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Reasonable morning to watch training, pics will be up on my Twitter account Demonpk later Only 2 missing today Trengove and Roh Bail On modified program Watts, Terlich, Gawn, Spencer, Riley, McKenzie, Kent, Dawes, Harmes, Stretch, Brayshaw and to some extent Bernie Vince After the physical pounding they took on Monday, today was more about ball work, there was an interesting one being run by Ben Mathews with chain passing and it was being timed, there was another goal kicking one where they received the ball from a backwards kick from the pocket into a central position about 40 out There was also a lot of work going on with picking up ground balls Answer to a burning question, Dave Misson said it would ideal if Petracca played at around 90-92kg, he is 94 at the moment, Angus Brayshaw said he would like to play at 88kg, so yes a pair of big boys. Keeping with the new boys, I asked Billy Stretch, said he hasn't been doing a lot of extra work, just the normal footy traiinig, he said it was genetic from his old man, thinks he will have to put on some bulk. Alex Neal Bullen was a State rep in distance running so he has the tank, says his main focus will be increasing his speed, Oscar McDonald is enjoying it, relishes the hard work like his bro One person bouncing around today was Dom Tyson, so at the end asked how he was going, the smile when he answered was blinding, just pumped to be injury free and able to do every session, really enjoying the coaching, learning so much, looking at going up another notch this year and knows he needs a full pre season to do that Had a joke with JKH about his musclebound physique, which he thought was funny, persuaded him to do a 'guns' pic, will be on Twitter, a good sport Any questions feel free

Well, I played a game with him a few years ago when he was little fatter and slower... Then he got bloody serious about his footy and really is a dominant mid in the NEAFL. Easily Ainslie's most damaging player. He has a bit of dynamism to him but I don't want people to get their expectations up - he is going to find it tough to step up a few levels from NEAFL to AFL. He may even have issues at VFL level with execution of close skills, but he will get in nice and hard and low and get forward a bit. He would be very surprised to be honest - he was headed over the Centrals in SA to play next year but he will gladly have this opportunity - he is a very self-assured bloke too. You can interpret it as arrogance, but I think all players require a bit of that...

The rain looked like it would hold off so I decided to walk my unemployed self to watch what was a very enjoyable to watch training sessions. I remember reading reports from Monday that the session was mainly focused on running drills. Today's session was all about skill drills and exercises. The main part of the session was based around five groups The five groups were as follows (apologises to those who were there if I missed anyone) Group #1 The Talls/Rucks - Jamar, Hogan, Pedo, Gawn, Fitzy, King, Vince Group #2 The Backs - Garland, Tommy Mac, Dunn, Oscar Mac, Frost Group #3 Mids - Salem, Jetta, Garlett, Cross, Tyson Group #4 More Mids - Toump, Grimes, Viney, Matt Jones Group #5 Even More Mids - N.Jones, Lumumba, JKH, Newton, (think Petracca joined for a while) The five drills were as follows Kicking drill - players would kick the ball to each other Goal kicking - receiving a pass and having a shot on the run Marking drill - players would attempt to mark against Hard Ball Gets - mostly just players bending over and picking up footys on the run Midfield drill I didn't watch New draftees were involved in some boxing exercises before spreading out to the other groups. Also worth noting that Mckenzie and Spencer were involved in these boxing exercises all session Kent, Dawes, Harmes and Terlich ran laps for most of the session After groups rotated around to each drill, players split into new groups and participated in new drills There was then a midfield drill involving roving where players would pair up and attempt to gather the ball before their opponent. Players involved included N.Jones, Tyson, Lumumba, Cross, Petracca, Salem, Neal-Bullen, Viney, M.Jones. Players like Jamar and Gawn would ruck for the pairs. The boys looked like they were having a lot of fun with this one. Some drool worthy match ups including N.Jones vs Tyson as well as Cross vs Lumumba. A highlight here was when Cross and Viney were paired up. Viney ended up reading the ball better than Cross and came out on top. A few boys also practiced shots at goal Toump, Howe, JKH, Grimes, Pedders Harmes and Fitzy. A great moment when Harmes missed a shot from a snap kick and Fitzy then showed him how to do it the right way. A number of players were also participating in some more boxing exercises, couldn't identify any. Dawes, Kent, Mckenzie, Spencer, Brayshaw and Stretch left early. Noticed the number 10 was on Brayshaw's bag as he was leaving. He still has that devilish smile on his face. A few points - Toump and Tyson looked on, really on. Both were marking and kicking well throughout the entire session. - Grimes looked a lot smoother than I remember seeing him - I love watching JKH gathering the ball, so smooth and silky. Could easily see him slip into the midfield next year. - Dawes was looking very fit (as an enthusiastic supporter noted) - Didn't see Watts anywhere, neither Bail

