Has there been any improvement in 2012?

[RalphiusMaximus 6,053]

There has been significant improvement this year. If you look at the stats that Neeld wants us to improve, things like clearances and contested possessions, we are well up on last year and are actually quite competitive compared to the top sides. We've had more inside 50's than in previous years, and by and large have been preventing sides from getting those massive scoring runs that used to destroy us. A number of our younger players have improved drastically, which is a great sign. We now have a decent rebounding back pocket in Nicholson to offset Bartram (should he still be playing), Watts is showing signs of being dominant in the HBF role, and the move to recruit Clark looks like it may have been genius. All in all good signs.

Regarding our abysmal ladder position, I defy any side to do better with the injury run we've had. The bombers have been farcical as their injuries mounted, despite supposedly having a better list. We have played almost half a season without a single specialist forward in the side. Before that we had 1. No side can be judged on their results when they've had a year like we have. If we want an accurate gauge of how the side is going, we'll have to wait until next year and hope that we manage to keep a few more players on the park.

[Ned 156]

Disappointing Ned. Will you then get back on board when things turn around? (A big assumption, I know). We need all the members we can get. Remember the black hole we were in a few years ago. Some hard work was put in behind the scenes so that we can now talk about football, and not finances or mergers. Up to the footy department and players now. But we need to support them and membership is a must.

I will of course. I am and always will be a Demon supporter.

[Sir Why You Little 37,039]

I will of course. I am and always will be a Demon supporter.

What will you gauge as improvement Ned...how much better must the club become before you open the wallet again?

Just interested btw. Not having a go at you. I think a lot of supporters have just had enough of being heartbroken at games. You are not alone.

I hope the club realizes this at draft month. We need players ready for battle next year. Not 18 y/o prospects.

[Forest Demon 4,681]

Yesterday was pretty ordinary, but those first few games were no exaggeration, pretty much the worst few performances I have ever seen.

I think we have improved but we are still rubbish. Next year will be very interesting and will be where we see if neeld really has made any inroads.

[Ned 156]

I think we'll all know it when we see it wyl. I just want to enjoy watching footy again.

[Sir Why You Little 37,039]

I think we'll all know it when we see it wyl. I just want to enjoy watching footy again.

Yeah i know what you mean. The season was over during the last Q of round 1. I have NEVER felt that before.

I managed to see the Geelong Saints game here in Thailand on friday night. I was amazed how good the Cats skills were. They are not quite 2007 anymore but they could still win the flag in 2012.

I want my MFC to play like that. So i can high five strangers in the crowd.

[jnrmac 20,065]

Yesterday was pretty ordinary, but those first few games were no exaggeration, pretty much the worst few performances I have ever seen.

I think we have improved but we are still rubbish. Next year will be very interesting and will be where we see if neeld really has made any inroads.

Yesterday we were beaten on the contested possessions and clearances by the worst side in history. It's a fact guys. there is no gilding the lily over that.

[angrydee 842]

You clearly don't know much footy history. They have won 2 games. Double the number we won in 1981. Look at the ladders over the last 115 years. You might learn something.

[Fitz Fitzpatrick 886]

A tough question Jnr. I went to Darwin feeling confident and we barely fired a shot. Plus, as noted above, our skills remain poor. Then I came away from the St. Kilda game thinking that we had gained some structure and purpose. I would like to have been able to answer your question if we had kept Clarke and Jurrah on the paddock. At times we showed improvement but lacked the firepower to back it up.

How's that for procrastination?

Did they let you on the plane with that collar on?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

There has been significant improvement this year.

FMD.

There hasnt. We are plain rubbish. We have struggled over 2 development teams and beat one side who treated us a bye and week off.

I find hard to think of a worse year. And apart from half a dozen individual players (one of whom we recruited in), I reckon we have gone backwards.

Neeld will be under the gun next year. So should the MFC senior mgmt.

[old dee 23,791]

FMD.

There hasnt. We are plain rubbish. We have struggled over 2 development teams and beat one side who treated us a bye and week off.

I find hard to think of a worse year. And apart from half a dozen individual players (one of whom we recruited in), I reckon we have gone backwards.

Neeld will be under the gun next year. So should the MFC senior mgmt.

That about sums it up RR

Sad year when the joy is the improvement in 5 -6 players

[drdrake 3,163]

That about sums it up RR

Sad year when the joy is the improvement in 5 -6 players

Thats my position, we have seen improvement from 5-6 players but on the flip side we have seen 5-6 players really fall away. Our midfield shows no signs of improving, our transition from Back to Forward looks bad and our inability to keep the ball inside our attacking 50m arc is still a major concern. But once again the tease is there, if we can get a full pre-season into most our players, if we can get our best 22 fit and playing well, I think we are in a better place than at the end of 2011. Besides Jones, Howe and McDonald most other players have teased us with inconsistant good performances, there hasn't been to many games when the team has played well as a team.

