Lucas Cook back in the red and blue

[John Crow Batty 8,266]

If we didn't tank or list manage as some prefer to call it, we would never have had the opportunity to pick Scully, Trengove, Morton, Watts et al. That's our karma. We may have chosen more pragmatically.

[Earl Hood 5,789]

If we didn't tank or list manage as some prefer to call it, we would never have had the opportunity to pick Scully, Trengove, Morton, Watts et al. That's our karma. We may have chosen more pragmatically.

Gee we didn't tank that much we were just Shyte! You get early picks when you are absolute Shyte. That is the system.

[Curry & Beer 5,444]

If we didn't tank or list manage as some prefer to call it, we would never have had the opportunity to pick Scully, Trengove, Morton, Watts et al. That's our karma. We may have chosen more pragmatically.

but , again , every one of those would have gone at the same pick by every other club except maybe some clubs would have had Watts at #2.. and that's not even a blunder I would still happily keep Watts over the novelty act

also we were well comp'd for Scully and Trengove is just another of the many to have injuries ruin a career

[poita 3,640]

but , again , every one of those would have gone at the same pick by every other club except maybe some clubs would have had Watts at #2.. and that's not even a blunder I would still happily keep Watts over the novelty act

Correct. I don't know why people have this belief that we erred with the picks of Morton, Scully and Watts. They were widely, if not unanimously, regarded as the best players available in those draft positions. Nobody expected Dangerfield to go as high as he did and Adelaide copped a lot off flak for drafting him when they did.

The errors were clearly Maric, Strauss, Gysberts and Cook. Players who were drafted well ahead of the consensus view, who were clearly unsuitable for AFL football and who were selected by people too dense to understand the fundamental differences between junior football and the AFL.

[La Dee-vina Comedia 16,485]

Correct. I don't know why people have this belief that we erred with the picks of Morton, Scully and Watts. They were widely, if not unanimously, regarded as the best players available in those draft positions. Nobody expected Dangerfield to go as high as he did and Adelaide copped a lot off flak for drafting him when they did.

The errors were clearly Maric, Strauss, Gysberts and Cook. Players who were drafted well ahead of the consensus view, who were clearly unsuitable for AFL football and who were selected by people too dense to understand the fundamental differences between junior football and the AFL.

I agree.

But what do we think the fundamental differences are between junior footy and AFL? Commitment? Body size? Skills, and, if so, which ones?

[nutbean 8,837]

I agree.

But what do we think the fundamental differences are between junior footy and AFL? Commitment? Body size? Skills, and, if so, which ones?

you forgot the biggest fundamental difference. its called a million light years.

Firstly TAC football - unwritten law around tagging - doesn't happen. The modern catch phrase "2 way running" is all one way running. Little respect is paid to opponents so ( besides actual defenders) it is much easier for a creative midfielder to shine. Body size is different - which is why big bodied or ultra tall boys can do well in that environment.

The biggest point to make is that most coaches accept that players have not really matured as footballers until 22 ( and for big men even longer ). So were are drafting players at least 4 years before they start to peak. It has been shown over and over again that stars against your own age may not necessarily translate to a star in AFL and there is a plethora of late bloomers - footballers who were OK at TAC level but matured in fabulous footballer aged 22 plus.

[Mono 454]

and every single other club would have done the same

there was no way of knowing his influence would be completely stifled in the big league by a complete lack of ticker

Not so. About half the clubs rated Morton, half didn't (at any pick). Sadly we were in the first lot.

[nutbean 8,837]

Not so. About half the clubs rated Morton, half didn't (at any pick). Sadly we were in the first lot.

I can point to countless articles by junior football watchers who had Morton in the top 4 - have yet to read anywhere that he wasn't rated - but happy to see anything written where he wasn't rated

[Demon trucker 1,776]

Not so. About half the clubs rated Morton, half didn't (at any pick). Sadly we were in the first lot.

And you would know? No every club rated him, u just made that up, where were u when he was picked? I don't see u saying that when he was drafted, I wish we lived in hindsight.

[Mono 454]

I can point to countless articles by junior football watchers who had Morton in the top 4 - have yet to read anywhere that he wasn't rated - but happy to see anything written where he wasn't rated

See below

And you would know? No every club rated him, u just made that up, where were u when he was picked? I don't see u saying that when he was drafted, I wish we lived in hindsight.

And I could say you just made that up. Get a grip. The comments I made are as I remember them, and have made such comments occasionally over the past 6 years or so.

