10 hours ago, DeezNuts said:

Culture is a real thing: it seems Adelaide’s culture is extraordinarily poor. But it’s been sustained over a number of years, how many of their guns have left since Vince?

Bok, Davis, Gunston, Vince, Tippett, Dangerfield, Lever, Cameron, McGovern, Betts(?)

I'm sure I'm missing some?

Edited August 31, 20186 yr by Dr. Gonzo

2 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Bok, Davis, Gunston, Vince, Tippett, Dangerfield, Lever, Cameron, McGovern, Betts(?)

I'm sure I'm missing some?

It is difficult to put one's finger on why they are leaving.

When players left Brisbane, it was because of the 'go hard or go home' approach of Vossy and Browny that ignored player welfare and family issues. The players needs were ignored and blokes openly mocked had they left.

When players left us, it was mostly because we were a club that valued image over substance, was full of party boys who weren't fair dinkum and that seemed hell bent on perpetuating an insular culture that propped up chosen sons at the expense of everyone else.

When they left the Suns it was because they threw a bunch of kids up on a party strip and hoped that a bloke with the football talent of Kevin Bartlett but the assertiveness and mindset of Ned Flanders could lead them (while recruiting Karmichael Hunt at the same time). Having people as coach, football manager and CEO who had no experience in those posts didn't help that situation either.

The camp was a one year thing which didn't cause all those departures but might be symptomatic of deeper issues that have yet to make the public record.

 

Is there a good summary of what actually happened on this camp? Lots of snippets and hints, but I can't find any really meaty articles on it. For example, what happened to Eddie Betts? And why did Tom Lynch collapse?

No, no good summary. As you say, just hints. But it was a "Mankind Project" camp. tons of stuff on the internet about Mankind Project, but most of it is put out there the Mankind Project itself. You really want stuff written by people who aren't part of the Mankind Project.

Best thing I've found is this, by a guy who attended one of their camps.

I had also been tipped off by a number of concerned wives - who'd noticed disturbing changes in their husbands' behaviour since attending one of ManKind's UK weekends away.

...

Deprived of food and sleep and subjected to the raging emotions of people around me, I am instructed to strip, put my blindfold back on and hold the hand of the man next to me.

My (very) weird weekend with the naked woodland warriors who travel to remote England to 'reclaim their masculinity'

53 minutes ago, Mazer Rackham said:

No, no good summary. As you say, just hints. But it was a "Mankind Project" camp. tons of stuff on the internet about Mankind Project, but most of it is put out there the Mankind Project itself. You really want stuff written by people who aren't part of the Mankind Project.

Best thing I've found is this, by a guy who attended one of their camps.

I had also been tipped off by a number of concerned wives - who'd noticed disturbing changes in their husbands' behaviour since attending one of ManKind's UK weekends away.

...

Deprived of food and sleep and subjected to the raging emotions of people around me, I am instructed to strip, put my blindfold back on and hold the hand of the man next to me.

My (very) weird weekend with the naked woodland warriors who travel to remote England to 'reclaim their masculinity'

Jesus. How utterly mental.

1 hour ago, Mazer Rackham said:

No, no good summary. As you say, just hints. But it was a "Mankind Project" camp. tons of stuff on the internet about Mankind Project, but most of it is put out there the Mankind Project itself. You really want stuff written by people who aren't part of the Mankind Project.

Best thing I've found is this, by a guy who attended one of their camps.

I had also been tipped off by a number of concerned wives - who'd noticed disturbing changes in their husbands' behaviour since attending one of ManKind's UK weekends away.

...

Deprived of food and sleep and subjected to the raging emotions of people around me, I am instructed to strip, put my blindfold back on and hold the hand of the man next to me.

My (very) weird weekend with the naked woodland warriors who travel to remote England to 'reclaim their masculinity'

what a hilarious, and hilariously damning read (if this was similar to what occurred)... coaches and fd departments don't know, what they don't know, when they chase the panacea for mental *ahem* toughness. frightening that merely by word of mouth of one the fd's direct experience - they don't due their due diligence - on whether any of the practitioners are members of AHPRA.

3 hours ago, Mazer Rackham said:

No, no good summary. As you say, just hints. But it was a "Mankind Project" camp. tons of stuff on the internet about Mankind Project, but most of it is put out there the Mankind Project itself. You really want stuff written by people who aren't part of the Mankind Project.

Best thing I've found is this, by a guy who attended one of their camps.

I had also been tipped off by a number of concerned wives - who'd noticed disturbing changes in their husbands' behaviour since attending one of ManKind's UK weekends away.

...

Deprived of food and sleep and subjected to the raging emotions of people around me, I am instructed to strip, put my blindfold back on and hold the hand of the man next to me.

My (very) weird weekend with the naked woodland warriors who travel to remote England to 'reclaim their masculinity'

This was also the pre cursor for the men's rights movements and manosphere. Lots of self help patter mixed with misogyny and overall weirdness.

The Crows camp seemed different in thrust but the techniques seem similar. This seemed to encourage this women are the root of my pain which the Crows cap didn't. However, it was emotionally manipulative and calling it unorthodox is an understatement.

