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Jurrah urged to 'be strong' ahead of committal hearing A committal hearing is a proceeding before a magistrate who is required to determine the question whether there is sufficient evidence to justify the case against an accused. If there is such evidence then the matter goes to trial. In Liam Jurrah's case, that would most likely mean a trial by jury at some time in 2013. However, the magistrate can decide there is insufficient evidence for a case to succeed and therefore throw out the charges. We can't for legal reasons comment too much about the case but I'm sure that the whole Demon community wishes Liam well and hopes that the best possible outcome including peace within his community can be achieved within the near future. I think it's great knowing that Liam has the support of the club and his mentor (and biographer) Bruce Hearn Mackinnon who will be at his side during this difficult time. I'm sure he will also be in the minds of thousands of others who won't physically be there but wish him all the best and look forward to a speedy return to both his home community of Yuendumu and to the football fields on which he provides us with the gift and excitement of his great skills.

Lets put everything aside, history, recruiting, past coaching indiscretions, and concentrate on one very simple stat. In the first quarter tonight, we kicked a bigger score than we kicked for the remaining 3 quarters. Despite Port activating their sub in the first quarter, and having another very sick player on the ground. Last week we lost because we apparently ran out of legs. This week, we've been apparently preparing for this climate and had full use of our bench for the whole match, so what's this week's excuse? I fully understand that our list has some holes. Our midfield is horrible, yet players like Magner and Couch, who we all know will never been A graders, are getting a game ahead of Gysberts and Morton. If Neeld wants tough in and under players like Magner and Couch, he should understand that he also needs very good outside support because these guys are rubbish users of the ball. Yet both of these guys were used in attacking roles for the last few weeks. Why? Garland has had a good month up forward, and Rivers is an absolute leader of troops down back. Yet Garland was kept in the backline until the last 10 minutes of the match, despite having a dirty game defensively, and Rivers was never switched back to help. Why? Neeld persists with Dunn down back, who lacks strength and accountability, but who is a beautiful kick at goal, and yet we can't kick to save ourselves. Why? Nothing is ever so black and white that we can categorically say "problem X is the absolute core of our issues". But a senior coach who cannot react mid games, a senior coach who cannot motivate his players to push past their opponents even from very winnable positions, and a senior coach who seemingly won't budge on tactics, is a senior coach who deserves to be questioned. If you just blindly follow what is put in front of you, then you have nobody but yourself to blame for the disappointment that may come your way.

Every Melbourne game consists of a Howe screamer, a Blease goal on an acute angle, and a bunch of shite football in between.

Yes. I really think we can and it's possibly not as far away as you might think and I wouldn't take too much notice of what's happening this year as the new football regime takes stock of what we have and what we need. I suspect that our training levels will rise dramatically in the off season and we'll start seeing results in 2013 and 2014. Of course, we need a lot of things to go right with our recruiting and player development over the next 2 or 3 years but it can happen.

I've been avoiding this thread for 24 hours but can't resist contributing. When I'm not working or spending time with my family or on Demonland, I'm obsessing over the team I coach. I coach an open women's footy team up here in Queensland. I've got players ranging in age from 15 to 35. We play in a 7 team competition across south-east Queensland. I have 30 players on my list and the best 15 are all deserving of higher recognition. The very best 4 or 5 would easily be talented enough and committed enough to represent a Brisbane team in a national competition. The best 30 in the Brisbane region across the seven teams would be a very competitive unit. They'd be fit, athletic and in most cases highly skilled. In my team alone I have three players who are equally adept on both sides of their body. Many of my team are elite middle distance runners. The most athletically talented members of my team could easily have chosen another sport and made money playing professionally but have instead decided to play the game they love - sadly a game with a limited chance of them being recognised as professionals. The very fact that a rank amateur like me is their coach speaks volumes regarding the challenges women's footy confronts. A few years ago a '2020 Vision' was published with the goal of introducing a national league for female footballers. Most who are involved with women's footy sadly think this is still a pipedream and when I have a quick glance to some of the responses in this thread I am reminded of why. For those with a genuine interest regarding the state of female footy check our the link below where the best female talent in the country will play an exihibition game at 10am today. The High Performance Academy members have been together in Melbourne over the past week (and met with Brad Green and Matthew Bate) and will conclude their week with a game at Visy Park. If you do catch some of the game take particular note of the youngest player out there (a young ruck from QLD who has just turned 15) and you might just think the 2020 Vision might yet me realised. http://www.aflcommun...ndex.php?id=753

