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2022 Trade Report Card

Demonland
Demonland
in Melbourne Demons

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11 minutes ago, Demonland said:

Kane weighs in. Dees from 5:38

 

Smart guy that Kane Cornes!!

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    3 hours ago, old55 said:

    D+ is very harsh on North. JHF decided to leave and they had to make the best of a bad lot like us with Jackson. They turned JHF into pick 2.

    Following that pick 1 into 3 and F1st is good dealing too if you don't want the player GWS does at 1, ie Cadman. You still get the 2 players you want and the F1st.

    They got a couple of handy players from Freo for their must-trade assistance picks, which is decent going with their coaching uncertainty.

    I thought North were a B-. The rating of D+ is a bit fanciful. They got rid of a problem child in JHF, and managed to get overs for him, and picked up Logue and Tucker, both of whom will be starting 22 players, and both are underrated. 

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    Geelong has gone and got a lot of new players which is going mean a lot of their other premiership players are going to be under the pump to get games. it will be interesting to see how many start to leave for other opportunities in the next few years.

     

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    Times have changed the former Fairfax flagship “The Melbourne Age” has now appeared to have shrunk into a scurrilous little rag of a newspaper. ‘With its AFL footy entity ‘Real Footy’ struggling for relevance. So much column space was devoted to the Cats’ trade week triumphs that as Chris Lamb suggested ‘everyone is going to Geelong’. Seems The Age’s relocation is also eminent. Along with Mark Corrigan and Daisy Pearce.


    It’s take on the Dees trade late period was rather trite with condescension suggesting the Demons rely on ‘the replacements’ and are now a ‘lost dogs home’  with the acquisition of the two former bullies. Trust it comes back to bite them at “The Geelong Age”.

    Of course cooler heads will await the longer term return rather than rush for the now gratification fix.

    Edited by Tarax Club
    Geelong’s pyramid scheme mummified

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    2 hours ago, Demonland said:

    Kane weighs in. Dees from 5:38

     

    Scathing of Norf

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    Certain teams were clearly tanking the trade period this year. So obvious. 

    Imv the fixture is going to cause a lot of controversy when its released. 

    Norf, Eagles, Hawks and Giants won 2 games between them in the last month of football and all of them have worst (or stagnant) lists heading into 2023. 

    Playing only 1 of them twice v playing 3/4 of them twice will be worth 2 to 3 wins, which is huge. 

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    23 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

     

    Bit like the VCE these days.......Nobody fails!

    Not true.  I've failed VCE students over the years.  This year I'm failing 2.

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    23 hours ago, george_on_the_outer said:

     

    Bit like the VCE these days.......Nobody fails!

    My son has to re-introduce himself to his teachers regularly. He’ll still pass with flying colours. 😂
     

    Just read Kat’s comment (above) and now I kinda feel bad. 😬 

    Edited by WalkingCivilWar

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    45 minutes ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

    Not true.  I've failed VCE students over the years.  This year I'm failing 2.

    What's the lowest passing score you can get?

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    On 10/13/2022 at 4:22 AM, old55 said:

    D+ is very harsh on North. JHF decided to leave and they had to make the best of a bad lot like us with Jackson. They turned JHF into pick 2.

    Following that pick 1 into 3 and F1st is good dealing too if you don't want the player GWS does at 1, ie Cadman. You still get the 2 players you want and the F1st.

    They got a couple of handy players from Freo for their must-trade assistance picks, which is decent going with their coaching uncertainty.

    I don't think King can get his head around future picks - the analysis reads as though the extra 2023 first rounder doesn't exist.

    I agree - 2, 3, F1 and Logue is a decent outcome for the Roos in the circumstances 

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    I think a grade of an A- is about right for the Demon's trade period.

    I admit to carrying on like a pork chop regarding the Luke Jackson trade. Like the rest of us I wanted a top 7 pick. But in the end, we did alright out of it with the Dockers, given the circumstances, and far better than the Bulldogs did losing Josh Dunkley to the Lions.

    As others have mentioned, you just gotta wait until the trade period is over to make a proper rational assessment.

    We are in good hands with Tim Lamb and the rest of the MFC list management team.

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    Unfortunately when a player is uncontracted then the club does not have the upper hand and has to accept less than they want for players and move on with other trades.

    Not many list managers have skills to do deals fast so they can get other deals done where the outcome is better.

    We did well with Brodie Grundy, Lachie Hunter and Josh Schache who are not out of their best window.

    In the end Pick 13 and 37 is good result for the club.

    Every one has lauded Geelong for getting Pick 7 but I don't believe they did so great with the personnel they got Tanner Bruhn 2 years in the system with most stats below-average, Ollie Henry 2 years in the system with most stats below-average and Jack Bowes 6 years in the system who played 5 games last year with most stats average and below-average for a middle of the table team and was on $800,000 per year, the premiers lost only Joel Selwood but are 1 year older the replacements they need in forward lines and rucks are older the midfield will depend on Dangerfield who has had injury riddled season lately where are the Cameron/Stengle/De Konig recruits of the previous years?

