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Rather damning post from BF:

There's a substantial amount of evidence there to build up what is a circumstantial case against the players and officials of the Essendon Football Club and most of these aspects have been discussed from time to time through the pages of this and previous threads here on Demonland and elsewhere. The gathering of this sort of evidence has to be painstaking and laborious and explains why we're nearly two years down the track and only now seeing a distant light at the end of the tunnel. The players have already suffered pain and there's more on the way irrespective of the AFL Tribunal outcome: their reputations as clean sportsmen will be tarnished because of the clear cover up and the absence of records of what they ingested during the programme.Those who planned and perpetrated this disgrace should be run out of the sport.

DD, this is my last response to a JW topic - no ill feeling towards you, or any other posters. Jack was never/ will never be an epitome of the tough nut and tough culture we had under the Northey regime....he is a genuine, bona fide finisher who's athletic, covers the ground quickly, reads the game well and delivers with great skill. Look up occasionally and appreciate him for the vital cog that he is.

By having it at Casey

Definitely not far off the mark. Allison alluded on the MFC website that the rooms were chosen specifically for each new player, and Cross is the perfect mentor for Brayshaw. Oh hell, Cross is the perfect mentor for everyone in our team.

Why would any innocent "doctor" stay at this club unless they are irrevocably embroiled in the mire...

They shut the gate.

My uncle had a farm at Waverley, he sold it to the VFL for some of Waverley park, his driveway Cypresses are still there. He thought he'd move away from the encroaching city so he moved to the Clyde just out of Cranbourne and ran a dairy farm, you guessed it his property is now Casey fields. Edit: I just looked at satellite images and the dairy and farmhouse are still there. The cows grazed over the rail line, no room for cows now, although some may argue there are still a few left.

Exactly! Not relevant for us and not relevant for the players. I would not want my salary made known to other employees in my organisation just as I would not want to know theirs - it can only cause ructions.

I still think as the team improves we will see the best of watts

Give it a rest! You (and heaps of you) have your complaints about Jack - Demi Dee expresses positive belief about Jack on the basis of thinking he will benefit from a toughening up of the team around him. Do you disagree about the toughening up of the team around Watts? Do you disagree with Demi Dee's point that someone who is not especially aggressive himself and has been criticised for not being physical enough could be expected to walk taller when surrounded by tougher team-mates? But no - you have to ignore the positive thoughts and grab for the negative spin you can put on this comment on the growth of the team and its probable impact on Watts. An attemptedly arrogant Watts, with his physique and character, and the lack of support around him, would only have invited mockery until now. I agree with Demi Dee - things may be very different this year, and if Jack is part of the general improvement in confidence and assertiveness, it will be lovely to watch. Starting the assertive and physical stuff was never going to be Jack Watts' thing - but we all know what he will have to offer when there is a space made for him to do it. (And don't pick at that - you might as well argue that everything depends on the ruckman, because he's the first cab off the rank every time there's a ball-up; or try to argue that forwards are useless because they aren't the ones who get the ball down there. Watts is a role-player. Demi Dee suggests the team is developing in a way that makes his role more viable than it has been. Good point to make, and without any need for sneering and - yawn - Watts-bashing.)

correct, azzkika, this is a cherry picker

Well after spending the last couple of weeks in Vic, I've unfortunately been unable to railbird and report on any training. I did however manage to get into the Demon shop today (what a stupid fucken place to have it) and purchase various MFC paraphernalia to adorn myself with. Served by a lovely young lass too I must add. Back to WA I go where I shall look forward to us smashing the Dorkers in the NAB challenge. If it's not telecast and I'm not too intoxicated, I shall endeavour to report on the teams performance. Thanks to everyone who takes the time to type up any training report; some are better than others in many different ways but all are appreciated so please keep it up. So looking forward to this season, I reckon the Dee's are going to be the story of the year - all for good reasons. Ed: spealing

STFU Nice little STFU there to the incomparable Mitch Clark. What an inspiration he was to Hoges, who apparently looked up to him as a mentor. Hopefully that's past tense now.

That's terrible daisy....im really disappointed in you.

