Leaderboard

Keen to get my fellow DL members thoughts on what I believe was a wonderful result with Pick 23 in the latest trade / draft period. Trading it to GWS for Frost, Pick 40 and 53 allowed us to get three young talents from a 2nd round pick which was a master stroke. To then get ANB at 40 and Oscar at 53, both of whom were predicted 2nd round talents themselves, I don't think we could have asked for anymore from the List Mgt team. Frost, ANB and Oscar is a great package for 23 as it includes two young KPP, when Saints get only one in Goddard for 21. Paying under the odds for Stretch at 42 and having Petracca slide to us only adds to a fantastic draft, giving Roos and Goodwin plenty to work with over the next 5 years. Who else agrees??

Better still, why not mosey across to Collingwood's training and give them a dose?

This is plainly wrong. He's one of the few Melbourne players people know because of the hype surrounding him. Hogan is on the same profile level as Boyd and Daniher (whom he will be compared against for the rest of his career). Any supporter who doesn't know who Hogan is would have to be living in a cave. He's THE biggest reason to be excited about what's to come. I think Toumpas will be the surprise packet of 2015, because of how widely he has been written off as another high pick failure.

Let's not go there. Memories of our performance against an undermanned Saints in round 1 last year are still clearly etched In my mind.

I started that thread to spark debate - not to end it. I think you are taking a few leaps in the above post. We improved markedly last year, and yet, we were still so far behind even below average teams, that the next step is to get to those teams level before looking past them.

Liam Jurrah was the last player who got people out of their seats, yelling out his name every time he got the ball, and as brilliant as he could be his form was flaky. Before him we probably have to go back to the Wizard and the Ox. We need 1-3 players to be crowd pullers, commentator darlings, the kind of player that other supporters wish their club had. It has been far too long between drinks at MFC. It is possible that Hogan and JKH could be, but it remains potential. We need to see an A-grade breakout season very soon and I hope it happens in 2015. But apart from the crowd-puller, I reckon Toumpas or Newton will become lock-in starting 22 for mine.Toumpas will be an entry inside 50 specialist delivering with precision. Newton will replace Cross by mid-year and our starting midfield five will become Jones, Vince, Tyson, Viney, & Newton. Kent might slot in there as well.

You're

But, to be a good football player you need to kick goals from a set shot 20 meters out, directly in front.

I think that you have surprised the whole of Demonland by your post Bluey! Of all the players on our list, Jordie was the last that l would expect to have a break- out year!

With the age of our group, competition for spots and the wealth of development support I expect there will be many. I think Kent will have the biggest jump in his consistent performance levels. I hope for Toumpas to regain the confidence and spark that had me so excited about him when he was drafted.

I think it's high time that the law of averages operated in this area because over the past decade or so, Melbourne simply hasn't produced it's share of surprise packages. I think Lynden Dunn last year was one of the few surprises we've produced in that time. He really did lift his game to a level I certainly didn't expect. There may have been a few others in this time but our record has been that we've produced too many players who simply haven't come near the expected level. Our surprise packets have mainly been the ones who have surprisingly not produced the standards expected of them when they were recruited and that's one of the reasons we've stayed down for so long. Time for that to change.

Sorry mate, I don't know who you are talking to, but any fan worth a pinch of salt knows who Hogan is. Much like they would know who Paddy McCartin is. Key forwards who are top 10 picks gain an immediate profile. The fact Hogan has been in the system for a couple of years but is yet to play a senior game has added to his mystique, but he isn't any less well known to the football following public.

Essendon - will be missing half their team Carlton - probably bottom 2 for them, knives out for Mick by round 2 although more like round 1 or the NAB cup Saints - odds on for the spoon but Carlton may give them a run GWS - hard to pick but may improve Lions - still have a lot of deficiencies, midfield strength will get them a good share of wins but the honeymoon is over for 'Leppa' Dogs - have made some big Demon like mistakes Collingwood - probably stay where they are, don't really see them making a big move up or down GC - I would expect to make the 8 with Eade in control, a very good coach and with another year the reliance on Ablett will be less Richmond - no good, their first half season form last year is the real Richmond. Expect to see 'Dimmer' gone 2015/16 West Coast - probably around the same mark as Collingwood Geelong - taken big risks to cover ageing list with shortfalls, will slide further Freo - see Geelong but without the additions to the list. Make or break for them. Well coached so should make top 8, top 4??? Adelaide - have deficiencies, 12th - top 8 if they get a good run with injuries. Around the mark with the Pies and WC Port - a contender Swans - need a win to justify Buddy Tippett Hawks - ageing champions could slide, difficult for them to win it this year. Should finish 8 - 2 North - taken risk with Waite, think they can win it. So close yet so far...probably top 8, if the risk works still can't see them winning Us - Well it's not easy to take the big jump but Port did it a couple of years back. I would expect us to finish away from the bottom grouping and move into the middle rung this year which will give us a chance to scrape into the 8 if things go well. I think it more likely and in fact a must in 2016.