As you said it... playing lists do NOT change dramatically... so either everyone was wrong and our list wasn't as good as everyone thought or the coach has actually made things worse. If we look at the development of players like jones, mcdonald, grimes, watts, nicholson, to some degree howe are you saying that our coaching panel has turned us backwards? Honestly if you run through our list i rekon it was really over rated. Theres other threads looking at our list and the players haven't changed but we still have negative things to say about half of them which was still true last year. We really needed a new coach and defensive structures to allow our team to develop and progress. It was hard watching today's game but hopefully after another full preseason, continued learning and development and hopefully recruiting some players with football smarts we can move forward.

No accountability on or off the ground. Mark Neeld has a hell of a lot to answer for, and our list seems to be a lot worse than anyone could foresee after years of rebuilding.

This is by far the hardest game I've had to watch for a mighty long time. My brain is just hurting so badly. Thank God there is nothing riding on this. Especially when we have no dignity remaining anyway. Clark and Jurrah play and this game is iced at half time.

Why bring on Strauss as sub in the heat than play him in a back pocket. What a waste! Silly move by Neeld move his run up the ground

Thank christ for that...

Bommers getting pantsed has put a smile on my face. I'd like a win for the MFC though

Dr ... just take another quick look. I urge you to reconsider.

I was at lunch in the Jim Stynes Room for the Richmond game. When I went to the lift Neil Craig and a young player were ahead of me. He stood back, put his arm in front of the player and said "Members first". That struck me as balance. I might have spoilt the moment though when he asked "So, looking forward to a good game?" "Nope. I'm looking forward to a win." He did give a wry smile.

Liam couldn't hope for a more empathetic magistrate than David Bamber. Very aware of all the difficulties LJ has faced. Bamber is from Melbourne and a Demons supporter.

68 dreamteam points. A better average than Kreuzer.

I dont completely understand your agenda hardnut but whatever it is take it somewhere else. Our forwardline tonight on paper was the worst you could possibly see and it really was only second to our disposal forward of centre. . The list was rated highly based on where players were chosen in the draft not based on their output or the balance of the list. Our mids were rubbish last year and they're rubbish this year

Well as a Darwin resident I attended...but left before the siren as Im absolutely fed up with this crap. It bloody breaks ya heart. First quarter i thought here we go then when I left we had 2 goals in 3 quarters. I sat right next to the emergencies and coaches box, they were very quiet in there. Im not sure about the crowd but I wouldnt think it would be more than 7500-8000 and a very poor atmosphere. Jake Spencer - walk away from the game son. Jetta - take a bow. What he lacks for in pace he makes up for in footy smarts. Grimes - was good Sylvia - did try to lift us but to no avail. Trengove - first time I've seen him play this year live & I agree he looks awfully slow. Tom McDonald - may well be our best backman. Bail - tried hard to break the lines Petterd - hmmm, not the player he was. Green - great first quarter, did try his heart out. Couch - major thumbles. Magner - is a good VFL player. Disposal nowhere near AFL standard. Slow Nicholson - broke the lines but can get too excited and caught in trouble too often. Martin - slowed right up but offers so much more around the ground than Jamar, nice goal. The heat was not an issue as it was quite chilly after half time. We had been training for it for a month anyway. Im really disappointed with that performance, Im usually quite positive but I have seen enough this year to warrant disgust, when is this team going to improve, we have been rebuilding since 2007 and still we are no better on field, our skills are quite possibly the worst in the league and its not good enough. Mark Neeld has all the right people around him but as Ive said before hes done nothing yet to excite me, Im still sitting on the fence as to whether he can actually coach. We will know more next year with hopefully some better players & less injuries but he'd better improve. We were probably ahead in the free kick count but jee wizz the umpires stooged us with some stupid decisions. I did not enjoy myself at all tonight at TIO and walk away with only 3 things that impressed me. 1. Jeremy Howes mark 2. The speed at which Neil Craig chews chewing gum 3. How many snakes alive the emergencies and coaches go through. The rest of it can go to hell. Over it and not wasting my weekends anymore this year watching this shambles. Sorry to be negative guys but just sick of it and the crap we all cop being MFC supporters.