Cringe.

Hi all, I've done a bit of an overview of our list post national draft and jotted some thoughts on who I think we should be looking at for today's rookie draft. It'll be something I look to do on a yearly basis (if there's a reasonable response, of course). Thoughts? http://chaserj.blogspot.com.au/2014/12/melbourne-fc-list-assessment-rookie.html

I called in this morning for about an hour not a lot to add to what Saty has said. I would confirm his comments about Hogan, when they were doing the goal kicking exercise Hogan hit the centre with every kick. In Total I did not see too many that missed I guess this is a good example that kicking goals at training is a lot easier than during a game when the pressure is on. I was very surprised at the size of Oscar Mac he looks to be a little taller than his big brother and almost as muscular, he could be a very big unit in a year or two. Seemed to kick quite well today so fingers crossed. Pleasantly surprised with the average physical development of the team when I think back a couple of years they make that group look like school kids. As mentioned earlier while I was there the intensity seemed to be low today. Still a bit of fun for Saty and I plus 20 others well it is the 3rd of December.

I was contemplating the recent trade ins, draftees and now rookies, and its apparent that competition for a spot in our team has gone up several notches and will be hard to earn. That Lumumba, Gartlett, Frost, Hogan, are coming into the team, with the loss of just Frawley (Clarke we never really had) means several 2014 regulars won't get a regular game. That what many reported to be the hardest day of training at the MFC occured on the same day as our high pick recruits arrived was no co-incidence. It was intended to give them a rapid reality check that simply being a high draft pick won't get you into this team in 2015 - A mental and physical shock' for Demon draftees after brutal running session, that both our two prize pick in Petracca and Brayshaw were suitably humbled was the intention. That we just picked up two new rookies Aaron Vandenberg (aged 22, 188 cm, 90 kgs) and Mitchel White (aged 18, 188 cm, 85kg), both competing for midfield and flankers spots. That Grimes reliquished the Captaincy to focus on his football, read, staying in our best 22. All indicates that Roo's is consciously creating an high performance environment with intense competition for spots in the MFC 22, and that the bar is high and getting higher. It feels different to anything I've seen at this club for a long time, and bodes well.

I like to drip feed who I talked to if they get mentioned, similar to Russian, Fitzy is fit and firing and hasn;t missed a session, if he gets though he is another one who will have their first full preseason, his marking was impacted by the shoulder issues he had in the past, which are now fixed (same with Tommy Mc), on the goalkicking drill hardly missed, but being Fitzy couldn't resist at the end practicing the checksides, he didn't miss one of them either... I posted the other week, we have quite a few 'forgotten" players who are finally getting in a full preseason....the competition for places is going to be fierce,, hoo bloody ray finally Speaking of which I also spoke to Jack Grimes, he made the decision to stop being a co captain because he knows the competition is finally going to be there and he needs to improve his on field output, he is in great nick as well, hasn't missed a session

Just ignore it. Am I the only one who gets sick of what's valuable and great about these training threads getting sidetracked by petty discussions of the form rather than the content? Comments about Saty and his questions/photos have been done to death, and presumably, everyone has had their say and pitched their tents. Time to move on.

Thank Christ. I thought we just [censored] up our near perfect under the radar offseason.

