Training - Monday, 17th June 2019

[Ugottobekidding 1,181]

At the moment we are a poorly coached side going nowhere.

[Wells 11 5,381]

9 hours ago, —coach— said:

Olympic park sports medicine based at AAMI park has sport psychology services, as I understand it a few of the players go there.

I wonder if you’re allowed to go as a depressed supporter? 

[binman 42,689]

37 minutes ago, Wells 11 said:

I wonder if you’re allowed to go as a depressed supporter? 

Most organizations have an EAP program.

Perhaps as part of our membership we could access to a Supporter Assistance Program. 

Very appropriate acronym too.

[TRIGON 4,783]

11 hours ago, monoccular said:

I have been on about that for years.  

As I understand we did have one (or maybe two) but ND didn't think we needed one and they were sacked.

Maybe if we did have one when Liam Jurrah was struggling things may have turned out differently?

I also understand that at least some other clubs do have these on their staff, though I am not sure which clubs these are.

It would be interesting if those that do are the successful ones.

LJ had a close relationship with the then player welfare manager. Neeld ousted the player welfare manager.  For LJ, things went south quickly afterwards. However, I’m not sure to what degree, if any, there was cause and effect.

[DemonOX 8,790]

21 minutes ago, TRIGON said:

LJ had a close relationship with the then player welfare manager. Neeld ousted the player welfare manager.  For LJ, things went south quickly afterwards. However, I’m not sure to what degree, if any, there was cause and effect.

Ah the pure mention of the name Neeld and I want to run over my neighbours cat. 

That name makes my skin crawl. ?

[Lucifers Hero 39,609]

9 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

I have already reported about the issue with the goal kicking, as McCartney said 'over thinking' it

Short memories on here again, Tommy Mc couldn't miss last yeat, it will sort itself out

They have set a high standard at training, obviously in Macca's eyes, didn't reach it today

Goodwin has been saying similar:  the goals will come.  Macca seems to be saying set shot kicking accuracy will come when players stop thinking about it.  Rather than wait till things sort themselves out I wonder what are we doing to make them happen?   I'm keeping the faith but those comments do not fill me with confidence.  

The yips for goal has little to do with our fitness or injury problems.  We've had all year to solve the goal kicking yips be they physical, technique or head related.   I see little progress after 12 games.

At the end of the day actions speak louder than words. 

Edited June 17, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[Superunknown 4,214]

14 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

And yes, when it comes to game day you have to be in your routine and in a clear head space. Focusing on technique never works, just ask any golfer. The focus has to be on the routine which should be a series of mental and physical processes. 

Exactly this.

My golf routine is the same even when I am smashing balls down the paddock.

[Laughing Goat 308]

3 hours ago, Ugottobekidding said:

At the moment we are a poorly coached side going nowhere.

Agree with this post.....pretty simple really.

No balance with our team, playing unfit & selfish players & a side that can't convert opportunities.

Play the kids & bring on 2020.

[Earl Hood 6,082]

1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Goodwin has been saying similar:  the goals will come.  Macca seems to be saying set shot kicking accuracy will come when players stop thinking about it.  Rather than wait till things sort themselves out I wonder what are we doing to make them happen?   I'm keeping the faith but those comments do not fill me with confidence.  

The yips for goal has little to do with our fitness or injury problems.  We've had all year to solve the goal kicking yips be they physical, technique or head related.   I see little progress after 12 games.

At the end of the day actions speak louder than words. 

I am wondering if goal kicking issues became a major focus in their post match analyses and attempts to rectify the problem have proved counterproductive to the point where last week we had players passing off (e.g. Jeffy, Oliver) when they were within their normal range? It seemed to me the problem had spread through out the team last week. So now the strategy is to stop talking about it and take the pressure off. 

[FireInTheBennelly 4,072]

Yep sounds like the old ignore it and it'll go away trick.

What could possibly go wrong?

[Brownie 5,969]

2 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Goodwin has been saying similar:  the goals will come.  Macca seems to be saying set shot kicking accuracy will come when players stop thinking about it.  Rather than wait till things sort themselves out I wonder what are we doing to make them happen?   I'm keeping the faith but those comments do not fill me with confidence.  

The yips for goal has little to do with our fitness or injury problems.  We've had all year to solve the goal kicking yips be they physical, technique or head related.   I see little progress after 12 games.

At the end of the day actions speak louder than words. 

Years ago I saw a keynote by Lawrie Lawrence. His talk was all about preparation (and practice practice practice).

He told an amazing story about the 2000 Olympics. The one athlete with more weight on their shoulders than any other was Cathy Freeman.

She was expected to bring home the gold in athletics for Australia. The pressure on her was immense.

Lawrie said that the reason she did this so successfully and that the pressure didn't crush her (I.e. don't think about it) was preparation.

She practiced and practiced her whole routine so often that by the time she walked into that stadium, she was on auto pilot.

You must be prepared at an elite level.

So you gotta wonder why we are taking this so casually.

If this is match day simulation, then they should be putting blokes on the mark and simulating the whole thing over and over until it's just a routine on match day. And..  coaches are there to correct and coach along the way.

We seem to be more Krygious than Freeman

[Sorry kids 635]

I hate to say it but I conclude a lot of our players are just happy being AFL players. That was their ambition and now they are living the dream, being well looked after financially, enjoying there time with their mates at the Club and the minor celebrity that goes with it. This goal kicking issue shows no one is really pressuring them to get better in the way a professional athlete should and the way players of similar ability at other Clubs do. 

[Moonshadow 17,675]

12 hours ago, Earl Hood said:

On the contrary I can understand where he is coming from. If you keep concentrating on trying to fix a problem with your technique it may just get worse as you over analyse the mechanics of kicking a ball straight. A lot of advice to cure the putting yips in golf does not involve the mechanics of the swing but rather what’s going on in your mind when you line up. 