I think the only way to do this investigation, is closed. Who wants the media making a circus of things. Let them do their job and take all the time needed to come up with the correct decision. AS LONG AS IT'S GUILTY!

Yep,I wouldnt wear a union jack either. Besides it could play havoc with the scooter wheels.

I would agree with all of that except for one word "Vital" I don't believe he has proven that yet. Here's hoping he does in 2015.

They tell you it's on at 2.00 PM when they actually have it in the morning.

Well, as I spend thousands of dollars grocery shopping at Woolies every year (far more invested there than in MFC memberships), I think I will demand that a board be displayed at the entrance of the Leichhardt Market Place Woolworths store entrance, listing every checkout person, shelf stacker and manager and their individual salaries. Seems fair.

Your uncle is the Wilmer McLean of the AFL. The US Civil War started on his property at Manassas, just outside Washington DC, and finished with the surrender meeting in the living room of the house that he'd moved to 200 km away.

Why do I suddenly feel like I am back in school?

I'm not too sure, but I have an inkling that it may have been due to the fact that Carlton had a functioning, talented and deep running midfield..Just a thought though.. (But seriously, if Garlett kicks close to 30-40 goals from our midfield next year, I'll be unbelievably surprised to say the least). For those predicting Garlett's total for the end of the year, did you happen to glimpse our inside 50 average for last year? Our midfield, (which will supply Garlett) still has a LONG way to go going by last year's form. Garlett is a dangerous acquisition but he's going to need the ball to come his way quickly and often if he's going to kick 30+ goals.

Quite agree Felix. The players have been appallingly badly advised on this, particularly by Essendon. It seems their advice was framed in such a way to protect Hird and beggar their self interest. Once ESSENDON and Hird decided to fight (really at the time Little came to power), their future was doomed. ASADA has shown little interest in deals recently, and will take this to its logical conclusion is penalties all round.

What do you earn per year?

Watts will grow enormously this year. We all agree his skill set, vision, size and knowledge across all the lines should see him potentially be one of the most damaging players in the league. What he has lacked from day one is that feeling of having his back covered. The confidence to go in hard, knowing that if it all turns pear shaped, a couple of the boys will stand them down. One or two of those players whom others fear. Someone to rag doll the opposition, make them think twice. We have lacked that presence. Watts will find a swagger when other teams know it's going to hurt to play us. Collingwood had it that day, but, I think Watts would love nothing more than to run amok against their young backline while Hogan quietly shatters their self belief.

I am not Watts basher but "very good player" and "excellent player to have on our list" is overreach IMO. I agree with your assessment of his skillset and he is the player that I am most comfortable having the ball in his hand and I love his vision in that he opens up play.To be a very good player he needs to do it more consistently. As yet he has not been a week in and week out footballer. He has had some games where he is really been good for a couple of quarters and then goes missing. I think Roos understands exactly what he has but I would hope that he has expectations that he does what he does more frequently and consistently

Somebody on here posted that being a MFC member was like being married in that you have to be prepared to take the good with the bad times. Not too sure about this analogy linking membership to marriage! My support for the MFC has outlived six marriages and, if I get romantic, it may even outlive a seventh (and that is without 'good times')!

Gold...

If the infraction notices are being adhered to they wouldn't be allowed to attend training as per Ahmed Saad. So I don't see how there could be any backdating as they haven't been operating under the infraction notice to date....

dunno, but it's only 1k up on xmas time (1 month ago) somebody will have records

Afraid you are much more optimistic than me. I think it will go something like this. The AFL will reprimand the players and hird will get off. WADA will come in and send it to CAS. The players will all get two years from the date of the WADA appeal and hird, the doc, and most of the other coaches involved will get rubbed out for a long long time.

WOW

Hope not. Terrible nickname for someone under 60.

Club website has it at 9:15 am at Goschs, Moonie will be so excited that I will be able to be there, fanboying to my hearts content

I think you will find that those salaries are probably readily available through the union EBA. Those people are paid set wages. Same with first and second year AFL players.

