THE SAGA CONTINUES - WADA APPEALS

[Lucifers Hero 39,798]

5 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Is the $300,000 the actual fine or is that figure the maximum the court can impose? My recollection (admittedly hazy) is that the court is yet to determine a sentence and the $300k figure is just the maximum which could apply for this particular matter.

You could be right LDVC.  If the fine ends up being less than $300k it makes the dire predictions more of a fizzer.

[sue 9,106]

19 minutes ago, iv'a worn smith said:

20 minutes ago, iv'a worn smith said:

Why do people have to resort to pinning nasty epithets on people, which it would seem, is simply because they hold divergent point of view to theirs?  Le Grand is anything but a 'Nong', nor, as far as I know, is he a 'rent boy' for the EFC.  As a journalist of long standing, I would reckon his investigations into this saga, are far more in depth that anything that has gone on in this forum.

I certainly hold no affection for the EFC, but there a rules of law, rules of procedural fairness and natural justice which must be applied, regardless of whether you hate the protagonists to the core or not. 

 

 

OK, so he's used some extreme language.  But to me its undeniable that Le Grand and many of his colleagues have sought to protect the EFC and some of its players rather than do their proper job to protect the integrity of our sport, not to mention the well-being of the players.

I went into this saga with no hatred of Hird, quite the contrary, and no knowledge of the existence of any of the other people involved or the EFC (beyond the usual opposing supporter's bias which I see as a joke).  Their behaviour has moved me in to wish them ill, not my prejudice.

If this whole thing ends up in "can't prove anything because the records don't exist", then while it may (arguably) be a victory for "rules of law, rules of procedural fairness and natural justice" it will be a disaster for just about everything else.

[H_T 3,047]

2 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Monsieur le Nong knows jacque sheet.

He's just pushing out the old efc barrow like the good rent boy he is.

He can't know the extent or contents of this hearing. He'guessing,extrapolating from what he's fed,flying the Windy flag.

He'll be amongst a handful of the media who'll be shown up for the fIogs they are after this washes up.

You seem so definitive in your 'appraisal' of Le Grand.

In my opinion Le Grand has been unbiased view through all this, neutral and dealing with known and proven facts.

He has been anything but 'pushing the old efc barrow', I think you unfairly misrepresent him. 

 

[beelzebub 23,374]

32 minutes ago, iv'a worn smith said:

Why do people have to resort to pinning nasty epithets on people, which it would seem, is simply because they hold divergent point of view to theirs?  Le Grand is anything but a 'Nong', nor, as far as I know, is he a 'rent boy' for the EFC.  As a journalist of long standing, I would reckon his investigations into this saga, are far more in depth that anything that has gone on in this forum.

I certainly hold no affection for the EFC, but there a rules of law, rules of procedural fairness and natural justice which must be applied, regardless of whether you hate the protagonists to the core or not. 

 

Le Grand a journalist. Give me a break. True journalists hold no favour and get their facts right.

This clown often muddles his efforts with his own versions of events. Just another media wannabe. About as credentialed and believable as Slobbo.

Fanboys like Le Nong. Robbo as well as even RoCo and Ralph have become but the mouthpieces for the Essendon bandwagon.

We're they scrupulous and reported with unbiased integrity I would pay them the respect that would demand.

Chup "as far as I'm aware" sums it up perfectly. 

[beelzebub 23,374]

1 hour ago, H_T said:

You seem so definitive in your 'appraisal' of Le Grand.

In my opinion Le Grand has been unbiased view through all this, neutral and dealing with known and proven facts.

He has been anything but 'pushing the old efc barrow', I think you unfairly misrepresent him. 

 

We read things differently .

[biggestred 5,088]

Chips book has a quote from tim watson on the front.

Id say thats about as baised as you could get.

[sue 9,106]

4 minutes ago, beelzebub said:

We read things differently .

I doubt if it was Russian or Chinese journos writing sympathetically about their sports people accused of cheating they'd be any disagreement on how things are read. 

[beelzebub 23,374]

A problem for me is how easily Chip slides into the role of effectively blaming Asada/wada/CAS ..in reality anyone who's role it is to deal with such breaches. That's procedural. And hasn't been quickened by any or all of the "help" given by the accused.

[daisycutter 29,616]

35 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

You could be right LDVC.  If the fine ends up being less than $300k it makes the dire predictions more of a fizzer.

it would be funny if the 300k fine was per breach or per employee injected.........now how many injections were there?

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

6 minutes ago, biggestred said:

Chips book has a quote from tim watson on the front.

Id say thats about as baised as you could get.

Ahh the old bias chestnut.  In the eye of the beholder, regardless of how myopic that beholder may be.

[H_T 3,047]

10 minutes ago, biggestred said:

Chips book has a quote from tim watson on the front.

Id say thats about as baised as you could get.

So his quote is as biased as you can get? lol.....

 

[Mazer Rackham 14,971]

QUOTE

Le Grand has a gut feel that CAS will find the players not guilty.

“I’ve always felt it’s going to be very difficult for any tribunal to be satisfied that a banned substance was given to the players, mainly because there’s such an appalling lack of documentation and reliable evidence of what happened at Essendon in 2012, he said”

“In some ways the ineptitude and the incompetence of Stephen Dank, Dean Robinson and others were up to at Essendon has become an alibi in the sense that it’s very difficult.  

END QUOTE 

 

So Chip found it appalling?

