Whatever happens....Shouldn't be as many sniffles around the locker room next year anyway...

13 hours ago, hemingway said:

Tough decision does not necessarily equate to right decision. 

Sometimes the tough decision is the easy decision. 

Maybe Hemingway but it is better to make a decision than sit on your hands

12 hours ago, praha said:

If anyone here follows the NBA, they'll know that the league is filled with a whole bunch of unfulfilled talent, and potential superstars who never put in the hard yards or excel beyond a certain point to strive for greatness. Carmelo Anthony is a great modern day example. New York is arguably a better team now that he's gone, despite getting not much in return and losing 30 points per game as a result. 

I didn't like what we got in return, but I still feel this is an instance where we are a better team when you consider the variables. We can now as a club move on from that era and focus on a new core group. There isn't a young player in the team that was *expect* to be great, who hasn't yet lived up to where we thought they'd be. Oliver as exceeded expectations. Petracca is on track. Hogan is a workhorse and competitive beast and we know he'll have his break out season. Guys like Kent are fringe players that we *hope* to get more from, but don't necessarily expect it. We expected it from Watts and never got it. It's always wait wait wait. We needed to move on. 

I have no doubt this team is bound for greatness. We need competitors. Relentless, uncompromising competitors. It took ANB three seasons to be more important to the team than Watts was at any point in his career. 

Hogan, Garlett, ANB, were carrying Watts in the forward line. We needed Watts to do the carrying. He couldn't.  That's fine. We moved him on.

Time to get over it.

What a [censored] view of Watts in that he was carried by Hogan ANB and Garlett. Many of the goals scored by that trio were results of Watts setting them up. Jeffy and Hogan are going to miss Jack VERY much.

Fancy the word [censored] being censored, It does have other meanings you know.

WTF it has been censored again. I will try quere and see if that passes the censor. Talk about political correctness. Funny how WTF passes.

Edited October 20, 20177 yr by Bobby McKenzie

4 hours ago, Bobby McKenzie said:

Many of the goals scored by that trio were results of Watts setting them up. 

Jack isn't a contested beast or clearance king, so he relies on his kicking skills to provide maximum value.  But in reality, his finishing skills are a luxury that won't be difficult to replace. 

Jack averages about 10 kicks per game and kicks inside 50 would be a lot less than that. 

The average disposals in a game are about 750, which means Jack's kicking is occurring about 1.33% of the time. 

Put simply, in an average game of footy Jack isn't kicking it 98.7% of game time.  It's nice when he does, but his tiny cameos will be one of the easier things to replace.  His affect on games is minimal.  And it's not like he won't be replaced.  We will still choose 22 players. 

13 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

Despite all that, our Jack held his head high and did not once comment on what mfc was putting out to the public.  He took it on the chin.  He was gracious, respectful and showed goodwill to the end.  You must be a very proud uncle, Chewy. 

You're being sarcastic, right? 

14 hours ago, ChewyOnMyBoot said:

I wish the Dees every success but really hope the FD get their heads around some better, more respectful, player management practices.

Says the guy posting private information about a player, information received in confidence, on a public forum.

Respect?

35 minutes ago, bing181 said:

Says the guy posting private information about a player, information received in confidence, on a public forum.

Respect?

1.  It's a disgrace

2. The type of person you are dealing with is self evident casting serious doubt on the information

3.  The relationship between the poster and player is far less likely to produce objective information anyway 

4.  It's a disgrace

We may get to 300 but this one is grinding toward an unsatisfying draw. Can we declare it a dodgy pitch, abandon the match, and retire to the club-house for a beer yet?

I am just glad he went to Port., so that we don’t have a weekly commentary on his “new” career

very little Port Adelaide news makes stories over here

that said i wish JW no ill feelings at all, and expect to see him supporting the Demons in a few years..he had many chances to redeem his career...

29 minutes ago, Skuit said:

We may get to 300 but this one is grinding toward an unsatisfying draw. Can we declare it a dodgy pitch, abandon the match, and retire to the club-house for a beer yet?