A good year for us is if we are able to get ourselves out of the bottom 4.

Our first five opponents (their previous two weeks where applicable) and location: 12th Gold Coast - MCG 16th Giants (St Kilda - Away) - Canberra 10th Adelaide (North - Home, Collingwood - Away) - Adelaide 8th Richmond (Bulldogs - Home, Brisbane - Away) - MCG 4th Fremantle (West Coat - Home, Sydney - Home) - MCG We need to win early to provide momentum and to offset and perhaps reduce late season form fluctuation. Last year, finishing 17th, we beat 13th, 10th, 8th and 7th placed teams. We lost to Gold Coast by 8 points and let GWS run away with the last quarter after being 7 points down at 3/4 time. Our defense was strong last year - in scores against we ranked 11th. I'm confident that the defense will continue to do its job and be better aided by recruits, our midfield and some increased scoreboard pressure from our forwards. Much has rightly been made of our inability to score consistently. Previously it was our inability to get the ball forward. Dawes' absence in round one will not help, but his presence thereafter will be invaluable. Garlett and Hogan (amongst the regulars) should be able to capitalise on Kent and Lumumba bombs and a more mature midfield delivery. Watts precision will be required and Bail, with eyes lowered, will give the team ample score assists. How far can we go? I'll be disappointed if we don't win eight games but if I see the application, the intent and the team capability improvements continue from last year I'll be at least comforted that steady progress in being made.

I'm another fan of the global pass, works a treat and love the option of watching any game live or in replay. Is your son a member? If not the Dees offer an international membership for $179 that includes the $149 AFL global pass (so he gets a Dees membership for $30). Or if he is a member you can get an add on to your Dees membership where they give you the global pass for $110 saving him $39. It's all here http://membership.melbournefc.com.au/packages/view/199/International-Digital-Membership

and while you're thinkin about that, think about this: the talk at the time very strongly indicated that we were looking to nab a big name (Dangerfield/J.Kennedy) by throwing that pick 23 along with pick 3 AND the pick received by trading Trengove (12?).. so it's quite possible by JT failing that medical, we missed a big name but ended up with Brayshaw, Trengove, Frost, ANB and O-Mac ALL instead of that one marquee player. Could be a huge blessing in disguise.

1997. Wooden Spoon. 1998. Fourth. Some sides can turn around things quite quickly. Not sure if this team can engineer such a dramatic turnaround, but I am definitely expecting significant improvement. I reckon 8-9 wins and a percentage in the 90s.

There should be no limit to how far we go That should be the mindset every single season Anything less than a flag is unacceptable

Pointless comparison as both players went before 23. The only way to really compare is to look at who was still there are 23 and who was picked around that pick. GWS used pick 23 to get one of the biggest shocks of the draft, Patrick McKenna the Captain of the Aus U19's Cricket Team. Not a big background in footy. Good luck to them if their punt works but it wouldn't have been our pick. Pick 24 was used by GWS to get Jack Steele. He was developed in their Academy and as far as I'm concerned at this stage certainly doesn't show any more than ANB. I'd be confident that most pundits would have picked ANB ahead of him. Pick 25 North Daniel Nielson, who looks like a reasonable prospect as a 193cm defender but is going to take 3-4 yrs to develop whereas Frost already has that development and has shown he can perform at this level. I'd take Frost over Nielson any time. Pick 26 Bulldogs Toby McLean a 179cm midfielder. We don't need any more short midfielders. This is just the first few picks around the mark. It's no wonder several of the Phantom Drafts in the press had ANB ahead of these players. So starting with Frost who also looks better than any of them especially as a potential ready made replacement for Frawley and then getting ANB and Oscar looks like a no brainer, to the extent that every pick in the draft is a gamble, these picks look outstanding results. There's really no point in saying we'll only know in a few years because that is irrelevant to the decisions that had to be made in the here and now in the trade period and the draft. Was the decision to make the trade the right decision at the time. Surely you'd have to say yes. Any of the single players we would have picked at 23 might be a fail but as others have said to get the three we got is spreading the risk so it's likely at least one or more will be great pick ups.