Taken from bigfooty as posted by DMoore30. ⬇️ I know a small portion of the White family and Mitch played for the same junior club as I. With good knowledge I can confirm that for his size he is a competitive kid, was a big goal kicking CHF as a junior but turned to a defender when he got selected to sting rays and Vic country, he won the FDJFL (league) best and fairest in under 15's and was a multiple best and fairest winner in a side that won 3 premierships in a row in the top division. Mitch played in the same side as Jack Lonie and Rourke Fischer, a massive kick of the footy and very athletic. Mitch was also involved in a cricket squad which went to England to tour. Multi-talented and is up for the challenge, good get for the dee's, a versitile player who can play both ends. Edit: Due to his physical strength and abilities it wouldn't surprise me if he was recruited as a big bodied midfielder. He was always an athletic foward in juniors and a versatile defender in Sting-Rays. Has the capability to become a damaging midfielder. He had a game at Fullback for Vic Country against WA in which he gathered 20 odd disposals and was damaging, one of the best on the field.

Either picked up a bit of an injury or recovering from op, being done properly, all confirmed by either the player or Dave Misson Watts -groin Terlich - ankle (op) Gawn - knee Spencer - ankle (op), bit of back soreness Riley - leg, making sure we don't damage the one he broke McKenzie - calf, had issues last season Kent - quad Dawes - history of soft tissue Harmes - glandular fever Stretch, Brayshaw - new Vince - shoulder (op)

Watch out 'P-man', he's heading for the top 5... Tyson will be the A grade mid we've been looking for, he's not far off it now.

Becuase picking a key position player would be very Clarkson?

They think if they keep getting batter, they're still in the mix.

Nice try.

For a great cause. Well done MFC and the guys. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLtN14uP8Bs

I reckon it is two drafting periods so far sweet Dee it started in November 2013

Given that nobody other than a small few had heard of Aaron Vandenberg an hour ago, I daresay you're going a tad early. I'd like to see him play, or at least train, first. And by the sounds of it, he's recovering from shoulder surgery anyway. My money is on no rookie promotion for the first few rounds at least.

Most important thing he said was that ASADA have the evidence and don't need him.

In almost every proposed 2015 22 posted Jeremy Howe is selected in the forward line. He played some good footy in the backline in 2014 after appearing completely lost in the forward line. When did he make the switch back - did I miss something? Which group is he training with? I think he's well-suited to playing in the backline and that's where I'd have him.

I love how Ess fans are shouting ASADA case relies on evidence of a convicted criminal. The criminal Hird had a close relationship with for how many years and the one of the Ess employees used to import drugs through???

Yep, that certainly gives good cause to ignore the rest of TDI's informative training report... go forbid, a little levity!!

Brett Anderson ‏@BrettAndersonIF 11m11 minutes ago Pumped that Mitch White got a chance. Stingrays' rave about him but just had a bad run with injuries. #AFLDraft

Better than 'Pet.' I said pet, I said love, I said darl, I said pet - get the effing ball! Actually, I don't mind that...

Yep,i myself get them all the time.

I don;t often post, but thought i might weight in here as i do have an honours degree is Statistics. Day 1 of first year Statistics you will generally be presented with the "Birthday Paradox": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthday_problem In your class of 30 people - there is a 70% chance that two people share a birthday. Much higher than you might expect. (A lot of people wrongly predict 30/365 are the odds). In this, as in many probability problems, you need to look at the "complementary" (opposite) event. i.e. What are the odds that in a class of 30 no-one shares a birthday. This is 365/365 * 364/365 * 363/365 *362/365 * ....... * 336/365 = 29.4%. (or a 70.6% chance that people share a birthday). For our class of 5 draftees. the odds that 2 share a birthday are: 1 - 365/365 * 364/365 * 363/365 * 362/365 *361/365 = 2.7%. i.e. Pretty low. But extrapolate this across 18 clubs with 5 draftees. The odds that at least one club has a pair of draftees with the same birthday is (again using complementary events): 1 - (97.3%)^18 = 39%. i.e. Pretty good odds. Probability & Statistics on the Demonland Board - Let the Good Times Roll!

