20 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Have watched Toby closely in the last 5 or 6 VFL games. In a few games I commented as to how he had a nearly great game in the sense that with one faster step, one jag to the left or one less slip his disposal would be perfect. Another time a team mate handballed to him while he was on a brilliant breaking run but the handball didn't quite connect.

Just not sure

Saw him run at pace during a game at the G and collect a half volley without breaking stride -  a thing of beauty. But it only works sometimes and sometimes he needs to slow down instead of  nearly taking possession or nearly handpassing because at that moment he had already spent the ball.

Every preseason when I see Bedford and think this year will be his year, he stands out so much more than Anb or Spargo to me but alas the coaching group don’t seem to see it that way. I suspect he will either rot away in the VFL never getting a proper run or he will leave and we will roo that we didn’t give him that run.

He went at more than a goal a game this year 9 goals from  8 games many starting as sub, he kicked 2 goals in 3 of those games, by comparison ANB kicked the same number of goals 9 over his 23 games as a starting player or Spargo 10 from 24 games as a starting player. I think given the same opportunity bedford would have easily kicked 30+ goals over a season.

Edited September 21, 20222 yr by Garbo

22 minutes ago, cantstandyasam said:

Saw him run at pace during a game at the G and collect a half volley without breaking stride -  a thing of beauty. But it only works sometimes and sometimes he needs to slow down instead of  nearly taking possession or nearly handpassing because at that moment he had already spent the ball.

Agree

Toby is what I'd describe as a work in progress - shows some flashes of brilliance but he lacks consistency

One thing he does have in spades is speed and excellent acceleration - these are qualities that we don't have in abundance so I would prefer Toby stays a Demon and strives to improve and force himself into the starting 22.   

3 minutes ago, Garbo said:

Every preseason when I see Bedford and think this year will be his year, he stands out so much more than Anb or Spargo to me but alas the coaching group don’t seem to see it that way. I suspect he will either rot away in the VFL never getting a proper run or he will leave and we will roo that we didn’t give him that run.

He went at more than a goal a game this year from the 8 times he got on the ground, I’m not sure how many were only partial as he started sub, but he kicked 2 goals in 3 of those games, by comparison ANB kicked the same number of goals across 23 games as a starting player. I think given the same opportunity bedford would have easily kicked 30+ goals over a season.

To be fair if the coaching group didn't rate Toby they wouldn't have selected him as medi sub so often - there is no doubt in my mind he is on the edge of regular selection and some of our regular small forwards (probably with the exception of Kozzy) are very much on notice 

It may come down to keeping one of Toby or Kade Chandler.

I think Chandler could be a more skillful version of ANB, depending on whether he can build a similar tank  - i thought some of his kicking in the VFL GF was elite given the conditions (passes over 40m within a metre of the boundary).

Never really seen how quick he is relative to Toby. Has anyone seen a comparison at training? I am assuming Toby is quicker, but I not 100% sure.

 

21 minutes ago, spalding said:

It may come down to keeping one of Toby or Kade Chandler.

I think Chandler could be a more skillful version of ANB, depending on whether he can build a similar tank  - i thought some of his kicking in the VFL GF was elite given the conditions (passes over 40m within a metre of the boundary).

Never really seen how quick he is relative to Toby. Has anyone seen a comparison at training? I am assuming Toby is quicker, but I not 100% sure.

 

Chandler is not slow but I would say Bedford is just about the quickest on our list so having watched a fair amount of Casey I'd say he has Chandler covered for speed

52 minutes ago, spalding said:

It may come down to keeping one of Toby or Kade Chandler.

I think Chandler could be a more skillful version of ANB, depending on whether he can build a similar tank  - i thought some of his kicking in the VFL GF was elite given the conditions (passes over 40m within a metre of the boundary).

Never really seen how quick he is relative to Toby. Has anyone seen a comparison at training? I am assuming Toby is quicker, but I not 100% sure.

 

Chandler has some real jets, would be similar pace to Bedford at top speed.  One of the training sessions i went to in match sims i recall was exceptional....He gathered the ball just outside the arc one handed, ran full speed at 4-5 players, baulked and shimmied around all of them the kicked a beautiful checkside goal from about 40 out.  Was one of the most electrifying bits of footy i ever seen, was totally surprised to see it during a practice session!

Imo Bedford gets to top pace a bit quicker but Chandler would not be far off.

Kozzie, Chandler & Bedford would cause nightmares for opposition teams, really hope to see it this coming season!

1 hour ago, NeveroddoreveN said:

Chandler has some real jets, would be similar pace to Bedford at top speed.  One of the training sessions i went to in match sims i recall was exceptional....He gathered the ball just outside the arc one handed, ran full speed at 4-5 players, baulked and shimmied around all of them the kicked a beautiful checkside goal from about 40 out.  Was one of the most electrifying bits of footy i ever seen, was totally surprised to see it during a practice session!

 Chandler is - relative to position as a small forward - slow. If he was even close to Bedford’s pace he would be a quality afl player.

1 hour ago, DeeSpencer said:

 Chandler is - relative to position as a small forward - slow. If he was even close to Bedford’s pace he would be a quality afl player.

If Chandler is slow then Spargo is glacial. 

IMO pace is more beneficial for defensive effort than attacking. 

9 minutes ago, mo64 said:

If Chandler is slow then Spargo is glacial. 

