Jump to content


Recommended Posts

Posted

I was thinking about another way our success of top four finishes has played against us, such that I’m open to us losing the rest this year, not for draft picks but to reset our draw in 2025 to be average versus the hard draws we’ve had every year since 2021. 
In the AFLs crazy new world of “entertainment” over competition, teams that finish top are penalised the following year with a harder draw. It’s a new “innovation” that makes it considerably harder for teams in their window to win multiple flags, as they are worn raw by the inequitable draw.

So how do we get a fair, or god forbid, a favorable draw? Not in terms of when and where, but who we play…? 
if we’d had tha same draw as the Hawks, or Dons we’d be sitting top 4… but for the fourth year we’ve had a horror draw.

Makes the competition unfair, and it’s a blight on the game. 

  • Like 4
  • Clap 3

Posted

Also… while I’m ranting. 😃 Call out to @WheeloRatings to see if your stats boffins could produce an “Equitable Ladder” that is one based only on teams playing every other team once. For those you play twice the average result could be used, but only 4 points per team…

Any chance? 

  • Like 1

Posted
2 minutes ago, HarpenDee said:

Well Todays results mean we may have to win our remaining 4 to make the 8!

Yep. It’s a very tall ask now 

look at the % differences 

  • Like 1
Posted

I can’t believe bottom four Whorethorn is above us on the ladder. The MFC players who won a grand final are now officially a disgrace. And how did Fritsch’s bum get so fat?? Maybe jogging around and doing nothing!???

Posted

Reality is how Hawthorn have won more games than us and the dogs have turned it around! The blow torch needs to go onto Goodwin and his assistants as something is clearly wrong with our game plan and our smashing of clearances all season, a review of our footy dept including the horrible trades of what’s come in vs what we let go

  • Clap 1
Posted
43 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Since round 8 when we were 6-2

We have gone 4-7 and had a fairly easy run at times

We are in horrible form 

Reset and rebuild for 2025-2027

I fear the clarity of your thoughts may be lost on some. I neither blame nor dismiss them. Their desire is real. However what is..is.  What is is a hill inclined to about 60deg. Anyone attempting to scale said hill must approach the incline and jump and scramble with unheralded gusto and unerring  grip for the slighest mistake will have them sliding to the hill's base. This is the mission facing the might Dees at present.

It's not so much a run home as scaling K2.. ( i thought and realised denoting Everest might be a bit far fetched )

Anything can happen in footy. That said more often than not the 'expected ' often happens.

Could we come up against the Pups at a worse time ?  Port are flying...  Suns...whatever....in reality thst game doesn't matter....  and the Pies... what an ironic game that will be.

Time to admit 24 is truly cooked... best we start 25 in earnest...now..   truth be told, we might as well.


Posted
10 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

I fear the clarity of your thoughts may be lost on some. I neither blame nor dismiss them. Their desire is real. However what is..is.  What is is a hill inclined to about 60deg. Anyone attempting to scale said hill must approach the incline and jump and scramble with unheralded gusto and unerring  grip for the slighest mistake will have them sliding to the hill's base. This is the mission facing the might Dees at present.

It's not so much a run home as scaling K2.. ( i thought and realised denoting Everest might be a bit far fetched )

Anything can happen in footy. That said more often than not the 'expected ' often happens.

Could we come up against the Pups at a worse time ?  Port are flying...  Suns...whatever....in reality thst game doesn't matter....  and the Pies... what an ironic game that will be.

Time to admit 24 is truly cooked... best we start 25 in earnest...now..   truth be told, we might as well.

We are cooked and disappointing, but only hope we can knock out the pies from playing finals 

  • Like 2
Posted
25 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

I fear the clarity of your thoughts may be lost on some. I neither blame nor dismiss them. Their desire is real. However what is..is.  What is is a hill inclined to about 60deg. Anyone attempting to scale said hill must approach the incline and jump and scramble with unheralded gusto and unerring  grip for the slighest mistake will have them sliding to the hill's base. This is the mission facing the might Dees at present.

It's not so much a run home as scaling K2.. ( i thought and realised denoting Everest might be a bit far fetched )

Anything can happen in footy. That said more often than not the 'expected ' often happens.

Could we come up against the Pups at a worse time ?  Port are flying...  Suns...whatever....in reality thst game doesn't matter....  and the Pies... what an ironic game that will be.

Time to admit 24 is truly cooked... best we start 25 in earnest...now..   truth be told, we might as well.

