Roos on SEN

[rjay 24,687]

So why didn't they target a Soccer player in the way they did with K Hunt and Izzy F?

1. ​So here is why, if you target a like for like soccer player it would probably have to be a goal keeper. He catches (marks) the ball and picks up and kicks.

   Have a look at his annual salary in 2012 and it's in pounds. Way out of the AFL's league.

   Mark Schwarzer

   Footballer
2. Mark Schwarzer OAM is an Australian professional footballer who plays for English club Chelsea as a goalkeeper. He represented Australia at international level from 1993 to 2013, and was selected for both the 2006 and 2010 World Cups.Wikipedia
4. Born: October 6, 1972 (age 41), Sydney
5. Height: 1.95 m
6. Nationality: Australian
7. Salary: 2.34 million GBP (2012)

[Pennant St Dee 12,811]

how could those two not go completely hand in hand

what you are saying is that nobody watches soccer but heaps are playing it, surely that can't be the case

Do the stats include people watching Soccer from overseas, there is a lot of access to it now with ESPN, FOX, Setanta, SBS. There are a lot more people playing soccer now than there was 20 years ago. Auskick is getting lots of kids playing which makes participation numbers look very good but they drop off drastically by the time the kids are 12/13.

AFL has to be careful not to kill the goose that laid the golden egg. Crowds are down, people I have spoken to have had enough, economic downturn means less money spend, the prices at games, the expansion sides spreading the talent so thin, Asada etc etc. But the scheduling of games to suit TV seems to be the big issue of those who used to attend regulalry

[McQueen 17,864]

• ​So here is why, if you target a like for like soccer player it would probably have to be a goal keeper. He catches (marks) the ball and picks up and kicks.

  Have a look at his annual salary in 2012 and it's in pounds. Way out of the AFL's league.

  Mark Schwarzer

  Footballer

• Mark Schwarzer OAM is an Australian professional footballer who plays for English club Chelsea as a goalkeeper. He represented Australia at international level from 1993 to 2013, and was selected for both the 2006 and 2010 World Cups.Wikipedia

• Born: October 6, 1972 (age 41), Sydney

• Height: 1.95 m

• Nationality: Australian

• Salary: 2.34 million GBP (2012)

Fair enough but that's at international level. Domestic players salaries must be pretty similar to AFL players?

[McQueen 17,864]

There isn't an argument.

[binman 42,162]

Fair enough but that's at international level. Domestic players salaries must be pretty similar to AFL players?

a fair bit less actually. But as the a league grows so will the salaries. This is what the afl fears. Once the a league gets to that level it suddenly creates a step between local and international and the a league becomes a lot more attractive and realistic as a pro option. The wanderers are a phenomenon and Melbourne city will be huge with the backing of Manchester city

[Adam The God 29,679]

Given any thought to disowning him for being un-Australian?

Way better game to play than AFL.

[chook fowler 19,304]

So why didn't they target a Soccer player in the way they did with K Hunt and Izzy F?

Imagine those soccer prima donnas performance if they were tackled or crunched in a pack. They would be forever taking dives and play acting. Most wouldn't last 10 minutes.

[Grapeviney 9,591]

There's only one soccer player who's ever made it in footy, and that was former Manchester United superstar Brad Green.

[P-man 13,366]

There isn't an argument.

http://youtu.be/X5Rb7E62IXc

Mac, is this a serious post?

If so:

1) When has it ever been up for debate as to which of the two codes was the more physical? Never I should think.

2) The discussion, I thought, was around whether soccer players with their build and skillset could be converted/drafted. A video showing a series of dives in international leagues proves precisely zip. Firstly, it adds nothing to a discussion about build or skillset, I presume only "toughness". Secondly, I'm not defending simulation, but it is a largely cultural thing that is not nearly as prevalent in Australia or amongst Australian players. Indeed it is not in the same ballpark as the South Americans or Europeans.

3) For a video showing off how tough footy is, the majority of the hits in that video would now see the players serving a lengthy ban. The bump is all but extinct. It's not the game it once was in that regard.

There's no plausible reason why soccer players, be it the tall striker or the stocky midfielder with the low centre of gravity, couldn't have potential from an athletic point of view. They would be vastly ahead of rugby players in terms of endurance. The leap would be far greater however in terms of the difference between the two games. Best to snap them up while they are still juniors.

Edited July 17, 2014 by P-man

[robbiefrom13 877]

There's only one soccer player who's ever made it in footy, and that was former Manchester United superstar Brad Green.

That's just silly - he tried out, and played a bit in a minor league.

Edited July 17, 2014 by robbiefrom13

[camillo 106]

Just took a well deserved break at work to listen to Roosy. Here's a light summary of what I heard and my interpretations:

-It sounds as though Roos is the perfect blend of nurturing but hard. He spoke about the players confidence with KB, about how the early days down there were really about chatting to the players as a mate, doing weights with them and so on to gauge their self esteem and confidence levels. Since then he's been building them with each player and spoke about how over the preseason and next year he'll apply more pressure to them.