IMO pace is more beneficial for defensive effort than attacking. 

I can’t find Spargo’s numbers but Chandler ran a 3.06 20m sprint which isn’t good. Spargo’s got good agility and a faster footy brain, his first few steps would be quicker.

The big different between them is Spargo’s best attributes have translated to afl footy. Chandler hasn’t had the same opportunities but the stuff he does at VFL level - marking, kicking goals, bursting through tackles - hasn’t showed up. 

2 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

I can’t find Spargo’s numbers but Chandler ran a 3.06 20m sprint which isn’t good. Spargo’s got good agility and a faster footy brain, his first few steps would be quicker.

The big different between them is Spargo’s best attributes have translated to afl footy. Chandler hasn’t had the same opportunities but the stuff he does at VFL level - marking, kicking goals, bursting through tackles - hasn’t showed up. 

I think Bedfords strengths show through more at afl level than Chandler, albeit both on a small sample size 

We might be able to get a second rounder for Bedford plus our 3Rd rounder. Whereby we wouldn't get anything for Chandler. That's not to say Chandler won't become a decent player.

Toby has apparently been looking for more ‘opportunities’ and is considering a move, with the giants a likely target. Thoughts on his value to us/ at trade?  Will Toby flourish somewhere else, or will he get more time in ground with us next year?

Beveridge and Toomey saying Ess not interested and Toby will either go to GWS or stay at the Dees.

2 minutes ago, Lucifers Hero said:

Beveridge and Toomey saying Ess not interested and Toby will either go to GWS or stay at the Dees.

I'm not surprised about Essendon - they're getting Alwyn Davey Jr this year.

Twomey reporting that he has been in Sydney and GWS have put an offer to him.  He now has to make a decision as its a pretty good offer.

I think out of all the rumours of movement from the club this one hurts the most(besides Jackson of course).

We are in a bad spot here as he is out of contract and worth more to us than he is on the Market.

Hope he stays

On 9/21/2022 at 7:59 AM, Demons11 said:

He is great to listen to Goody.  The club is in great hands and he clearly understands they’ll need to change some things next year 

If he didnt have some understanding of what is obvious in terms of change, I for one would be extremely worried

1 hour ago, Travy14 said:

Twomey reporting that he has been in Sydney and GWS have put an offer to him.  He now has to make a decision as its a pretty good offer.

I think out of all the rumours of movement from the club this one hurts the most(besides Jackson of course).

We are in a bad spot here as he is out of contract and worth more to us than he is on the Market.

Hope he stays

Hogan, Preuss and Bedford would be one of the most random collections of ex-MFC players ever.

On 9/21/2022 at 5:34 PM, DeeSpencer said:

I can’t find Spargo’s numbers but Chandler ran a 3.06 20m sprint which isn’t good. Spargo’s got good agility and a faster footy brain, his first few steps would be quicker.

The big different between them is Spargo’s best attributes have translated to afl footy. Chandler hasn’t had the same opportunities but the stuff he does at VFL level - marking, kicking goals, bursting through tackles - hasn’t showed up. 

Spargo had a lot games early in his career when I don't think he deserved them. Chandler has had next to no games by comparison. Spargo had some good games in 2021 but this year has been far from that form IMO. He doesn't get the ball often enough. 

Didn’t place in the top 10 in Casey b and f despite playing majority of the year there

He's got good speed but no more / less than Chandler, for instance, and none of the same ability to win and use his own ball

5 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

Didn’t place in the top 10 in Casey b and f despite playing majority of the year there

He's got good speed but no more / less than Chandler, for instance, and none of the same ability to win and use his own ball

I'm not much of a fan of Bedford, but how many games do you think he played for Casey in 2022 ?

B&Fs reward players who play.  Bedford would barely have played half their games.

 

That’s an aggressive contract that suggests we see Tobes as more than depth. Not sure I really see it, and if I was his manager I’d probably suggest he go with the team that provides him easier game time. Tricky decision for him. 

12 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

That’s an aggressive contract that suggests we see Tobes as more than depth. Not sure I really see it, and if I was his manager I’d probably suggest he go with the team that provides him easier game time. Tricky decision for him. 

What is "easier game time" please explain. 

I thought it was a 2 year deal but 3 is a real show of confidence.  It's really frustrating as Toby for about 3/4 of his footy shows the required ability and skills. BUT he has not mastered the art of finishing and composure. Which is a fault of some of our role players.

Thats why our disposal and goal kicking let's us down. Chico needs to get back on the disposal horse and repeat the 2021 lessons to a few. Toby is one of those. 

We do need his pace and perhaps his confidence about being an AFL  regular is the other drawback to becoming a senior regular. 

Hopefully he stays and 2023 is his year. 

 

 

A 3 year offer for Bedford is another head scratcher. Are we offering him an extra year, but on less money per annum?

Personally, I think that Bedford is a limited footballer. But if he has the tank, he could be a useful defensive small forward who's capable of averaging a goal a game. And I see that as an upgrade on Spargo. 

We have plenty of players who can apply defensive pressure at the contest, but very few with the pace of Bedford and Hunt to be able to apply defensive pressure once the ball has cleared the contest.

I think we need to inject pace into the team, so retaining Bedford makes sense. But the problem is whether stubborn Goody will make any changes to his Premiership team.