Jason Taylor - Is he up to it?

[ignition. 1,478]

  On 31/08/2015 at 21:31, dazzledavey36 said:

My thoughts?

This is such a stupid thread plain and simple. Salem will be a star. His game on the weekend showed how badley we missed him all year. Jay is still young and already played 20 games. Jayden Hunt still has time.

Funny how you started this thread based on the 2013 draft yet no mention of Brayshaw Stretch ANB OMac Vandenberg who have all showed that they will important members of the future. The Vandenberg pick was a jackpot. Thats good enough for me. I will also say that Mitchell White will most likely debut this week or next year. Another win for us.

Taylor is a breath of fresh air. Once Petracca is up and going i can see 2014 draft a pivotal one in the future that will set us up.

Jason Taylor is doing his job. To question him now is laughable and stupid.

Well said Dazzle.

The only pick I genuinely didn't like was Hunt, I remember thinking we could have got him in the rookies - but I won't hold it against JT.

Overall I think he's done a pretty good job so far.

As for saying we could of got this player who went there and that one that went another 10 picks later is the complete unknown of the draft that someone can not predict (e.g. Fyfe at #20, 2009 ND).

[Watts Jurrah Dunn? 735]

  On 01/09/2015 at 01:11, beelzebub said:

Ill make this succinct

the threads question is..is Taylor up to it ?

The answer is YES ( resoundingly )

now we can all move on

The answer cannot be a resounding yes when you win 6 games in a season and lose to the likes of Carlton, Essendon, St Kilda (twice), as well as Essendon's top up side and the Western Bulldogs U/21 side in the pre-season.

When you kick 1 goal in the first quarter over 3 weeks against the Bulldogs, Carlton & Fremantle, your recruiting can NEVER have been a resounding success.

I like the thread as I'm not a sycophant. When you win 6 games in a season you should question everything. In my opinion Tyson and Salem might be ok but have been absolutely useless this year having missed about 20 games between them to hamstring injuries. So how good have those recruits been for us given what we gave for them? Right now I wish we'd never done the deal and had taken Bontempelli at 2 and Lewis Taylor at 23. Who knows what it will look like in 5 years but Tyson and Salem would certainly want to get over these persistent injuries because at this stage, based on 2015 output, they are far from recruiting masterstrokes.

My opinion is that Taylor is up to it, but it's not a resounding yes. 2013 is looking just ok. In 2014 vandenBerg was an absolute masterstroke. Neal-Bullen is an ok blue collar midfielder but I like the look of a number of zippy half forward flanks that went shortly after him in Lonie (41), Dale (45), Daniel (46) and Gregson (47).

I really like that Taylor rated Lewis Taylor as highly as he did, and I like that they rated Jake Lever really highly too. We have been keen on a couple of really likely types.

[bing181 9,447]

  On 01/09/2015 at 04:26, Watts Jurrah Dunn? said:

I like the thread as I'm not a sycophant.

There's a difference between a sycophant and someone who comes to the reasonable conclusion that the question doesn't need to be asked.

[Little Richard 6,265]

  On 01/09/2015 at 01:14, hogans_heroes said:

I wouldn't be writing off JKH yet, the kid has played 21 games and is 20 years old... How long did Nev Jetta take to blossom?

Lets see how he goes after a 3rd preseason

There are plenty of examples we could use, but the fact is that his output at the moment is not up to standard. His first year was better - just has to lift back to that level and beyond next season. Some of his attributes are very good.

I really hope he makes it - seems like a top guy.

[ignition. 1,478]

I can't believe he took Petracca at pick two when Brayshaw went at pick three.

Inexcusable... he must go now!

[RalphiusMaximus 6,111]

I have to say, I too am a little worried about JKH. At his size he really needs more pace. His kicking, vision and sidestep are all very good, but I don't know if they'll be enough without that burst pace that so many others have.

[The Song Formerly Known As 6,479]

at the moment he seems to be better than he who shall not be named.

Ask us again in 5 years time if he was on the money.

[Little Richard 6,265]

  On 01/09/2015 at 09:05, RalphiusMaximus said:

I have to say, I too am a little worried about JKH. At his size he really needs more pace. His kicking, vision and sidestep are all very good, but I don't know if they'll be enough without that burst pace that so many others have.