Mate, we are all in the pub across the road. There are a few still out on the ground falling over in the dark. Let them be.

16 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

From what I've read Sydney, Collingwood, Geelong and Port were interested in Jack.  Jack decided in week one of trade week that he wanted to go to Port but couldn't announce it as lose ends were being tied up.  I took this to mean the trade picks and the portion of salary to be paid by Port.

So I for one believe you that Jack had other offers.  

I heard WB's Football Manager, Chris Grant yesterday talk about Stringer and why he was being let go.  Unlike mfc he made it clear the issues were best kept in-house as they wanted to treat Jake with dignity and respect.

The same cannot be said of mfc's coach, captain and football manager.  Their public critique of Jack was constant; a very harsh way to treat a loyal albeit imperfect employee who is being exited.  People say everyone knew Jack's deficiencies.  Probably true but our club didn't need to keep reminding everyone of them and certainly not after the deal was done, which Mahoney did.  Not sure what was going on inside mfc but deliberately devaluing one's asset isn't very smart in my book. 

Despite all that, our Jack held his head high and did not once comment on what mfc was putting out to the public.  He took it on the chin.  He was gracious, respectful and showed goodwill to the end.  You must be a very proud uncle, Chewy. 

I agree with what you've said LH, i just want to add to the discussion 

Your criticism of Jacks public criticism is more then fair but i believe thoae you've criticised have every right to express an opinion about those who work.for them or work with them.

Moving on Jack was always going to cause outrage with the faithful as JW is a ripping guy.

I'm personally not as upset as others about the approach taken by those you've highlighted as I'm not emotionally attached to Jack.

I reckon many of the faithful would have been equally upset if nothing was said, like you've implied should have been the approach. But it was a no win situation and a hard decision as has been put by the FD. 

It's no fault of JW but I'm assuming he doesn't dit thre style.of play Goody and the FD want to play.

I enjoyed they opened some discussion as to the reasoning why the decision was made. Others didn't and that's fine. And it never escalated in to a mud flinging contest.

The FD imo have every right to comment on how they want to run the show and what standards they require.

After all isnt this part of the brave new AFL rights era and more access inside clubs?

On 10/20/2017 at 11:03 AM, Fifty-5 said:

There's no doubt that Brendan McCartney is an influence on this decision, he's a key member of the FD.

Just thought I'd add these points on Brendan McCartney's influence.

I've heard him speak twice and the two things he values above all else are elite preparation and commitment to the contest.  Jack Watts' deficiencies are in both these areas.

We've seen what can happen when a player devotes himself to elite preparation - Clayton Oliver.

We've seen that the last two flags were won by teams with greater commitment to the contest than their more skillful opponents.

Jake Lever is renowned for his preparation and commitment to the contest.

There's a clear plan that makes sense to me.

 

Well there is another view. The leadership group were tired of Jack and his habits both on and off the field. They want players who are going to buy in and burn for this club. They are sick of being mediocre. They saw what Richmond and what the Bulldogs have done and want Melbourne to do the same.

It takes a unified purpose and Jack was never prepared to buy in to the levels that the playing group believe is required.

So some here can put a halo around jack but the club has been more than fair and patient given his limited output over 9 years.

If the above is true and I have been told by several sources that it is then I am very happy that this club will leave no stone unturned in the quest to be better and compete for a flag. I am happy they are burning about the loss to Collingwood and missing the finals because us fans are.

18 hours ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

From what I've read Sydney, Collingwood, Geelong and Port were interested in Jack.  Jack decided in week one of trade week that he wanted to go to Port but couldn't announce it as lose ends were being tied up.  I took this to mean the trade picks and the portion of salary to be paid by Port.

So I for one believe you that Jack had other offers.  

I heard WB's Football Manager, Chris Grant yesterday talk about Stringer and why he was being let go.  Unlike mfc he made it clear the issues were best kept in-house as they wanted to treat Jake with dignity and respect.