[daisycutter 29,616]

FMD.

There hasnt. We are plain rubbish. We have struggled over 2 development teams and beat one side who treated us a bye and week off.

I find hard to think of a worse year. And apart from half a dozen individual players (one of whom we recruited in), I reckon we have gone backwards.

Neeld will be under the gun next year. So should the MFC senior mgmt.

hard to disagree with that - FMD²

[poita 3,902]

I thought 2011 was a painful season to endure, but 2012 has been far, far worse. As said above, our season was shot to pieces by round 1 and, aside from the fleeting enjoyment provided by the Essendon game, every game since has been a real struggle to watch, let along enjoy.

Our style of play is horrible to watch, and it hard to ever see it blossoming into something that will allow us to even compete with, let alone beat, the better sides. The only player who ever backs himself is Blease, and he then gets lambasted and ultimately dropped for being selfish.

As good as Jones and Clark have been, and as promising that the signs are from McDonald and Howe, these would be the only four players to receive a pass mark this year.

Most of our senior players have gone miles backwards, particularly Jamar and Moloney, and Davey has continued his putrid performances of the previous two years. Not only are these players unable to perform at the level required, they appear to have no interest in trying to do so.

What really hurts though is seeing the likes of Dunn, Macdonald and Magner being regulars, despite being genuine C or D graders, plus further confirmation of our wasted investment in Strauss, Tapscott, Cook and about a dozen others.

Notwithstanding our strong draft hand, I cannot see any prospect of improvement in 2013, and would not be surprised if we finish below at least one of the expansion teams.

[Ouch! 2,263]

If you look at this, I think it's fairly hard to disagree that we have improved. Since Round 12 having an effective % of 90 as opposed to 55% ish up to round 12.

I know that the draw has a lot to do with it, and we have had an easier back half of the season, but combine that with the fact we have also had a lot more injuries as well that have directly impacted our ability to score this year.

We are not getting smashed in games like the doggies seem to be each week.

Still been one hell of a painful year.

[The Chazz 4,077]

While some are correct in saying that we have improved in the 2nd half of the year, can I ask who the oppostion has been? The 2nd part of this season was always our "dream run", of which at the start of the season we could've been looking at 6-10 wins such was the "ease" of the draw.

I'm not getting buying this "we've improved in the 2nd half of the season" rubbish.

[PaulRB 6,363]

The only way to be optimistic about this year is if you subscribe to the "one step back to take two steps forward" strategy.

This year, "the one step back" involves:

• Getting games into the next gen, have then playing a solid brand of footy,
  
• Pushing the players hard to improve their fitness and mental fortitude
  
• Identifying who to keep and who to cut at end of 2012
  
• Rebuilding the leadership group after a disastrous 2011
  
• Bedding down and fine tuning the new FD, game plan and "elite" training regime
  

Hence the focus on "non-winning metrics" such as the development of young players, defensive and clearance stats, marginalising of former leaders who are under-performing, etc... Otherwise known as "rebuilding our foundations".

Edited August 20, 2012 by PaulRB

[Ned 156]

FMD.

There hasnt. We are plain rubbish. We have struggled over 2 development teams and beat one side who treated us a bye and week off.

I find hard to think of a worse year. And apart from half a dozen individual players (one of whom we recruited in), I reckon we have gone backwards.

Neeld will be under the gun next year. So should the MFC senior mgmt.

Yes, this pretty much sums up my feelings. And as WYL said, this season was over before our round one match was even completed. Very depressing.

I'm prepared to give Neeld more time, though I think a failure to show genuine improvement in the first half of next year will trigger calls for his head that will be difficult to resist. I expect to see some heat on Cameron Schwab, too. Melbourne could really do with a top CEO, worth investing the money there I reckon. But I don't want to open up that debate again.

But I feel pretty let down as a supporter, and as I said the football we produce is close to unwatchable.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

http://demonland.com...iew__getnewpost

If you look at this, I think it's fairly hard to disagree that we have improved. Since Round 12 having an effective % of 90 as opposed to 55% ish up to round 12.

I know that the draw has a lot to do with it, and we have had an easier back half of the season, but combine that with the fact we have also had a lot more injuries as well that have directly impacted our ability to score this year.

We are not getting smashed in games like the doggies seem to be each week.

Still been one hell of a painful year.

That's pizzing around the edges in the extreme. I would have thought it would have been difficult to mount a case that we have improved at all. Some of the treacle posts alluding to cosmetic or miniscule "improvements" are laughable.

I have no doubt Neeld took over a deficient list with a dysfunctional FD and management group behind it. And he deserves more time to get things right but he would not want to have MFC in the same position in 12 months time. He may have inherited a train wreck he could possibly be making it worse. At this stage I dont know if Neeld will be a success but I dont see the purpose if smudging some silly stats to "prove" the upside when from every angle view the quality and standard of the football being played is putrid.