    Pick 7 may be a boom or a bust player since players rarely come to a club and perform straight away.

    Richmond on the other hand gained Jacob Hopper 7 years in the system with a injury riddled 2022 and Tim Taranto 6 years in the system with stats that are elite and above-averge, maybe they will have an injury free year for Martin and Pestia but they have no picks to speak of in the draft.

    Brisbane did well but some of the new recruits like Gunston who has a history of back troubles and Dunkley who threw a tantrum when he did not get enough midfield time the loss of McStay will only be known during the 2023 season, only time will tell.

    Collingwood have gained Daniel McStay, Tom Mitchell, Bobbie Hill and Billy Frampton, other than Mitchell none of the others have set the world on fire but I think the loss of Grundy is probably the worst decision they could have made, since Cameron and Cox are reasonable where as Grundy at his best is in AA class.

    Femantle may have sold the shop to get Jackson but got O'Meara for weets packets from Hawthorn, they also lost a forward and backup ruckman in Lobb, Acres, Tucker, Meek and Logue and have no picks in the draft until 30, Acres was given to Carlton for a future 3 round pick why?

    Sydney gained Francis from Essendon, did they improve?.

    I have watched football for over 70 years and I look forward to 2023 when the Demons get to raise the cup in the GF beating Richmond or Geelong.

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    I'm pretty happy with our overall result. I'm comfortable that we'll get the very best out of Gawn's intercepting and escape-option marking now that Grundy will be doing a lot of the roaming closer to the ball or mixed into general play. Lachie Hunter might prove to be a bigger pickup than the lack of fanfare suggests.

    I feel like we have actually reached the point where our only weak area on the field is the tall targets in the forward line. We can touch wood and hope for some return to form from Brown, return from injury for McDonald, and arrival on the scene from Van Rooyen.

    Meanwhile, with two first and two second round picks to work with in an allegedly deep 2023, plus Kynan Brown looking likely, that is going to be a fun draft session.

    Last I heard, Ben McKay is still a free agent for 2023, so it might also be possible to add a genuinely tall, genuinely contested-marking mature player to our group, which is always handy whether added to defence or swapped forward.

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    8 hours ago, Little Goffy said:

    feel like we have actually reached the point where our only weak area on the field is the tall targets in the forward line. We can touch wood and hope for some return to form from Brown, return from injury for McDonald, and arrival on the scene from Van Rooyen.

    Can a Wizard of Oz miracle take place on Schack who looks like the tin man (or the lion even).  If he acquired both traits he could be a massive gain. Mark Williams / Alan Richardson please weave your magic. 

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    On 10/14/2022 at 9:58 AM, layzie said:

    What's the lowest passing score you can get?

    You don't get scores per se in VCE, it's a ranking (confusing considering they call it a "study score").  If you are able to show in your outcomes that you know the content and can demonstrate the skills, you get a satisfactory outcome of an individual are of study.  For example if you get an ATAR of 85, it means you performed better than 85% of the state. A semester may have up to four areas of study - if you fail one you fail the semester - in Year 12 that means the whole year (you have to achieve a satisfactory for all areas of study to pass the subject.) You only get your VCE if you can pass 16 units across the two years. A unit is semester long, with Unit 3 (semester 1 in Year 12) being the rerequisite for Unit 4 (semester 2 in Year 12).  You can go unscored which means you still get your VCE, you just don't get an ATAR.

    Edited by Katrina Dee Fan

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    7 minutes ago, Demonland said:

    This was his reasoning when ask why the Dees got a D+

     

    These things are probably click bait at best.

    Funnily Cornes said we were second behind Geelong.

    If you analyse it, you would say Grundy is a better player than LJ atm, Hunter is better than anyone we lost and we got him for a steal, Schache who is bigger and more versatile than Weid, cost nothing and replaces Weid, who got us 37. We also added 2 first round picks.

    Not sure how that ends in a D+, but then again, who cares?

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    On 10/14/2022 at 5:07 PM, jamarkmywords said:

    ESPN have given us a D+ 

    https://www.espn.com.au/afl/story/_/id/34783902/afl-2022-trade-free-agency-draft-period-every-club-move-dealings-graded-rated

    Rated 3rd worst only ahead of GC (F) and GWS (E+)

    I hadn't seen that.

    How on earth could he land on a D+?

    His 'rationale' is ridiculously flawed. 

    Part of it is based on the fact we didn't get a top 10 pick in the Jackson trade. Sure we only got Freo's first round pick next season, and they are likely to finish inside the 8, so its not likely to be a top 10 pick.

    But they are not going to finish top 2 either, so if they don't make top 4 we'll still get a pick inside the top 15.

    In a supposedly rich draft (though surely that has to be the biggest myth in footy - the so called super drafts), in reality how different would say a pick 9 and pick 14 be? Particularly given that we will still be in the premiership window, in that draft range we will likely be looking to fill specific needs as opposed to best available.