And why would they? Jack Watts has elite disposal, has great footy smarts, lost track of how many times last year I've thought "who the f##k is that to" only for him to hit someone on the chest in heavy traffic or put the ball out in front of someone and into space. His work ethic at times is pathetic, was it last year Dawes has to sprint 30 odd metres past Watts to man up his man, we are all aware of these types of examples. I understand the difference positions but Watts takes outside to a new level. I've seen Watts in a two in one going for a loose ball, he was in perfect position to hit the jets grab the ball and sprint away, but because of the chance of contact he pulled up and waited for his teammate(can't remember who it was) to get the ball out to him, his teammate got the ball but also got tackled resulting in a ball up and everyone flooding back. People will argue he is playing his role but I think he is the exception to some of these "non negotiables". Struggles to lay an effective tackle. He has the potential to become elite but while he continues to search for kicks in the carpark of the MCG he will continue to cop flack here and at the game as an unfulfilled talent and his name will be brought up as we near each trade week. Just remember it wasn't that long ago Trengove was untouchable.

I prefer Koyaanis-Scratchy!

Probably because we are either (due to previous disappointment) over pumping Jack up .. Or we accept the fact that what you see is what you are likely to get ( and are disappointed) .... Or.. we quietly hope that Jack will have a "breakout year" but don't say anything (because we don't want to be disappointed ...again).

OK, you're statistically innumerate, I get that. But why so serious?

I can see why you hate these arguments - but do you really believe each game has a fixed total of inside 50s?

I reckon he will be played in a defense role for the very reasons you suggest. He can get the ball and is extremely reliable in his disposal. His last game against Nth Melb last year showed his potential when he shut down Cunnington who went on to win the Roos B&F. Viv could surprise a few this season.

I know, I looked it up and created a thread concerning it, but again, we managed to keep the other team out of their forward line 6 times a game, but still could not bring it into our own one more time a game than in 2013. It is going to tough for us to get to that 'median AFL team' level - such is where we are coming from.

Unusual to see a post suggesting that Casey is too close to the CBD to attract new supporters !! As I have said above the biggest problem with Casey is the continuing perception that it is a wobbly alliance - that Melbourne will walk away from as soon as it has the finances to do so. Hawthorn has complete on-field control over the Box Hill Hawks ( formerly the Box Hill Mustangs).Do we aspire to have total on-field control over Casey ? If so we need to bury the unhelpful history of the Springvale "Scorpions" and lock in our claim to the growing gateway into Gippsland through a long-term investment in the Casey "Demons". "What's in a name?" many of you may ask. In this case, I'd suggest quite a lot . Given a say in the matter why would Melbourne want its overflow players to play for a separately- badged club - and why would it use the logo of a separately-badged club as an entree into a community ahead of a jointly-badged option. The Casey Scorpions website needs a bit of maintenance - but everything about it - including its Board - suggests that it retains control over all key decisions - including the brand. Although the Casey FC has struggled to survive we didn't have the financial strength to impose our own conditions on the alignment when it was first established. Is that still the case? If not - launch the Casey Demons.

Tyson was a very similar fighter to smokin Joe Frazier, except as we saw, had a glass jaw.... but Frazier wouldn't drop. Ali would pick Tyson off. especially the younger Cassius.

i'm still shaking my head about how well (at least potentially) it turned out - a good triple header by the look of it

i don't give a fig who as long as at least 3-4 are surprise packets and even then there is a long way to go

Ahh the old he 'would be a much better player in a good team'..Biggest myth in football history.

We've probably got about half a dozen who could fit into this category, who are at that right age and experience to start showing at AFL level. Frost Newton Michie Viney Kent Toumpas JKH Riley And then there are the draftees who could produce anything...or nothing. My guess is Newton or Toumpas to really step it up

Has Viv been training in the midfield group or backline?I thought his last game where he was playing off a half back showed some real promise. His kicking is such a weapon you just need the ball in this guys hand to set us up.

