Hawthorn but to me whilst that is a very big part of it, IMO it shows the true colours of the likes of Lake and Frawley as followers. Frawley will do well he will have good players around him, but I can almost guarantee when the chips (pardon the pun) are down and if they go through a bad patch without the Mitchells, Hodges, Lewis and Roughies at the club it wont be Frawley and Lake standing tall and saying right boys lets dig in and make this happen. We drafted plenty of talented followers and need more Nate Jones's, Viney's, Cross's, if there is a chance of drafting a Hodge, Lewis, Roughie and a Joel Selwood type for their leadership then by god we better get that call right as opposed to the kid who is a great kick and has been very good at underage level, Brayshaw playing whilst clearly hurt and seeing him when things aren't going his way still trying to provide physical pressure is a glimpse of this, seeing Petracca wanting to hurt opponents at every tackle is another good sign. Chip the follower is gone Pick 3 needs to be used to get the future leader we crave by whatever means be it via draft or trade

I really don't see what the issue is? Here we have a person who has come from a disturbing background but has managed somehow to turn himself into a respectful person with integrity and strong values. Yeah I love a laugh at the pathetic things in life, but here we have an afl footballer who isn't all about going to the Barkley on a sunday night trying to pull birds bragging about afl stardom. We have a bloke who sticks up for what he feels is right. Sure, he can come across a little self-righteous, but in a day and age where the youth aren't of sound moral fibre, he is prepared to be a good role model and get on the front foot to use his status as an afl footballer to try to better those who look up to him. Anyone with an issue with a person who wants a peaceful and respectful earth should have a good look at themselves before casting rocks at someone like heritier.

On the contrary, it's a great speech with a sharp subtext - very Roos in fact. As others have suggested, he paid tribute to what he's been through with them, and what the club has done for him on & off the field - but only up to 2011. Though he did not bag them, it was notable that in this tribute he left out the Buckley era entirely. And everybody in that audience would have been acutely aware that despite being their 4th best, they're actually giving him the flick. Awkward!! The implication is that they could handle him as "Harry O'Brien" but not as Heretier Lumumba. And that's a serious cultural weakness in 2014, especially for a club that thinks it's just a bit better than everyone else. It brings up echoes of their Nicky-Winmar-Michael-Long days of 20 years ago. They still don't "get" diversity, in any of its forms. And best of all, his message in the "Prince who is gifted and has the last laugh" line is that he goes with his head held high, and he expects that with us, he's going to have the last laugh on them! And he'll bust his guts to make it happen! So ... "thanks for what we've been through together" (but only up to 2011) ... but "I'm leaving with my head held high" ... and "I'm going to have the last laugh." What's not to like?

Jeez, imagine smoking a cone with this bloke

I believe the club has been told we have pick 3

Was it filmed earlier in the year?

I have been a critic but all indicators are that he will come to us with a massive point to prove and a burning desire to succeed. That can be infectious.

I thought his speech was a thinly veiled FU to the CFC about values and them pushing him out when he is obviously talented (finishing 4th in their B&F). I liked it, the Collingwood Football Club has gone from the club of the working people with community values, to a glorified corporate bogan devoid of values and ashamed of their roots. Welcome Prince!

Cut out the sexism and get some class.

Heriter Lumumba is the Kanye West of AFL.

It is truly ironic that posters on Demonland who spit out damning opinions of Lumumba label him 'self righteous'. Can the guy play footy? Will he improve our list? Does he fit Roosy's plan? Is the trade fair? The rest is bulls**t. Roos wants him. That's good enough for me.

It would appear the right-wing faction of Demonland is upset at recruiting someone with leftist attitudes.

I pose the question, are Hawthorn the games largest parasites? (inflammatory language intended) Add their ability to attract players that other teams have put the hard yards into to the fact their home training ground VFL park once belonged to the wider football community, now it is theirs. Also add that we built the G but now its their home ground too (along with the lesser parasites) Add the money they "receive" from Tassie. All up they "poach" other teams players, are gifted the communities VFL park, use ours for home games and are paid money by a state in which they are not even based. Pretty smart way of doing business it seems. A quote I heard recently in a non football sense was "the goal in life is not to own the land but to control the land". The Hawks have done a great job in controlling assets that they don't own or even necessarily developed. Let the pot shots begin............

