Just did a quick check of Wheelo's page and found that only three players this season polled coaches votes in 16 games - two from Gold Coast (Rowell and Miller) and Gawn. What an extraordinary achievement in a team that only won 7 times. That is consistency of a remarkable level.

1) Flower

2) Lyon

3) Oliver

4) Schwarz

5) Stynes

Gawn seems like the natural successor to Stynes.

1 hour ago, Little Goffy said:

I agree but with one caveat...

So far.

I have the smallest glimmer of a feeling that his successor is already on our list.

Massive call on Bison - but lets hope you are right.

Who expected Gawn to end up here? For years he was that tall guy with the beard or the one with the name you could make "gone" puns from. I really don't know who's the best. But would I be wrong saying Gawn mainly takes workman-like reliable marks over and over. Apart from THAT Geelong preliminary final he's not really a highlights package. That's not necessary but it's yet another way he's just slowly worked his way into this conversation over 15 years

29 minutes ago, monoccular said:

Massive call on Bison - but lets hope you are right.

He's talking about Sharp. 😂😂😂

13 hours ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

About 8 - 10 years ago there was a poll/thread speculating on the greatest Demons. ( i searched but couldn't find it )

As I recall , the top three centered around Robbie, Neitz and Barassi.

I reckon now Max Gawn must not only be added to that that notable list but ... arguably ... be placed at the top.

Comments.

Agreed. He has achieved so much. AA’s premiership, premiership captain. Pity he wasted a couple of years at the beginning of his career.

Whether the best of all time, not sure, (I'd like us to get someone soon who also surpasses him as well:) )

but I would place him equal on top of the tree with a select few group of great players for our club. For me it was still Flower, nut I'll put Gawn, and Barassi together with him in terms of players. Then Norm Smith as a player and coach.

17 hours ago, Roost it far said:

I grew up on Robbie Flower and I just can’t go past him as the greatest MFC player I’ve seen. However for the ability to grind it out year after year Max has few peers, 8 AA’s, Captain of a Premiership side and those continual marks down the line make him likely to become recognised as our greatest ever.

Yeah have to agree, Max is sensational but the measure of Rob Flower were his BOG state games and his finals record albet briefly. As any opponent and all the great wingmen Grieg, Shimelbusch, Turner, Hawkins and anyone else all say the same thing. Champion player, and better still, champion bloke!

Edited August 29Aug 29 by picket fence

10 hours ago, Little Goffy said:

I agree but with one caveat...

So far.

I have the smallest glimmer of a feeling that his successor is already on our list.

who

The dilemma for me is how to compare eras!

Flower and Gawn have claims to the Best Demon but I've concluded it is Barassi!

• 6 x Premierships, 2 as captain

• 2 x Premiership BOG ie Norm Smith Medal equivalent

• 2 x BnF

• 2 x Leading Demon goal kicker (Somehow, I never knew this😲)

• 5 x Demon captain

• Widely recognised as the best player in the league and maybe GOAT.

Never won a Brownlow most likely because teammates 'took' votes and probably not the fairest player. As an aside, there were no Demon winners during those glory demon days.

AA and Coaches Awards weren't invented then. Would have won a few.

Forgiven for leaving because he came back and to his last days was red and blue through and through.

Can't split Flower and Gawn for a close 2nd spot. Both special, different talents. Both not recognised enough in the wider AFL community. Both brought joy in some not so successful years.

Edited August 29Aug 29 by Lucifers Hero

For me Robbie Flower just shades Max.

If not for injury I think would have been Jackovich. An absolute freak that had it all.

Sincere apologies to the Ox.

Norm Smith (who I did not see play but I come from a long line of Dees supporters who spoke so highly of him), Ron Barassi, Robbie Flower, Max Gawn, Clayton Oliver.

All for very different reasons, but all have one equal ingredient - unstoppable. Smith for nous & skill, Barassi for heart and effort, Flower for skill grace and speed, Max for tap work marking and ridiculous fitness, Oliver for grunt clean hands and contested beast mode.

Best of the 5? - I have Flower & Oliver as my equal top.

Gawn and Barassi are the most influential of the 5. All players around them stand taller because of their effort and leadership.

Below this five you have a LOT of players - Hardeman, Wells, Alves, Lyon, B Lovett, Farmer, Stynes, Neitz, Jones, Petracca, etc...

And 3 others cruelled by injury - Shwarz (who would have probably been our best ever), Jakovich and Tingay.

)

1 hour ago, Lucifers Hero said:

Never won a Brownlow most likely because teammates 'took' votes and probably not the fairest player. As an aside, there were no Demon winners during those glory demon days.

Yeah, and another factor was probably that characteristically for Barass he was ahead of his time, and in the one-umpire era he often took it upon himself to help out with the officiating by giving advice to the umpires, and usually not with sugar-coated delivery!

