Caroline Wilson's descent into gutter journalism

[H_T 2,941]

This is not about what we , or other clubs did that was supposedly right or wrong.. This is about a handful of "nose out of joint sh!theads" pushing a barrow.

Absolutely. A few with a bee in their bonnet here too that don't like the word unity and would prefer to see their club and supporters crumble and punished, rather than advance with something to look forward to.

[Sir Why You Little 34,443]

A few months ago you wanted us 'to take our punishment and get on with it' and now it can't be proved?

We didn't tank.

We experimented with players, we sent them off early for surgery, and we culled seasoned pros in an attempt to better position ourselves in the future.

The AFL know that any allegations of tanking is frought - which is why AD says that tanking is only when plaeyrs are instructed to lose.

Being instructed to experiment isn't tanking.

Being instructed to send players off for season ending surgeries isn't tanking.

Being instructed to replace Whelan, Wheatley, Brown with Martin, McNamara, and Cheney isn't tanking.

We did not tank.

a few months ago i said i wanted the AFL to do whatever it deemed so this whole sordid chapter of "Tanking" could be finished once and for all. My thoughts have not changed. It still drags on.

The club took advantage of dodgy draft rules to maximize our pick value over 2 years.

4 wins in each of 2 years.

We did it & we all know it. Head out of the sand rpfc.

If we are sanctioned by the AFL i would go straight to court. The AFL made the rules not the MFC, we just pushed them.

[stuie 7,374]

Neither Schwab nor Mclardy should be at the club now. Connolly should walk as well. This club is still run by amateurs at the top.

Ahhhhhhhhh offseason (aka trollseason) is kicking off earlier than normal this year...

If you can't understand what the current admin have done for us, then there's no way you'll be able to comprehend the subtleties of dealing with the AFL when you're not one of the 3-4 powerhouse clubs.

[stuie 7,374]

a few months ago i said i wanted the AFL to do whatever it deemed so this whole sordid chapter of "Tanking" could be finished once and for all. My thoughts have not changed. It still drags on.

The club took advantage of dodgy draft rules to maximize our pick value over 2 years.

4 wins in each of 2 years.

We did it & we all know it. Head out of the sand rpfc.

If we are sanctioned by the AFL i would go straight to court. The AFL made the rules not the MFC, we just pushed them.

You're contradicting yourself WYL.

Please read rpfc's post explaining tanking as I don't think you understand it at all.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,397]

a few months ago i said i wanted the AFL to do whatever it deemed so this whole sordid chapter of "Tanking" could be finished once and for all. My thoughts have not changed. It still drags on.

The club took advantage of dodgy draft rules to maximize our pick value over 2 years.

4 wins in each of 2 years.

We did it & we all know it. Head out of the sand rpfc.

If we are sanctioned by the AFL i would go straight to court. The AFL made the rules not the MFC, we just pushed them.

That's what I want to see. The words "tanking" and "sanctioned" used in the same post. Both words have multiple meanings. I'll assume you meant "sanctioned" as in "punished" rather than the alternative meaning "approved of". But I'm sure the journos at the Herald Sun when faced with both "tanking" and "sanctioned" will have no idea where to go with the story.

[P-man 13,168]

Isn't the issue here, at least from the AFL's perspective, that of draft tampering? So whether or not players were instructed to lose, if the so called "experimentation" was done with the aim of losing, it's irrelevant what name you place upon it. You've taken the action to improve your position in the draft.

That said, the two issues raised previously ring very true:

1. The AFL put this system in place and have willingly turned a blind eye to previous transgressions. The appropriate action would be to fix the damn system.

2. To make an example of the MFC and NOT take action against Carlton, Collingwood, and arguably Richmond, Hawthorn (the list goes on) would be a gross injustice and downright stupid.

I'd also add that whilst Vlad has denied tanking takes place, recently he has qualified those comments by saying if there is evidence to the contrary it should be looked at and dealt with. Let's not assume he is in our corner. The AFL will however need to tread very carefully if penalties are going to be imposed. If we are stripped of picks at the next draft I expect the club to react swiftly and emphatically.

[jnrmac 18,954]

I'd really like those within our club or who have been at our club to shut the hell up. Move on.

[Sir Why You Little 34,443]

You're contradicting yourself WYL.