Mine too. I watched videos of him all night last night. One of the things he did was he reduced complicated things. Caught in traffic, he would simplify it, with turning, going around, paddling the ball on the ground in his first game I remember, till he got the feel of being there, and in one of the 5-minute bits of vision on here you see him (faster than thinking, as he did) turn on a sixpence and then take a half step backwards before being aligned with the way through - and off he went. Robbie was like the Ockham's Razor of football - he just simplified the most complicated things on the field, and then tore through with off-the-show skill. But it was that "knowing how to get through" that is unparallelled in my opinion. Maybe this came of his total commitment to being there, being in a Melbourne jumper. He said he arrived at the game every time, with the view that we could win it. He was entirely unphased about his celebrity, genuinely seemed not to be comfortable at all with it (I loved the story that when he did something really good at tennis, he'd be looking down fiddling with the strings on his racquet while people made their comments); it was like being there was the issue, being part of the Melbourne footy club, not himself. In total faith. Comments from supporters of other clubs say a lot about how watching him was getting the magic of the game, and no-one ever took it as a tribal thing to barrack against him. Dipper's comments about when he'd busted his shoulder illustrate the aura of the man. He set standards beyond anyone. Total commitment makes a lot of things different I think. In everything - like marriage, children, learning something, playing music, whatever. Robbie always had it, way beyond anyone I ever saw playing footy. Maybe Barassi, though he didn't have the sublime giftedness. (Nothing like the starey-eyed Essendon or Mitch Robinson focus, either. Just fully active immersion.) Robbie Flower has been a sort of pole star for me, not only in football. His passing doesn't change that, but the world is somehow a lonelier, less supportive place, without him still being here.

To begin with many of the other threads on this board at the moment are ones for proper discussion - scrapping the sub rule, our theme song etc. Things that are yet to happen and are open to debate and discussion. Same as the trade ideas and what picks we get and why Mitch Clark the worst human being on earth etc. etc. etc. Your post is a waste of time. You are worried about something that has been done and there is no way around it. I guess I can turn to the wife and tell her that I feel better knowing Curry and Beer is worried and disgruntled about something that's already happened, but what else is there for it? Why waste time whipping ourselves into a frenzy over it? I just don't get the point of your post at all. Roos is here until the end of 2016 and then Goodwin takes over. That's the way it is. But it's not just that. It's your rubbish comments about how Roos has only made a 'half arse' commitment to the club and that we have rats deserting a sinking ship (even though Tyson, Vince, Cross, Michie, Lumumba etc were and are all keen on coming to the club...). It's simply untrue and founded on nothing. Roos was always brought into the club NOT to coach us to our next premiership but to set us up for the next one. That includes changing the list, changing the culture and overhauling the structures that have kept us a mile behind all the other clubs. His job was to help select the successor who would hold those values and then take over - Simon Goodwin is the man who will be charged with taking us to our next flag, and I have no doubt that Roos will still be around the club giving his support to that push. And let's not even start with this. I love posters who will hold on to any piece of evidence and claim it supports their point. Bailey might have won a few more games but he oversaw the worst defeat in our history and oversaw a side that had no idea how to train, no idea how to play defence and no idea how to improve themselves. He allowed players far too much freedom, to the point of cancelling the odd session, and he allowed some like Prendergast to make some of the worst draft selections in our history, which I have no doubt he had a hand in. Roos may not have won as many matches this year, but he ticks WAY more columns on the overall list than Bailey ever did. Bailey was all short term. Roos sees the bigger picture and aren't we the better for it.

Probably with the boys on the end of season trip lol

Not yours either. A dictionary doesn't give 'metaphorical definition(s)' it gives meanings ... unless of course you had in mind Giambattista Vico's idea that all language is metaphorical, which I somehow doubt. But you're a fine one for accusations about understanding language since you don't even seem capable of recognising Adam's basic question about why meanings like 'self righteous, over sensitive, self absorbed' have been attached, metaphorically or otherwise, to the word princess and not to the word prince.

2 years and goodbye Jordie.

That Bulldogs forum sounds like some of the rubbish some Demonlanders proffer from time to time (read - regularly).

