On the Couch - Brock talks about 'tanking'

[diesel 420]

Great post. The players intervened FFS! They met with an ailing Stynes they must have had no other choice. That would be the last thing any player wants to do unless it was really bad down there. Brad Green, Moloney, Davey all leaders and true Dees with all their heart couldn't stand it anymore. They are all now on the fringe. 186 saved Schwabs bacon and set us back a couple of years.

The administration enforced the tank, the administration demanded JUNIOR MAC go! The administration divided the club!!

Schwab - leave now.

You're confused, perhaps the players were to? We were supposed to be winning games last year. The players thought Schwab was gone and Bailey was staying and they then went out and put on the Geleong display. Nice celebration of the departure of an administrator and vote of confidence in the coach? Fact is Schwab, Bailey, everyone fell for the theory that we could get a bounce through the draft but we've drafted poorly and one of the key draftees has gone.

It just didn't work out, simple really. Some will hang onto it, like Sheahan, other media types, oppo clubs & supporters to bring us down a peg or pump themsleves up like Brock was trying to. To all of them I extend the middle finger. We've learnt from the experience and moved on, until the on field results turn we'll continue to be kicked. It happens to every club at the bottom of the ladder.

[Range Rover 1,935]

Kevin Bartlett (mate of Gerard's?) going on with it on SEN now. Patrick Smith all over it. Expect a big article in The Australian tomorrow.

[Range Rover 1,935]

Bartlett just brought up the possibility of us being stripped of our draft picks.

Get ready boys .... the fix is in!

[The Demon 2565 28]

Kevin Bartlett (mate of Gerard's?) going on with it on SEN now. Patrick Smith all over it. Expect a big article in The Australian tomorrow.

WGAF? let them write their articles, it will come to nothing. the AFL can't do anything about it retrospectively and its not like our image in the wider football world can become much more tarnished than it already is (irrelevant ski chalet owning Old Scotch bloody Range Volvo drivers the lot of us). besides, Patrick Smith is the king of the peanut gallery, and is far more interested in making a strong stand about things rather than what he is in what the stand is actually about

the disappointing thing is that I was actually beginning to begrudgingly respect Brock for the way he was grabbing his last chance and running with it. all respect for him, begrudged or genuine, is once again gone

[rjay 23,948]

If all the issues this year were not enough then this just caps it off.

The club faces some really serious issues and I don't have faith in the CEO to handle this situation. Changes should have been made not only to the Football dept. after 186 but right through the club, it was always going to come back and bite us on the bum.

I'm interested to see how the board handle this now.

[Biffen 12,372]

Great post. The players intervened FFS! They met with an ailing Stynes they must have had no other choice. That would be the last thing any player wants to do unless it was really bad down there. Brad Green, Moloney, Davey all leaders and true Dees with all their heart couldn't stand it anymore. They are all now on the fringe. 186 saved Schwabs bacon and set us back a couple of years.

The administration enforced the tank, the administration demanded JUNIOR MAC go! The administration divided the club!!

Schwab - leave now.

Schwab has been the man behind our draft strategy for the past five years ,along with CC . We have been actively attempting a rebuild based on youth and have made no secret of the fact .It is no surprise that some of the older players at the club have been disgruntled at this approach.

The voice of some of these guys may have been a lot more relevant if they had shown more on field leadership and had attempted to protect the kids coming through the ranks .Instead they chose to speak out against the administration and divide the club whilst their own performances underwhelmed .

What we have now is a team that is the third youngest in the competition ,with some more young talent coming through .We have a no nonsense coach and the last bite of the cherry in the draft before the rules change .I think Schwab has orchestrated our survival both on and off field whether we like it or not .I feel for the older supporters who may not be around in two or three years ,as I feel for the older players who have tried hard on the field of play .

If I were CEO of Melbourne I would have followed the same path. The pain we all feel at watching our young guys make mistakes and our old guys not try will all dissipate when we have 22 talented ,well trained players at the age of 23-27 who are winning nearly every match.Mclean may be bitter that we could not afford his asking price at the time but I for one am glad there is a long term plan in place .

Teams like the Saints ,the Bulldogs ,North and Freo and Geelong will slip down the ladder in the future as they need to introduce new blood.It may not look like it at the moment ,but we are closer to our next flag than these older teams . The future finals series will be made up of younger lists that will not suffer from retirements/delistings as we have in our re-build .I can see Essendon ,Richmond ,Meth Coast and even Gold Coast becoming stronger in the future as we will .Collingwood ,Carlton ,Hawks ,Swans , Crows and WCE have the window open as they have the right amount of games into their talent and their bodies are strong enough to cope.

Next year will be brighter for us ,the year after even better .

