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TRAINING: Friday 12th August 2022


kev martin

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6 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

That was a big Burgess motto and it worked great last year, but feels like maybe this year the injuries/soreness have been worse and maybe it's not had the same effect.

Difference is we are coming off a season that lasted an extra month and players played through more in finals because that’s what you do. When I went and saw Rivers and Salem hobbling in Round 1 I knew it was nonsense. There is resilience and there is reckless.

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2 minutes ago, rpfc said:

Difference is we are coming off a season that lasted an extra month and players played through more in finals because that’s what you do. When I went and saw Rivers and Salem hobbling in Round 1 I knew it was nonsense. There is resilience and there is reckless.

Yeah it's a fair point re finals. Feels like we haven't quite got the balance right this year, but fingers crossed we overcome those niggles in time for finals.

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Considering how many sore boys we have, the pre-finals bye could work in our favour.  whether we finish 2nd/3rd or 6th it will still help us.

Although I have lost some confidence in us over the past 2 months, I still feel we can get up for 2-3 weeks and pull something out of the bag. Like an elite 10K olympic runner waiting for the last 2 laps

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1 hour ago, rpfc said:

Difference is we are coming off a season that lasted an extra month and players played through more in finals because that’s what you do. When I went and saw Rivers and Salem hobbling in Round 1 I knew it was nonsense. There is resilience and there is reckless.

Its pretty long bow to be accusing the fitness team (and by extension the club) of being reckless, particularly given i'm assuming - and i stand to be corrected - that you don't have inside knowledge of their program or specific expertise in sport science.  

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9 minutes ago, binman said:

Its pretty long bow to be accusing the fitness team (and by extension the club) of being reckless, particularly given i'm assuming - and i stand to be corrected - that you don't have inside knowledge of their program or specific expertise in sport science.  

In fairness there have been some really questionable decisions around the management of certain players this yead

Both Salem and Rivers started the year off with bandages around their knees and were very poppy and have been since. They were CLEARLY not 100% fit and that's where I question if it was necessary they had to play so early and quickly from their knee injuries when best caution of practice would be too take as much time as possible.

I look at the way they managed Hibberd and thought that was done far more professionally and his recent form bar Collingwood showed that he hasn't looked out of touch at all.

Even the recent James Jordon knee injury. Since he hurt his knee he's running around and has a turning circle of a Ben Brown. He's lost his speed and power as of a result of this and it's costing us big time because he's awareness and slow movement kills our transition chains. 

The decision to continue to play Jordon when he's clearly not fit with that knee really is puzzling. There's fit blokes at Casey that can come in or even better, we move Brayshaw to a wing and get Bowey in.

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48 minutes ago, binman said:

Its pretty long bow to be accusing the fitness team (and by extension the club) of being reckless, particularly given i'm assuming - and i stand to be corrected - that you don't have inside knowledge of their program or specific expertise in sport science.  

I mean, probably no different to you giving everyone on Demonland exact timelines around our loading program...

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49 minutes ago, binman said:

Its pretty long bow to be accusing the fitness team (and by extension the club) of being reckless, particularly given i'm assuming - and i stand to be corrected - that you don't have inside knowledge of their program or specific expertise in sport science.  

What are we doing on here then?

And you of all people are comfortable with making assumptions of the program. 

We have been straddling the line playing players with niggles who shouldn’t be playing. 

I am comfortable saying that playing injured players is fraught and, at times, reckless.

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1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

In fairness there have been some really questionable decisions around the management of certain players this yead

Both Salem and Rivers started the year off with bandages around their knees and were very poppy and have been since. They were CLEARLY not 100% fit and that's where I question if it was necessary they had to play so early and quickly from their knee injuries when best caution of practice would be too take as much time as possible.

I look at the way they managed Hibberd and thought that was done far more professionally and his recent form bar Collingwood showed that he hasn't looked out of touch at all.

Even the recent James Jordon knee injury. Since he hurt his knee he's running around and has a turning circle of a Ben Brown. He's lost his speed and power as of a result of this and it's costing us big time because he's awareness and slow movement kills our transition chains. 

The decision to continue to play Jordon when he's clearly not fit with that knee really is puzzling. There's fit blokes at Casey that can come in or even better, we move Brayshaw to a wing and get Bowey in.

The Jordon one stumps me, it really does.

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1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

In fairness there have been some really questionable decisions around the management of certain players this yead

Both Salem and Rivers started the year off with bandages around their knees and were very poppy and have been since. They were CLEARLY not 100% fit and that's where I question if it was necessary they had to play so early and quickly from their knee injuries when best caution of practice would be too take as much time as possible.

I look at the way they managed Hibberd and thought that was done far more professionally and his recent form bar Collingwood showed that he hasn't looked out of touch at all.

Even the recent James Jordon knee injury. Since he hurt his knee he's running around and has a turning circle of a Ben Brown. He's lost his speed and power as of a result of this and it's costing us big time because he's awareness and slow movement kills our transition chains. 

