Changes for Round 3

[DeeSpencer 23,689]

Howe needs to go back up forward. Back to where we drafted him for and back where he actually plays the position well. Thought they would have put him forward this year considering Hogan and Watts are up there with Garlett and Frost aswell. Disappointing we continue to use him as a defender when he isn't a defenders [censored].

In 2013 Howe kicked 28 goals so its pretty much a 30 goal year 3rd forward. At his best we all know he can be a damaging forward. Drop Dawes and put Howe up forward. I reckon he would benefit hugely with Hogan Watts Frost and JKH Garlett buzzing around his feet.

Nope. How many of those goals came against GWS anyway. He's a defender. A damn good one as he showed last week. He was well tagged by Palmer and he wasn't at his best. Hardly a surprise 2nd up without any preseason games.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,486]

Howe needs to go back up forward. Back to where we drafted him for and back where he actually plays the position well. Thought they would have put him forward this year considering Hogan and Watts are up there with Garlett and Frost aswell. Disappointing we continue to use him as a defender when he isn't a defenders [censored].

In 2013 Howe kicked 28 goals so its pretty much a 30 goal year 3rd forward. At his best we all know he can be a damaging forward. Drop Dawes and put Howe up forward. I reckon he would benefit hugely with Hogan Watts Frost and JKH Garlett buzzing around his feet.

If people think Howe is lazy as a backman they have forgotten how lazy he was as a forward. There is a lot of people with itchy trigger fingers here. He looked excellent last week with the right application.

[watchtheeyes 1,320]

Glad a few have pointed out his limitations as a forward, just because he was capable of taking a pretty grab does not mean he was a quality forward. He's a back for me, he just needs to work harder.

[3Dee 1,153]

And I'd bring in Bail simply for his speed and run,

just like in the NAB Essendon game?

[jimcor 212]

Given the incredible variation in the performance and result from last week, could it be something simple like our inability to respond to changing circumstances I.e. a lack of intelligent on-field leadership with leadership not just being about being amongst the hardest triers? I wonder if we travel OK out of the middle when Jamar is winning and we are roving to his taps however when he is not winning we fail to start roving to the oppositions's taps when they are winning the ruck duels. If this is part of the problem, then that's not just about effort, it's also a lot about leadership (by players & coaches) and coaching.

[monoccular 16,695]

I am just hoping to hear that there was some food poisoning, gastro or 'flu going around.

That could provide the only possible explanation for the fade out, other than laziness and / or complacency after a good start.

Sadly I suspect the latter.

And for those who are bagging Nathan Jones - the poor bugger has carried the midfield for years. He can be allowed one occasional downer. Pity the others didn't / couldn't / would't stand up.

Is Howe doing a Frawley? Didn't see the game at all (thank my lucky stars) but by all accounts he showed as much interest as Frawley did last season. If we find alternatives, which we couldn't last year with JF, then IMO Roos should tell him, sign up or play Casey. Its not as if we are finals bound, despite some of us sentimentalists just starting to dream a little after round 1. We are still developing and need to work on building a line up for the next few years. If he won't commit, why should we retard another's development?

Edited April 12, 2015 by monoccular

[What 18,810]

Our - Dawes

In - JKH

[Willmoy1947 3,871]

Does anyone think that Dawes and Vince were not accepted as well back into a winning side as what was generally thought.

A similar situation was noticed at Sydney and resolved....

[Deespicable 2,574]

The main issue from the game, which has been correctly pointed out is that after the first term, we were smashed at the stoppages and that made us look slow because we were chasing rather than doing like last week.

So I would suspect the only major restructuring this week will be figuring out how to fix the stoppage issue.

And there won't be too many switches there because our two best players from last year - Jones and Tyson - were the main culprits if you like and they have countless credits.

I'd suspect Jonesy was ill or tight, or like us, allowed himself to dream of better days.

Unless he has the dreaded OP which I doubt given his training, he will be back working his butt off in Adelaide.

One of only two switches that I see is deciding whether against Adelaide we can back Jamar to last the whole game against Jacobs, or whether he feels he needs to have another bull - Spencer.

If he goes Spencil and Jamar, then Frost either drops out or gets sent to defence - that's why we recruited him after all.

Another option to this is that Roosy could just drop Jamar and back Spencer's greater endurance (but less reliable tapwork) and retain Frost as the second ruck.