I don't hope, I know. We will see over the next months who is right OD: your relentless pessimism seemingly on all things, or my views on informed balance of probabilities. Best of luck!

PJ now 100% focused on the MFC (not that he wasn't) http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-12-01/jackson-quits-afl-victoria-to-focus-on-dees

as the Dees FB post mentioned today, both Robbo and Davey came in as rookies (they didn't mention James McDonald for some reason!) Three of the very best players we've had in the last 20 years You just never know

and demonland reports on all media sources can't see the problem, all power to the [censored] jerks

This matter has developed expeditiously from a football team taking drugs a couple of years ago to a subliminal major criminal investigation that in my opinion may only include ASADA and Essendon in a peripheral sense. There are now a number of figures too numerous to mention that are ringing very heavy alarm bells to me.

I wouldn't promote unless it leads immediately to a game in the 1sts - otherwise why bother ?

Back in the present, Whispering Jack discovers the cure for the club's ailments ... A HIGHWAY OF DEMONS by Whispering Jack CHAPTER TWELVE - THE DELISTING OF JOE BTFSPLK "Well I'll be damned Here comes your ghost again But that's not unusual It's just that the moon is full And you happened to call" ~ Diamonds and Rust by Joan Baez It was the day of the AFL National Draft. I ventured out into the crisp morning air for a light jog to clear the head after what had been a hard week at work. With no particular course in mind, I simply ambled along in a random direction followed by the silky white clouds of misty breathing. At the end of the road, I discovered that I had stumbled by accident upon a place full of long forgotten memories buried deep in the past. It was my old school bus stop. There used to be a petrol station on the corner of North Road and now it's a fire station but the seating outside where we waited for the bus remains in place with a new roof so that today it provides shelter for travellers who sit in patience waiting for their ride. I was in the very spot where I alighted the number 10 bus every school morning and the memories of 1964 came flooding back. I was a young teenager holding the Sun News-Pictorial open at the comic section where my favourite was Li'l Abner by satirist and artist Al Capp. I recalled the many famous characters of the comic strip, whose images has been hidden from mind for more than half a century. Abner Yokum and his sweetheart Daisy Mae, Mammy and Pappy, Moonbeam McSwine, Sadie Hawkins, Earthquake McGoon, Rotten Ralphie and other residents of Dogpatch and the dystopian Lower Slobbovia. There were also assorted other characters like Fearless Fosdick, Senator Phogbound, General Bullmoose and the controversial Joanie Phoanie who sang revolutionary songs of class warfare like "Molotov Cocktails for Two". Capp had bitingly and unfairly used the character to parody singer/songwriter Joan Baez. Somewhere at home I had an album by the real Joan singing sweet songs of peace and freedom and it was close to my heart. Suddenly, he appeared in my mind's eye: the iconic Li'l Abner character whose image best describes the sad condition that has infected my football team during that long gulf in time that separates then and now. Joe Btfsplk was the world's worst jinx, a man whose very presence caused instantaneous bad luck to befall anyone unfortunate enough to be in his vicinity. Joe had a perpetually dark rain cloud over his head and despite the fact that he was well-meaning and friendly, people avoided him like the plague. I realised then and there exactly what had to be done. I turned around and with heat pounding, I made my way home running faster, yet more smoothly in stride than I had done in many years. Thoughts bounced through my head all of the way back and when I got there, I went directly into the study where I found a large sheet of white paper, a drawing pencil, crayons and some ink. I worked feverishly, drawing rectangular boxes, sketching characters and scenes within them and after an hour, withdrew to view my work. Modesty prevents me from describing it as a masterpiece. The first box portrays the scene in an office where a Christmas tree adorned with festive decorations sits in a corner next to a calendar showing the month of December 1964. A newspaper of the day is visible showing a front page picture of Melbourne Football Club hero Ronald Dale Barassi