He wasn’t your exquisitely gifted exponent of the skills of the game like Tulip, but was a force of nature around the ball. You can see it in the YouTube videos that are around; he was fitter, stronger and more intense in the contest than everyone else, but also was footy smart and made the most of his skills. He’s rightly in the mix in the discussion of Greatest Demon in terms of team outcomes - and team outcomes are what we all crave.

Edited August 29Aug 29 by Tim

11 hours ago, chook fowler said:

Indisputably the greatest ever ruckman

I thought media folks loved to compare against Cox in the AFL era - and then the convo harks back to Madden....

22 hours ago, whatwhat say what said:

he's the greatest ever imo

no one else comes close - barassi walked out on us, flower never lead the team to premiership glory, and neitz the same

to do what max has done - be the greatest player ever for his position - is something that will be gloried for years to come

I think he might be just started, you know.

Lock it in!

You might like to transfer the discussion to this similar thread as discussion will most likely duplicate

Edited August 29Aug 29 by Lucifers Hero

20 hours ago, praha said:

My personal top 10 (in order), based on what I've personally witnessed.

1. Max Gawn

2. Clayton Oliver (until 2023)

3. Jeff Farmer

4. Gary Lyon

5. Christian Petracca

6. Jack Viney

7. Angus Brayshaw

8. Jim Stynes

9. Kozzie Pickett

10. The Ox

Honourable mentions

• Steven May

• Adam Yze

• Sean White

• Brett Lovett

• Nathan Jones

1. Flower (maybe my age bias)

2. Oliver (till 2023 agree)

3. Max

4. Petracca

5. Kozzie (little bit best yet to come and could go higher)

6. Farmer

7. Lyon

8. Neitz

9. Stynes

10. Schwartz & Jakovich both cruel led by injury & could have been anything

Notables: Wells, Alves

Flower, Kozzie, Farmer, Schwartz & Jakovich could all do the unbelievable, such a pity last two injury challenged!

70’s and onward stars, never saw Barassi play as a Demon!

3 hours ago, ghost who walks said:

who

Picket

9 minutes ago, D4Life said:

1. Flower (maybe my age bias)

2. Oliver (till 2023 agree)

3. Max

4. Petracca

5. Kozzie (little bit best yet to come and could go higher)

6. Farmer

7. Lyon

8. Neitz

9. Stynes

10. Schwartz & Jakovich both cruel led by injury & could have been anything

Notables: Wells, Alves

Flower, Kozzie, Farmer, Schwartz & Jakovich could all do the unbelievable, such a pity last two injury challenged!

70’s and onward stars, never saw Barassi play as a Demon!

started really watching footy in the mid-80s, and i'll go...

1. gawn

2. flower

3. stynes

4. neitz

5. lyon

6. petracca

7. oliver

8. schwarz

9. farmer

10. pickett

i fully expect pickett to rocket past the ox and the wizard, at least, by the end of his time at the dees

if jakovich and jurrah hadn't flamed out then they'd probably be toward the top of the pile - to get less than 50 games from either was such a shame

I see Don has been visited by the same gypsy woman who confirmed for me that we are locked in for the 2028 premiership.

Gawn is certainy up there, but Robbie Flower is near impossible to dethrone as the greatest Demon for me. He had the loyalty and never-say-die attitude of Nathan Jones, the skill and poise equal to few if any in the league today (think Pendlebury's decision-making and sense of space, Kozzy's pace and the kicking skills of Bailey Dale/Touk Miller/whoever), the versatility to play just about anywhere apart from the ruck, and courage in spades, especially from a bloke who was as skinny as a rake and always seems to be the little brother playing with the big boys.

If you were picking the Melbourne Team of the past 100 seasons, Robbie would be the first name picked, with Gawn as first ruck and Barassi as one of the midfielders. Who would be the captain is another interesting debate ...

20 hours ago, Redleg said:

No one goes ahead of Robbie, no matter what.

Happy for Max to be next.

Up until this year I would have no argument with this statement (recognising that I don't recall Barassi and never saw Norm Smith). Now I'm starting to wonder. Are we, the spectators of the Flower era, remembering him as better than he actually was? I only say this because Flower only won the B&F once. That has never made any sense to me as he seemed head and shoulders (metaphorically, of course, as opposed to Gawn for whom that expression is both literal and metaphorical) above every other teammate in his era.

51 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Up until this year I would have no argument with this statement (recognising that I don't recall Barassi and never saw Norm Smith). Now I'm starting to wonder. Are we, the spectators of the Flower era, remembering him as better than he actually was? I only say this because Flower only won the B&F once. That has never made any sense to me as he seemed head and shoulders (metaphorically, of course, as opposed to Gawn for whom that expression is both literal and metaphorical) above every other teammate in his era.

I will never have anyone ahead of Robbie and it’s personal with me.

Max is an out and out champion and I am happy to have him just behind Robbie.

Has to be Barassi or Smith. That aside, very impressed by Gawn's speech at the AA...saying it was a privilege at the age of 34 to be involved in a new start, with a new coach. That's impressive. In fact the general response of the playing group has been extremely encouraging...and an antidote to the prevailing negativity.