Should we start dribbling the ball along the ground towards goal?!!

[ManDee 7,126]

36 minutes ago, Sorry kids said:

I hate to say it but I conclude a lot of our players are just happy being AFL players. That was their ambition and now they are living the dream, being well looked after financially, enjoying there time with their mates at the Club and the minor celebrity that goes with it. This goal kicking issue shows no one is really pressuring them to get better in the way a professional athlete should and the way players of similar ability at other Clubs do. 

SK you make sweeping statements with little or no real knowledge and then respond poorly when found out. I put it to you that someone is pressuring them to get better.

[Bossdog 2,002]

It's all in the mind......If you were kicking to a mate 40m away 9 times out of ten you would get the ball to him....But put a set of goal post in there ........and the pressure comes on....Ignore the post and just kick to a person or target in the crowd.    It always worked for me.

[old dee 23,782]

5 hours ago, binman said:

Most organizations have an EAP program.

Perhaps as part of our membership we could access to a Supporter Assistance Program. 

Very appropriate acronym too.

The club would go broke subsidising it binman.

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,778]

1 hour ago, Sorry kids said:

I hate to say it but I conclude a lot of our players are just happy being AFL players. 

And more than satisfied beating bottom sides:

Any surprise we haven't won since, with these ludicrous celebrations.

[old dee 23,782]

2 minutes ago, Bossdog said:

It's all in the mind......If you were kicking to a mate 40m away 9 times out of ten you would get the ball to him....But put a set of goal post in there ........and the pressure comes on....Ignore the post and just kick to a person or target in the crowd.    It always worked for me.

Hi BD I have not seen you for a while, good to hear from you.

[daisycutter 29,604]

1 minute ago, Bossdog said:

It's all in the mind......If you were kicking to a mate 40m away 9 times out of ten you would get the ball to him....But put a set of goal post in there ........and the pressure comes on....Ignore the post and just kick to a person or target in the crowd.    It always worked for me.

always? you must have been a gun ?

[old dee 23,782]

31 minutes ago, ManDee said:

SK you make sweeping statements with little or no real knowledge and then respond poorly when found out. I put it to you that someone is pressuring them to get better.

Serious comment MD. They should change the people involved because it ain't working.

[At the break of Gawn 4,460]

The problem with “free style set shot kicking” is that it doesn’t recreate a real-game situation. As all scientists know, in order to prove something you have to recreate the conditions as much as possible.

What’s severely lacking with their goal kicking practice is the “social pressure”. That is, when a player misses a shot he feels the social shame from the crowd, his team, his opponents. With free style goal kicking practice, there’s no one really watching them if they miss.

A good exercise to do would be to allow only one person kicking for a goal at any particular time, with one person on the mark, and the rest of his team mates watching him. Also, some form of consequence needs to occur if they miss. Making everyone do push-ups won’t work as the sports scientists will go nuts, but I’m sure they could think of something internally. Utilising the above steps would emulate the social pressure more and allow them to get used to the feeling and feel much more conditioned in real-match situations.

 

[ProperDee 1,698]

1 hour ago, Bossdog said:

It's all in the mind......If you were kicking to a mate 40m away 9 times out of ten you would get the ball to him....But put a set of goal post in there ........and the pressure comes on....Ignore the post and just kick to a person or target in the crowd.    It always worked for me.

Absolutely right BD. I was always taught to pick out somebody behind the goals and kick the ball to them. I wouldn't say it always worked but it was something to fix on other than a space between the posts.

[3183 Dee 2,853]

2 hours ago, Sorry kids said:

I hate to say it but I conclude a lot of our players are just happy being AFL players. That was their ambition and now they are living the dream, being well looked after financially, enjoying there time with their mates at the Club and the minor celebrity that goes with it. This goal kicking issue shows no one is really pressuring them to get better in the way a professional athlete should and the way players of similar ability at other Clubs do. 

I’m not sure about the last bit, but I’m afraid I tend to agree with the first bit. I cringe at the thought of the upcoming Inside Melbourne podcast, which will be run by the players during Player Takeover Week. I’m all for mixing things up and having a bit of a laugh, but not sure that this is the right moment!

[Lucifers Hero 39,609]

2 hours ago, At the break of Gawn said:

The problem with “free style set shot kicking” is that it doesn’t recreate a real-game situation. As all scientists know, in order to prove something you have to recreate the conditions as much as possible.

What’s severely lacking with their goal kicking practice is the “social pressure”. That is, when a player misses a shot he feels the social shame from the crowd, his team, his opponents. With free style goal kicking practice, there’s no one really watching them if they miss.

A good exercise to do would be to allow only one person kicking for a goal at any particular time, with one person on the mark, and the rest of his team mates watching him. Also, some form of consequence needs to occur if they miss. Making everyone do push-ups won’t work as the sports scientists will go nuts, but I’m sure they could think of something internally. Utilising the above steps would emulate the social pressure more and allow them to get used to the feeling and feel much more conditioned in real-match situations.

As well as social pressure, simulate game condition during practice:  eg Run around the oval, do a few tackles and sprints to be fatigued.   Have massive crowd noise blaring thru loud speakers.  Put half a dozen players on the mark.  A few more players in the goal square (especially for Max who can't get it thru within 30m).  Pretend it is after the final siren to win the game. 

Edited June 18, 2019 by Lucifer's Hero

[bing181 9,194]

4 hours ago, old dee said:

Serious comment MD. They should change the people involved because it ain't working.

The problem with this is the underlying assumption that you can take ANY player, and whatever their shortcomings, it's down to the coaches or the staff or the Board or even the CEO.

Sometimes it's just because the players aren't very good.