We get 3 bites at the cherry. Either Frost, ANB or Oscar Mc turn out to be a player, we've nailed it. If 2 of those 3 turn out to be players, we've hit the jackpot. If all 3 turn out to be players, we can kiss the curse goodbye.

Anyone that thinks Viney does not need to improve has seriously low expectations. He performed as second year should last year but his overall season was not the levels I expected. I suspect as a lot of players do in their third year that he will show a significant increase in his ability to run out games. I also suspect this will improve his disposal which was iffy alot of last year more out of tiring rather than mechanics. I think he is about half the player he will become and think he will make a big leap forward this year.

On the face of it, this appears to be a good trade and it looks all the more so when you consider that we might have been forced to use the pick to secure Billy Stretch as a father son selection. There were a few experts around who were surprised that one or two clubs didn't bid in the high teens/low twenties for him given his performances in the under 18 championships (All Australian) and in the senior team at Glenelg later in the season.

wow, with every side improving every year, imagine what it will be like in a few seasons' time

The question is who is going down the ladder for us to go up? Essendon- might crack a little Carlton - look to be slipping a little under Mick Saints - still at massive rebuild stage GWS - should improve Lions - pick up some good players in trade week, should improve Dogs - new coach new game plan, may slip Collingwood - lost a couple of experience players, may slip a little Gold Coast - should improve Richmond - should improve West coast- should improve The rest of the club's I can't really see us impoving enough to take there spots. We will be lucky to be 14th at the end of 2015 If any one thinks otherwise you have a bad case of off season denial.

I dream too Ron but 97 to 98 was a return to where our list deserved to be if I remember it all. 1997 was a year of injury, Tingay, Lyon, Neitz, G Lovett, Shwartz etc. Come 1998 we had those players back plus Rigoni, TJ, JMac and Robbo contributing if my memory is correct? And the Whizz! Those were the days. Are to dream we have that sort of potential on the list!

Way too early to call, which is bleedingly obvious. Appears good on paper.

Eats ,shoots and leaves taught me much about pedantic apostrophe placement. 'Tis a good 'un.

I too agree with the general tenor of the thread. I enjoy the read and dont always have time or inclination to respond. Usually I send some worthless contribution that at least makes me feel better. I do really appreciate the quick, witty and often very clever irony that just seems to spark especially from those contributors who know each other well and have continued sniping at each other until they run out of said clever invective. They usually keep me entertianed as I hope it is is friendly rivalry and not real hatred. The discussions usually bring out the best lenes so please please dont moderate them out of the game. I reckon moderators do a great job usually letting contributors know when they are getting out of hand. So Yeah I enjoy Dland

There are no more off field excuses These things have all been dealt with. It is now up to the players to see how far they want to push themselves...

FMD!! How's this for a shite start to the NY? I'm sitting here slurping a very good shiraz, and thinking up vitriol, when the Lads alert me to a blowfly ( the size of a dog) entering the premises. So I unleash enough flyspray to blow the effer into the ozone layer .... and what happens? The [censored] dive bombs straight into my shiraz!! FMD.

How many paid up members does Demonland have? A number of years ago I remember seeing the various footy sites ranked in terms of popularity. By memory the AFL site was clearly number one, bigfooty and then some of the larger clubs official sites and then Demonland came in around 8th ish. It was easily first in terms of unofficial supporter sites. Demonology was also on the list. I remember thinking that we are certainly a passionate bunch

The mods do their jobs; then they try and enforce the rules in their spare time. As far as jobs go, Demonland pays pretty poorly and is therefore prioritised as such. I've said for a while that I reckon we're undermoderated at present. To my knowledge there's only one active mod (Grapeviney) with cameos from me, WJ and Andy. We need a few 21 year olds with a good grasp on the rules, with nothing better to do but delete thread hijacks all day long. Yes, I'm describing myself 10 years ago. As to the OP - I don't think we're found wanting for active members during the season. I don't think it comes as a surprise that nobody wants to log in and talk about stuff when the club is on Christmas holidays.

This place is fine, I really think some of you are spoilt - go and have a look at Bigfooty or any other sports related forum - this place is a beacon compared to those places.

I had 100 100ml shots of egg nog. It sounds like a lot but achievable over a whole day. Sprinted to the toilet a few times. Dedication.