FWIW, Colin Wisbey's rankings for 07 draft were:

1 . COTCHIN, Trent (2 RIC)

2 . KREUZER, Matthew (1 CAR)

3 . MYERS, David (6 ESS)

4 . MASTEN, Chris (3 WCE)

5 . RIOLI, Cyril (12 HAW)

6 . VESZPREMI, Patrick (11 SYD)

7 . HENDERSON, Lachlan (8 BRI)

8 . MARIC, Addam (21 MEL)

9 . EBERT, Bradley (13 WCE)

10 . MEREDITH, Brett (26 SYD)

11 . MCCARTHY, John (31 COL)

12 . MOTLOP, Marlon (28 POR)

13 . PEARS, Tayte (23 ESS)

14 . MCNAMARA, Tom (66 MEL)

15 . GARLETT, Cruize (R30 KAN)

16 . MORTON, Cale (4 MEL)

17 . WARD, Callan (19 WBD)

18 . PETRENKO, Jared (R25 ADE)

19 . GREENWOOD, Levi (32 KAN)

20 . JACKY, Jarrhan (30 ADE)

21 . MCEVOY, Ben (9 STK)

22 . TAYLOR, Harry (17 GEE)

And FWIW, check out bigfooty and DL posts around Nov 2007 and you will see plenty 'for' and 'against' Morton. I was in neither camp in 2007.

[angrydee 842]

I remember chatting to Robert Hyde during Maric's first season as a 16 yo. He described him as potentially the best small forward since Daicos. And he was a good judge

[monoccular 16,235]

OMG this is a quiet time of year - 25 (now 26) posts on this non-event.

[obbafan 128]

How, in any way, is this self flagellation of any use?

This is fantasy optimism time. Give yourselves the joy of imagining the best.

Reality may soon beat you over the head but, then again, it may not.

[nutbean 8,837]

See below

And I could say you just made that up. Get a grip. The comments I made are as I remember them, and have made such comments occasionally over the past 6 years or so.

FWIW, Colin Wisbey's rankings for 07 draft were:

1 . COTCHIN, Trent (2 RIC)

2 . KREUZER, Matthew (1 CAR)

3 . MYERS, David (6 ESS)

4 . MASTEN, Chris (3 WCE)

5 . RIOLI, Cyril (12 HAW)

6 . VESZPREMI, Patrick (11 SYD)

7 . HENDERSON, Lachlan (8 BRI)

8 . MARIC, Addam (21 MEL)

9 . EBERT, Bradley (13 WCE)

10 . MEREDITH, Brett (26 SYD)

11 . MCCARTHY, John (31 COL)

12 . MOTLOP, Marlon (28 POR)

13 . PEARS, Tayte (23 ESS)

14 . MCNAMARA, Tom (66 MEL)

15 . GARLETT, Cruize (R30 KAN)

16 . MORTON, Cale (4 MEL)

17 . WARD, Callan (19 WBD)

18 . PETRENKO, Jared (R25 ADE)

19 . GREENWOOD, Levi (32 KAN)

20 . JACKY, Jarrhan (30 ADE)

21 . MCEVOY, Ben (9 STK)

22 . TAYLOR, Harry (17 GEE)

And FWIW, check out bigfooty and DL posts around Nov 2007 and you will see plenty 'for' and 'against' Morton. I was in neither camp in 2007.

I took up your challenge and I am batting 6 phantom drafts ( including Emma Quayle and Matt Burgan who was with the AFL in 2007) and all had Morton in the top 4 with 3 of the 6 having him going to Richmond ahead of us.

So I have checked out Big Footy and DL and to suggest "plenty for and plenty against" is a stretch. That Morton wouldn't go top 4 was definitely a minority opinion and one that I can find supported by a solitary professional commentator being Wisbey

[poita 3,640]

I know that Colin Wisbey was fairly highly regarded at the time, but I wouldn't be using the opinions of someone who had Maric at 8 and McNamara at 14 as the voice of reason in this scenario.

Note also the absence of Dangerfield from that list. It doesn't seem like too many people saw him becoming the star that he is today.

[daisycutter 28,629]

I know that Colin Wisbey was fairly highly regarded at the time, but I wouldn't be using the opinions of someone who had Maric at 8 and McNamara at 14 as the voice of reason in this scenario.