He spoke of what he believes in; forget the words of formed sentences & take the intent the theme is whats important. He stands for the underprivileged & for equity & justice. A fine example of a person who stands on his principles. glad he's coming over to us.

I just want to remind everyone that any comments wishing physical harm on a player are totally unacceptable and will result in a forced holiday from Demonland. I know we are all angry at the situation but think before you post.

i just went on the Bigfooty Melbourne board for the first time ever this is the title to their equivalent Demonland Heritier thread 'The [censored] off we don't want Harry O thread'What a great way to welcome a player to the club that actually wants to come to us and make an impact and be a leader to help us out of the mire. Pathetic. Wont be going to that forum ever again

I am firmly of the opinion that Frawley was stitched up by the Hawks pre season and that to avoid another Scully saga he had to play an elaborate charade including feigning interest he might stay and also string along other clubs who were interested in his services. I was convinced he was gone mid season and am amused that some now suggest he was burned by Roos. Roos knew what was happening and prepared for life without Frawley from the beginning of the season.

Thank you for posting my poem, I am amazed that you have kept it all those years. I signed up to Demonland just to respond. By the time I had the absolute honour of reciting it at his Testimonial Dinner in 1988 I had made a few slight changes to it and I have edited your original post above to show it as it now stands. Just added a few missing verses too. Thanks to David Schwartz and his producer Mitch for allowing me to record it at SEN yesterday, and Eddie for the very appropriate music he put behind it. https://soundcloud.com/sen1116/ode-to-robbie-flower There has never been a more inspirational footballer than Robbie Flower. He was my hero. Condolences to the entire Flower family who must be feeling the pain we are all feeling, a hundred times over.

I am doing well. On the 21st September I said on here not to go after him. Today on another thread I said to go after him. He was an inch away from playing for the Premier in the GF, He is a Premiership player and like Cross a good trainer and hard at the ball player. I think for 2 years he could be valuable to us helping out our young mids. Even if we do get Petracca and Brayshaw they would benefit from having him in their club. I suppose it depends on cost. In the PSD he would be free.

Well said again. Anybody who dares to utter philosophies or beliefs outside the cookie cutter mould of twenty-something male sporting mantras is going to raise the ignorant criticisms of many. Pure tall poppy-ism. He's different, and if people can't cope, then that's about them, not HL. I heard Luke Ball talking about him on the wireless a few weeks ago, and his praise for him as a footballer and person was both genuine and glowing. It spoke volumes.

Considering our midfield balance at the moment, Hrovat is a bit too small. Especially if we're going to be giving up early picks.

Disagree with you on this one sweet. Rarely is it possible to put the terms "highly articulate" and "footballer" on the same page let alone when referring to one. Heritier spoke honestly and proudly and .... if that's what his name means .... so be it.

It's actually not so much as the age and demographic of the Melbourne supporter that's the problem but those whose mindset is so totally negative that they surrender on every tough issue at the club so that they are completely unwilling and unable to confront them.

i recently had a 2 week holiday from demonland and was forced to attend Mark Neelds footy camp at ocean grove i learnt a lot, thank you Nasher

Maybe he likes to perform to the extent of his ability, rather than hold his best back because it might benefit the club that wants him? Hmmm, why does this sound familiar?

Lumumba just came 4th in the copeland. Not a bad effort for a player that majority of demonland didnt want and basically a straight swap for Clark. Lumumba over Clark is a massive win for us.

Nothing you have said in that post has been proven right. And your comment earlier was a disgrace.

I'm all for downgrading one of our earlier picks ala the Tyson deal, but 3 to 15 seems a large jump for mine.

Changing my stance again from 'well, whatever' to 'welcome aboard HL, sorry for all the dickbags'.

Even if it was Goodwin I doubt there is anything to worry about: - There is nothing in that article that suggests anything illegal was done - Apparently he 'came clean' to MFC Board, about his role in the saga - PJ is smart enough to have built contingencies into Goodwin's contract should anything come up - The AFL would needed to have approved the appointment (as the 'receivers' of MFC) and if there was anything in the ASADA Interim Report the AFL would have just said keep looking PJ, Goodwin is not for you. They could just say: best to steer away from EFC staff for now. The interesting question is who leaked the info to HS. Could it just be one J Hird to embarrass one of his best mates, Xavier Campbell for doing his job and siding with EFC on the ASADA appeal rather than siding with JH. If my hunch is right that is another bestie that James has thrown under the bus!!