The decision to continue to play Jordon when he's clearly not fit with that knee really is puzzling. There's fit blokes at Casey that can come in or even better, we move Brayshaw to a wing and get Bowey in.

All reasonable points.

It is clear burgess had a particular philosophy about playing through injury and not resting players, and it would appear that Griffith has the same philosophy. 

Under Burgess lots of players played though niggles and soreness - maxy being an obvious one. From memory in that Burgo-Brucky podcast he speaks on this very topic and why he thinks it was factor in our success. 

I find it hard to assess that philosophy, but see what you are saying, particularly in regard to playing players who are hampered when there are players who appear less so at Casey - though presumably that is more Goody's call than Griffiths, who would just tick of, in collaboration with the medical staff, that a particular player is good to go. 

That said i have total confidence that no player's welfare is being put at risk (not suggesting you are saying it is).

And i  reckon Burgess and Griffith could both point to the remarkably low number of soft tissue injuries we have had in the last 3 seasons as indication the program is effective. How many have we had this year? 

Edited by binman
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My gut feel is the coaches really want to settle the team down and minimize changes, trusting that the pre-finals bye and modified training will be enough to get guys up and going for finals. 

I don't think you want to be making too many unforced changes at this time of year

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5 minutes ago, binman said:

That said i have total confidence that no player's welfare is being put at risk (not suggesting you are saying it is).

Who are you saying said that then? I will assume you're referencing @rpfc's "reckless" comment, but that comment didn't necessarily mean it was in the context of player welfare, you're assuming that. It could have meant in terms of the impact on our performance and results, it could have meant in terms of it impacting the ability to get back to 100%, it could have even been in relation to how it impacts the ability to keep our depth players when sore/injured players are consistently picked ahead of them.

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18 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

Who are you saying said that then? I will assume you're referencing @rpfc's "reckless" comment, but that comment didn't necessarily mean it was in the context of player welfare, you're assuming that. It could have meant in terms of the impact on our performance and results, it could have meant in terms of it impacting the ability to get back to 100%, it could have even been in relation to how it impacts the ability to keep our depth players when sore/injured players are consistently picked ahead of them.

Perhaps he just meant exactly what he said Nev, and that he wasn’t referencing any other poster. He was simply stating his opinion that he’s convinced that the experts know what they are doing. We’ll have to ask Binny, but is there just a possibility that is what he meant?

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13 minutes ago, Neil Crompton said:

Perhaps he just meant exactly what he said Nev, and that he wasn’t referencing any other poster. He was simply stating his opinion that he’s convinced that the experts know what they are doing. We’ll have to ask Binny, but is there just a possibility that is what he meant?

So he just randomly brought up that comment in the midst of having a crack at rpfc and his 'reckless' comment...?

Yeah, not sure I believe that one.

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So please clarify, is this captain’s run only for the 26 named?  For example no mention of Joel Smith.

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@binman; Salem kicked the ball 35m in the 2nd minute of round one with a strapped knee and was out of the game for 15 minutes, then put back on, then subbed out for 11 games.

I am not worried about his ‘welfare,’ I am worried about my welfare!

You don’t eff around with your star players and I felt that that decision to play a clearly hampered player went over the line from resilience to ‘whatever-word-defines-a-star-being-out-for-three-months.’

That’s the wager they are making with this ‘resilience training/playing’ and I think it is fine with bodies that are fresher than we were after a long season playing a strenuous and demanding style.

Just seen a number of our better players playing clearly hampered this year…

 

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51 minutes ago, Trisul said:

You dont have to go back too far to find a season destroyed by injury management.

But even less far back to find a season made by injury and fitness management 🏆🤗. All smiles then. 

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13 minutes ago, rpfc said:

@binman; Salem kicked the ball 35m in the 2nd minute of round one with a strapped knee and was out of the game for 15 minutes, then put back on, then subbed out for 11 games.

I am not worried about his ‘welfare,’ I am worried about my welfare!

You don’t eff around with your star players and I felt that that decision to play a clearly hampered player went over the line from resilience to ‘whatever-word-defines-a-star-being-out-for-three-months.’

That’s the wager they are making with this ‘resilience training/playing’ and I think it is fine with bodies that are fresher than we were after a long season playing a strenuous and demanding style.

Just seen a number of our better players playing clearly hampered this year…

 

Yep fair enough.

I suspect once the season is done we will hear that quite few plyer have been carrying things this year.

Maxy has never looked right all season to my eye, nor May since his out with concussion.

You can add Salo, Rivers, Jordon and Lever as well i reckon.  

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30 minutes ago, binman said:

Yep fair enough.

I suspect once the season is done we will hear that quite few plyer have been carrying things this year.

Maxy has never looked right all season to my eye, nor May since his out with concussion.

You can add Salo, Rivers, Jordon and Lever as well i reckon.  

My completely untrained eye suggests that May might have a back problem. He seems not to have the flexibility to bend over comfortably which results in him fumbling when he tries to pick up a ground ball.

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