Please read rpfc's post explaining tanking as I don't think you understand it at all.

how am i contradicting myself Stuie?

The MFC put strategies in place to win NO MORE than 4 games a year in 2008-9 to maximize our chances of recieving priority picks. That is well known. Backed up by our last departing coach.

Did the players tank? NO.

Did the coaches and match committee during the weeks before games devise strategies to minimize our chances of winning games?

$$$ on that one for me.

The rules were there to bend...The MFC (& others) bent 'em.

The major point here is, Did our actions compromise the game or as they like to say "Bring the game into disrepute"?

[Bossdog 2,002]

Neither Schwab nor Mclardy should be at the club now. Connolly should walk as well. This club is still run by amateurs at the top.

This club is run by astute people who have got the club out of a $5 mil debt.......Have new sponsers in hugely difficult situation.....Have a FD which is funded as well as anyone else in the AFL.......When Schwab was at Freo he got them financial and out of debt(Don't know how much).......Schwab and Connolly got Freo to their first final series......I know the reasons Schwab was told to concentrate on the running of the club instead of putting his nose in the FD,a job that he does very very well.......As I stated in another thread the club in in the best position I have seen it for 20 years......As for Connolly he does his job very very well....Entertaining sponsers and bringing new community involvement to the club.........These are the facts......Either get over it or put in for the jobs

And while I'm at it, Jim started the revival but was too sick to see it through....The above two and the board has turned this Footy club around......If you don't want to be here....welll.....See Ya....

[Jack Jack 415]

Here's a direct link to the MP3 file.

[Pennant St Dee 11,257]

This club is run by astute people who have got the club out of a $5 mil debt.......Have new sponsers in hugely difficult situation.....Have a FD which is funded as well as anyone else in the AFL.......When Schwab was at Freo he got them financial and out of debt(Don't know how much).......Schwab and Connolly got Freo to their first final series......I know the reasons Schwab was told to concentrate on the running of the club instead of putting his nose in the FD,a job that he does very very well.......As I stated in another thread the club in in the best position I have seen it for 20 years......As for Connolly he does his job very very well....Entertaining sponsers and bringing new community involvement to the club.........These are the facts......Either get over it or put in for the jobs

And while I'm at it, Jim started the revival but was too sick to see it through....The above two and the board has turned this Footy club around......If you don't want to be here....welll.....See Ya....

Good post, but as you would be aware lots of agenda's and haters going to continue hating. As many have said we are easy prey at the moment and earlier in 2012 Caro targetted James Brayshaw and often let her contempt cloud her judgement. Once the Roos put wins together all the bad news stories went away and everything was about the on field performance of an up an coming team.

Once we put some wins together and become competative week in week out, another club will become cannon fodder and IMO that will be the Doggies

[stuie 7,374]

how am i contradicting myself Stuie?

The MFC put strategies in place to win NO MORE than 4 games a year in 2008-9 to maximize our chances of recieving priority picks. That is well known. Backed up by our last departing coach.

Did the players tank? NO.

Did the coaches and match committee during the weeks before games devise strategies to minimize our chances of winning games?

$$$ on that one for me.

The rules were there to bend...The MFC (& others) bent 'em.

The major point here is, Did our actions compromise the game or as they like to say "Bring the game into disrepute"?

Here's where you're contradicting yourself:

You're saying we tanked, but you're saying if they punish us we'll take them to court.

Doesn't match up.

[wizardinoz 2,015]

Surprisingly Patrick Smith was on our side this morning talking on SEN. He believes we might just cop a wrap over the knuckles & nothing more because the AFL created the tanking environment and then chose to ignore it when it was clearly going on with more than just one AFL club. They would clearly be hypocrites if they just singled out us.

[PJ_12345 1,098]

Melbourne v Carlton - round 22, 2007 is the clearest example of tanking in any game in which I've ever seen the MFC participate.

Pity it was Carlton that tanked it though.

As a result, we got Cale Morton with pick 4. Carlton managed to get Kreuzer AND Judd.

The Kreuzer Cup

[Sir Why You Little 34,443]

Here's where you're contradicting yourself:

You're saying we tanked, but you're saying if they punish us we'll take them to court.

Doesn't match up.

i never said it did. The AFL made the rules not a court of law.