Time for a supporter and member driven rebellion. The club is a laughing stock.

1. Moloney - He's been worked out, and the game has passed him by. 2. Trengove - Played one of his best games of the year tonight. Slow, but from reports he's under the stress of a difficult training regime 3. Grimes - Played one of the better games of his career tonight. 4. Frawley - Definitely has gone backwards. I'm a little worried, but he's not where the problem lies. 5. Davey - His desire and speed are both gone. The game had already passed him by when Bailey was still in charge. 6. Bail - He was never that good. 7. Jamar - He's played one good year in his entire career. He has 1 strength; The ability to win taps. However, they don't go anywhere useful. They never have. 8. Magner - Definitely being played in the wrong position. This is on Neeld. 9. Petard - He's been shite since about halfway through 2010. Hardly any of your list is Neeld's fault, IMO.

I don't think Bailey's game would have stood up in finals, no doubt, but to blame him for the ineptitude we are seeing now is just cowardly. Neeld makes the calls on who to play and where. He chose to play two rucks in this heat, to have a sub with zero fitness base, to play a tiny makeshift forward line. He tells our players to kick across the ground, even if they cannot actually kick. He is responsible for centre bounce set ups, where we are often hopeless out of position and chasing our opponent. He may not have inherited the fittest or best skilled list, but he inherited a list with lots of good young players who have now gone backwards. It's not all his fault, but when you are leading, you need to take accountability.

Boring game, predictable result. Not fussed by the result at all, it's the same crud we've served up all year so I'm pretty used to it now.

The biggest difference is he probably would have ripped into his teammates for being so stupid and lazy.

Our Trengove is better than their Trengove.

I dont suppose anyone possibly thinks we might actually be t........... surely not !!! lol

I'm surprise because we're playing way worse than we did just one quarter ago.

Has Mark Neeld ever made a positional change during a game that anyone can recall?

Let the coaching staff walk home - the players might win a game in the next few weeks without coaching 'help'!

Getting sick of hearing out on the full.

Stef Martin! Not many ruckmen can do that. If it was Nic Nat, there would be jizz all over the commentary box.

Have spoken to him a few times and he is a strong minded man. He is big on integrity and principle and will be a leading component of our club's culture change. He is very impressive with solid experience in many areas of football and sport generally.

Restricted free agent. Give the Bombers nothing.

Redlegger WE need the MONEY and will for some time That is the total story. So we need to get used to the idea and problems. I struggle with the idea it could make us worse. Can we slip much further than 2 wins?

Headlines in today's NT NEWS: "FIRE AND ICE - record cold snap has Territorians reaching for the kindling" For info, minimum tonight is forecast to be 15 degrees, maximum 29 - it's all relative I guess. Staying with my brother who recommends I rug up tonight for the game "'cos it's gonna get cold Bro." Played golf at Marrara last evening - was still 26 at 6.30. I was here last year for the Dees v Port and recommend it as a cultural experience not to be missed.

go away bluey

Not unless you turn the clock back 300 years.....