Mountain climbing anyone ?

  • Clap 1

Posted
1 hour ago, PaulRB said:

I was thinking about another way our success of top four finishes has played against us, such that I’m open to us losing the rest this year, not for draft picks but to reset our draw in 2025 to be average versus the hard draws we’ve had every year since 2021. 
In the AFLs crazy new world of “entertainment” over competition, teams that finish top are penalised the following year with a harder draw. It’s a new “innovation” that makes it considerably harder for teams in their window to win multiple flags, as they are worn raw by the inequitable draw.

So how do we get a fair, or god forbid, a favorable draw? Not in terms of when and where, but who we play…? 
if we’d had tha same draw as the Hawks, or Dons we’d be sitting top 4… but for the fourth year we’ve had a horror draw.

Makes the competition unfair, and it’s a blight on the game. 

Well we are every chance of finishing 13th this year and get an easier draw in 2025.

Current form of 4-7 and who we play I'd say it's more likely than not to happen.

Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, david_neitz_is_my_dad said:

Dogs will finish our season officially

It's finished already.

I'm not saying we've already put the cue in the rack it's more just saying that this is the reality of it all.

The doggies and Hawks are in mighty form and deserve to be ahead of us fighting out for 8th. I think the Hawks just miss out and watching the doggies today, I can easily see them shaking up the finals series just with the way they're going.

Us missing finals isn't a bad thing though. Means some forced changes need to happen with the footy department in terms of coaching restructure.

We'll see a few early retirements such as Brown and Hunter and then maybe there'll be hard decisions made on guys like Salem who may be put up for trade.

The positive is with us already blooding some kids this year, we've seen that there is talent on the list. If we can really nail this trade and draft off season then I can see us bouncing back into finals contention next year.

Edited by dazzledavey36
  • Like 6
Posted
1 hour ago, PaulRB said:

Also… while I’m ranting. 😃 Call out to @WheeloRatings to see if your stats boffins could produce an “Equitable Ladder” that is one based only on teams playing every other team once. For those you play twice the average result could be used, but only 4 points per team…

Any chance? 

Here is the ladder if the average result was used where two teams played each other twice, ordered by Match Ratio (% of possible points) given different numbers of opposition teams played.

    M W L D For Agn Pts MR %
1 Sydney 16 12.0 4.0 0.0 1630.5 1157.5 48.0 75.0 140.9
2 Greater Western Sydney 16 10.5 5.5 0.0 1424.0 1248.0 42.0 65.6 114.1
3 Fremantle 14 8.5 4.5 1.0 1175.0 1002.5 36.0 64.3 117.2
4 Brisbane 16 9.5 6.0 0.5 1513.5 1266.5 39.0 60.9 119.5
5 Carlton 14 8.5 5.5 0.0 1310.5 1207.5 34.0 60.7 108.5
6 Geelong 15 9.0 6.0 0.0 1345.5 1255.0 36.0 60.0 107.2
7 Western Bulldogs 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1462.5 1228.0 38.0 59.4 119.1
8 Melbourne 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1282.0 1189.0 38.0 59.4 107.8
9 Port Adelaide 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1377.0 1304.5 38.0 59.4 105.6
10 Hawthorn 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1312.5 1278.0 38.0 59.4 102.7
11 Collingwood 17 8.5 7.0 1.5 1484.5 1447.0 37.0 54.4 102.6
12 Gold Coast 16 8.5 7.5 0.0 1368.0 1318.5 34.0 53.1 103.8
13 Essendon 15 7.5 7.0 0.5 1243.5 1316.5 31.0 51.7 94.5
14 Adelaide 16 6.5 9.0 0.5 1310.0 1255.5 27.0 42.2 104.3
15 St Kilda 16 6.5 9.5 0.0 1176.0 1230.5 26.0 40.6 95.6
16 West Coast 15 2.0 13.0 0.0 978.5 1511.0 8.0 13.3 64.8
17 Richmond 16 2.0 14.0 0.0 1032.5 1618.5 8.0 12.5 63.8
18 North Melbourne 16 1.5 14.5 0.0 1125.0 1717.0 6.0 9.4 65.5
  • Thanks 4
Posted

Gus’s retirement knocked us for six and we never really recovered. ( his loss can’t be underestimated). Plus we were unable to cover for Clarrys slow start and Tracs and Gawns injuries .

We will need another preseason to take stock and reset for next year.

Wouldn’t have done any serious damage in finals this year anyway.