[thaipantsman 180]

Yes, this pretty much sums up my feelings. And as WYL said, this season was over before our round one match was even completed. Very depressing.

I'm prepared to give Neeld more time, though I think a failure to show genuine improvement in the first half of next year will trigger calls for his head that will be difficult to resist. I expect to see some heat on Cameron Schwab, too. Melbourne could really do with a top CEO, worth investing the money there I reckon. But I don't want to open up that debate again.

But I feel pretty let down as a supporter, and as I said the football we produce is close to unwatchable.

IMO 5 wins this year is a pass mark for Neeld but only a bare one. The constant talk of massive cull by RR types is not going to happen but obviously some changes are a comin...Gutsy types such as Couch, Magner, Sellar, Greene and possible retirement of Davey will make way for some quality trades.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

IMO 5 wins this year is a pass mark for Neeld but only a bare one. The constant talk of massive cull by RR types is not going to happen but obviously some changes are a comin...Gutsy types such as Couch, Magner, Sellar, Greene and possible retirement of Davey will make way for some quality trades.

I am not sure where the other wins come from. But on your measure this year is a fail and a cull can be expected.

Neither Magner or Couch are on the senior list being upgraded rookies and I would not keep Sellar. Davey still has a year on the list and would be mad to retire unless the Club were to pay him out. He could go to the rookie list.

[thaipantsman 180]

That's pizzing around the edges in the extreme. I would have thought it would have been difficult to mount a case that we have improved at all. Some of the treacle posts alluding to cosmetic or miniscule "improvements" are laughable.

I have no doubt Neeld took over a deficient list with a dysfunctional FD and management group behind it. And he deserves more time to get things right but he would not want to have MFC in the same position in 12 months time. He may have inherited a train wreck he could possibly be making it worse. At this stage I dont know if Neeld will be a success but I dont see the purpose if smudging some silly stats to "prove" the upside when from every angle view the quality and standard of the football being played is putrid.

Initially had the same feeling about Neeld however he is a 3 year proposition and should be given the chance over 3 not 2. Sure he's a big worry with Hot Air statements, poor eye contact but he's learning. Neeld will be judged midway 2014. If we're pushing for 8th at that time he'll be given another 3 years.

[thaipantsman 180]

I am not sure where the other wins come from. But on your measure this year is a fail and a cull can be expected.

Neither Magner or Couch are on the senior list being upgraded rookies and I would not keep Sellar. Davey still has a year on the list and would be mad to retire unless the Club were to pay him out. He could go to the rookie list.

Cheers Rhino am not au fait will all the intricacies around the trade table. Yes Sellar is a trier at best. Bewildered to why he was brought to Melbourne especially since Craig knew how good/bad he was. Good Suburban player and would dominate that level.

Wait and see if the 5th win comes. If not it's a failure for mine and backwards from last year. Perhaps knock off Crowbaggers this week would do it?

[thaipantsman 180]

The only way to be optimistic about this year is if you subscribe to the "one step back to take two steps forward" strategy.

This year, "the one step back" involves:

• Getting games into the next gen, have then playing a solid brand of footy,
  
• Pushing the players hard to improve their fitness and mental fortitude
  
• Identifying who to keep and who to cut at end of 2012
  
• Rebuilding the leadership group after a disastrous 2011
  
• Bedding down and fine tuning the new FD, game plan and "elite" training regime
  

Hence the focus on "non-winning metrics" such as the development of young players, defensive and clearance stats, marginalising of former leaders who are under-performing, etc... Otherwise known as "rebuilding our foundations".

Identifying who to keep and who to cut at end of 2012

Doesn't this happen every year to every team regardless of outcome?

[jnrmac 20,065]

Cheers Rhino am not au fait will all the intricacies around the trade table. Yes Sellar is a trier at best. Bewildered to why he was brought to Melbourne especially since Craig knew how good/bad he was. Good Suburban player and would dominate that level.

Wait and see if the 5th win comes. If not it's a failure for mine and backwards from last year. Perhaps knock off Crowbaggers this week would do it?

We undoubtedly will see a massive cull. I think you are off the money there. neeld is a first year coach and what he has seen has shocked him. He is not going to sit around and wait for improvement. He will go out and get it. The Swans have shown it is possible at the trade table and this year will be a revelation with FA. We will be aggressive.

As for sellar I don't get the animosity towards this bloke. He is a role player and has actually done his job well. We lost Warnock and had no-one to play on the 'gorillas'. Who do you think is going to do that?? Rivers, Garland, Frawley? Its laughable. Have a look at the history of players like Cloke against us. Sellar has been OK.