Those who cannot stay the journey and want to knock their own club should get off the reality bus now.

Our recruitment policies are based on the realities that faced us after the Daniher years.

I can cop the flak from tools like Brock McLean and I will laugh when we knock him out of future finals contests(if he is around).

If your skin isn't thick enough to handle the abuse now then get tougher or get off the Reality Bus .

Unfortunately ,being a Melbourne supporter is tough

[Hannibal 5,814]

Im hoping but assuming the BP accusation from Ben-hur is a joke.

Just a bit of levity, Frankster.

This is the wrong thread, but there's no doubt that we're in the predicament we're in because we stuffed up our draft picks. Some supporters like to bury their heads in the sand, but imagine if we had Shuey, Redden, Jetta, Fyfe, or Darling instead of Blease, Strauss, Gysberts, Tapscott and Cook. Getting it right on draft day has a massive influence on your club. I accept that there are development issues, but just as importantly getting the best talent into your club is vital.

Gysberts, Blease and Strauss may well play plenty of games for Melbourne, but it's clear they're not top 20 draft picks. This club can't keep letting opportunities slip by.

[DeeZee 6,779]

Maybe they should take away all the premierships we've won as a club since we tanked...ala Melb Storm.

[rjay 23,948]

Schwab has been the man behind our draft strategy for the past five years ,along with CC . We have been actively attempting a rebuild based on youth and have made no secret of the fact .It is no surprise that some of the older players at the club have been disgruntled at this approach.

The voice of some of these guys may have been a lot more relevant if they had shown more on field leadership and had attempted to protect the kids coming through the ranks .Instead they chose to speak out against the administration and divide the club whilst their own performances underwhelmed .

What we have now is a team that is the third youngest in the competition ,with some more young talent coming through .We have a no nonsense coach and the last bite of the cherry in the draft before the rules change .I think Schwab has orchestrated our survival both on and off field whether we like it or not .I feel for the older supporters who may not be around in two or three years ,as I feel for the older players who have tried hard on the field of play .

If I were CEO of Melbourne I would have followed the same path. The pain we all feel at watching our young guys make mistakes and our old guys not try will all dissipate when we have 22 talented ,well trained players at the age of 23-27 who are winning nearly every match.Mclean may be bitter that we could not afford his asking price at the time but I for one am glad there is a long term plan in place .

Teams like the Saints ,the Bulldogs ,North and Freo and Geelong will slip down the ladder in the future as they need to introduce new blood.It may not look like it at the moment ,but we are closer to our next flag than these older teams . The future finals series will be made up of younger lists that will not suffer from retirements/delistings as we have in our re-build .I can see Essendon ,Richmond ,Meth Coast and even Gold Coast becoming stronger in the future as we will .Collingwood ,Carlton ,Hawks ,Swans , Crows and WCE have the window open as they have the right amount of games into their talent and their bodies are strong enough to cope.

Next year will be brighter for us ,the year after even better .

Those who cannot stay the journey and want to knock their own club should get off the reality bus now.

Our recruitment policies are based on the realities that faced us after the Daniher years.

I can cop the flak from tools like Brock McLean and I will laugh when we knock him out of future finals contests(if he is around).

If your skin isn't thick enough to handle the abuse now then get tougher or get off the Reality Bus .

Unfortunately ,being a Melbourne supporter is tough

Bif if you look at the history you will find that Schwab was responsible for some of the problems in recruiting from the Daniher years, costing in the draft with salary cap breaches in his previous time at the club.

Surely you don't think his current draft strategy has been working, a twice failed CEO in my view.

Time for the broom to sweep clean.

[daisycutter 28,630]

Geez, I feel such a d1ckhead

I always thought young Brocky left because Casey Fields was too far away from his favourite haunts

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

One simple fact though.

The fact that the club didn't re-sign Brock had nothing to do with tanking. They just didn't think Brock was as good as he thought he was.

And virtually ALL MFC supporters were over the moon we managed to get pick 11 for him. Most Carltank supporters were not pleased with the deal.

Says it all really.

Love the histrorical revisionism that occurred last night though.

[Biffen 12,372]

Bif if you look at the history you will find that Schwab was responsible for some of the problems in recruiting from the Daniher years, costing in the draft with salary cap breaches in his previous time at the club.

Surely you don't think his current draft strategy has been working, a twice failed CEO in my view.

Time for the broom to sweep clean.

We all live and learn-Schwab has us in a very ,very ,very ,very strong position gong forward.

Where are the Saints at?

Edited July 30, 2012 by Biffen

[diesel 420]

Bartlett just brought up the possibility of us being stripped of our draft picks.

Get ready boys .... the fix is in!