Our defenders have to be looked at a little - McDonald's hot form means he will go to Tex, but can Dunny cope with Jenkins' height. Isn't Jenkins the perfect match-up for Frost. It could be that Frost is sent back and Garland is unluckily squeezed out. Given Garland's Rd 1 form, that would be a huge call and Lynch does appear a perfect match up for him. But Howey or Dunn could go to him.

The other selection issue is that JKH had a blinder in our shock win in Adelaide last year and he must be a huge chance of a recall.

The question is for who though - almost impossible to gauge that which is why it may not happen unless there is a genuine injury.

The Adelaide win last year is a reminder that we actually match up better with them and hopefully Brodie Smith is out because he provides so much of their drive out of defence.

I'd expect Viney to go to Sloane and Cross to Dangerfield, but it may be the other way around. Jetta will have Betts like last year, Salem will have to take Douglas or Cameron.

The key in my view is having Tyson, Jones and Vince playing like in 2014 - if they do we could pull off another Adelaide Oval upset.

The second key is that going big up forward can be a huge advantage but it also requires the third and fourth tall - Watts and Frost and Vandenberg - to create match-up havoc. That didn't happen at all against GWS.

While I know there will be heaps of calls for change and yes, I accept that Dawesy didn't provide the strong long outlet that he needs to, but I reckon we may end up making only the one. In Spencer. Out Frost.

If Jones is injured, then JKH will come in as the sub.

[titan_uranus 23,250]

If people think Howe is lazy as a backman they have forgotten how lazy he was as a forward. There is a lot of people with itchy trigger fingers here. He looked excellent last week with the right application.

Agreed. His drive off half-back last week was huge for us.

[Demon Stalwart 255]

My thoughts are is the problem with having Dawes in is he isn't producing and when he is in the team our players go looking for him as a key forward

He wasn't in the first game and look at the avenues to goal we created , this last game that wasn't bought into play

I was happy when we got Dawes , but now I'm begging to understand why it didn't worry Collingwood losing him all that much

I believe he has the ability to dominate but he doesn't, unfortunately for us.

Edited April 12, 2015 by Demon Stalwart

[dazzledavey36 49,826]

Cannot believe people are now starting to wake up and realize why Collingwood laughed at us when we went so hard for Dawes.

While we need to continue to add classy midfielders there is a kid by the name of Josh Schache from the Murray Bushrangers who trained with us earlier this year who i hope we really consider. 199cm lead up CHF who also can take a big pack mark.

In saying that i just heard Jay Clark mention that Carlton could be targeting Jeremy McGoven from West Coast. I hope we are too.

[WhyAlwaysMe 237]

the balance of our side is all wrong, even in our win round 1 we were not able to clamp down we simply outscored GC in a high scoring game especially for us. with the new talent to the side this year we will be able to carry players who occasionally turn the ball over but can keep the game tight, we need at least an additional 2 players of the like of McKenzie, Riley, Grimes, Bail. these type players help our quality midfielders gain more & better access.

We don't have any quality outside pace not already in the team so forget about that (maybe JKH).

Between Dawes Frost AVB Watts Hogan only 3 can play in 1 side.

Howe would be an outstanding sub, very athletic would be hard for tired opponents to deal with.

Spencer & Gawn are not good enough & can't help us Jamar will have to carry the load, Mummy & Sandilands will beat everyone, he'll be ok against the rest.

Cross needs to be put on notice,if he's not working hard every contest & leading by example then he is just taking up list space.

Dawes & Lumumba are playing very predictable & the opposition aren't buying it, go back to basics.

[Henrietta Lumbago 331]

Brayshaw not to be sub.

Adelaide will play fast football, JKH probably had his best game for us last year against Adelaide

JKH in, Garland out

Newton sub

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,486]

JKH and Michie in

Garland and Vandenberg out

Frost to go back.

Brayshaw to start. Kent as sub.

I want to see Toumpas have a solid 3 weeks at VFL level before considered rather than him drift in and out of the side.

Edited April 12, 2015 by big_red_fire_engine

[titan_uranus 23,250]

JKH and Michie in

Garland and Vandenberg out

Frost to go back.

In this situation you'd have McDonald, Dunn and Frost playing key back positions, so I assume you're relying on Dawes to do the relief ruck work?

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,486]

In this situation you'd have McDonald, Dunn and Frost playing key back positions, so I assume you're relying on Dawes to do the relief ruck work?

Frost can swap in when Jenkins does. Jacobs takes the majority of ruck work.