Who cares if he impedes game time for young mids, if they want to get a game then they will need to earn it. Sewell sits comfortably in our 22 and would make our young players earn their spots whilst also making us a better team. Would love to have him at Melbourne.

I actually hope that if this is the case that this little snippet makes its way to the list. I know we chop and trade players without too much sentiment but it will send a message to the group that if you want to "put you contract talks on hold and just concentrate on playing footy" there may not be a contract waiting for you when you are ready to talk.

The club really should warn all new arrivals about Saty.

With you there 'pitchfork'. Firstly we get the ignorant hyperbole about the terminal uselessness of the entire MFC supporter base, and then to raise the juvenile generalisations and fear baited paranoia to even greater levels, the Muslims get a mention. Wow.

If opposition scouts and its managers are reading opposition fan forums to gain insights into who they should be drafting and trading then god help them (although if you're Barry Prendergast then it would help).

You can all wear your Ima Toumpa Apologist badges with pride. I only care for a capable Melbourne. We ve had our fill of NQRs and Jimmy is right on that list currently and if you think otherwise youre delusional. Yeah Trenners lit up the crappy SANFL too ( for the record its below VFL std these days ) He got going straight away until injured. The Toump had some decent games late in that season he played senior SANFL and had a reasonably good Final..Done sfa since then. paint it anyway yo wish but realistic apparently. When anyone talks of Dimitri is always about what "might" be. All potential...Even the club says the same shlt wrapped up in the words "HOPE he has a breakout season" They f'n hope ?????? Seriously ???? Hes either cherry ripe next year after a preseason or we are wasting a list space, money and a pick. Thats called reality. I hope he comes good..Only because I want good players on our team not cloggers. I want Melbourne to win, not continue the misery. I dont care wtf plays for us, but they better play and play well...or why have them. Its not a social convention for homeless nqr's. They are after all getting paid a lot of money..Wheres the return. If he cant provide , get someone who can. Its really that simple.

There are a few ways to deal with this.If we want Petracca we just tell Saints if they want McCartin to not swap their pick. Then we take Petracca and Brayshaw. If they are as good as hyped then we have 2 class mids coming in. If Saints are going to swap their pick we tell them do that and we either take McCartin or swap him to Dogs. This allows us to get involved in all early deals for perhaps more players thrown in. We could get Frost or O'Rourke for nothing from GWS, a pick or player from Saints and a pick and player from Dogs. This is a great opportunity for us to act ruthlessly like a top club.

WtfTry again sweet dee. Your having a go at the kid for performing to the best of his ability and trying to impress not only melbourne but everyone around him. Good on him for not holding back we have a beauty on our hands. A kid that is absolutely driven to get the best out of himself and prove he has what it takes to play at AFL level. Regardless what pick it is he will be a fine player for the MFC. Poor form as usual by you.

Hi all. First time poster, long time reader and very long suffering member. Never posted before because I've never had anything of substance to add to the conversation. However, as I am Hobart based I sometimes hear snippets relevant to Tasmanian players. In relation to Chip, the message from this former Tasmanian player was that Chip in fact wanted to stay. It was actually our choice to send him on his way as we knew we'd see a high pick as compensation which could then be used as needed. Chip was apparently devastated by that decision. I have no way of verifying the veracity of the story but I can see some reason in it from the clubs perspective and it also provides a different view on Frawley and possibly some of the other social media posts by players. Read into this what you will it I just thought it was interesting and worth sharing with other tragics. PS I am a strong believer in both PJ and PR.

Yep. Can't believe animals like this are still free to roam in society. Rumour has it they were caged eggs. Not at my club, man, not at my club.

Hi Dees, The bomberblitz team extends its deepest condolences on the loss of a true legend of not only your club but the game itself. With your approval I would like both teams to wear black arm bands on Sunday as a mark of respect for Robbie Flower. Your thoughts? Cheers, Scotty