  • Like 2
  • Clap 2

Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, WheeloRatings said:

Here is the ladder if the average result was used where two teams played each other twice, ordered by Match Ratio (% of possible points) given different numbers of opposition teams played.

    M W L D For Agn Pts MR %
1 Sydney 16 12.0 4.0 0.0 1630.5 1157.5 48.0 75.0 140.9
2 Greater Western Sydney 16 10.5 5.5 0.0 1424.0 1248.0 42.0 65.6 114.1
3 Fremantle 14 8.5 4.5 1.0 1175.0 1002.5 36.0 64.3 117.2
4 Brisbane 16 9.5 6.0 0.5 1513.5 1266.5 39.0 60.9 119.5
5 Carlton 14 8.5 5.5 0.0 1310.5 1207.5 34.0 60.7 108.5
6 Geelong 15 9.0 6.0 0.0 1345.5 1255.0 36.0 60.0 107.2
7 Western Bulldogs 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1462.5 1228.0 38.0 59.4 119.1
8 Melbourne 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1282.0 1189.0 38.0 59.4 107.8
9 Port Adelaide 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1377.0 1304.5 38.0 59.4 105.6
10 Hawthorn 16 9.5 6.5 0.0 1312.5 1278.0 38.0 59.4 102.7
11 Collingwood 17 8.5 7.0 1.5 1484.5 1447.0 37.0 54.4 102.6
12 Gold Coast 16 8.5 7.5 0.0 1368.0 1318.5 34.0 53.1 103.8
13 Essendon 15 7.5 7.0 0.5 1243.5 1316.5 31.0 51.7 94.5
14 Adelaide 16 6.5 9.0 0.5 1310.0 1255.5 27.0 42.2 104.3
15 St Kilda 16 6.5 9.5 0.0 1176.0 1230.5 26.0 40.6 95.6
16 West Coast 15 2.0 13.0 0.0 978.5 1511.0 8.0 13.3 64.8
17 Richmond 16 2.0 14.0 0.0 1032.5 1618.5 8.0 12.5 63.8
18 North Melbourne 16 1.5 14.5 0.0 1125.0 1717.0 6.0 9.4 65.5

Thank you! That’s interesting and feels right with Hawks and Dons lower and us on edge of 8 and with a real chance to come home with a wet sail… 

Interesting that it rates GWS as second best. 

My kingdom for an equitable competition. 

Edited by PaulRB
Posted
14 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

Gus’s retirement knocked us for six and we never really recovered. ( his loss can’t be underestimated). Plus we were unable to cover for Clarrys slow start and Tracs and Gawns injuries .

We will need another preseason to take stock and reset for next year.

Wouldn’t have done any serious damage in finals this year anyway.

I disagree DZ   I hope we make finals (even if it's a short visit)

Image the experience of a taste for our younger brigade.

  • Like 2
Posted
1 minute ago, Bitter but optimistic said:

I disagree DZ   I hope we make finals (even if it's a short visit)

Image the experience of a taste for our younger brigade.

Yep ...get there...get arses kicked.. marvellous... NOT !! 

Let their experience be positive... not soul sapping.

Time..place...   not this year.

  • Like 1

Posted

Well if one thing about a good draw is prime time games I definitely don't want to hear complaining when we don't get them anymore. We got them and people hated it.

As for a fair draw I don't care either, just play better or retire.

  • Like 1
Posted
11 hours ago, DeeZee said:

Gus’s retirement knocked us for six and we never really recovered. ( his loss can’t be underestimated). Plus we were unable to cover for Clarrys slow start and Tracs and Gawns injuries .

We will need another preseason to take stock and reset for next year.

Wouldn’t have done any serious damage in finals this year anyway.

Yeah we lost quality but it shouldn’t disguise the real issues of our coaches/game plan, poor drafting and what’s we have lost and exposed our ruck & mids, a review is needed on our list mgt & new assistant coaches 

  • Like 1

Posted

Interesting article on the AFL website ranking the fixture difficulty to date, and then the run home.

The most fascinating one is Carlton. Had the equal 9th hardest run to date, but then have the 15th hardest run over the next month!

How a team makes a preliminary final and gets that fixture the next year is beyond comprehension. They are the only team to play 17th and 18th twice this year.

The fixture is so rigged it makes a mockery of playing so many games. Just give the finals to the teams you want in it AFL, and save us all a couple of months.