But to those who say we did not manipulate the rules of the day to get a better output i beg to differ.

I believe the AFL must do something to save face. But that does not mean we cannot challenge in a court.

2 separate issues Stuie.

[Still Waiting 94]

If MFC is santioned for tanking then Brock McLean is implicit or he would have at that very time quit the club due to his personal beliefs on the tanking issue. Hang on, he didn't whinge about it till some time down the track ??????? Very sour stuff by him I say!

There are AFL laws that forbid any interferance with the result of any AFL official game! So our club allegedly, has been foolish in it's responsibilty. "IF" this is the case it is another pathetic decision taken at that time by those in charge. Any of those who were involved should be sacked, banned and shamed. Make your bed, lay down in it!

Deal with it everyone.......... and lets get on with copping our whack and trying to create a better all round environment for the whole club.

What we need is honesty, professionalism and aggression on and off the field! There is still a way to go............unfortunately.

[rpfc 27,451]

The MFC put strategies in place to win NO MORE than 4 games a year in 2008-9 to maximize our chances of recieving priority picks. That is well known. Backed up by our last departing coach.

What strategies?

And how can they be considered losing for losing's sake?

[Redleg 37,577]

The best outcome for all would be an outcome which could not prove/establish tanking in breach of AFL rules and we all move on.

Agree.

[stuie 7,374]

i never said it did. The AFL made the rules not a court of law.

But to those who say we did not manipulate the rules of the day to get a better output i beg to differ.

I believe the AFL must do something to save face. But that does not mean we cannot challenge in a court.

2 separate issues Stuie.

I'm sorry WYL, but you just seemed to lack understanding of this matter and you're coming across as a bit confused mate.

[nutbean 8,837]

i didn't say it could be proved. But it did happen.

A court of law would rip the AFL apart. Herein lies their problem.

no problem - the AFL may be stupid but they're not stupid (?). They would get legal advice and the first question would be - if we do X Y and Z to the MFC and they legally challenge what will the outcome in all probability be. Again, another reason why I think this will go nowhere.

edit - you may say that the AFL wants to make an example and following your logic, the example will be AFL sanctions the MFC, the MFC takes the AFL to court over the sanctions and the court tears the AFL a new one. Are you seriously suggesting that this is the example the AFL wants to make ?

doulbe edit - unless there is something in writing or someone party to the situation goes on the record and says we instructed/were instructed to lose games then the AFL would in all probability lose any case that went to court OR their hand would be forced to bring sanctions against other tankers - which I am sure is scenario that the AFL finds less than inviting.

AFL is on a hiding to nothing so they will go with nothing

Edited October 30, 2012 by nutbean

[PaulRB 5,920]

Hey Stuie just because another person doesn't agree wholeheartedly with your view of a topic does not mean they "lack understanding" or are "confused", they just see it from a different perspective to you.

[Sir Why You Little 34,443]

What strategies?

And how can they be considered losing for losing's sake?

strategies to gain priority picks. Quite straightforward.

You are not going to deny that are rp?

[PJ_12345 1,098]

This club is run by astute people who have got the club out of a $5 mil debt.......Have new sponsers in hugely difficult situation.....Have a FD which is funded as well as anyone else in the AFL.......When Schwab was at Freo he got them financial and out of debt(Don't know how much).......Schwab and Connolly got Freo to their first final series......I know the reasons Schwab was told to concentrate on the running of the club instead of putting his nose in the FD,a job that he does very very well.......As I stated in another thread the club in in the best position I have seen it for 20 years......As for Connolly he does his job very very well....Entertaining sponsers and bringing new community involvement to the club.........These are the facts......Either get over it or put in for the jobs

And while I'm at it, Jim started the revival but was too sick to see it through....The above two and the board has turned this Footy club around......If you don't want to be here....welll.....See Ya....

Debt free for the first time in 30 years - not easy to do when we were also the worse team in the AFL

[rjay 23,903]

you may have some link in cache.. currently that podcast shows nothing in time length etc...it doesnt run..its empty

30-10-12

KB is joined by Patrick Smith ()

Yep, I probably do, try 'Jacks' link

Here's a direct link to the MP3 file.

[PaulRB 5,920]

Same strategies the GWS used in the last two drafts trading their Mini-draft picks for ND picks.