-KB asked about a mark for the season. Roosy explained how they didn't have KPI's in terms of wins (heard this before) but that they were aiming to be competitive, which has definitely been achieved. Mentioned that he was a bit disappointed that we'd dropped off since about round 15 but consistency before that was great.

-KB met Watts and Jones at a function recently, was extremely impressed with the way they represented the club.

-KB mentioned the J. Cameron rumor and this was an interesting one. What was said will probably be interpreted differently by each person but I think Roosy aptly avoided the question. He went into a discussion about people are constantly talking to players management (etc) but his definitive statement seemed to be 'I'm not aware of any contact, direct or indirect'. My sentiment after hearing this is that we have been in contact with him.

-KB asked about Frawley. Roosy basically just said that he 'doesn't know' and said that Chip himself 'doesn't know'. He did go on to discuss free agency and the system in the NRL, more so about players continuing to play for a club after signing with another. His final statement here was along the lines of 'player should be invested in the club 100%, if not may as well leave'. I thought this was interesting.

-Spoke about the 3rd year at the Demons. Said he hasn't thought about it too much, which sounded genuine. If provided with a deadline for a decision he said he'd sit down with the family and discuss it but at this point I believe personally that a third year is a given.

- He then went on to discuss Cameron Ling vs Malthouse (lost interest a bit) and the aesthetics of the game these days. His opinion was along the lines of - talent spread thinly due to so many teams, players that definitely wouldn't have got a game twenty years ago are playing these days.

Hope that helps!

Great summary thanks.

Edited July 17, 2014 by camillo

[Nasher 33,607]

You'd have to have serious blinkers on to not be aware of the inroads soccer has made and continues to make.

I had that perception too, but since my kids started school I thought I must have overestimated it. All my son's mates play AusKick, and when I turn up to pick him up, it's always a case of playing "dodge the flying Sherrins" (or "mark the flying Sherrins" if I'm in the mood) as I walk through the school grounds. I've not once seen a soccer ball out and being played with. It may be that soccer is making inroads, but its penetration amongst kids is not deep, or threatening to our game in my opinion.

[rjay 24,687]

I had that perception too, but since my kids started school I thought I must have overestimated it. All my son's mates play AusKick, and when I turn up to pick him up, it's always a case of playing "dodge the flying Sherrins" (or "mark the flying Sherrins" if I'm in the mood) as I walk through the school grounds. I've not once seen a soccer ball out and being played with. It may be that soccer is making inroads, but its penetration amongst kids is not deep, or threatening to our game in my opinion.

The argument came up when 'Curry' made the point that other games including soccer have made no ground in the last 20 years. My point was that they have and that they are in a place where they could be the major code in the next 20 years. I actually said would be.

I don't like that this is the case but I think the AFL will be seen to have made mistakes that have been critical during the Demitriou period. I also think that the pure weight of numbers on a worldwide basis will be to big to hold back.

Australia is also fragmented, with the Southern states having AFL as the major code and the Northern states, League. Soccer has finally got it's act together in this country and could garner enough support across the whole country to make it the number one sport. The reason, as 'Titan' claimed earlier that the AFL have started off the 2 new teams is in response to the threat.

As for the kids, well I know Auskick is doing well but I also know and see a lot more kids in my area playing soccer. Some primary schools mix football and soccer, talking to a kid yesterday and asked him if footy was kicking off again this term and he said they were playing soccer instead. That would have been unheard of in my day.

'McQeen' asked why the AFL didn't poach a soccer player like they did with the league players and there is a bit of a laugh about the diving etc and toughness of our game compared to soccer. Maybe we should post a best of Lindsay Thomas to see diving isn't just restricted to soccer.

It really isn't the point anyway and is a bit of a side show besides which the AFL couldn't afford to convert a top line player, they make more in a week than most AFL players make in a season.

Do I like this? no. I don't mind soccer but didn't go out of my way to watch a world cup game. I was brought up on the real football, Aussie rules and love the game but I can see the writing on the wall. Gillan has a big battle on his hands to stem the tide.

[Ethan Tremblay 30,436]

That's just silly - he tried out, and played a bit in a minor league.

I think you'll find he was being sarcastic...

[Adam The God 29,679]

I had that perception too, but since my kids started school I thought I must have overestimated it. All my son's mates play AusKick, and when I turn up to pick him up, it's always a case of playing "dodge the flying Sherrins" (or "mark the flying Sherrins" if I'm in the mood) as I walk through the school grounds. I've not once seen a soccer ball out and being played with. It may be that soccer is making inroads, but its penetration amongst kids is not deep, or threatening to our game in my opinion.

If participation levels in the APS are anything to go by, penetration is deep. You'll have three AFL teams and then 5 boys and 3 girls 'soccer' teams. It has blown up in the last 15 years, more so even since I left school in 2005. Continual World Cup qualification means increased facilities, resources and participation. Edited July 17, 2014 by AdamFarr

[McQueen 17,864]

Mac, is this a serious post?

If so:

1) When has it ever been up for debate as to which of the two codes was the more physical? Never I should think.