wearing a Carlton guernsey. The two men standing in the office appear to be in shock, their faces ghostlike. They are Stormin' Norman Smith and Jumpin' Jim Cardwell, leading figures in the most successful football team over the past decade. The next box is a close-up of Jumpin' Jim with a dialogue balloon that says, "Water under the bridge Norm. He's gone and there's nothin' we can do about it now!" Moving to the right we see Norm and his response, "I suppose you're right. The silver spoon mob destroyed any chance we had to keep him and now, we have to move forward ... Did I hear a knock on the door?" Norm's hearing is good because in the next frame we see the unmistakable figure of Joe Btfsplk standing before them with the customary dark cloud hovering over his head. Then another Jumpin' Jim close-up, almost identical to the last, but this time a touch of red lights up his chubby left cheek. "Sit down Joe and thanks for coming. Norm and I have been talkin' and ... er ... well, um ... we think your future here is limited. We're moving you on. You've been delisted. Oh, and on your way out, can you ask that young Alves feller outside to come in please?" The following scenes show thunderous storms surrounding the M.C.G with heavy rain lashing the old Grey Smith Stand doomed to fall soon under the wrecker's ball. The 1965 season is well under way and Stormin' Norman has just been sacked as coach. The Demons are on the other side of town playing the Kangaroos under stand-in coach Checker Hughes and are on their way to defeat. A week later, Smith is reinstated but the team keeps losing and slips out of the finals for the first time in more than a decade. I sensed that the hand of Joe Btfsplk was behind this despite or perhaps because of his delisting. But something more still had to be done so I spent the rest of draft day trying to come up with a solution. By mid-afternoon, when I thought I finally had the answer, I went back to the drawing board and kept working away for a couple of hours until the stroke of seven o'clock in the evening and my work was done. Just in the nick of time. This time the first box is dominated by the hulking figure of Abner, all 191 centimetres of him (or 6' 3" on the old scale) with hat in hand, and next to him stands the diminutive Joanie Phoanie, the sad-eyed lady of the lowlands. "Joanie, Mr. Capp probably won't agree with me sayin' this but on behalf of the good citizens of Dogpatch, I want to sincerely apologise to you for the hurt, his nasty attacks caused you. We're sorry." The following box features Joanie, her eyes now lit up, placing a gentle kiss on Abner's cheek and the ones that follow show the modern municipality of Dogpatch bathed in sunshine. The swamps and the piggeries are gone, the streets are clean and green and the townspeople all look happy. Joe Btfsplk is standing in the crowd but the storm clouds no longer sit over his head. They have been replaced by a rainbow halo. The next strip contains vision of a scene at the Gold Coast Convention Centre and it contains five rectangular boxes, all of them depicting the same white haired man and the five balloons above him bearing the following words, "Player number 214953 Jubilation C Petracca ... Eastern Ranges, Beverley Hills Junior Football Club", "Player number 215163 Available Angus Brayshaw ... Sandringham Dragons, Hampton Rovers", "Player number 214809 Smilin' Alex Neal-Bullen ... Glenelg, Klimpton Football Club", "Player number 215424 Stupefyin' Billy Stretch ... Glenelg, Henley Sharks Football Club", "Player number 214991 Oscar Colossal McDonald ... North Ballarat Rebels, Edenhope-Apsley". The bad luck that inflicted this football club for so long is gone. We're over players killed in tsunamis, tanking sagas, footballers involved in machete attacks, sacked coaches, mental illness, parents killed in car accidents, dodgy sponsors, merger talks, drunken players in jail, outside casinos and urinating in bars, lazy and incompetent officials, disgruntled players, presidents, club legends and coaches dying before their time, salary cap breaches, debilitating injuries and bungled drafts. With the ghosts of the past buried and the curse of Norm Smith gone with it, the picture should be clear. We're ready to take on the world.

So he must be almost as good as Tom Mitchell I guess?

I named Aaron Vandenberg as someone we will look at pick 53 last week. He had a meeting at the club prior to the draft. 190cm ball magnet midfielder. Got 56 disposals in one game this year.

