PREGAME: Rd 07 vs North Melbourne

[Willmoy1947 4,170]

15 hours ago, buck_nekkid said:

Grundy is ok in the ruck and in front of the ball.  His defensive skills are poor, dropping off the main too easily in the the back half - made Bombers rucks look like gods and did the same in D against tigers. He also doesn’t mark well enough.  I wouldn’t be dropping him, but be getting him to work on the defensive side of his game.

Grundy stood up in my book when JVR got the knees in the back after taking the mark of the day.

Always loved that in players i coached.

[FritschyBusiness 1,478]

1 hour ago, Vipercrunch said:

That's not correct.  Looking at his heat maps for all 6 games, he played back for rounds 1 and 2 (WB and Lions), and returned back for round 5 (Ess) because Lever was out.  He was forward against Sydney and West Coast, then again for Richmond.  We've won every time his played as a forward, not that anyone should read much into that.

Yes, You are correct about round 5, slipped my mind but I am trying to not think about that game ever again.  

1 hour ago, Sydee said:

Tells you something about the form of the blokes at Casey last week that might be his replacement in F50.

Don't look at his contribution as just goals scored - yes that's obviously one of his main KPIs as a forward and I still think he will have games soon where he kicks multiple goals - this week could be one of those. What he is much better at than (BB & Schache) is competing strongly in the air stopping opposition intercept marks and chasing when the ball hits the ground

I wish we had two Petty's so one could play back but we don't. May is in very poor form IMO - if he was flying, we probably wouldn't even have to think about Petty going back

I really value him so highly as a defender and don't know why we are robbing Steven to pay Jacob. 
We have seen this regularly in defence but forward in these games he has only taken a handful of marks. 

We are going shorter in defence with the 7 rotation now being - May, Lever, Rivers, Brayshaw, Hibberd, Bowey and McVee which in turn has seen an increase in marks by opposition inside their attacking 50. 
 

5 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Yep....horses and courses.

He might well make for a left field shuffle of the magnets in a game whereby all the widgets and stars align to make it a workable ploy..

Other than that he is a key link in the fabric of our defence.

Experiments.....  we can meddle elsewhere

As they say.... Harry in defence aint broke...let's  not 'fix' it .

Agreed that it ain't broke. 
I'm a big campaigner for the Keep Petty in defence, I haven't seen enough results to change my mind yet. 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,950]

10 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Other than that he is a key link in the fabric of our defence.

Experiments.....  we can meddle elsewhere

As they say.... Harry in defence aint broke...let's  not 'fix' it .

I don't know whether the Petty forward experiment will work. But if clubs didn't experiment, Neitz would never have become a full forward.

[Colm 2,188]

2 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

If we move Petty to defence this week then IMO it’s defence for the year for him. I don’t want us to keep flipping him from week to week. Whether it’s forward or back, he needs to get stability with May/Lever or JVR/whoever. Flipping him around is giving me Brad Miller vibes - never got settled and never got to his potential as a result. 

If he’s a forward then leave him there. If not, move him back and get Brown back into the side. 

This is where the problem is and why I'm now thinking Petty will probably stay up forward for a while yet to learn the position a bit better. I think he’s improving as a forward and needs a run of games there to develop into the position. 
BBB and Tmac are both struggling with injuries and form this year and there will times when we can’t get either of them on the pitch. We can’t leave it to JVR and Max. 

[rpfc 28,843]

14 hours ago, deejammin' said:

I agree if they’re injured. But last year we were 7-0 playing a VFL West Coast side and 8-0 playing the Roos and we didn’t rest sore players, that’s when we should’ve. Right now we’re 4-2, not in very good form and have a chance to play close to our full strength lineup. If players are injured, sure, rest them. But if they’re just a bit sore but capable of playing we need to get our best team on the park, in the right positions and find some form. Let’s get to 5-2 and 6-2 and then think about resting players with niggles, right now I’d like to see us play. 

I get that. I just think we have three weeks we should win even with a few managed.

[Deebauched 1,220]

2 hours ago, DubDee said:

Why the hell are we playing on saturday after playing monday night?  Tigers get a sunday match.  we are playing north, clearly not a blockbuster

[censored] me

Agreed but Coll & Ess have short breaks too and their games are nasty unlike ours.

Both sides could be cooked by half time. I wouldnt bet on either of them.

[deejammin' 2,374]

34 minutes ago, rpfc said:

I get that. I just think we have three weeks we should win even with a few managed.