  • Like 2
Posted
2 hours ago, layzie said:

Well if one thing about a good draw is prime time games I definitely don't want to hear complaining when we don't get them anymore. We got them and people hated it.

As for a fair draw I don't care either, just play better or retire.

Yep that's a good point.

We're probably projected now to finish 12th-13th which will mean far less Thursday and Saturday night games in the first 15 rounds of next year compared to this year.

There will be more Sunday 1:10 games and maybe even some Saturday arvo's of which we had none of this year. 

Posted

We have everything to play for.

Personally, I don't think we'll make the finals. We need to win every game and I just don't see it. The doggies are flying. GC up there will be hard (it has been for most others), Port will be tough and the Pies always find something against us. Can we win some? Sure. We CAN win them all, but with Gawn clearly not right yet, no Trac, a half-fit Clarry, and an apparent inability to play 4 quarters of consistent football, I don't see it. Happy to be proven wrong though. If we do, we will enter the finals like a steam train and will have earnt it, and will worry other teams. 

BUT, to me at least making finals doesn't really matter. This year has been hard. We lost Gus, who is an irreplaceable, last minute anyway. Looking at guys like Houston is smart. But that's for 2025. Trac being injured for most of the year, Clarry not being fit, these are not nothings. We have been missing forwards/forward synergy, which really should have been planned better, but alas here we are. Missing players, Petty being way off, Melksham only just re-joining. JVR and Disco are kids. If we don't make finals, we need to finish the year as a team who will be serious contenders next year. 

Maybe I have had too much coffee/got a little more sleep than normal (thanks, bub!) - but I am feeling pretty good about our prospects next year. Trac will be back, Clarry will be fit, Max will be patched up and good to go. We start the year with JVR/Fritter/Melksham (who will get another year for sure) and Disco up forward - plus Chin, Kosi etc - pretty dynamic and dangerous. Petty has been good the last month, I think he will start strong. He may go back if TMac hangs em up, though. May has another good year or two. Flanked by Lever of course. Judd etc. Viney has another couple of years, The kids will bulk up a little, build a tank. That's a good core.

But - ending this year strong and with a message to send in 2025 will mean we can make an argument for trades. As it stands, we will not be the only team looking to plug holes. We're not a destination club and honestly we're a little bit of a basket case - and I say this with love - the 'which Dees' will turn up today, or any quarter actually, is something that causes blood pressure spikes, for me anyway. If we are to contend next year we MUST get on top of that. We need to play 4 quarters. That does not mean full intensity for 4 quarters, that's not smart, and not possible for the full year. But we should expect effort and consistency over the 4 quarters. No more fadeouts, and letting teams slam 5 goals at the end of the game to put us out of touch. Get on top of skills. Basic skills. No more hospital handballs. Hit targets. SKILLS!

We need to sell ourselves to trade prospects that they will find success with us. I think we can win a flag next year. But, together with good health to our stars and our kids improving, this means we need to fill gaps - a replacement for Gus. Maybe another forward, and definitely another plug and play ruck if we're not going to play Fullarton. At least. Plus a better, more consistent game plan. Which will be assisted by having all/most of our guys on hand, of course. We have not had a 'game' this year. Its been a mess. I know, in part affected by personnel. But I think we have been confused at times as to what/who we are. We need to settle that in the offseason and commit to it/one another. 

Whatever happens, I just want the boys to have a dip and end the year like they know we can do it next year, and they want to enter 2025 with some momentum and send a message to other teams, and trade prospects. Work on regaining reputation and a consistent brand of footy. There are other teams on the up, we need to push. 

I really think we can do it. Other teams avoid these dips. But it takes vision, smarts, hard work and commitment. 

(If you made it this far, thanks for reading!)

Let's go 💙❤️

  • Like 2
Posted

Keep doing the Autoladder tipping on the Squiggle website and then getting angry at the machine. 

Posted

My 'doom and gloom' outlook extends to next year and beyond. Other than JvR, Caleb and ? I can't see any of our current players getting any better. MJ our only real hope at Casey. Some dead wood will go and hopefully JT and his mob have learnt not to recruit more dead wood.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Demonland Forums  

  • Match Previews, Reports & Articles  

    TRAINING: Friday 22nd November 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers were out in force on a scorching morning out at Gosch's Paddock for the final session before the whole squad reunites for the Preseason Training Camp. DEMONLAND'S PRESEASON TRAINING OBSERVATIONS It’s going to be a scorcher today but I’m in the shade at Gosch’s Paddock ready to bring you some observations from the final session before the Preseason Training Camp next week.  Salem, Fritsch & Campbell are already on the track. Still no number on Campbell’s

