What do you realistically get by trading him? Unless you trade with a later pick to maybe get into the 50s somehow? 

7 minutes ago, layzie said:

What do you realistically get by trading him? Unless you trade with a later pick to maybe get into the 50s somehow? 

A list spot.

Current out of contract key defenders:
Kyle Hartigan, Matt Scharenberg, Jacob Koschitzke, Jarrod Lienert, Ryan Garthwaite, Oscar Clavarino, Lewis Melican. 

Most would be free to a good home or a 3rd rounder at most. Are any of them any good? I don't know. But surely it's worth finding out. Lienert is one guy I'd sign up for sure.

21 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

A list spot.

Current out of contract key defenders:
Kyle Hartigan, Matt Scharenberg, Jacob Koschitzke, Jarrod Lienert, Ryan Garthwaite, Oscar Clavarino, Lewis Melican. 

Most would be free to a good home or a 3rd rounder at most. Are any of them any good? I don't know. But surely it's worth finding out. Lienert is one guy I'd sign up for sure.

Some good ideas there Deespencer, I like Lienert as well.

On 10/2/2020 at 10:45 AM, Moonshadow said:

I know I'll get howled down for this, but with the right coaching and development I think OMac will become a handy backman. Only 24yo, would do much better at Rich or WCE. Rich turned Grimes into an AA. Not comparing the two, just illustrating that development is king

5 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

A list spot.

Current out of contract key defenders:
Kyle Hartigan, Matt Scharenberg, Jacob Koschitzke, Jarrod Lienert, Ryan Garthwaite, Oscar Clavarino, Lewis Melican. 

Most would be free to a good home or a 3rd rounder at most. Are any of them any good? I don't know. But surely it's worth finding out. Lienert is one guy I'd sign up for sure.

I think most of those will be gone and be available as DFAs, and should come really cheap, contact wise. Hartigan I don't think fits the mould as he'd be one who there'd be no point getting in unless he's definately plays, and not sure he'd fit with the others. Carlisle from the Saints is apparently on the outer, while he's a bit of a DH, he'd offer some extra aggression along side May. 

4 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Howling at the Moonshadow!

15 hours ago, jnrmac said:

I reluctently agree Jr Sometimes Oscar surprises me with some skillful play

Could be another example of poor development  If we can tarde well Im am not against keeping him on the list

Edited October 4, 20204 yr by Kent

Unfortunately Oscar has been around long enough and still hasn’t improved enough to be a mainstay at the top level.

He still plays like an 18 year old boy which would be forgivable if he was but he’s been around the club 6 years now and hasn’t overly improved in this time.

He played a really good game earlier in the year with a couple intercepts and some rebounding which I was thrilled to see only for him to revert back into his shell. I don’t know Oscar at all but he strikes me as just a nice, shy kid who needs a bit more dog and swagger to him to be a top line player - which I doubt will never happen.

Has never deserved the heat he has copped online and it disgusted me some of the crap thrown his way which I believe the club is at fault for as well. He should have been playing twos for his first 3 years till he was dominating that level and built the confidence to play top line footy.

Instead he was in and out like a yo-yo playing like a kid scared of making a mistake.

In saying that though, a change of scenery will be best for him. Plenty of talent in the state leagues in which we’ve seen players like Mihocek and Sam Collins really show there worth.

Id rather take a punt on one of these types or bring back Frawley as protection for Lever/May in case of injury.

18 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Lienert is one guy I'd sign up for sure.

Yep...

I think Oscar is a third defender, body to body he has always struggled, but playing as a third defender he is a good mark, reads to play well and kicks it OK.  The issue is we like playing Lever as third defender and I think the club see Oscar behind Lever, Smith and Tomlinson.  Throw Petty and if we keep Hore in the mix and our tall defenders look to have depth.

 

On 10/4/2020 at 4:37 AM, binman said:

I cant even be bothered to list the plethora of duds given nominations each year.

On 10/4/2020 at 4:37 AM, binman said:

A truly trumpian level of debating skills. 

 

Yes, but only if he was the one giving the nominations....

Just rewatched the Rd 22 2018 win v Eagles highlights 

Great to see Omac take down Jack Darling with a fair, regulation, hard nut tackle...

Whichever way it goes, I'll always see Omac as a strong role player who performed many times for our jumper

Hope the best for him!

Swap of Frawley for omcd. That’s some far out left over centre thinking !!!  Unfortunately Frawley looked spent in 2020 and might actually be delisted by the dorks

10 hours ago, Deeko2 said:

... or bring back Frawley as protection for Lever/May in case of injury.

 

On 10/2/2020 at 2:18 PM, No Plan B said:

Development is king - in some cases. Not here.

OMac has some traits that allowed him to have six seasons with us. Not a bad intercept marker, a good kick for his size. A good kid with his head screwed on by all reports.

But his lack of strength in the contest has always been a problem. His biggest deficiency by a mile though is his lack of pace. I've lost count the amount of times he would lumber in behind his opponent who'd take an easy chest mark, not to mention the amount of times the ball would sail/dribble past him for a goal when a faster player, heck any player, would have been able to get a hand on it. No development coach in the world can fix that.

I'm not suggesting he goes out there and doesn't try his best, but he doesn't have the intensity required for AFL footy. That game he played in Cairns was almost Tom Gillies like in its badness and thankfully Goody finally saw the light. 

I wish OMac all the best, but let's face it. In the past decade only one MFC player has actually gone to a new club and flourished (Jeremy Howe). We overrate our players big time, in most cases anyway. 

Stef Martin??  