I hope you’re right if we do rest some guys. Such an even top 12 atm it’d be great to put a gap on the competitors.

[deeTRACted 406]

Unless absolutely necessary I would prefer us to have no changes. We havent had a settled side at all this season and I think thats why its taking us a while to click in games. 

[Willmoy1947 4,170]

I wouldn't have any talk on indicating resting anyone. every bit of Media plays up questions to teams that we play saying lying questions on us resting, and we get the backwash..

[Lord Travis 10,763]

18 hours ago, buck_nekkid said:

Grundy is ok in the ruck and in front of the ball.  His defensive skills are poor, dropping off the main too easily in the the back half - made Bombers rucks look like gods and did the same in D against tigers. He also doesn’t mark well enough.  I wouldn’t be dropping him, but be getting him to work on the defensive side of his game.

Defense isn't Grundy's strength for sure, but it's no worse than most other rucks. Essendon's rucks did well against him because they overworked him in 2-1. One took a break, the other tagged in. He wasn't able to keep up, and most ruckman wouldn't on their own. Even Max has had games in the past where teams like Port or Saints worked him over and beat him.

Grundy's form overall has been fine though. Hardwick acknowledged him as the game changer in the 3rd quarter, so opposition coaches rate his impact. If his form keeps improving, we'll be in for a treat!

[beelzebub 23,388]

3 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't know whether the Petty forward experiment will work. But if clubs didn't experiment, Neitz would never have become a full forward.

I think we've seen the experiment's results...jmo.

He has excellent craft down back....and just the other side of sfa up the forward arc. Just seems terribly list most times. It's quite odd really. Fine reader of the ball but doesn't seem to translate  from one end to the other..

I stand to be corrected but Neeta was a swing player capable of both ends but played most earlier games as a fwd..  .. at Melb he went back as a CHB but returned to his natural forward slot.

Harry is no Neeta....  very few are ;) 

[640MD 3,482]

Just my two bobs worth,

I think May is struggling with an injury or confidence.  If Petty goes back then the defense grouping is very similar to when May had an easier time.

So that leaves a hole up forward, BBB kicked 4 points in Casey, but if he had kicked straight, we would not hesitate.

Yes I know   If your Auntie had nuts she would be your uncle.   But this means Norths best goes onto BBB and gives Rooey the lesser player, and maybe Fritta gets it easier.    And get Kossy to sign and he plays without any concerns for the next 5 years.   

Go Dees

[beelzebub 23,388]

3 hours ago, Willmoy1947 said:

Grundy stood up in my book when JVR got the knees in the back after taking the mark of the day.

Always loved that in players i coached.

Who was  that [censored] of a Ninthmond player..   what a tuffy 

[IRW 1,388]

3 hours ago, FritschyBusiness said:

Yes, You are correct about round 5, slipped my mind but I am trying to not think about that game ever again.  

I really value him so highly as a defender and don't know why we are robbing Steven to pay Jacob. 
We have seen this regularly in defence but forward in these games he has only taken a handful of marks. 

We are going shorter in defence with the 7 rotation now being - May, Lever, Rivers, Brayshaw, Hibberd, Bowey and McVee which in turn has seen an increase in marks by opposition inside their attacking 50. 
 

Agreed that it ain't broke. 
I'm a big campaigner for the Keep Petty in defence, I haven't seen enough results to change my mind yet. 

There has to be a solution to the forward line that doesn't include exposing May Hibberd and Lever to their injury management issues.

Max behind the ball down back and Petty continues his synergy with usual defenders.

 

[Lucifers Hero 40,489]

On AFL 360 last night Goodwin said Gawn and Petty give us the aerial presence we haven't had for a while.  We can all recall the numerous games where defenders marked in fwd 50.

On thinking about that, technically McD and Brown should provide it and they have in the past.  I wonder whether their respective past injuries (McD's foot; Brown's knee) prevent them from jumping and therefore it is difficult for them to contest and mark or bring the ball to ground.

Therefore their one wood and now maybe only trick is to lead out.  Very easy to defend if a fwd has only one tool.  So their absence from the team may not be their form or perhaps their form is a result of not being able to jump and contest.  They have run out of tricks so to speak.

So Petty isn't necessarily there to kick goals.  He is there to mark or to give our small players a chance at ground level.  Ditto Max.  They will kick goals from time to time.  Worth noting that of the 15 goals we kicked vs Tigers only two were kicked by Petty and Gawn. 