So many others at the MFC? Pace!?

[Gorgoroth 13,210]

So it's the recruiters fault Salem and Tyson missed games through injury...

Dumbest. Comment. Ever!

[Canplay 635]

Salem, Bradshaw, ANB, Vandemberg, JHK, Oscar Mac,..... No complaints from me.

[Whispering_Jack 31,340]

I think it's fair to question the performance of all of the club's officials and employees and to do so on a regular basis but the evidence so far about Taylor and his recruiting would be well on the positive side and compared with what went before him, it's difficult to question his performance so far.

Still, you have to say recruiting is an inexact since. Looking at the 2013 draft cited in a post above, it reminds me of how I thought Collingwood had pulled off a major recruiting coup getting Scharenberg and Freeman as top 10 picks. However, injuries to those players and the possibility that the former could be on his way back to SA has soured that. Then you compare that with the Bulldogs' choices of Stringer, McRae (2012) and Bontempelli (2013) who have all remained healthy and developed rapidly and you can see the element of luck involved (and I'm not denying that all of them were initially good choices).

For me, Taylor is a big tick to date and I would certainly be looking at some others in the off field department for possible improvement before him.

[beelzebub 23,392]

  On 01/09/2015 at 04:26, Watts Jurrah Dunn? said:

The answer cannot be a resounding yes when you win 6 games in a season and lose to the likes of Carlton, Essendon, St Kilda (twice), as well as Essendon's top up side and the Western Bulldogs U/21 side in the pre-season.

.............

..............

If you dont mind me saying you /and many have missed entirely the essence of the question.

Is he UP TO IT ?? Of course he bloody is. Will he get every pick right? wtf knows ..Only time will evaluate that.

Its not Taylors fault some havent come on ( just yet ). Seldom does a recruiter get them ALL right

Taylors influence to date would have to be firmly as a positive. hencve my answering is he up to it? a resounding yes

[71 Molloy 266]

  On 01/09/2015 at 19:17, Gorgoroth said:

So it's the recruiters fault Salem and Tyson missed games through injury...

Dumbest. Comment. Ever!

Pies went with Scharenberg and Freeman. Could have been worse.

[Mad_Melbourne 877]

  On 01/09/2015 at 04:26, Watts Jurrah Dunn? said:

Western Bulldogs U/21 side in the pre-season.

When you kick 1 goal in the first quarter over 3 weeks against the Bulldogs, Carlton & Fremantle, your recruiting can NEVER have been a resounding success.

I like the thread as I'm not a sycophant. When you win 6 games in a season you should question everything. In my opinion Tyson and Salem might be ok but have been absolutely useless this year having missed about 20 games between them to hamstring injuries. So how good have those recruits been for us given what we gave for them? Right now I wish we'd never done the deal and had taken Bontempelli at 2 and Lewis Taylor at 23. Who knows what it will look like in 5 years but Tyson and Salem would certainly want to get over these persistent injuries because at this stage, based on 2015 output, they are far from recruiting masterstrokes.

My opinion is that Taylor is up to it, but it's not a resounding yes. 2013 is looking just ok. In 2014 vandenBerg was an absolute masterstroke. Neal-Bullen is an ok blue collar midfielder but I like the look of a number of zippy half forward flanks that went shortly after him in Lonie (41), Dale (45), Daniel (46) and Gregson (47).

I really like that Taylor rated Lewis Taylor as highly as he did, and I like that they rated Jake Lever really highly too. We have been keen on a couple of really likely types.

Firstly we beat the bulldogs in pre season.

Secondly, whilst no one is saying that it is great, the fact that we have 7-8 of our best 22 is making a statement that we are limping over the line.

I think 2013 and 2014 recruiting has been well above "just ok", basing your premise on Salem and Tyson not being successful purely due to injury and missing games is laughable. Dom Tyson finished 2nd in the BNF last year and Salem has earnt a spot in the best 22 from pre season, unlikely injured during the year.

JKH was a significant gap in our list and without the recruitment of Gartlett would have spent more time in the 1s.

Hunt was a speculative pick that was influenced by Paul Roos, that said he has suffered from significant injury set backs.