Chip has been so appalled, he has not spared Essendon in order to hold them to account for their appalling lack of documentation. He has lashed them at every opport-- ... oh hang on.

Turns out he thinks that Essendon are victims! Of the ineptitude and incompetence of Dank and others!

 

 

 

In fact Chip has not spared any opportunity to spin this in Essendon's favour.

[biggestred 5,088]

2 minutes ago, H_T said:

So his quote is as biased as you can get? lol.....

 

Father of an accused Brownlow medallist saying anything on the cover. 

Could have put a quote from mcdevitt but chose timmy saying its as close as you can get to the truth.

Righto...

[Chris 2,892]

5 minutes ago, H_T said:

So his quote is as biased as you can get? lol.....

 

And how is Tim qualified to determine what is the truth? He has massive conflicts of interest in the entire affair and if the book is being sold as being 'the truth' then that quote should not be there. Tim would merely be a player in the many quotes in the book, if he is even that!

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

I still say Jake Melksham will line up on the HBF for the Dees, come round 1 2016, injury permitting

[Sir Why You Little 37,036]

24 minutes ago, biggestred said:

Chips book has a quote from tim watson on the front.

Id say thats about as baised as you could get.

What is the quote Bigg??

[Chris 2,892]

34 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

What is the quote Bigg??

Top left corner of the cover of the book as shown above in a few comments. 

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,754]

1 hour ago, sue said:

OK, so he's used some extreme language.  But to me its undeniable that Le Grand and many of his colleagues have sought to protect the EFC and some of its players rather than do their proper job to protect the integrity of our sport, not to mention the well-being of the players.

I went into this saga with no hatred of Hird, quite the contrary, and no knowledge of the existence of any of the other people involved or the EFC (beyond the usual opposing supporter's bias which I see as a joke).  Their behaviour has moved me in to wish them ill, not my prejudice.

If this whole thing ends up in "can't prove anything because the records don't exist", then while it may (arguably) be a victory for "rules of law, rules of procedural fairness and natural justice" it will be a disaster for just about everything else.

Actually, I don't think that's their job. Their job is to either (1) report the news in an unbiased manner or (2) provide analysis or opinion. Unfortunately, it's not always clear when a journo is writing or speaking as to which they are doing.

[beelzebub 23,374]

4 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Their job is to either (1) report the news in an unbiased manner or (2) provide analysis or opinion. 

I'd agree with this essentially. For me the ruse is it's really an opinion piece jacketed as a clinical assessment.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

1 minute ago, beelzebub said:

I'd agree with this essentially. For me the ruse is it's really an opinion piece jacketed as a clinical assessment.

Rather similar to opinions proffered on here.

[Sir Why You Little 37,036]

15 minutes ago, Chris said:

Top left corner of the cover of the book as shown above in a few comments. 

I haven't seen a copy of the book so i have no idea what that quote is, but depending on what it is...would definately determine how seriously i would read the book or throw it away...

[Chris 2,892]

2 minutes ago, Sir Why You Little said:

I haven't seen a copy of the book so i have no idea what that quote is, but depending on what it is...would definately determine how seriously i would read the book or throw it away...

A pic of it is in various posts above. The quote is;

"The Essendon supplements investigation became a wrecking ball. Chip's access to key players on both side makes this a must read for anyone interested in the truth."

As I said, how does Tim know what the actual truth is. His only info would be coming from within the club, the 'parents nights' and his son. One I think he should trust, Jobe seems an honest and forthright person with integrity, the others I have some serious questions about. 

[beelzebub 23,374]

12 minutes ago, iv'a worn smith said:

Rather similar to opinions proffered on here.

I don't purport my offering as anything but opinion except where reporting a fact.

I haven't written a book pretending one is the other

 

[Sir Why You Little 37,036]

4 minutes ago, Chris said:

A pic of it is in various posts above. The quote is;

"The Essendon supplements investigation became a wrecking ball. Chip's access to key players on both side makes this a must read for anyone interested in the truth."

As I said, how does Tim know what the actual truth is. His only info would be coming from within the club, the 'parents nights' and his son. One I think he should trust, Jobe seems an honest and forthright person with integrity, the others I have some serious questions about. 

I agree completely  i heard Watson Snr say a lot in the early days of this whole thing. Never sounded convincing to me

What has ALWAYS astounded me is that the parents of all the 34 players have remained almost silent. 

Were they paid to "Shut it" & how much?

[H_T 3,047]

1 hour ago, biggestred said:

Father of an accused Brownlow medallist saying anything on the cover. 

Could have put a quote from mcdevitt but chose timmy saying its as close as you can get to the truth.

Righto...

 

1 hour ago, Chris said:

And how is Tim qualified to determine what is the truth? He has massive conflicts of interest in the entire affair and if the book is being sold as being 'the truth' then that quote should not be there. Tim would merely be a player in the many quotes in the book, if he is even that!

He doesn't know the truth, that's exactly it. It's a quote used by a father of one of the players - not Chip's view. It's used to promote the book. 

It states "Chip's access to key players on both sides.." highlighting a balanced take. 

Big, you're right that it could have been a quote from anyone, could have been one from early on like...Kyle Reimers at the very start with the interview with Barrett. Tim is a big name, father of the year, etc, why not use a quote from a popular figure? 

Let's not forget there is also an essendon player (guernsey) on the front also with a syringe saying the biggest drug scandal - biased there? C'mon..