    Hell, it's possible that even if we had a top 10 pick we will get the same player we have identified at 15. Taylor has shown that he doesn't follow the herd when it comes to draft order. 

    The same logic applies to our pick 13 in this year's draft. We are every chance of picking a player at 13 that draft watchers have say outside the top 20.

    And he completely ignores the fact we got the deal done early, which cleared the way to get the Grundy, and to a lesser extent the Hunter, deals done - and done in a way advantageous to us.

    Compare our approach to say that of the Pies, a club now paying part of the salary of two former players, with henry, which just created unnecessary angst.

    Or even Freo, who, for the second year in a row, jerked Lobb around before caving late and letting him go. How is jerking players around good for the current players, or for future trading?

    He gives the Hunter trade short thrift. The best thing he can say is we didn't have to offer much up to get him. But he completely ignores the fact that Hunter fills a clear need - an aerobic beast with good kicking skills who can play on the opposite wing to langers. Surely filling such a specific need deserves recognition - i mean doing so would be Lamb's KPI.

    He also gives short thrift to the fact that part of Hunter's salary will be covered, as will Grundy's.

    Bu the biggest flaw in his argument relates to Grundy. He reckons:

    'Brodie Grundy who comes in while undoubtedly a star ruckman, is also an ill-fitting piece and will likely relegate Max Gawn to playing predominantly as a key forward next season. The positive for Melbourne is Grundy only required pick 27 to acquire which is a bargain on paper. Collingwood will pay a portion of his contract which also helps, though with the size and length of his contract, it's a list flexibility killer that will make retaining existing talent and adding rival talent within the constraints of the salary cap in future years more challenging than would otherwise be the case.' 

    So much nonsense in that palaver its hard to know where to start, but here goes :

    • With Jackson bailing, we desperately needed a second ruck - and not just any sort of ruck; an athletic beast who can run all day. We snared a dual all Australian who has probably 5-6 years of top footy ahead of him and is probably one of the best athletes in the AFL. Given the market, how could we have possibly done better than Grundy?
    • An ill fitting piece? Huh? See above
    • Relegate Max to 'playing predominantly as a key forward next season'. Bollocks. It depends bit on what he means by 'predominately' i guess, but the club want to engineer a scenario where Maxy does less grunt work in the ruck and more time up forward (no doubt as part of a strategy to extend his career).
    • Wasn't he watching this season? That is exactly how we played Jackson and Maxy all season! Still, i'd be surprised if Maxy doesn't take at least 40% of ruck time
    • We are in the premiership window right now and Grundy increases our chance of winning a flag in the next 2-3 years - arguably even more so than Jackson
    • Which makes the comment about the size and length of his contract being a 'list flexibility killer' bizarre - we are paying Grundy less than we would have had to pay Jackson and we would have had to probably offer Jackson an even longer contract. And Grundy make it more likely we win a flag in the next two years to boot, IMO. 
    • Grundy's deal makes retaining 'existing talent' harder? Really?
    • Did he miss the memo that we have long terms deals signed with Tracc, Oliver, Gus, Salem, Viney and (i think) Maxy. Who else is realistically going to be hard to fit under our salary cap in the next 3 years or so? Kozzie perhaps, but i'd be shocked if we don't have the salary cap space to offer him a long term deal on competitive coin
    • 'adding rival talent within the constraints of the salary cap in future years more challenging than would otherwise be the case"?  - isn't that true of any quality player traded into a new club?
    • I mean, just one example is Jackson. I firmly believe he will be super star of the competition. But no-one could argue that he is at the moment. And it is very unlikely he will be for at least another 2-3 years (he has just turned 21 after all). Yet Freo have locked him in on a long term contract on serious coin. How are they going to go renegotiating Darcy's contract? Or Frederick's? How are they going to go next trading period bringing in a star with so much of their cap tied up with Jackson?
    • Freo are paying Jackson more that we are paying for Grundy. It's pretty clear in my mind who will be represent better value for money in the next 2-3 years - and it ain't the unicorn messiah!

    D+? 

    Sheesh.

     

    Edited by binman

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    I've said before on here that Knightmare is a horrible judge of talent and lacks any real feel or understanding for the game. He gets very little correct and when he does, it's because he covered every eventuality. 

    He's very dedicated but for a guy who puts in as much time as he does, the fact he doesn't have either a) a permanent reporting gig (ESPN just pay him per column) nor b) a role in AFL land, speaks for itself 

    Pay his semi literature rambling musings no mind 

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    1 hour ago, Demonland said:

    This was his reasoning when ask why the Dees got a D+

     

    Didn't he bake us for taking Jackson over Green in '19?

    Now 2 firsts and a second (whilst maintaining our own 1st & 2nd rd picks) is poor compensation for Jackson. 

    Nonsense.

    Edited by ChaserJ

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    1 hour ago, Demonland said:

    This was his reasoning when ask why the Dees got a D+

     

    Poor judge further proves his poverty.

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