That's just stupid, ignorant talk. There never was and never will be a rule which says you can't accumlate picks, be it by 'experimenting' or 'resting' players. Where would all this end if you opened that can of worms?

[diesel 420]

Geez, I feel such a d1ckhead

I always thought young Brocky left because Casey Fields was too far away from his favourite haunts

It would be great if someone from the MFC just came and spilt on the real reasons for Borcks agreed departure. Last night was all about Brock re-casting himself as unwanted at the MFC (at least on his terms?

[Mac7 309]

That's just stupid, ignorant talk. There never was and never will be a rule which says you can't accumlate picks, be it by 'experimenting' or 'resting' players. Where would all this end if you opened that can of worms?

Completely agree, however the AFL love's making up rules on the run.... they also love the old "bringing the game into disrepute!!"

[stinga81 210]

Why he felt the need to rehash an old topic is beyond me, or better still wait for your career is over to start laying the boots in to your former club. I appreciate that he's one of those blokes "who tells it how it is", but there's a time and a place. What makes it even more ironic is the team he's playing for now were probably the main 'players of the tank'. Without watching the interview, and by the posts on here, obviously the panel members didn't ask him about the Round 22 2007 game, you know for a bit of balance. Bit of a farce really.

Maybe he it was his audition next year when potentially he's footy career is all over.

The sooner 2012 is over the better, this year has been farked.

[The heart beats true 16,381]

Gysberts, Blease and Strauss may well play plenty of games for Melbourne, but it's clear they're not top 20 draft picks. This club can't keep letting opportunities slip by.

Bit early for Sammy Blease BH. Has just started playing consistently this year (which is still not true of Strauss and Gys). If he was surrounded by better players to learn from he could be anything. Think about how everyone kicked Lewis Jetta for a few years and now look at him.

[dees189227 10,888]

Poor neeldy will now be asked about these allegations even though he wasnt at the club at the time but some journo will ask the dumb question. Seriously what else does this club need to deal with this season. Bring on 2013. This season cant end quick enough.

By the way Brock have the guts to name names. Who was it.

[The Albino Warrior 44]

Love the historical revisionism that occurred last night though.

Me too.

Conveniently no mention of what an appalling disappointment McLean was or continues to be as a footballer, and how perfunctory the Demons' attempts to keep him were.

[rjay 23,948]

We all live and learn-Schwab has us in a very ,very ,very ,very strong position gong forward.

Where are the Saints at?

I think he has us in a very, very, very, very precarious position again.

I fail to see what the Saints have to do with anything here but while you're at it they had a previous CEO called Brian Waldron. Do you think the Storm would be stupid enough to re appoint him.

[The heart beats true 16,381]

The facts:

1. Brock did appear to try and recast himself as harshly dealt by the club and leaving for cultural reasons (tanking). In the light of day this has been proven to be untrue, simply because he left for Carlton.

2. The On The Couch team tried to establish Brock as a real clubman by talking up his $10,000 contribution to the debt demolition. Posters here have pointed out that there is an allegation that this was his way of 'paying' a club sanctioned fine in a media friendly way. Still need confirmation, but it doesn't look good for Brock.

3. We tanked. You can call it whatever you want but we did. The issue for me isn't that we did it, because the system encouraged it. The issue is the residue this left on our culture combined with the handling of other issues (Jnr., 186).

Brock is no angel and we did the wrong thing in hindsight. The only thing we can do is try and move forward with a cleaner slate. A lot of the players are gone/going so for mine that only leaves those further up the chain. They should be replaced so this can be put to bed and we can all move on.

[Biffen 12,372]

I think he has us in a very, very, very, very precarious position again.

I fail to see what the Saints have to do with anything here but while you're at it they had a previous CEO called Brian Waldron. Do you think the Storm would be stupid enough to re appoint him.

Schwab hasn't broken any rules as far as I am aware of .

"Tanking" is an issue that really concerns betting .

As a club we are paying our bills and have a new home ,our seconds sit atop the ladder and we have a bright future.CS has done a terrific job for the club and may not be macho enough for some people but he presents an articulate and intelligent corporate face for our club .

[s-t-i-n-g-a 439]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2008-03-13/carlton-tanked-liberatore/1071980

[s-t-i-n-g-a 439]

Are Carlton trying to get us out of the race for Cloke?

[Bonkers 918]

Has nothing to do with it, the current admin were there and running things when the so called tanking happened.

They are responsible for a failed re build and now oversee another re build.

Pretty hard to be responsible for a re-build in which you haven't laid the foundations & footings for. The one thing I would say the board was accountable for was not addressing the andrews report quick enough & also replacing Leoncelli. However we all know how that ended so I think it's best to back the current board/admin as they have put us in a strong financial position off field. There aren't any viable alternatives IMO.