It is interesting to consider the training camp stuff and how early on it was us copping it for the players backing out of it at the last minute. Of course the narrative for the media was all dependent on what happened in our year, we have made the finals and finished the H&A season by beating two top 8 teams. So there hasn’t been any more mentioned about it for a while. 

For Adelaide, they’ve missed the finals after being grand finalists and minor premiers so naturally the media will dissect anything they can to do with them. 

Dear Bros and Sisters. Late last year the brooding naysayers reacted self-righteously and flung  lots of pooh pooh  on the players who Don Piked on the Pre Season Camp Horror, flung more pooh pooh at the administration, and with all the smugness the tough and the righteous carry in their back pockets gave this as A. Yet another example of why this club is a permanent bottom dweller, and B. as all the proof they needed - as though they still needed some - that the players have no integrity, grit, balls ete etc and C. proof that Simon Goodwin was a lousy coach who had lost the players.

I recall reading all this with total amusement, especially when the 'Toughen them up, being humiliated and turned into a feckless puppet never hurt anyone' brigade came thundering down the mountain.

Go eat your own pooh pooh to all these muppets, is all I can say.

 

Dieter you should be better than that. If we went to the camp we might have finished on top and won the minor premiership. It is pure speculation.

 

I always had my suspicions that the OP was Kevin Rudd. 

Edited September 20, 20186 yr by Ethan Tremblay

Only the saddest of individuals use hindsight to lambaste strangers on the internet. Jog on mate, you're full of s|-|it. 

well that went down well, didi ?

I've read that three times and am no better off.

Germans ranting about camps never ends well. 

It always amuses me when people get this retrospective vision where something that has happened in the past suddenly seems to always fall with great significance into logical sequence today.

28 minutes ago, ProperDee said:

It always amuses me when people get this retrospective vision where something that has happened in the past suddenly seems to always fall with great significance into logical sequence today.

The Big Bang theory?

To all you embarrassed naysayers, all I can say is, well, the players and Goodwin have proven you wrong. Long live workplace democracy. And I would have thought the Adelaide Football Club experience with their camp might make you think twice. But no, a troglodyte who wants army style robots on the football field will always believe in Boot Camps Full Metal Jackets style. Interesting too, the same roll call of the same people I disagree with just about everything else about feature above.

1 hour ago, DSP said:

I've read that three times and am no better off.

Try reading it backwards or upside down. Persist, young man, persist.

I have read and understood Catch 22 by Jospeh Heller, A Crock of Gold by James Stephen, and got through A Brief History of Time while understing about 2/3 of it. I even read the Match Review Statements and can sort of understand them.

But I have no idea what this piece is about, what the author is attempting to say, and if his/her/its acid attacks are veiled barbs or ill-aimed self-harming.

in fairness the OP must be written by a kid.

pooh pooh?  really?

What he is saying is that if we had failed to get to a Prelim Final many of the posters on here would have blamed it on A. The non Camp. B. The players are no good. C. It's all Goodwins fault (and probably Jack Watts too). Most likely all 3.

Saying this to the glass half empty fraternity is a pointless exercise much like me posting this or trying to explain Schrodinger's cat.

What should have been said is "eat a fat one naysayers".

I'm sure in the fullness of time the negative, highly critical here, will find something else to be wrong about. Is there still snow at Mt Buller?

Go Dees!! And of course #2 #6 #11 #9 and all the other numbers.

Edited September 20, 20186 yr by dworship
Oops proof reading

38 minutes ago, dworship said:

What he is saying is that if we had failed to get to a Prelim Final many of the posters on here would have blamed it on A. The non Camp. B. The players are no good. C. It's all Goodwins fault (and probably Jack Watts too). Most likely all 3.

Saying this to the glass half empty fraternity is a pointless exercise much like me posting this or trying to explain Schrodinger's cat.

What should have been said is "eat a fat one naysayers".

I'm sure in the fullness of time the negative, highly critical here, will find something else to be wrong about. Is there still snow at Mt Buller?

Go Dees!! And of course #2 #6 #11 #9 and all the other numbers.

Hey, man, I couldn't have said it better meself. I take me hats off to ya. Finally, someone  Demonland who understands me!

59 minutes ago, Maldonboy38 said:

I have read and understood Catch 22 by Jospeh Heller, A Crock of Gold by James Stephen, and got through A Brief History of Time while understing about 2/3 of it. I even read the Match Review Statements and can sort of understand them.

But I have no idea what this piece is about, what the author is attempting to say, and if his/her/its acid attacks are veiled barbs or ill-aimed self-harming.

Have you read Finnegans Wake, by any chance? You seem like a well read Maldon Boy. Good second hand bookshops in the area, I understand...

I think it was smart by our boys to cancel our camp. They obviously had their concerns and voiced up. Goodwin came from a club (Essendon) were the coaching staff put the players at risk - for a bigger cause (success). Keeping that in mind, I have no problem with the players cancelling the camp, and that fact (that Goodwin had previously been a part of a club that compromised the health of players) seems to of escaped those in the media, who just wanted to run down MFC. To Goodwin's credit, he handled the cancellation of the camp like a pro, and has gone on to surpass all expectations of himself as a coach. Goodwin had to earn the players trust and it looks as though he has more than achieved that throughout this year.