But it wasn't the player manager or the list manager that was ridiculed when TS played his first game against us......It was the player who coped the abuse and that was without the knowledge of what his salary actually was. Supporters yell and abuse players because that is what they see at the game..... so if they now had the knowledge of exactly how much each player was getting paid the expectation would rise and fall on those payments. Which I think is unfair.

Hahaha, I know it does worry me but surely I am due for one!! I should have placed the 'surprise packet expectations' on Clark, Scully, Bennell, Pettard and Stef!

I can understand the concern for players well being and the need to shield them from criticism, but will it really be the players that cop it for being overpaid? It's the players agent and the list manager that negotiate their salaries, I'd hope that those would be the ones getting the majority of criticism. Rather than opening up players for criticism about being overpaid, I'd think the blow torch should/ would be pointed squarely at the list manager who did the deal. I know it's not a perfect world, but the players have limited input in regards to what they're paid. Case in point - TS - he hasn't played up to the $million price tag, but he didn't set that price, he simply took the best offer on the table (as we all would).

"I think Toumpas will be the surprise packet of 2015, because of how widely he has been written off as another high pick failure. " Now that is strangely twisted logic Just WOW!

There is the "Kiss of Death" deeko Sure to go down with an injury now.

Sure you weren't thinking of Glen Waverley and the Mentones?

I'll answer this in regards to the Sports Bra (if that's what you meant ). The Sports Bras hold the Catapult Sports GPS units (see link http://www.catapultsports.com/global/system/outdoor/) on the upper back of each player as they train (and they actually give pretty good support to the pecs surprisingly enough haha - done a bit of validity research with them at my work ). During matches the GPS units instead are placed in the little pouch sewn into each players Guernsey - so there is no need for the sports bra then. In regards to the video, i know my work has done some research with decision making from player worn video data, however its normally head mounted. This may be related or he may have gotten permission to wear it for himself (maybe hes staring in a new TV series: the demon within??? - i'll work on my jokes).

No. Honestly, who gives a [censored]. If you have the time to care what a player is getting paid, get a life, get a new job or get a hobby.

How to turn any thread into a Watts thread: Mention Jack Watts

Watts' often plays well in Darwin when they go in those big cool rooms during the breaks. You could be on to something here Ron! I'm just a bit over the Roos is a messiah because he got Watts to have a season remarkably similar to ever other year he's had. And that Watts' is some kind of special outside player who can play good footy whilst refusing to put his body on the line. It's crap. He's not the third Hill brother. He's not even Andrew Gaff. You got to go when it's your turn and do defensive things. It's really pretty simple stuff.

Agreed. The letter reads like a contrived after the fact ass covering. Was it really hand written and not email? Does he have an Essendon email account? Any email account that he uses professionally? Why not use that instead of hand writing something of such importance that there would be no possible duplicate nor proof of delivery or existence. Any one in the workforce that uses email is taught in week 1 to "PUT IT IN AN EMAIL" for proof. The snail mail version of this is a REGISTERED LETTER with a photocopy! A flimsy memo for something so important FFS? I might take 6 weeks off work without advising anyone and on my return drop a post dated letter in my bosses office, "sorry boss, I wrote you a letter, didn't you get it?" "sorry boss for the 4 hour lunch break, I wrote you a letter, can't you find it?" "Sorry boss, I didn't like my colleagues stripping the office bare and selling the furniture and computers for personal profit, but I wrote a letter, can't you find it?" "The hand-written letter was intended for chief executive Ian Robson and his directors, and yet none of the above were aware of it until February this year. That document was not seen by Evans until about one year later, shortly before the story broke" How very convenient, just before the story broke it pops into existence. Link From memory the "letter" wasn't found till AFTER the story broke. "Lost" until the SHTF? Any fair minded person would have to be suspicious. You could plant a market garden in this steaming pile of a story!!!

nonsense - it's Jack Watts fault.

Well, there's one thing that hasn't changed in 115 years.

I agree mate, once we finally do turn this around it is going to feel so sweet, most other clubs will have no idea (bar maybe st. Kilda). That's why the win against essendon this year was so bloody good, once it starts happening consistently it's gonna feel bloody great.