Edited April 26, 2023 by Lucifers Hero

[Redleg 41,759]

12 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Who was  that [censored] of a Ninthmond player..   what a tuffy 

Tylar Young I believe.

[FritschyBusiness 1,478]

5 minutes ago, IRW said:

There has to be a solution to the forward line that doesn't include exposing May Hibberd and Lever to their injury management issues.

Max behind the ball down back and Petty continues his synergy with usual defenders.

 

The solution with the forward line would be TMac or Brown but both are either out of form or not healthy/fit enough for the role at the level its required to be. 

[monoccular 17,607]

4 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Would ice after a game on his achilles be a sign of concern or just standard practice for a 33 year old with a recent achilles problem?

With respect to the Petty forward or back debate, I'm wondering whether the thinking is that Turner has progressed enough through the pecking order so that we have the luxury of trying to turn Petty into a true key position forward. Whether they play this year or not, Brown and McDonald are both nearing the end, so the intention might be to have key defenders of May, Lever, D Turner and Tomlinson and key forwards of van Rooyen, Petty and eventually Jefferson.  

LDVC - agree with most of what you say but, sadly and reluctantly I am beginning to think that Tomlinson is becoming history.   Don’t like it but it is looking that way. 

4 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't know whether the Petty forward experiment will work. But if clubs didn't experiment, Neitz would never have become a full forward.

A Coleman medalist what’s more. 

16 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

Who was  that [censored] of a Ninthmond player..   what a tuffy 

 

3 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Tylar Young I believe.

And of course the MRO didn’t see anything in it.  

[forever demons 2,253]

4 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I don't know whether the Petty forward experiment will work. But if clubs didn't experiment, Neitz would never have become a full forward.

And never  should have.Was the best chb in the afl by  a mile.

[IRW 1,388]

Just now, FritschyBusiness said:

The solution with the forward line would be TMac or Brown but both are either out of form or not healthy/fit enough for the role at the level its required to be. 

They show every sign of being on their last legs and I'm a fan of both of them.

Weid ( of whom I was not a fan)was being used much more suitably to his natural skills by the Bombers on Sunday .

If they can get Brown fit and kick on the lead it's problem solved.

I doubt it will happen though 

Part of TMacs history was that he could run up and down  the ground as well as stand tall in the middle of a pack.

I think the runnings gone. 

 

[beelzebub 23,388]

6 minutes ago, monoccular said:

 

And of course the MRO didn’t see anything in it.  

It just went with flow of that night's umpiring. Absolutely deplorable 

How is it with all the colours to.choose from some nuffy decided to kit the maggots in yellow and black....i mean  ...wtf

[Dee*ceiving 1,699]

We didn't take anywhere near enough of our chances to rest and freshen up players last year and paid for it in the long run. 

In terms of who needs the rest most it's difficult to determine, but, i think these 4 players should be given a run next week. Two were never dropped and two have form justifying a place, at leat to have a taste. 

• Ben Brown
• James Harmes 
• Luke Dunstan 
• Bailey Laurie 

Beyond that I'd consider Daniel Turner if another tall needs to miss. 

[Lucifers Hero 40,489]

16 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

It just went with flow of that night's umpiring. Absolutely deplorable 

How is it with all the colours to.choose from some nuffy decided to kit the maggots in yellow and black....i mean  ...wtf

They wear yellow and black to every MCG game.  Daft, I know but that is how they work...

Edited April 26, 2023 by Lucifers Hero

[Gawndy the Great 9,011]

1 hour ago, 640MD said:

Just my two bobs worth,

I think May is struggling with an injury or confidence.  If Petty goes back then the defense grouping is very similar to when May had an easier time.

So that leaves a hole up forward, BBB kicked 4 points in Casey, but if he had kicked straight, we would not hesitate.

Yes I know   If your Auntie had nuts she would be your uncle.   But this means Norths best goes onto BBB and gives Rooey the lesser player, and maybe Fritta gets it easier.    And get Kossy to sign and he plays without any concerns for the next 5 years.   

Go Dees

That is the first i've heard that saying and it has made my day. Ill make it my life's purpose to use it as often as i can. 

[Vipercrunch 2,834]

It's these sort of numbers as well as comments Goodwin has made that make me think Petty will be persisted with up forward.  I am pretty sure the green ones are on the side of the ledger that we want them to be.

 

Edited April 26, 2023 by Vipercrunch