2) The discussion, I thought, was around whether soccer players with their build and skillset could be converted/drafted. A video showing a series of dives in international leagues proves precisely zip. Firstly, it adds nothing to a discussion about build or skillset, I presume only "toughness". Secondly, I'm not defending simulation, but it is a largely cultural thing that is not nearly as prevalent in Australia or amongst Australian players. Indeed it is not in the same ballpark as the South Americans or Europeans.

3) For a video showing off how tough footy is, the majority of the hits in that video would now see the players serving a lengthy ban. The bump is all but extinct. It's not the game it once was in that regard.

There's no plausible reason why soccer players, be it the tall striker or the stocky midfielder with the low centre of gravity, couldn't have potential from an athletic point of view. They would be vastly ahead of rugby players in terms of endurance. The leap would be far greater however in terms of the difference between the two games. Best to snap them up while they are still juniors.

I will endeavour to improve my attempts at humour in the future.

[Ethan Tremblay 30,436]

P-Man...over analyse much?

It was a joke, you know, light hearted fun, not to be taken so seriously..

Edited July 17, 2014 by Ethan Tremblay

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I don't care how much the population had grown, no doubt there is a dilution of talent with an 18 team competition.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Clint Bizkit

[deanox 9,791]

I'd suggest that the current argument explains exactly why the talent is diluted.

Not only are the 18 professional AFL teams there are also professional soccer teams, and more professional rugby league and union teams.

The talent is spread across all sports and there are more professional teams competing for that talent now than before.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,664]

What do we mean when we say the "talent is diluted"? Do we mean there are fewer players to choose from, players being drafted with less talent than in previous years or a bit of both?

If it's fewer players to choose from, I support the earlier post that points out the number of players required to support 18 teams is from a population significantly larger than the population which supported 12 teams. You could drill down further and point out that when it was a 12 team competition, the talent pool was only the southern States plus NT. Today it includes NSW and Queensland (as well as Ireland).

If it's less talent, I also think that is wrong. Players today are fitter, stronger and better skilled than they were in the past right from the time they are drafted.

So I suspect what we are seeing is a poorer standard of game, not players, because of defensive coaching and the inability of those responsible for the rules of the game to prevent the coaches from developing gameplans that are built around trying not to lose rather than trying to win.

[rjay 24,687]

What do we mean when we say the "talent is diluted"? Do we mean there are fewer players to choose from, players being drafted with less talent than in previous years or a bit of both?

If it's fewer players to choose from, I support the earlier post that points out the number of players required to support 18 teams is from a population significantly larger than the population which supported 12 teams. You could drill down further and point out that when it was a 12 team competition, the talent pool was only the southern States plus NT. Today it includes NSW and Queensland (as well as Ireland).

If it's less talent, I also think that is wrong. Players today are fitter, stronger and better skilled than they were in the past right from the time they are drafted.

So I suspect what we are seeing is a poorer standard of game, not players, because of defensive coaching and the inability of those responsible for the rules of the game to prevent the coaches from developing gameplans that are built around trying not to lose rather than trying to win.

Even though I understand the dilution of the talent pool argument I suspect you are quite right here. I also suspect Roos is a master media person and has deflected the question beautifully.

[P-man 13,366]

P-Man...over analyse much?

It was a joke, you know, light hearted fun, not to be taken so seriously..

hehe, yeah I'll put my hand up for that. I wasn't sure if he was serious or not. Evidently not.

[Mousey 47]

One of the many advantages of having Roos on board is his performance in the media. Great ability to answer a question without really 'answering' the question specifically, never gives anything away, if he does you can bet its for a reason. Very calculated, strategic, and trustworthy to potential recruits or coach appointments which is a great asset to possess. Never puts undue pressure on the these potential appointments and the clubs that they may have to work with at the end of the year. He is part of the list management committee that meet weekly so obviously he would be part of the process of targeting specific players like Cameron and know exactly whats going on.

[P-man 13,366]

One of the many advantages of having Roos on board is his performance in the media. Great ability to answer a question without really 'answering' the question specifically, never gives anything away, if he does you can bet its for a reason. Very calculated, strategic, and trustworthy to potential recruits or coach appointments which is a great asset to possess. Never puts undue pressure on the these potential appointments and the clubs that they may have to work with at the end of the year. He is part of the list management committee that meet weekly so obviously he would be part of the process of targeting specific players like Cameron and know exactly whats going on.

Generally saying someone would make a good politician isn't a compliment, but with Roosy, he genuinely would. His answers are very careful whilst still managing to sound genuine, even after the fourth time he's said it.

[Machsy 2,858]

are you serious? What better indicator of a sport's popularity do you want? We are talking about the fact that having 3 extra sides should in no way relate to a dilution of talent given we now have 4.5 million people

soccer, rugby, cricket, basketball.. these were all in existence 20 years ago and none of them have gained any ground or taken anything away from the AFL in the time since

you can't just name six basketballers and rest your case FFS

jesus christ people will argue if the world is round in here

What are you talking about?

The issue isn't popularity to the masses as far as a spectator sport.

It's the thinning out of talent.

And I have 6 current examples of elite athletes that could be playing AFL if not for the high youth participation numbers in basketball that have drawn those players away.