Note also the absence of Dangerfield from that list. It doesn't seem like too many people saw him becoming the star that he is today.

to be honest i'd never heard of colin wisbey until i read this thread - lol

[Melon22 174]

Let me describe Cale Morton the prospect to you, 190cm, runs 15+beep, sub 3 sec 20m sprint, clean hands, good decision maker and kicks 50 - 60 metres on a dime. Dominated the U18 national championships and was voted best player. These are the reasons that we took Cale Morton at 4, from the outside he looked a can't miss. I put my hand up as well as I thought he was the goods as well, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Back on topic...

I'm glad to see Lucas back playing Footy, I watched him play some excellent footy in his first year at the club.

[DeeSpencer 23,256]

See below

And I could say you just made that up. Get a grip. The comments I made are as I remember them, and have made such comments occasionally over the past 6 years or so.

FWIW, Colin Wisbey's rankings for 07 draft were:

1 . COTCHIN, Trent (2 RIC)

2 . KREUZER, Matthew (1 CAR)

3 . MYERS, David (6 ESS)

4 . MASTEN, Chris (3 WCE)

5 . RIOLI, Cyril (12 HAW)

6 . VESZPREMI, Patrick (11 SYD)

7 . HENDERSON, Lachlan (8 BRI)

8 . MARIC, Addam (21 MEL)

9 . EBERT, Bradley (13 WCE)

10 . MEREDITH, Brett (26 SYD)

11 . MCCARTHY, John (31 COL)

12 . MOTLOP, Marlon (28 POR)

13 . PEARS, Tayte (23 ESS)

14 . MCNAMARA, Tom (66 MEL)

15 . GARLETT, Cruize (R30 KAN)

16 . MORTON, Cale (4 MEL)

17 . WARD, Callan (19 WBD)

18 . PETRENKO, Jared (R25 ADE)

19 . GREENWOOD, Levi (32 KAN)

20 . JACKY, Jarrhan (30 ADE)

21 . MCEVOY, Ben (9 STK)

22 . TAYLOR, Harry (17 GEE)

And FWIW, check out bigfooty and DL posts around Nov 2007 and you will see plenty 'for' and 'against' Morton. I was in neither camp in 2007.

9 out of 22 busts and 3 in the top 10, plus the unfortunate John McCarthy. Yikes.

[nutbean 8,837]

to be honest i'd never heard of colin wisbey until i read this thread - lol

Them good ole boys were drinking wisbey and rye, singling this will be the day that I die.

[daisycutter 28,629]

Them good ole boys were drinking wisbey and rye, singling this will be the day that I die.

i went to see don mclean once at the hilton (free tickets from work)

he was terrible.....sang a lot of boring religious songs

seemed (to me) that american pie was his one and only noteworthy song

the warm-up act (black, female, can't remember name) completely outclassed him

ah well..........maybe that was why i scored the freebies, but at least the food was good

[old dee 22,937]

i went to see don mclean once at the hilton (free tickets from work)

he was terrible.....sang a lot of boring religious songs

seemed (to me) that american pie was his one and only noteworthy song

the warm-up act (black, female, can't remember name) completely outclassed him

ah well..........maybe that was why i scored the freebies, but at least the food was good

Many moons ago dc I got freebies to a movie called "The effect of Gamma Rays on Man in the Moon Marigolds"

Terrible name but not a bad show, it had Paul Newman's wife and daughter in it.

It comes up on TV occasionally

In Today's TV world it is worth a look.

[nutbean 8,837]

he was terrible.....sang a lot of boring religious songs

I don't mind religion but it tends to interfere with my Devil worship, paganism and virgin sacrifices.

[old dee 22,937]

I don't mind religion but it tends to interfere with my Devil worship, paganism and virgin sacrifices.

It would be hard to find one for the last item nutbean

[pitmaster 3,064]

i went to see don mclean once at the hilton (free tickets from work)

he was terrible.....sang a lot of boring religious songs

seemed (to me) that american pie was his one and only noteworthy song

American Pie has to be one of the most over-hyped songs of all time and not much good at that.

It's always struck me that he was peeved that English musos had eclipsed the US players in popularity, hence all those digs at Jagger as Satan in the lyrics.

Good ole boys is also code for white racist trash, something which seemed to pass Don Mac by.

I'm just glad you didn't pay for those tickets - you could have done something more useful with the money, like tear it up and watch it blow away in the breeze. Very karmic.

[Sir Why You Little 34,642]

What a great read this thread is

Who is Lucas Cook anyway?

Never saw him play a game...