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Tha fact that Carlton only offered up chump change draft picks at trade should be ringing alarm bells for you Mr Martin. 

They don’t rate you much. 

 

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13 hours ago, manny100 said:

HUN article quoting Martins manager stating that there are many ways to structure a contract to scare off rivals. By rivals he means Ds and GC. The article then talks of first season at $800k plus that the Ds would not match given he would request a trade after the first season. The article actually says 'would request a trade after the first season.

You cannot get much more blatant draft tampering than those sorts of plans. I would say the Ds would be seeking clarification from the AFL. The AFL would need to step in to stop this. If not this could happen on a regular basis. It will scare clubs into accepting low ball offers for out of contract players or risk losing them for nothing in the PSD via dodgy structured contracts and the threat of walking out after one season if drafted by the non preferred club.

If the AFL allows a dodgy contract to stand  then I doubt we will draft him.

 

My understanding is that a player can not nominate a salary that is front loaded. It’s a number x number of years. 
 

He could still potentially say 1 year 800k and have an in Gentleman’s  agreement with thE Blues, but that puts both parties in very vulnerable positions.

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I'd like to take him if we can grab him. If we're able to reach 2018 form, he might discover a desire to succeed to match his talent.

If not, I'm all for driving up his price as high as possible with threats to take him in the the PSD. The more Carlton have to fork out the better.

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I believe it is worth taking a stand with Green and Martin.

If you look at what it costs, I dont believe it is as high as the message it sends to other clubs. It is also worth considering which players would you make such a big play for? Green and Martin will be probably very very good. For me the benefits easily outweigh the risks.

 

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38 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

Got a link pls?

Incorrect info deleted. 

Edited by McQueen

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Its nearly worth taking him just to give Carlton the s**ts.....Collingwood or Richmond wouldn't hesitate, why are we so damn nice??

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Given the AFL’s penchant for manipulating outcomes, I’d be amazed if they didn’t orchestrate matters so that GCS get to pick him and the AFL protects their downside risk (e.g juicy FA compo pick).

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16 hours ago, manny100 said:

HUN article quoting Martins manager stating that there are many ways to structure a contract to scare off rivals. By rivals he means Ds and GC. The article then talks of first season at $800k plus that the Ds would not match given he would request a trade after the first season. The article actually says 'would request a trade after the first season.

You cannot get much more blatant draft tampering than those sorts of plans. I would say the Ds would be seeking clarification from the AFL. The AFL would need to step in to stop this. If not this could happen on a regular basis. It will scare clubs into accepting low ball offers for out of contract players or risk losing them for nothing in the PSD via dodgy structured contracts and the threat of walking out after one season if drafted by the non preferred club.

If the AFL allows a dodgy contract to stand  then I doubt we will draft him.

 

Dover's got a history of this.

In the lead up to the 2012 mini draft this is from an article in relation to Martin nominating for the mini draft.  I'd like to know Jason's thoughts on the 'wrong club' and the 'right environment':

It is a system that Martin's manager, Jason Dover, said could work for the teenager if he is recruited into the right environment.

However, it is possible he would remain in WA for the first 12 months of any deal if that didn't happen.

"We need to make a decision by Wednesday as to whether Jack nominates or not and part of that decision is weighting up which clubs are likely to figure for this," Dover told AFL.com.au. 

"If it looks like the deal is done with the wrong club and we don't believe it would be best for Jack's development, then there is every chance that he'll stay in WA for that 12 months.
 
"Having a year in the system and developing a lot of the positive habits would be perfect for him in the right environment and with the right plan around him.

"I can see it working really well for a player like Jack, it's just trying to get him into the right environment."

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8 minutes ago, ChaserJ said:

Dover's got a history of this.

In the lead up to the 2012 mini draft this is from an article in relation to Martin nominating for the mini draft.  I'd like to know Jason's thoughts on the 'wrong club' and the 'right environment':

It is a system that Martin's manager, Jason Dover, said could work for the teenager if he is recruited into the right environment.

However, it is possible he would remain in WA for the first 12 months of any deal if that didn't happen.

"We need to make a decision by Wednesday as to whether Jack nominates or not and part of that decision is weighting up which clubs are likely to figure for this," Dover told AFL.com.au. 

"If it looks like the deal is done with the wrong club and we don't believe it would be best for Jack's development, then there is every chance that he'll stay in WA for that 12 months.
 
"Having a year in the system and developing a lot of the positive habits would be perfect for him in the right environment and with the right plan around him.

"I can see it working really well for a player like Jack, it's just trying to get him into the right environment."

A.r.r.o.g.a.n.t.

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12 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Check his instagram

I'm looking at his IG now, and see absolutely nothing wrong with it.  Is there more than one account?

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1 hour ago, hardtack said:

I'm looking at his IG now, and see absolutely nothing wrong with it.  Is there more than one account?