He's 24, should come cheap, knows the systems and fellow defenders, provides useful backup for injury or just selection rotation.

He does have some abysmal games and like the rest of the side is inconsistent, but he has played some games where the back line was on top.

He can kick well and I was always surprised that he did not kick out more often.Perhaps that is a role that he could be given to concentrate on while playing in the twos while waiting to be played when the opposition structure requires.

He would have been gone last year if he was out of contract and frost still had a year, showed nothing this year to prove he should continue to get games over developing another kid

17 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Swap of Frawley for omcd. That’s some far out left over centre thinking !!!  Unfortunately Frawley looked spent in 2020 and might actually be delisted by the dorks

 

I’m definitely no advocating for it SONS, more just giving comfort there are some other people around whom could play his role at a slightly higher level and remain year to year prospects.

15 hours ago, dpositive said:

He's 24, should come cheap, knows the systems and fellow defenders, provides useful backup for injury or just selection rotation.

He does have some abysmal games and like the rest of the side is inconsistent, but he has played some games where the back line was on top.

He can kick well and I was always surprised that he did not kick out more often. Perhaps that is a role that he could be given to concentrate on while playing in the twos while waiting to be played when the opposition structure requires.

He has a nice 30-40m neat kick usually to the boundary that comes on the back of a couple of slow paces. Which is certainly better than some defenders we've had (see McDonald, Tom) but doesn't make him a candidate for kick outs.

When he's asked to run the ball out of the backline or change direction and kick quickly he's incapable of doing so. Which pretty  much sums Oscar up. Handy enough when there's no pressure but ask him to do anything with any intensity and he's just not up to the pace.

On 10/3/2020 at 8:11 PM, Jaded said:

 

I'm of the belief that Tomald has stunted Omac's development as both a footballer and human being. It's not a massive criticism as I would apply the same to me, constantly looking up to a much older brother. Also, I'm allowed to post irrational garbage occasionally if everyone else gets to. 

On 10/4/2020 at 4:22 PM, DeeSpencer said:

A list spot.

Current out of contract key defenders:
Kyle Hartigan, Matt Scharenberg, Jacob Koschitzke, Jarrod Lienert, Ryan Garthwaite, Oscar Clavarino, Lewis Melican. 

Most would be free to a good home or a 3rd rounder at most. Are any of them any good? I don't know. But surely it's worth finding out. Lienert is one guy I'd sign up for sure.

i agree with you. i think sometimes its not even about upgrading the spot (oh how id love to slip a tarrant across in a polec deal)

but trying something different. same deal in our forward line. hunt, hannan, nibbler move them on and give three new blokes the chance to play the same role and see if they can do it better.

i like lienert (he's staying on a 1yr deal), hartigan impressed me this year. wouldn't touch the others tho personally.

hurley & hooker might become available. Cox, Pearce, Hamling, Logue, doesn't fit into one team at freo...

rotham at the eagles is underused (probably too small tho), jackson trengove is still 29

if i was Omac i'd be pitching to the dogs that you're an upgrade on ryan gardner

On 10/6/2020 at 3:20 PM, DeeSpencer said:

He has a nice 30-40m neat kick usually to the boundary that comes on the back of a couple of slow paces. Which is certainly better than some defenders we've had (see McDonald, Tom) but doesn't make him a candidate for kick outs.

When he's asked to run the ball out of the backline or change direction and kick quickly he's incapable of doing so. Which pretty  much sums Oscar up. Handy enough when there's no pressure but ask him to do anything with any intensity and he's just not up to the pace.

I think that applies to most of our squad.

 

We need an intensity coach to analyse and apply that feature to our players.

On 10/4/2020 at 4:10 PM, layzie said:

What do you realistically get by trading him? Unless you trade with a later pick to maybe get into the 50s somehow? 

At best it would be one of those goodwill trades where a swap of picks in the 60’s are exchanged, and we got up about 3 spots in the draft - much like the Dunn trade to Collingwood.

I can’t see O Mac having any value due to multiple poor games over the last 2 years.

Never understood why we persisted for so long with him as our number one or two key post and whilst I obviously don't rate him, it's hard not to show empathy for how he must feel walking on and off the field sometimes given the amount of abuse he cops. I'm not sure how I'd handle that level scrutiny week-in-week-out.

What angers me is that the club to some degree allowed this to happen far too often and for too long. It's a complete mismanagement of a young player, not dissimilar to the way we developed Watts early days.

To my mind and the mind of many others, Oscar was not only not playing to the level early days, but his body was completely underdeveloped. Yet we persisted with him weekly in the hope it'd fast track him which just simply didn't happen.

I'm not sure any Melbourne supporter can honestly say he improved and developed in the manner young key position players should over the course of his career to date? Can they?

It's the clubs fault as much as it is his own and now we're trading him.

Sometimes it's almost as if our club is run by nuffies. I can't imagine any other side in the AFL who would play such an underdeveloped key position player as a number one key defender for as long as we did.

Especially one who had so many weaknesses to work on from both a footballing and physical point of view.

23 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

 

Sometimes it's almost as if our club is run by nuffies. I can't imagine any other side in the AFL who would play such an underdeveloped key position player as a number one key defender for as long as we did.

 

English at Western.  He's going to be a very good player.  Maybe Beveridge is a nuffie?

12 minutes ago, Pollyanna said:

English at Western.  He's going to be a very good player.  Maybe Beveridge is a nuffie?

or malthouse who pushed josh fraser to start straight away (200 games) or buckley who did the same to brodie grundy (second best ruckman of his generation)