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports 2

    UP IN LIGHTS by Whispering Jack

    Those who watched the 2024 Marsh AFL National Championships closely this year would not be particularly surprised that Melbourne selected Victoria Country pair Harvey Langford and Xavier Lindsay on the first night of the AFL National Draft. The two left-footed midfielders are as different as chalk and cheese but they had similar impacts in their Coates Talent League teams and in the National Championships in 2024. Their interstate side was edged out at the very end of the tournament for tea

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Special Features

    TRAINING: Wednesday 20th November 2024

    It’s a beautiful cool morning down at Gosch’s Paddock and I’ve arrived early to bring you my observations from today’s session. DEMONLAND'S PRESEASON TRAINING OBSERVATIONS Reigning Keith Bluey Truscott champion Jack Viney is the first one out on the track.  Jack’s wearing the red version of the new training guernsey which is the only version available for sale at the Demon Shop. TRAINING: Viney, Clarry, Lever, TMac, Rivers, Petty, McVee, Bowey, JVR, Hore, Tom Campbell (in tr

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports

    TRAINING: Monday 18th November 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers ventured down to Gosch's Paddock for the final week of training for the 1st to 4th Years until they are joined by the rest of the senior squad for Preseason Training Camp in Mansfield next week. WAYNE RUSSELL'S PRESEASON TRAINING OBSERVATIONS No Ollie, Chin, Riv today, but Rick & Spargs turned up and McDonald was there in casual attire. Seston, and Howes did a lot of boundary running, and Tom Campbell continued his work with individual trainer in non-MFC

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports

    2024 Player Reviews: #11 Max Gawn

    Champion ruckman and brilliant leader, Max Gawn earned his seventh All-Australian team blazer and constantly held the team up on his shoulders in what was truly a difficult season for the Demons. Date of Birth: 30 December 1991 Height: 209cm Games MFC 2024: 21 Career Total: 224 Goals MFC 2024: 11 Career Total: 109 Brownlow Medal Votes: 13 Melbourne Football Club: 2nd Best & Fairest: 405 votes

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 12

    2024 Player Reviews: #36 Kysaiah Pickett

    The Demons’ aggressive small forward who kicks goals and defends the Demons’ ball in the forward arc. When he’s on song, he’s unstoppable but he did blot his copybook with a three week suspension in the final round. Date of Birth: 2 June 2001 Height: 171cm Games MFC 2024: 21 Career Total: 106 Goals MFC 2024: 36 Career Total: 161 Brownlow Medal Votes: 3 Melbourne Football Club: 4th Best & Fairest: 369 votes

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 5

    TRAINING: Friday 15th November 2024

    Demonland Trackwatchers took advantage of the beautiful sunshine to head down to Gosch's Paddock and witness the return of Clayton Oliver to club for his first session in the lead up to the 2025 season. DEMONLAND'S PRESEASON TRAINING OBSERVATIONS Clarry in the house!! Training: JVR, McVee, Windsor, Tholstrup, Woey, Brown, Petty, Adams, Chandler, Turner, Bowey, Seston, Kentfield, Laurie, Sparrow, Viney, Rivers, Jefferson, Hore, Howes, Verrall, AMW, Clarry Tom Campbell is here

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports

    2024 Player Reviews: #7 Jack Viney

    The tough on baller won his second Keith 'Bluey' Truscott Trophy in a narrow battle with skipper Max Gawn and Alex Neal-Bullen and battled on manfully in the face of a number of injury niggles. Date of Birth: 13 April 1994 Height: 178cm Games MFC 2024: 23 Career Total: 219 Goals MFC 2024: 10 Career Total: 66 Brownlow Medal Votes: 8

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Melbourne Demons 3

    TRAINING: Wednesday 13th November 2024

    A couple of Demonland Trackwatchers braved the rain and headed down to Gosch's paddock to bring you their observations from the second day of Preseason training for the 1st to 4th Year players. DITCHA'S PRESEASON TRAINING OBSERVATIONS I attended some of the training today. Richo spoke to me and said not to believe what is in the media, as we will good this year. Jefferson and Kentfield looked big and strong.  Petty was doing all the training. Adams looked like he was in rehab.  KE

    Demonland
    Demonland |
    Training Reports
  • Tell a friend

    Love Demonland? Tell a friend!

×
×
  • Create New...