The same cannot be said of mfc's coach, captain and football manager.  Their public critique of Jack was constant; a very harsh way to treat a loyal albeit imperfect employee who is being exited.  People say everyone knew Jack's deficiencies.  Probably true but our club didn't need to keep reminding everyone of them and certainly not after the deal was done, which Mahoney did.  Not sure what was going on inside mfc but deliberately devaluing one's asset isn't very smart in my book. 

Despite all that, our Jack held his head high and did not once comment on what mfc was putting out to the public.  He took it on the chin.  He was gracious, respectful and showed goodwill to the end.  You must be a very proud uncle, Chewy. 

What rubbish. Outright rubbish.

Saying a player isn't up to standard, or is not playing consistently, or is not where the club thought he would be after 9 seasons (!!!!) is not disrespecting him. This is common place in the league and happens all the time during the season. Why can't it happen during the off-season? Is Watts really that precious that he can't be criticised? People asked Goodwin and co. why he was being shopped. They were honest. 

Let's take a look at this history of this kid.

1. He's drafted in as the messiah and is absolutely hounded and mismanaged as a result.

2. Part of arguably the club's worst ever period.

3. Given absolutely every chance to succeed and grow as a player, nurtured by Roos with positive reinforcement for three years (!!!). 

4. Club changes, grows, evolves, gives players all the resources they need to succeed and improve as players.

5. At the start of the 2017 season, Watts is dropped ahead of pre-season games.

Mahoney at the time:

Quote

"We think there has been some predictable, but unfair media speculation about Jack Watts' non-selection. To clarify, the team is being selected on some key criteria during the pre-season," Mahoney said. 

"Jack knows exactly what needs to be worked on, and his past two or three weeks he's been working hard on what he needs to improve on in certain areas.

"He still remains a key player for us this season."

The club came out to bat for him -- AGAIN -- because he was hosting Skwosh events and taking party buses to Portsea Polo right in the business end of pre-season training. This is well-known and digging deep enough into Instagram and Twitter will bring about photos of this. That's not to say these players aren't allowed to party but there is a clear correlation between the sudden amplification of these images and him being dropped from pre-season games.

6. He is dropped after coming back from an injury, rumours of him not committing to rehab circulating. Again, a quick glance at Instagram show him having a "Sunny dayzz with my boyzz" in Byron Bay right in the midst of his time off for injury. 

7. The club encourages him to explore his options, and STILL manages to find upside. 

Quote

“He should be a much better player than he’s played so far, we think he’s got a lot of improvement left in him and if that’s at Melbourne Football Club, that’s great, if it’s at another club then it’s good luck to him as well,” 

It might be a backhanded compliment but it's essentially a "You're super talented, mate, but we're kind of over this [censored]".

Quote

“We’ve been very clear this is about performance and there was some talk it might be about money, but it’s definitely not about money, it’s about performance and our expectations on a nine year, 150 game player.”

That was all that was said. It's about reasonable expectations of what's expected from a nine-year player with leadership aspirations.

Stringer's issue was less about performance, more about his personal issues, which is why the club didn't come out swinging, because they know there's more to his training and performance issues. Watts decisions to get loaded on a weekday during pre-season, or go to Byron Bay for partyz wif da boyz mid-season while injured, is totally, 100%, unequivocally on him.

We have spent the past 4-5 years trying to nurture and guide this kid after ruining the first 4 years of his career. What else can we possibly do? I really like Watts, I think we got unders for him, but if you take a moment to really consider this and look at this history, it is absolutely no surprise that he was moved on.

He was in a comfort zone and may very well excel at Port. It was never going to happen at Melbourne.

@praha - the above is easily the best summation of the situation in 267 pages.  Couldn't have put it any better.

1 hour ago, praha said:

What rubbish. Outright rubbish.

Saying a player isn't up to standard, or is not playing consistently, or is not where the club thought he would be after 9 seasons (!!!!) is not disrespecting him. This is common place in the league and happens all the time during the season. Why can't it happen during the off-season? Is Watts really that precious that he can't be criticised? People asked Goodwin and co. why he was being shopped. They were honest. 

Let's take a look at this history of this kid.