What the Essendon mafia are doing is in effect a takeover bid, for control of the AFL. If Essendon is successful in finding the loopholes in the present anti-drug rules, and therefore open up a way to be free to resume systematic doping, I fear the entire AFL will out of competitive necessity end up adopting Essendon's values and modus operandi. Bye bye footy as we know and love it. FU, Essendon. Why doesn't the government step in to stop such a repellant attempted takeover? The more time the Essendon legal team are allowed, the more ploys they are coming up with to tangle the whole inquiry in legalities, thus removing the focus further and further from the original alleged systematic doping offences. Essendon make no pretence of being against drugs in sport, and the whole saga is now becoming a test case for drug-cheating. Essendon must be aware of that, so must the AFL, ASADA and WADA, and so must government. The ramifications of what they are doing clearly don't concern Essendon - they could for example very easily (and responsibly) make a public statement clarifying their intentions in the actions they have taken, making suitable assurances about their views on drugs in sport - but they haven't. Their silence on the matter indicates that they don't mind being potentially seen as the ones who legally cleared the way for future drug-cheating. Government too is apparently content to do nothing about this shift in the way football (and consequently all sport) is able to be played, the result of their permitting focus to shift in this case from being about clean sport to being about procedural disputation over the right of laws to be applied to wrong-doers. Is the government, the law so powerless, so compromised? This case is a matter of serious cultural significance to Australia, to Victoria - but neither State or Federal government has stepped up in any way to protect football. Is anyone going to make this all end in a win for drug-free sport? As long as Essendon call the shots, the answer is certainly "no". So, who is going to be our (the football public's) champion? The lawyers?... Will someone stand up to the current process, oppose the takeover, and change the trajectory that Essendon currently has us all on?

Nice work as always Chaser, wouldn't mind Hammelmen & Capiron. Keital an outside chance but is currently way off on his time trials. Eddy may also be worth a look to see if his SANFL form can be transferred as a fallback third tall option should injury strike any of our forwards

Had too much time on my hands, came across this, perhaps the legals here might like to comment. It's from the WADA code, and covers the "right to silence" and/or refusing to answer questions: 3.2.4 The hearing panel in a hearing on an anti-doping rule violation may draw an inference adverse to the Athlete or other Person who is asserted to have committed an anti-doping rule violation based on the Athlete’s or other Person’s refusal, after a request made in a reasonable time in advance of the hearing, to appear at the hearing (either in person or telephonically as directed by the hearing panel) and to answer questions from the hearing panel or the Anti-Doping Organization asserting the anti-doping rule violation. [Comment to Article 3.2.4: Drawing an adverse inference under these circumstances has been recognized in numerous CAS decisions.]

Petracca and Brayshaw look so un-MFC like for draftee midfielders to the club. Neither are choir boys. Bloody pumped. About time. I have always loved this club. And it feels like it is finally starting to pay me back.

The alternatives were simply unpalatable at the time. http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/melbournes-leadership-conundrum-20120121-1qbhv.html?rand=1327152211992 This Jake Niall article sums up our quandary. The thread below reinforces the view that whilst most (including yourself WYL at the time) were wary of appointing Grimes, Trengove or both, they couldn't point to an alternative. Jones receives scant consideration. Others thrown up were Moloney, Jamar or Frawley. The retention of Green was rejected by the vast majority. http://demonland.com/forums/index.php?/topic/29227-narrowing-in-on-either-grimes-or-trengove-for-captain/ We were simply in a lose/lose situation. If I had my time over, I still don't know which option I'd prefer. PS WYL - Don't read that thread all the way to the end. You may not like what you wrote about Neeld.

Thread heading into weird places.

I don't know how I could handle life being a Melbourne supporter and a Jets fan. What a deadly cocktail that would be.

I just keep watching his highlights, looks very ready to line up in round 1 for my money.. very complete and physically mature player.. what were you thinking St.Kilda you muppets

I too think he is perfectly suited to being the best player of the modern era.

Gee it sure feels bloody great to have a string of great things happen to the club. Now we just need to start winning - regularly.

We should never underestimate what this man has done for our Club.

Thanks MW was going to do all that, you saved me the effort.

The odds of someone posting about Angus on this thread are getting slimmer...