[whatwhat say what 20,448]

don't mind that henrietta.

i think one thing that really stuck out is that we don't have anything like enough numbers rotating thru midfield. admittedly gws are a bit of a rarity in that they effectively roll over half their side throughout the midfield - ward, shiel, treloar, greene, griffen, coniglio, whitfield, kelly, smth, palmer, he who will not be named, plus mummy in the ruck.

by comparison i'd say we had seven or eight midfielders yesterday - jones, tyson, viney, cross, vince, newton, lumumba, brayshaw, plus jamar in the ruck.

if probably left us quite top-heavy down back - mcdonald, dunn, garland and howe all 'play tall', so their 3's and 4's - which would be most side's 5's and 6's - were able to roll up even more effectively as they were so dominant winning contested ball.

we desperately need toumpas to actually come on as part of the midfield rotation, plus the likes of trengove and petracca to recover from injury going forward.

adelaide don't bat as deep in the middle as gws, and also play more 'standard' 3 and 4 forwards - walker and lynch as 1 and 2, plus jenkins makes them more typically 'tall' down forward, with betts also effectively a key forward, albeit a small one. mcdonald and dunn take the first two, garland the third, and jetta gets betts. that allows howe to rotate on / off the 5 / 6 and play the sweeper role that suits him so well.

i don't think we'll see massive changes this week.

my best guess:

IN: jkh

OUT: vandenberg

sub: kent

[angrydee 842]

The main changes needed are attitude, application and effort

[WhyAlwaysMe 237]

The main changes needed are attitude, application and effort

you sound like Roos in a presser, just dribbles on about effort, funny how we were beaten in the same areas last 3 against GWS, not out coached just need more effort, try harder, we don't have enough talent not to give 100% effort

[Demonsone 1,743]

A lot of posters are having a crack at Dawes & Vince, both had good form in the preseason & Casey ......Need to look further into the players mindset after 1/2 time...

[WhyAlwaysMe 237]

A lot of posters are having a crack at Dawes & Vince, both had good form in the preseason & Casey ......Need to look further into the players mindset after 1/2 time...

i dont see Casey games Dawes should be able to take 12 marks & kick 5 goals at that level Vince 35p's 10 clearances. and do it easily, did this happen?

[dazzledavey36 49,826]

A lot of posters are having a crack at Dawes & Vince, both had good form in the preseason & Casey ......Need to look further into the players mindset after 1/2 time...

Dawes didn't even play at Casey which he should have. Came in on the back of an ordinary nab challange.

Vince needed the blowout? Did he need another week at Casey? Probably.

[Henrietta Lumbago 331]

don't mind that henrietta.

i think one thing that really stuck out is that we don't have anything like enough numbers rotating thru midfield. admittedly gws are a bit of a rarity in that they effectively roll over half their side throughout the midfield - ward, shiel, treloar, greene, griffen, coniglio, whitfield, kelly, smth, palmer, he who will not be named, plus mummy in the ruck.

by comparison i'd say we had seven or eight midfielders yesterday - jones, tyson, viney, cross, vince, newton, lumumba, brayshaw, plus jamar in the ruck.

if probably left us quite top-heavy down back - mcdonald, dunn, garland and howe all 'play tall', so their 3's and 4's - which would be most side's 5's and 6's - were able to roll up even more effectively as they were so dominant winning contested ball.

we desperately need toumpas to actually come on as part of the midfield rotation, plus the likes of trengove and petracca to recover from injury going forward.

adelaide don't bat as deep in the middle as gws, and also play more 'standard' 3 and 4 forwards - walker and lynch as 1 and 2, plus jenkins makes them more typically 'tall' down forward, with betts also effectively a key forward, albeit a small one. mcdonald and dunn take the first two, garland the third, and jetta gets betts. that allows howe to rotate on / off the 5 / 6 and play the sweeper role that suits him so well.

i don't think we'll see massive changes this week.

my best guess:

IN: jkh

OUT: vandenberg

sub: kent

Bloody well analysed mate, I just don't like to drop a forward in Vandenberg, who had very little supply from our midfield after half time.

We need to someone to do a forward defensive job on B Smith who provides a lot of run for the Crows and we need to limit Dangerfields impact on the game obviously, maybe a job for Mckenzie, Cross would be far to slow, Viney will do a decent job on him.

[Demonsone 1,743]

Dawes didn't even play at Casey which he should have. Came in on the back of an ordinary nab challange.

Vince needed the blowout? Did he need another week at Casey? Probably.

Agree Dawes played Nab challenge... Wasn't that bad ... Not that you can gauge much from the challenge games....

Overall Roos will need to look @ the lack of intensity from the group