The awful tattoos, the outfits, the friendships with Bugg’s mate who runs the influencer business, the entire look of the bloke is off. 

Edit: talking Murray not Martin if there’s confusion 

Edited by DeeSpencer
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33 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

The awful tattoos, the outfits, the friendships with Bugg’s mate who runs the influencer business, the entire look of the bloke is off. 

Edit: talking Murray not Martin if there’s confusion 

That stuff doesn't bother me.  As long as he has learned his lesson re drugs and footy not mixing, I don't care who his mates are or how he dresses or the fact that he has poor taste in tats.  I just look at a guy like Dustin Martin (or even Marlion Pickett) and see how he has straightened himself out and become a better footballer as well as a better person, and see no reason why Murray, who possibly(?) has a less checkered past, couldn't take the chance to prove himself.  Personally, I hope we go for him.

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1 hour ago, hardtack said:

That stuff doesn't bother me.  As long as he has learned his lesson re drugs and footy not mixing, I don't care who his mates are or how he dresses or the fact that he has poor taste in tats.  I just look at a guy like Dustin Martin (or even Marlion Pickett) and see how he has straightened himself out and become a better footballer as well as a better person, and see no reason why Murray, who possibly(?) has a less checkered past, couldn't take the chance to prove himself.  Personally, I hope we go for him.

I have a tattoo of a cat on my right forearm............ (if you want to know why, just ask)

I used to hate the bloody things and thought anyone who had them was a [censored]. Changed my tune obviously.

Couldnt agree more with your post hardtack. If he has learned his lesson, and will make us a better team, i say we give him a shot. Guy can obviously football, so if he is available and "reformed" its still a win as long as he isnt a toxic personality.

The "nice guy" personality has had its time. If this bloke gets us closer to a premiership just get him. Everyone deserves a second chance.... even druggies.......... ESPECIALLY druggies. If i never talked to the in-laws of mine who have dabbled, i wouldnt speak to any of them. I mightnt be so up-tight if i'd tried a bit more myself.

I just want our club to be winner on field. Does that make me bad? 

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1 hour ago, hardtack said:

That stuff doesn't bother me.  As long as he has learned his lesson re drugs and footy not mixing, I don't care who his mates are or how he dresses or the fact that he has poor taste in tats.  I just look at a guy like Dustin Martin (or even Marlion Pickett) and see how he has straightened himself out and become a better footballer as well as a better person, and see no reason why Murray, who possibly(?) has a less checkered past, couldn't take the chance to prove himself.  Personally, I hope we go for him.

This should all be moved to the Murray thread but anyway....I know I'm being hypocritical because Gawn has a hipster beard, Harmes has crap tatts and Bugg dated and mixed with influencers, but I just don't like the vibe at all.

If you got busted for drugs and wanted to get away from that scene would you immerse yourself with an influencer/fashion/sneakers friendship group? When I think of people who don't mix drugs it's not the crowd I'm think of.

Dusty has been at Richmond since he was 18 and football - being damn good at it - and the Tigers are part of him, he's shown he can play AFL footy and do what he does in his spare time. Marlion Pickett's been back on the right path for years and has a family to take care of. Similarly someone like Sydney Stack can be drafted at 18 and put on the right path.

Can you play AFL footy and be acting like this - absolutely. But I'd want to see some serious proof of dedication because it doesn't even look like you're trying to impress clubs.

 

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6 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

This should all be moved to the Murray thread but anyway....I know I'm being hypocritical because Gawn has a hipster beard, Harmes has crap tatts and Bugg dated and mixed with influencers, but I just don't like the vibe at all.

If you got busted for drugs and wanted to get away from that scene would you immerse yourself with an influencer/fashion/sneakers friendship group? When I think of people who don't mix drugs it's not the crowd I'm think of.

Dusty has been at Richmond since he was 18 and football - being damn good at it - and the Tigers are part of him, he's shown he can play AFL footy and do what he does in his spare time. Marlion Pickett's been back on the right path for years and has a family to take care of. Similarly someone like Sydney Stack can be drafted at 18 and put on the right path.

Can you play AFL footy and be acting like this - absolutely. But I'd want to see some serious proof of dedication because it doesn't even look like you're trying to impress clubs.

 

What a bunch of poseur clowns. Which one is Murray, anyway? 

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7 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

This should all be moved to the Murray thread but anyway....I know I'm being hypocritical because Gawn has a hipster beard, Harmes has crap tatts and Bugg dated and mixed with influencers, but I just don't like the vibe at all.

If you got busted for drugs and wanted to get away from that scene would you immerse yourself with an influencer/fashion/sneakers friendship group? When I think of people who don't mix drugs it's not the crowd I'm think of.