1. He's drafted in as the messiah and is absolutely hounded and mismanaged as a result.

2. Part of arguably the club's worst ever period.

3. Given absolutely every chance to succeed and grow as a player, nurtured by Roos with positive reinforcement for three years (!!!). 

4. Club changes, grows, evolves, gives players all the resources they need to succeed and improve as players.

5. At the start of the 2017 season, Watts is dropped ahead of pre-season games.

Mahoney at the time:

The club came out to bat for him -- AGAIN -- because he was hosting Skwosh events and taking party buses to Portsea Polo right in the business end of pre-season training. This is well-known and digging deep enough into Instagram and Twitter will bring about photos of this. That's not to say these players aren't allowed to party but there is a clear correlation between the sudden amplification of these images and him being dropped from pre-season games.

6. He is dropped after coming back from an injury, rumours of him not committing to rehab circulating. Again, a quick glance at Instagram show him having a "Sunny dayzz with my boyzz" in Byron Bay right in the midst of his time off for injury. 

7. The club encourages him to explore his options, and STILL manages to find upside. 

It might be a backhanded compliment but it's essentially a "You're super talented, mate, but we're kind of over this [censored]".

That was all that was said. It's about reasonable expectations of what's expected from a nine-year player with leadership aspirations.

Stringer's issue was less about performance, more about his personal issues, which is why the club didn't come out swinging, because they know there's more to his training and performance issues. Watts decisions to get loaded on a weekday during pre-season, or go to Byron Bay for partyz wif da boyz mid-season while injured, is totally, 100%, unequivocally on him.

We have spent the past 4-5 years trying to nurture and guide this kid after ruining the first 4 years of his career. What else can we possibly do? I really like Watts, I think we got unders for him, but if you take a moment to really consider this and look at this history, it is absolutely no surprise that he was moved on.

He was in a comfort zone and may very well excel at Port. It was never going to happen at Melbourne.

@sue enough said.

50 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

@praha - the above is easily the best summation of the situation in 267 pages.  Couldn't have put it any better.

Gosh you've read 267 pages of this.

You don't have a life do you!

9 minutes ago, Vogon Poetry said:

Gosh you've read 267 pages of this.

You don't have a life do you!

That's a bit harsh on Wise, I've read all of them as well, on my lunch breaks etc, I must admit mainly for the comedy value in some of them

I also agree with Wise, the summation is very good, although I said the same thing about 150 posts ago, perhaps I should have used more words

 

16 minutes ago, Satyriconhome said:

That's a bit harsh on Wise, I've read all of them as well, on my lunch breaks etc, I must admit mainly for the comedy value in some of them

I also agree with Wise, the summation is very good, although I said the same thing about 150 posts ago, perhaps I should have used more words

 

There you are Wise, you and Saturday, peas in a pod. 

8 minutes ago, Vogon Poetry said:

There you are Wise, you and Saturday, peas in a pod. 

Saturday???!!!   auto correct is a wonderful thing    Wise and myself read everything, that way you don't make yourself look silly

Watts is now with the Power. His heart is not going to be working for that club. He will most probably have an inconsistent year ahead and will struggle to get the ball, to kick goals and to train as hard as he should. He was always the classic mobile forward with the best kicking reliability of all. He was never played in that role or to sustain that attribute when he broke free. Best wishes, Jack. I hope that I am wrong about the future with the Power.

 

One thing we should have learned by now is that there are times when the football industry is not always up front about things that happen within its ranks - Truth not always the main goal.

Perhaps, the full story of Jack's departure will come out one day. However, I doubt it will in the immediate future and, in the meantime, it feels almost voyeuristic to read all of the speculation.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/jack-watts-needed-to-leave-his-demons-behind-20171020-gz4u1r.html

Quite a good article from Pete Ryan. 

1 hour ago, Satyriconhome said:

Saturday???!!!   auto correct is a wonderful thing    Wise and myself read everything, that way you don't make yourself look silly

Some Melbourne supporters continue to stalk Jack Watts like Colin Sylvia appears to stalk ex girlfriends. Let him go.

Edited October 21, 20177 yr by america de cali