And so the trolling 'ology members warned off has commenced

My "quadrella" looks something like this - and as is known I don't follow U18 footy so my selections are representative: 3: Jack Martin - there has to be quality in the U17 draft and it ensures GWS pass on Viney 4: Toumpas - or whoever is best mid 13: Boak or Caddy - I don't want 4 x 18yos, B&C want to leave, we can overpay them to convince them come to us and 13 is unders 25: Viney That gives a balance of star potential and immediate improvement.

Nasher, do you ever wonder what Melbourne supporters watch on tv ? I mean, do they watch other sides play ? Do they watch the good ones ? Do they watch Hawthorn, or Collingwood, or the great Geelong teams ? If they do why do they argue over which C grader is better than the other, or which one should be kept ? Why do they care so much about crud footballers ? Is it some forlorn hope that they'll come good ? Explain it to me, as I'm genuinely baffled.

I was introduced to both sites by Whispering Jack in early 2004 and chose to post on Demonology as I found it much easier on the eyes and to navigate although I have read Demonland quite often. I have made many friends around Australia through Demonology meeting up with them around the country. I see no point in bagging any Demon supporter or either site and IMO those who choose to do so need to have a rethink. I rang Tim Stanes today and he spoke positively about the meeting tomorrow although he will not attend due to ill health. Thanks to Jack and George for their efforts and I hope the meeting produces some positive strategy which results in the revival of Demonology. In the meantime I will continue to read this site for which I am grateful.

He's wearing socks with thongs. Clearly a criminal.

I see on the club's website, they're pushing a training camp, and another "one or two games" a year in Darwin. I understand the financial pressures, but the climate's just too harsh up there, and two or (worse) three trips up there during winter could really be too much. It's not just the week of the match but the effect of the humidity on the players the following week that would be the worry. Melbourne (the city) needs a boutique 25K to 30K stadium along the lines of (but not) Visy Park for these smaller games. I fear 3 games in Darwin would do us no good at all.

I also enjoy reading and sometimes posting on both sites. Would love to attend but the hour's drive home would ensure that I would be in trouble from my carlton supporting partner. As it is I'll be at a mate's house watching while she watches her blues (hopefully) get beaten at home.

....And I think that will do, agree with McQueen./

You may not know this but J.Viney shed close to 8kgs post broken jaw - same game Gysberts broke his jaw. Viney lost some conditioning. I gather Jordan would have too - so it would have limited his fitness. I saw Gysberts play against Werribee and he was literally out on his feet and was kept quiet. Quite telling. Numerous interchanges gasping for oxygen. He looks to have conditioned himself better of late and his numbers are on the rise. But my point stands with regards to the like for like in and outs for this week. I'm sure he will get a run soon enough.

Not sure that Big Jake has it however it is fair to say he is 7 - 8 games into a season that did not start till six weeks after everyone else. I am cutting him a little slack, not easy to fire up after being out a full year with a knee reconstruction. Give them hell up north son.

On ya big Spence, hope you really put in a big one tomorrow.

hahah WYL your such a tool, your making all these judgements from another country? That explains everything...

Agreed and there is absolutely no competition or animosity between the site owners and "staff". In fact it is the exact opposite. Over the years we have worked together on many projects and functions. Demonland co-founder Whispering Jack is working very hard to get Demonology back up and running. There is definitely room for both sites to coexist and complement each other and the official site.

I don't blame Melb for keeping him. It's not unusual for a new coach to want a look at all of the players at his disposal. He's given him every opportunity, but he's simply not good enough. He's not good enough in the midfield and he's not good enough on a forward flank. There's no point hoarding players that won't take you to the next level.

1. Jetta played a good game for Casey. 2. Jetta ran the game out well. 3. Jetta is from South W.A 4. Jetta fits into the game style that Neeld is trying to build. 5. It may be a bit premature to bring him back after one game back at Casey but what other cards do we hold? We don't exactly have a full house atm....