Dusty has been at Richmond since he was 18 and football - being damn good at it - and the Tigers are part of him, he's shown he can play AFL footy and do what he does in his spare time. Marlion Pickett's been back on the right path for years and has a family to take care of. Similarly someone like Sydney Stack can be drafted at 18 and put on the right path.

Can you play AFL footy and be acting like this - absolutely. But I'd want to see some serious proof of dedication because it doesn't even look like you're trying to impress clubs.

 

Whole lotta TOOL TOOLS

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7 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

This should all be moved to the Murray thread but anyway....I know I'm being hypocritical because Gawn has a hipster beard, Harmes has crap tatts and Bugg dated and mixed with influencers, but I just don't like the vibe at all.

If you got busted for drugs and wanted to get away from that scene would you immerse yourself with an influencer/fashion/sneakers friendship group? When I think of people who don't mix drugs it's not the crowd I'm think of.

Dusty has been at Richmond since he was 18 and football - being damn good at it - and the Tigers are part of him, he's shown he can play AFL footy and do what he does in his spare time. Marlion Pickett's been back on the right path for years and has a family to take care of. Similarly someone like Sydney Stack can be drafted at 18 and put on the right path.

Can you play AFL footy and be acting like this - absolutely. But I'd want to see some serious proof of dedication because it doesn't even look like you're trying to impress clubs.

 

Just checked out his Instagram.

3 of the first 5 posts are videos of him working his [censored] off in the gym or at the beach. Yeah, he might have been a duckhead in the recent past, but the bloke obviously wants to succeed. i say we take a chance. The reward could be enormous.

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9 minutes ago, ding said:

Just checked out his Instagram.

3 of the first 5 posts are videos of him working his [censored] off in the gym or at the beach. Yeah, he might have been a duckhead in the recent past, but the bloke obviously wants to succeed. i say we take a chance. The reward could be enormous.

My main concern is the reward probably wouldn't be enormous. There's plenty of other speedy back flankers with dodgy kicks in the draft, pick up one of them up at 18 and put years of skill development in to them. We could've traded a 4th round pick for Richo's favourite Dan McKenzie or asked Richmond for Oleg Markov. That's about the level of footballer I see Murray as now that he's missed 18 months.

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2 hours ago, hardtack said:

That stuff doesn't bother me.  As long as he has learned his lesson re drugs and footy not mixing, I don't care who his mates are or how he dresses or the fact that he has poor taste in tats.  I just look at a guy like Dustin Martin (or even Marlion Pickett) and see how he has straightened himself out and become a better footballer as well as a better person, and see no reason why Murray, who possibly(?) has a less checkered past, couldn't take the chance to prove himself.  Personally, I hope we go for him.

 

It might not, but it should in my opinion.

 

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Just now, DeeSpencer said:

My main concern is the reward probably wouldn't be enormous. There's plenty of other speedy back flankers with dodgy kicks in the draft, pick up one of them up at 18 and put years of skill development in to them. We could've traded a 4th round pick for Richo's favourite Dan McKenzie or asked Richmond for Oleg Markov. That's about the level of footballer I see Murray as now that he's missed 18 months.

Yeah i get it D.S. He could be a bust. So could anyone we draft. At least the boke has some exposed form. Risk v Reward i guess.

Im just jaded by MFC playing it safe. Time to take some risks imo.

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7 hours ago, Lord Travis said:

He’s not a free agent, therefore hasn’t earns the right to choose a club and only play for that club. He must enter the national draft or preseason draft, which means he’s up for grabs from whichever club drafts him.

If he elects a club and refuses to join that club, he sits out of playing AFL. Anything else is draft tampering.
 

The AFL need to get involved here or it breaks the rules they’ve created, sets a precedent and changes the landscape in a negative way. 

I distinctly recall this scenario when the talk was that we would pick Luke Ball when he was available on draft night and we called Luke.......................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Tapscott

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1 minute ago, jnrmac said:

I distinctly recall this scenario when the talk was that we would pick Luke Ball when he was available on draft night and we called Luke.......................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Tapscott

And look how that worked out for us. Ball wound up a premiership midfielder. Tapscott was delisted within a few years. Let’s not repeat the mistake by drafting a low percentage kid instead of proven AFL quality.

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3 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

The awful tattoos, the outfits, the friendships with Bugg’s mate who runs the influencer business, the entire look of the bloke is off. 

Edit: talking Murray not Martin if there’s confusion 

Gotta move with times Dee S.

MFC could benefit from a few influencers. Hell the Saudis just hired a bundle of them to plug the new tourist visas to Saudi which could be an even harder sell than the MFC

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the MFC need to make a stand and Take him , you think collingwood wouldnt ?  even carlton would if it was a player we wanted 

bloody hell freo did it to us ? 

time to grow some balls and say enough is enough. if he is the best at pick 2 then we take him 

 

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