Harmes has broke through with good VFL form to play AFL games from a rookie pick which is great.

Petracca and Brayshaw were obvious.

Stretch, ANB, O'Mac are all developing players and will be better for the game time this year but it is ridiculous at best to suggest that we have failed with these picks relative to the few that you named.

Sure Lever is a gun, but we couldnt get him.

Lewis Taylor is a gun but he didnt slip to us, which Taylor thought was half a chance.

Recruiting and list management has been a solid A for the last two years and il be stoked if it continues.

[What 18,810]

He is at least 5000 times better than Prendergast. At least.

[DeeSpencer 26,649]

It's all about development with the likes of Tyson, Salem, JKH, Harmes, Petracca, Brayshaw, Stretch, ANB and Vanders. On the back of Hogan, Viney, Toumpas, Kent.

From their first games at the MFC they all looked like they could play AFL. All have great attributes and also weaknesses just as any player does.

Development is not linear. Mitch Wallis at the dogs was 1 player I thought was heading for list clogger or tagger at best, now he's seriously underrated if you don't know who he is yet you will soon.

JHK has the agility and smarts to find enough of the ball. A burst of speed combined with a tank will do more than having huge top end pace but never being in the game. He's suffering classic 2nd year blues right now and I think got a bit ahead of himelf but he was a really hard trainer and if he keeps doing that and building his defensive work he could come back hard next year and play some good footy. Tyson's struggling with a few injuries but nothing that seems too bad. He needs a huge preseason to build his tank to the elite midfield level. Once he does that I expect he'll improve as well.

Training standards and development coaching will make players out of all of these guys. If we've got that right then Taylor's recruiting will look very good. Although it's about a half job so far IMO, still need the same injection of quality again. 2 more draft crops of 3 or 4 very good players with at least 1 elite prospect in each draft is needed.

[What 18,810]

Very early and a small sample size but I love what Taylors done so far.

White and O Mac were a nice little bonus to end the season, neither looked out of place.

[dazzledavey36 56,194]

Taylor is beauty.

[Rod Grinter Riot Squad 5,674]

I had no faith in Cameron and was disgusted when he was replaced by his 2IC in Prendergast. Wasn't surprised at all that he was a flop.

I am very happy with what Taylor has done so far and have faith that he will be a big factor in this club recovering.

[SaberFang 7,151]

I wonder how pick 6 will challenge him. By all accounts it seems we've been putting a lot of work into kids that likely won't be available anymore.

[What 18,810]

  On 06/09/2015 at 09:47, Lamashtu said:

I wonder how pick 6 will challenge him. By all accounts it seems we've been putting a lot of work into kids that likely won't be available anymore.

I doubt he will get to use it, there would have to be a high probability that it will be used in a trade to land us an established mid

[Adam The God 30,687]

  On 06/09/2015 at 14:21, hogans_heroes said:

I doubt the will get to use it, there would have to be a high probability that it will be used in a trade to land us an established mid

Yep, my thinking too. The main reason I haven't bothered with any of the U18's this year.

[SaberFang 7,151]

Howe, pick 6 & pick 24 for Prestia & pick 9 (from Dixon trade)?

We can dream!

[rjay 25,408]

  On 06/09/2015 at 09:47, Lamashtu said:

I wonder how pick 6 will challenge him. By all accounts it seems we've been putting a lot of work into kids that likely won't be available anymore.

I think we will use a high pick this year, with trades it might not be pick 6 but we do need to keep rolling over with new talent and should still try and get something in the first round. Now that Curnow looks to be going in the top few I would be happy with Balic.

Would like us to get an A grade mid like O'Meara or similar and a forward/ruck to take Dawes place and I reckon we would be well set.

[SaberFang 7,151]

Last year I was on-board with recruiting an established mid, but seeing the potential of our properly developed youth, and the seeming rot that inhabits some of our older players, I'm happy to see us keep bringing in high draftees for another year.

The successful model of other clubs seems to be establish your core group of kids, develop them on smaller salaries, climb the ladder enough to look attractive to A-graders, then use the cap space to buy a free agent. I reckon if we can climb between 8th and 12th next year, we'll be in the bracket to achieve this.